Clampdown coming on multiple tourist visa runs

[hgma]

Q: Where does tourist money come from?

A: Outside Thailand.

Q: Where do tourists spend their money?

A: Inside Thailand.

Q: How does money from other counties spent in Thailand, benefit the Thai economy?

A: Countless way... it would seem.

Q: Why then would you want to discourage tourists from staying as long as they want?

A: Hummmmmm.... let me get back to you on that...

TAT comment........RUBBISH...YOUR MAKING SENSE!!

[hotrod4098]

as i see it...visa on arrival ..get 30 days ,,then pay immigration 2000.. for 30 days extension...and every 30 days..why the need

to go outside thailand...at least every one would no the visa rules..

as it it...what a mine field

[monkeycountry]

The more interesting question is why it is so important to limit the stay of "tourists" in a country that offers absolutely no welfare benefits for these "tourists"?

I asked my boss today what he thought of somehow limiting the spending of the companys customers, perhaps by limiting the amount of consecutive orders the customers can place, or perhaps ensure that inbetween orders to our company, they also place orders with competing companies. I am still waiting for his reply, but hope my idea will finally make him consider that promotion I have waited for so long.

Edited March 18, 2014 by monkeycountry

[thepool]

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In all seriousness a clampdown if properly enforced is a good thing. There shouldn't be a reason to do multiple tourist visa runs - if you prolong your stay in the country you are no longer a tourist - it's milking the system.

I suspect most of the people going on these visa runs are working here illegally anyway. Go and jump through all the hoops and go back and forth to the employment office with the reams and reams of paperwork and copies of passporst and marriage certificates, kids birth certificates and everything else like the rest of us did to be able to work and stay here legally.

This "probem" is easily resolved. If there are 3 30 day visa exempt stamps in a passport then only a 7 day permission to stay should be given !

Lets make the "runners" run !

[transam]

If I can go to the bother of getting the correct visa, why can't others?

I have to agree with the Thais on this one.

Why......?

Are these folk creeping in to claim Thai social security benefits ?

If they are doing it to set up dodgy businesses thats another thing, but most are spending their cash.

I would suggest immigration should look at ED visas and attendances at the establishments first, and ask why some are not learning Thai, learning other languages. Crazy.

[easybullet3]

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Continuing change and confusion. In the north, they recently extended the time to 30 days for land crossings, but limited this to 4 consecutive visa runs....

This latest change, if true and universal, May well cost the country quite a bit of income.

As the average length of stay for the almost 20 million visitors in 2011 was (per TAT) " ... 9.64 days and an average daily spend of 4,187.12 baht (US$137) per person," the financial contribution of those who stay long-term without non-IMM visas and who might be affected by any of the above changes in regulations most likely would not cost the country a great deal of income.

Q: Where does tourist money come from?

A: Outside Thailand.

Q: Where do tourists spend their money?

A: Inside Thailand.

Q: How does money from other counties spent in Thailand, benefit the Thai economy?

A: Countless way... it would seem.

Q: Why then would you want to discourage tourists from staying as long as they want?

A: Hummmmmm.... let me get back to you on that...

I have lived here doing back to back tourist visa's (not land crossings) for MANY MANY Years.. and I must have spend a good few million baht or more.. and I have not taken one baht from Thailand.

so I can personally vouch that people who are doing this (as I do) can actually PUT a LOT of money into the economy and NOT take from it.

PS: the above article didnt actually state whether they may be clamping down ONLY on land crossing visa-on-arrivals? or also on the 60 days tourist visa too?

does this mean I should now start studying thai with an Education visa if things get rough ??

[blowin]

If I can go to the bother of getting the correct visa, why can't others?

I have to agree with the Thais on this one.

Why......?

Are these folk creeping in to claim Thai social security benefits ?

If they are doing it to set up dodgy businesses thats another thing, but most are spending their cash.

I would suggest immigration should look at ED visas and attendances at the establishments first, and ask why some are not learning Thai, learning other languages. Crazy.

These are the rules and the law in Thailand. But it does drive me mad a bit. My wife came to my country with our son born in Thailand the first thing they both got was a PPS number ( social insurance) and my wife was given children's allowance. It took 3 years and she was given an Irish passport and citizenship . But when I try to get into Thailand well we know all the hoops I have to jump trough to get a retirement visa. But I have to say to get a 12 month non O visa was easy and no problem getting.

[evadgib]

Sometimes it would just be nice to be treated as the husband of a Thai citizen.

Not a pseudo criminal that needs to justify wanting to live with his family !!!

Better still if we could be treated as the WIFE, ie less...

Edited March 18, 2014 by evadgib

[LeeTheCelt]

It just all boils down to Thai's not wanting farang staying long term, they like our holiday cash, as most people are 2 week millionaires, no budget when your on holiday.

Just look at the long term visa situation, average Thai earns £100-£200 per month, Farang, if not married to a Thai, has to have £1600 a month being payed into a Thai bank account, every month. Don't know about you's guys but that aint a pension I will have coming in every month when retired, luckily I'm married, so may not apply to Me when My time comes (wouldnt bank on it though)

That sort of income, would allow you a comfortable living in the UK, let alone Thailand,lets just face the truth, they don't want us there long term, if we're married they will tolerate us, but thats as good as it will ever get.

[JLCrab]

Per post #38 the total inbound tourist expenditure for Thailand in 2011 was estimated at over $US 7 billion. No matter how much those on back-to-back tourist visas might bring into the country as individuals it represents such a small fraction of the total input that to make visa and immigration changes to further accommodate them doesn't seem to be in the works.

[HerbalEd]

This is a no-facts story and appears to only be hear-say. What a waste of time.

[impulse]

They should just set a bar say 25k baht a month spent in country for continued stay then enforce the work laws. This is mostly directed at teachers abusing the visa system. I am a professional vacationer and have spent loads of money in the almost 4 years I have been here why should I suffer for people working on tourist visas when I can show that I spend above the average middle class Thai family a month?

If you're in their target demographic, you should have no problem getting appropriate visas for pretty much as long as you want to stay.

If you're struggling with visas, or can't afford to fly out to get one occasionally, you're probably not in their target demographic.

Sucks for the folks who built their life plan around Thailand, and my heart goes out to those whose dreams will have to be rearranged. The good news is that we hear about these clampdowns a lot more than they actually happen.

No such thing as a professional vacationer, unless you're getting paid for it. And if so, that means you're working in Thailand and need a work permit, too.

Edited March 18, 2014 by impulse

[jimbeam1]

another nail in the coffin

Soon won't be able to lift it.

jb1

[jacko45k]

Kind of odd they would open all the Burmese crossing points and change it back to 15days. These border crossing seem to be purely for border runs. No one is going to waste their time hitting Ban Ron for a 15 day 900bhat(Not including transportation) stamp. They need to start beating the bushes for the 50+ crowd they seem predatory(Just look at all the creepers in most touristed areas) and might as well make them pay more for the privileged of long stay.

If you mean those on retirement extensions, at least they are living in Thailand as per the terms of their visa extension......mostly.

Rather than perpetual tourists who are far from being tourists.

And living on means that we know very little of.

Nevertheless I could live with more stringent retirement extension requirements and conditions.

Anyhow, we all know these things blow through the rafters periodically, and then it goes quiet.

[racyrick]

Sometimes it would just be nice to be treated as the husband of a Thai citizen.

Not a pseudo criminal that needs to justify wanting to live with his family !!!

ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!!!

GREAT POST AND SO TRUE!!

I love my Thai wife and our son that was born here. Family is everything to me and I thought Thais feel the same, but you have to qualify financially in order to live with your family and that is all that matters to immigration.

It seems love and keeping a family together is not the most important thing to immigration, the only thing that matters is how much a person has or makes is the most important reason (and only reason) for letting a farang stay with his family.

How pathetic.

THANKS cornishcarlos for the post and good luck to you.

[Pops]

Continuing change and confusion. In the north, they recently extended the time to 30 days for land crossings, but limited this to 4 consecutive visa runs....

This latest change, if true and universal, May well cost the country quite a bit of income.

As the average length of stay for the almost 20 million visitors in 2011 was (per TAT) " ... 9.64 days and an average daily spend of 4,187.12 baht (US$137) per person," the financial contribution of those who stay long-term without non-IMM visas and who might be affected by any of the above changes in regulations most likely would not cost the country a great deal of income.

You probably should rethink your thesis a bit if the 20 million visitors also contain the so called "visa hoppers"

These visa hoppers exit and enter the country every time they cross the border.

Which would bring the total number of real visitors to Thailand down a bit.

Also "the visa hoppers" do cross the border so "go out of the country" every 30 or 15 days which brings the average length of stay down quite a bit, since you do not know how many of the 20 million visitors are visa hoppers.

A visa hopper who stays here for 3 months is probably registered as a visitor who visited Thailand 3 times in the last 3 months with an average stay of 30 days or with the 15 day rule: he visited Thailand 5 times (first time 30 days then every 15 days) with and average stay of 18 days.

[moe666]

another nail in the coffin

That reframe is so old its already been put in the coffin and burned.

[JLCrab]

Per post #48 the visa hoppers even if they exited-and-entered 10 times per year probably wouldn't figure in the overall statistics as even a rounding error.

Edited March 18, 2014 by JLCrab

[Ianatlarge]

Why does Thailand do this? They apparently want tourists and people to spend money in the Kingdom, yet make it difficult to stay. The other side of the equation, I can get 90 days in Singapore, on arrival, and repeat with 2 hours across Johor Straight. What does Sing know that Thailand does not?

[crazykopite]

It is clear to me that Thailand do not want the tourists here long term so they will take there money elsewhere and spend it . After everything that has happened over the last few months you would think that Thailand would want as many people to stay as possible I would imagine that there are only the few who do many many border runs those who come from cold countries I would imagine are happy to stay until the weather in there own country picks up It is time the Thai government and immigration woke up to the fact it is those who come from abroad who bring in the money

[kevinsan]

Just more people will overstay. Cheaper in the long run for most people actually.

[MZurf]

Q: Where does tourist money come from?

A: Outside Thailand.

Q: Where do tourists spend their money?

A: Inside Thailand.

Q: How does money from other counties spent in Thailand, benefit the Thai economy?

A: Countless way... it would seem.

Q: Why then would you want to discourage tourists from staying as long as they want?

A: Hummmmmm.... let me get back to you on that...

I think they are not trying to discourage tourists, even long term ones. Rather they are trying to discourage people from living here more or less permanently on visa runs.

The Thai Government's position has always been that there is no problem with expats living in Thailand provided that they have a visa appropriate to their stay. Nothing wrong with that. Every country is the same.

Except they are making it even harder to get an appropriate visa, as evidenced by the recent clamp down on issuing Non Imm O marriage visas !!!

Every country is definitely not the same...

Is there a clap down on issuing marriage visas? How about extensions of said visa? Please post a link.

I noticed that the article says::

" Immigration is to bring in a new rule soon aimed at discouraging repeat visa runs by visitors to Thailand who get visas on arrival and then extend their stays by doing visa runs.

It might be just bad reporting but there is a difference between visa on arrival and the visa exempt stamp that many nationalities get when arriving without a visa.

Edited March 18, 2014 by MZurf

[moe666]

Sometimes it would just be nice to be treated as the husband of a Thai citizen.

Not a pseudo criminal that needs to justify wanting to live with his family !!!

ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!!!

GREAT POST AND SO TRUE!!

I love my Thai wife and our son that was born here. Family is everything to me and I thought Thais feel the same, but you have to qualify financially in order to live with your family and that is all that matters to immigration.

It seems love and keeping a family together is not the most important thing to immigration, the only thing that matters is how much a person has or makes is the most important reason (and only reason) for letting a farang stay with his family.

How pathetic.

THANKS cornishcarlos for the post and good luck to you.

Love and family are great but how does one feed there family on make believe.

[katareya2006]

On one hand Thailand is pushing for more Tourists to increase its GDP and on the other it is discouraging Tourists by severely tightening up on its Visa rules. One day Thailand will start to make sence.......

[belg]

i know some expats, working many weeks overseas and comming back to their family when they have no contract... so these people will only be able to stay for a short time with their families?

when will thailand start & grow a pair...

they want tourists & their monnies or not ?

smart country would ask a nice fee (the price of a flight + a hotelnight) and just to the renewal in the same country, at the airport ...

now what country does not even have an immigration service at their international airport? you have to travel 30 km at least to chaeng wattana

[JLCrab]

Why does Thailand do this? They apparently want tourists and people to spend money in the Kingdom, yet make it difficult to stay. The other side of the equation, I can get 90 days in Singapore, on arrival, and repeat with 2 hours across Johor Straight. What does Sing know that Thailand does not?

What I guess the Thai government might know is a lot (most?) of their prime tourist targets are not interested in spending 6 months in Singapore.

Edited March 18, 2014 by JLCrab

[dotx]

I agree every country has different visa rules. I do not know of any country where you can just walk in and live full time.

Vietnam. I lived there for almost two years. You have to get a visa the first time (you can't just "show up" at the airport) but after that, you can walk into any travel agency and they'll extend the visa for you. Sometimes it was 3 months, sometimes 6 months, depending on what rules the government had decided to change at that point.

But you could always extend it. No visa runs, no need to get out. Just pay the fee and get more time. Nobody cares what you're doing with your visa (I wasn't working illegally, but I guess some people could have)

[biggles45]

"Currently, visitors who come from countries on Thailands list of nationalities that may arrive with no visa and receive a visa on arrival can also hop out of Thailand into a neighbouring country and back, and get another 30 days. "

Visa on arrival, is not the same as a Visa Free entry. The change to 30 days at a land border was for G7 countries whose. citizens would already qualify for a Visa Free entry. , I doubt that many of the countries on the Visa on Arrival list would be in the g7 category?

If this change is only for VOA countries, as it reads, the effect will not be as big !!

Edited March 18, 2014 by biggles45

[drx13]

Chuck 'em out. Immigration packed with ne'er do-wells, while us genuine people wait forever.

[cornishcarlos]

Sometimes it would just be nice to be treated as the husband of a Thai citizen.

Not a pseudo criminal that needs to justify wanting to live with his family !!!

ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!!!

GREAT POST AND SO TRUE!!

I love my Thai wife and our son that was born here. Family is everything to me and I thought Thais feel the same, but you have to qualify financially in order to live with your family and that is all that matters to immigration.

It seems love and keeping a family together is not the most important thing to immigration, the only thing that matters is how much a person has or makes is the most important reason (and only reason) for letting a farang stay with his family.

How pathetic.

THANKS cornishcarlos for the post and good luck to you.

Love and family are great but how does one feed there family on make believe.

Who mentioned having no money ??

My point was, we will never just be able to live in peace with our families. There will always be something, be it a change in monetary requirements or reporting every 90 days. Whatever happens and whatever visa you are on, you are never secure for more than 12 months at a time. That is no way to be made to live.