Suthep prepares PDRC faithful for 'final battle' against govt

[northernjohn]

Suthep delivers "electrifying" news to the PEA.

Just as an aside:

Is the PDRC tracking all the donations it has received in the last six months and how it is spent? Is it reporting to the Government such information, ie., for tax purposes? Is it reporting to the NACC such information to assure noncorrupt uses? If the PDRC isn't accountable and transparent, how can the People expect it as a government to be so?

Is it reporting to the EC such information for campaign purposes? For the last six months the PDRC has spent millions promoting its political platform, pursuing and securing political support, doing its final pushes to replace the current PTP administration. On the other hand the other 63 political parties including the PTP are restricted to a 60-day period prior to a scheduled election date to campaign and limited to how much funds can be spent to campaign. This is the law designed not to give any party an unfair advantage in spending for a campaign. Yet, the PDRC/Democrats appear to show no compliance with these legal constraints.

Therefore, isn't the PDRC/Democrat's political expenditures for the last six months UNCONSTITUTIONAL to remove the PTP administration, assuming the PDRC/Democrats will participate in the next elections? Maybe this matter should be brought to the Courts for review.

Don't be silly, these are "the good people".

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Yes they are the good people. What other group is looking to better Thailand. Also they are not a party running for office.

Using rickirs logic the red shirts should be submitting records going back years. Typical red shirt attitude I am better than you so I don't have to account for my actions. If they are wrong it is your fault. Well Mr rickirs you are about to fall of your pedestal and it is a long ways down. But you won't be alone.

Surprising the ignorance that some people will subscribe to just to continue corruption.

[ggold]

Meanwhile, United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship adviser Thida Tavornseth said the body would hold six "warm-up" rallies in some provinces over the next week as a rehearsal for a mass rally prior to the Constitutional Court ruling on Yingluck's premiership status.

That has to be the most telling part of the OP!

seems to me the UDD aren't exactly sure how many supporters they have, warm up rallies sounds like "we need to see how many come out before the mass rally"!

IF there ever is a mass rally?

[northernjohn]

Meanwhile, United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship adviser Thida Tavornseth said the body would hold six "warm-up" rallies in some provinces over the next week as a rehearsal for a mass rally prior to the Constitutional Court ruling on Yingluck's premiership status.

That has to be the most telling part of the OP!

seems to me the UDD aren't exactly sure how many supporters they have, warm up rallies sounds like "we need to see how many come out before the mass rally"!

IF there ever is a mass rally?

Or it could be a test to see how much it is going to cost to get a mass rally. Transportation for 100's of thousands alone will be a massive bill. Add to that the cost of food and the daily pay checks. Yes they need a test to see how many are willing to do it all for free.

[chooka]

Suthep has already admitted openly that he has been surprised at the just how stubborn this government is.....

BTW this is the same final push from the last 2 months, not a different one. This is the one based on the constitutional court case and NACC negligence cases. Which both seem to be getting constantly stretched out... So of course the final battle is constantly getting stretched out the same.

If these cases end up in YL's favour as I am starting to suspect through constant intimidation, then Suthep should call everything off and declare that it is officially over for Thailand, and they are all going to head down the toilet, and do not come crying when it all happens.... and we all know he will be right.

Thaksin will be back, and the country will go bankrupt, and Thailand will see a massive civil war.

What is even more boring than constant 'final battle' headlines.... is the same old faces spewing out the same old 'not another final battle' boll-ox and not offering up a debate.

The limit of their intelligence maybe?... who knows??

While I back Suthep to the hilt in what he is trying to accomplish I do admit the last battle and what not is getting old. He needs a new format. In this case the NACC has awarded the Thaksin/Yingluck clone 15 more days so it will not be decided legally until after April 30. He will have no alternative than to make a new last battle. I strongly suggest he switch from Rhetoric to positive action such as he has been doing with his visits to the various government offices where he has been warmly welcomed.

Having the backing of the bureaucracy is defiantly a plus factor in his campaign. Now I see where unions are backing him.

The sad part of the whole thing as far as Thai Visa posters go is that some of them back Yingluck who has no other Thai support than the red shirts who are a violent group. In the pay of her brother. Where as Suthep has the backing of the Thai people. Amazing how these foreigners can over look the fact that it was peaceful grass root Thai's that started this whole thing.

They throw their support in with the corrupt side. Most of them are as clueless as to the facts. They ramble on about in such and such a year or so and so did this in such and such a year and on and on they go. Any thing except the corruption and the people responsible for it in 2014.

I am not being naive and saying that corruption will be eliminated under a new leadership. It is a fact of life in every country in the world some worse than others. Under the present regime it has grown and the country has moved 14 countries closer to the most corrupt. They have become so sure of their power that they do not even try to hide it until the courts step in then it is Oh we need time. Time given and once again we need time They won't need time if they don't have to doctor the books. Now they want the NACC to take an inventory. That is their job not the NACC and they should have a current running balance that can easily be established in a week. It is right in your face corruption with no remorse for it. The only remorse they have shown is do to fear they will loose their power.

The writing is on the wall. Thaksin see's it and is offering to call an end to it with a condition that will allow him to save face. He says if justice is returned to the country. Mr. Thaksin Shinawatra that is exactly what will happen if you and your clan including hired thugs and bribed politicians leave politics and no longer try to influence them. You have your money and your dream castle in the sand now go. Give Thailand a chance to recover and put in stops to wannabe dictators like you so that it will never happen again.

Thailand will over look the justice of chasing you down and imprisoning you for life. That is justice and you defiantly don't want it.

In your country would you back a slimey little weasel like Suthep the biggest moron to be born on the planet to lead your country? The guy doesn't even know what he had for breakfast and is calling for his 250th final push. They fool is a full on idiot and doesn't even know when the sun is shinning. How on earth does this tool attract likewise idiots to him.

[larsjohnsson]

Yes another final battle. 28 in the last 3 months. I bet it includes some money collecting also

[Torkmada]

Final Battle??? He has been saying this since December 2013!!!

Perhaps he doesn't realise it but he won the battle back in December when he forced the house dissolution that has precipitated everything else!!! Actually, Thaksin lost the battle when he tried to sneak that amnesty bill in through the back door.

So, my congrats go out to Suthep on doing a sterling job and to Thaksin for being such an idiotic numbskull!

Perhaps you don't realise he lost the minute he refused to allow elections.

He not only lost, but he lost so big that the greedy elite are now finished forever.

Only elected governments will rule Thailand forever more.

No more coups of any kind - ever again.

Suthep has single handedly accomplished the Red Shirts main objective by destroying himself and his backers in the eyes of not only all Thais, but the world.

Thaksin owes Suthep a debt of gratitude to Suthep for the utter routing of his unelectable foes.

Edited April 25, 2014 by Torkmada

[dao16]

I wonder if any of them got tired around the 4th final battle or the 5th. Maybe they will get their second wind after a few more final battles. Guess it depends on how long the deadline for each final battle is....or something.

[fab4]

I wonder if any of them got tired around the 4th final battle or the 5th. Maybe they will get their second wind after a few more final battles. Guess it depends on how long the deadline for each final battle is....or something.

It may depend upon the weather. It would be terribly sad if the promised thunderstorms were to coincide with his final push - all those people wetting their whistles - and the poor luvvies in Lumpini, well.....................

[Bluespunk]

Suthep delivers "electrifying" news to the PEA.

Just as an aside:

Is the PDRC tracking all the donations it has received in the last six months and how it is spent? Is it reporting to the Government such information, ie., for tax purposes? Is it reporting to the NACC such information to assure noncorrupt uses? If the PDRC isn't accountable and transparent, how can the People expect it as a government to be so?

Is it reporting to the EC such information for campaign purposes? For the last six months the PDRC has spent millions promoting its political platform, pursuing and securing political support, doing its final pushes to replace the current PTP administration. On the other hand the other 63 political parties including the PTP are restricted to a 60-day period prior to a scheduled election date to campaign and limited to how much funds can be spent to campaign. This is the law designed not to give any party an unfair advantage in spending for a campaign. Yet, the PDRC/Democrats appear to show no compliance with these legal constraints.

Therefore, isn't the PDRC/Democrat's political expenditures for the last six months UNCONSTITUTIONAL to remove the PTP administration, assuming the PDRC/Democrats will participate in the next elections? Maybe this matter should be brought to the Courts for review.

Pdrc and Dems are not the same organisation. Whatever suthep does its not the doing of the Dems.

[visionchaser45]

Suthep has already admitted openly that he has been surprised at the just how stubborn this government is.....

BTW this is the same final push from the last 2 months, not a different one. This is the one based on the constitutional court case and NACC negligence cases. Which both seem to be getting constantly stretched out... So of course the final battle is constantly getting stretched out the same.

If these cases end up in YL's favour as I am starting to suspect through constant intimidation, then Suthep should call everything off and declare that it is officially over for Thailand, and they are all going to head down the toilet, and do not come crying when it all happens.... and we all know he will be right.

Thaksin will be back, and the country will go bankrupt, and Thailand will see a massive civil war.

What is even more boring than constant 'final battle' headlines.... is the same old faces spewing out the same old 'not another final battle' boll-ox and not offering up a debate.

The limit of their intelligence maybe?... who knows??

You have got to be the worst psychic ever. Your "vision" of Thailand's future if Suthep loses his "final battle" is laughable. If he wins, however, you are sure to see the civil war you envision because the people will not stand idly by and have their votes annulled again. It is time to break the election-coup cycle and let the democratic process run its course. Fascism is not the salvation of a struggling democracy.

[Boxclever]

I wonder if any of them got tired around the 4th final battle or the 5th. Maybe they will get their second wind after a few more final battles. Guess it depends on how long the deadline for each final battle is....or something.

It may depend upon the weather. It would be terribly sad if the promised thunderstorms were to coincide with his final push - all those people wetting their whistles - and the poor luvvies in Lumpini, well.....................

demanding

And don't forget forget about Suthep's rent-a-thugs, they'll get awefully irritated and demanding more money when they get all wet in the rains....

[anteater]

Why can't he just embrace the democratic process and work to move the county forward , this guy would love Thailand to be under military dictatorship for the long run

If you bother to listen to him and not only red radio, than you would know that Suthep want elections!

Wrong. Suthep SAYS he wants elections. Just like he SAYS that this is the final push. He SAYS a lot. He SAYS too much. Maybe he should consider keeping his stupid mouth shut?

[binjalin]

Final Battle??? He has been saying this since December 2013!!!

Perhaps he doesn't realise it but he won the battle back in December when he forced the house dissolution that has precipitated everything else!!! Actually, Thaksin lost the battle when he tried to sneak that amnesty bill in through the back door.

So, my congrats go out to Suthep on doing a sterling job and to Thaksin for being such an idiotic numbskull!

[moonao]

I wonder if any of them got tired around the 4th final battle or the 5th. Maybe they will get their second wind after a few more final battles. Guess it depends on how long the deadline for each final battle is....or something.

It may depend upon the weather. It would be terribly sad if the promised thunderstorms were to coincide with his final push - all those people wetting their whistles - and the poor luvvies in Lumpini, well.....................

demanding

And don't forget forget about Suthep's rent-a-thugs, they'll get awefully irritated and demanding more money when they get all wet in the rains....

im sure the gullible "faithful" will help pay the costs of the rent a mob with their donations ... although with numbers dwindling daily he will need to increase the "final battles" from once a week to 3 times a week to keep the money flowing

Edited April 25, 2014 by moonao

[englishoak]

I think hes trying to bore the people into submission........... Hes certainly not got a clue what final means.

[Mentors]

After PM Yingluck today has agreed for a possible meeting with Abhisit i would say the days of Suthep are numbered.

He will fall like a hot potaeto.

Edited April 25, 2014 by Mentors

[anteater]

The question is - which is more offensive - grenade attacks against the independent agencies, a push to do away with the independent agencies, a push to impeach six judges of the Constitutional Court and replace them with others, a continual exodus to Hong Kong to receive instructions from a man who was not even elected to run the country, an agency called CAPO that issues intimidating directives to the Constitutional Court and the National Anti-Corruption Commission, a demand from Jatuporn that the Constitutional Court renege from their constitutional duty by considering an article that is already in the Constitution, a UDD rally that called for secession and calling for ten million Thais to arm themselves with guns, an amnesty bill designed to pardon Thaksin and over 25,000 people convicted of corruption, a rice scheme investigation that is being blocked at every turn, a transfer case that awarded yet another Thaksin relative through unconstitutional means, that same judicial process being blocked at every turn - after a two and a half year process through the courts, and a potentially impeached prime minister who refuses to address her defense in court.

So exactly which is more offensive - that - or trying to alert people as to the danger posed by all the preceding ?

Anyone who takes more than two seconds to consider that clearly isn't worth persuading of anything.

There is no question. All those things are very offensive. But, what's your point? Suthep is less offensive when compared to government offenses?

A small turd is still a turd. Comparing him to bigger turds doesn't make him less offensive.

Your alternative to Suthep?

- PTP to carry on ? You think they performed just and well in advantage of the country?

- "democratic" (means here with intimidation and more foul tricks) elections which just continue PTP etc?

The alternative to Suthep is surely democracy and voting. It works in increasing numbers of countries worldwide, so why not in Thailand?

To answer my own question, probably the major reason it doesn't work here is that 'the real powers' do not have a commitment to it. Whenever 'the real powers' sense that things are not going in 'the right way' they close the show down and send in their puppets. Perhaps I miscalculate, but have there been about 20 coups since 1932? Sorry, I'm losing count. You'd have thought that, by now -- after all these coups -- people would realise that this 'coup-coup-coup system' doesn't work. But apparently the obvious hasn't sunk in, so they just keep the rotten quasi-feudal system going - 'we are the wise ones', 'we know best', 'we can't trust you voters (especially in Isaan), so we have to keep the coup option in reserve'.

There is only one way to restore stability in Thailand and that is to have a system that is adhered to. Some would say that that should be absolute rule, and it's a not unreasonable opinion. Others would say it should be democracy. If it is democracy, then the one rule you have to follow is that you follow the rules. If a party gets elected, they get to govern. The same applies to the next elected government. And the next. And the next. And the next. It's not rocket science: you just keep the system going and you trust the people. One man one vote: now, and next year, and next decade etc etc. No coups, no judicial coups, no 'disqualifications of governments'. Just keep asking the voters periodically what they want, and if they decide to kick out a certain party for incompetence, arrogance, corruption, etc - so be it. The people have spoken.

It's actually unbelieveable that, here in Thailand, we have to keep explaining the principles and benefits of democracy, but for some reason the middle-classes here (and many of the Bangkok falangs) just don't get it.

Edited April 25, 2014 by anteater

[FangFerang]

This is the real final battle. Really. The last final battle, especially since court rulings might vindicate the claim....I mean since they never declared a final battle before...I mean, since they were always..um..

What were they always about? I can't remember. They keep changing goals so fast just to stay in motion, er, I mean to stay focused, that;s it -- focused.

Suthep is NOT a puppet drone...I mean, he is not anti-democracy as long as his people get to define democracy...er, I mean Suthep is not a wolf in Thai's clothing -- really -- look at all the flaggy items of flair he wears...and he gives out golden whistles, real gold! He should get the platinum whistle! That's it!! When Suthep wears the platinum whistle...then it's all over, whatever it is..er, I mean whatever he says it is.

Amen. As long as he hates the puppet rice corrupt poo Shins, I don't care how many people his guards torture and throw in the river, er, I mean, all that was just staged to make him look bad -- that's it! It was staged! And I'm right anyway. Just ask the TVF intelligentsia,

Amen.

Edited April 25, 2014 by FangFerang

[thepool]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

The question is - which is more offensive - grenade attacks against the independent agencies, a push to do away with the independent agencies, a push to impeach six judges of the Constitutional Court and replace them with others, a continual exodus to Hong Kong to receive instructions from a man who was not even elected to run the country, an agency called CAPO that issues intimidating directives to the Constitutional Court and the National Anti-Corruption Commission, a demand from Jatuporn that the Constitutional Court renege from their constitutional duty by considering an article that is already in the Constitution, a UDD rally that called for secession and calling for ten million Thais to arm themselves with guns, an amnesty bill designed to pardon Thaksin and over 25,000 people convicted of corruption, a rice scheme investigation that is being blocked at every turn, a transfer case that awarded yet another Thaksin relative through unconstitutional means, that same judicial process being blocked at every turn - after a two and a half year process through the courts, and a potentially impeached prime minister who refuses to address her defense in court.

So exactly which is more offensive - that - or trying to alert people as to the danger posed by all the preceding ?

Anyone who takes more than two seconds to consider that clearly isn't worth persuading of anything.

There is no question. All those things are very offensive. But, what's your point? Suthep is less offensive when compared to government offenses?

A small turd is still a turd. Comparing him to bigger turds doesn't make him less offensive.

Your alternative to Suthep?

- PTP to carry on ? You think they performed just and well in advantage of the country?

- "democratic" (means here with intimidation and more foul tricks) elections which just continue PTP etc?

The alternative to Suthep is surely democracy and voting. It works in increasing numbers of countries worldwide, so why not in Thailand?

To answer my own question, probably the major reason it doesn't work here is that 'the real powers' do not have a commitment to it. Whenever 'the real powers' sense that things are not going in 'the right way' they close the show down and send in their puppets. Perhaps I miscalculate, but have there been about 20 coups since 1932? Sorry, I'm losing count. You'd have thought that, by now -- after all these coups -- people would realise that this 'coup-coup-coup system' doesn't work. But apparently the obvious hasn't sunk in, so they just keep the rotten quasi-feudal system going - 'we are the wise ones', 'we know best', 'we can't trust you voters (especially in Isaan), so we have to keep the coup option in reserve'.

There is only one way to restore stability in Thailand and that is to have a system that is adhered to. Some would say that that should be absolute rule, and it's a not unreasonable opinion. Others would say it should be democracy. If it is democracy, then the one rule you have to follow is that you follow the rules. If a party gets elected, they get to govern. The same applies to the next elected government. And the next. And the next. And the next. It's not rocket science: you just keep the system going and you trust the people. One man one vote: now, and next year, and next decade etc etc. No coups, no judicial coups, no 'disqualifications of governments'. Just keep asking the voters periodically what they want, and if they decide to kick out a certain party for incompetence, arrogance, corruption, etc - so be it. The people have spoken.

It's actually unbelieveable that, here in Thailand, we have to keep explaining the principles and benefits of democracy, but for some reason the middle-classes here (and many of the Bangkok falangs) just don't get it.

"Democracy " is wonderful !

Please explain that concept in Egypt, Zimbabwe and Iraq !

Democracy is about more than voting !

North Korea holds "elections" and the people vote !

Democracy demands a reasonably well educated population that rejects power hungry , massively corrupt politicians who "buy" votes with promises that cannot be kept .

Edited April 25, 2014 by thepool

[anteater]

The question is - which is more offensive - grenade attacks against the independent agencies, a push to do away with the independent agencies, a push to impeach six judges of the Constitutional Court and replace them with others, a continual exodus to Hong Kong to receive instructions from a man who was not even elected to run the country, an agency called CAPO that issues intimidating directives to the Constitutional Court and the National Anti-Corruption Commission, a demand from Jatuporn that the Constitutional Court renege from their constitutional duty by considering an article that is already in the Constitution, a UDD rally that called for secession and calling for ten million Thais to arm themselves with guns, an amnesty bill designed to pardon Thaksin and over 25,000 people convicted of corruption, a rice scheme investigation that is being blocked at every turn, a transfer case that awarded yet another Thaksin relative through unconstitutional means, that same judicial process being blocked at every turn - after a two and a half year process through the courts, and a potentially impeached prime minister who refuses to address her defense in court.

So exactly which is more offensive - that - or trying to alert people as to the danger posed by all the preceding ?

Anyone who takes more than two seconds to consider that clearly isn't worth persuading of anything.

Get off your soap box Mr Scamper.

I have some trouble working my way around your syntax. Your question seems to be this: which is more offensive, the alleged offenses that you list, or alerting people to those alleged offenses. You give us 2 seconds to decide.

Oh damm, my 2 seconds are up!

Well, after another 10 seconds I've come to a decision. I've decided that your action in alerting people to the alleged offences is more offensive to me - simply because I don't believe these are offenses at all!

Obviously your own opinion on these issues is completely different: you are a supporter of the Bangkok ammart, so everything they say and do has the ultimate validity of the Gospels. Well, that's your POV. It's not mine. I am a socialist. I am opposed to the forms of quasi-feudal privilege that we see in Thailand today, and of course all of those privileges eminate from the power base of the ammart in Bangkok.

So, as to your specific charges:

"grenade attacks": of course these should be condemned.

"independent agencies": independent? really?

"a continual exodus to Hong Kong": continual?

"a man who was not even elected to run the country": I assume you're referring to Dr Thaksin, the former PM, who was forced to leave Thailand due to controversial decisions by Thailand's ammart courts. Why shouldn't Thai politicians confer with this respected former PM?

"an agency called CAPO that issues intimidating directives to the Constitutional Court and the National Anti-Corruption Commission": CAPO is an agency set up by the elected government. As CAPO derives from an elected government, surely it has a right to challenge the decisions of courts set up by a bunch of unelected Generals.

"a UDD rally that called for secession and calling for ten million Thais to arm themselves with guns": I'm not sure of the sources here, but the secession claims have been repudiated already.

"an amnesty bill designed to pardon Thaksin and over 25,000 people convicted of corruption": agreed that this was dubious and was abandoned by the PT government; of course the red shirts never supported it. They have admirably said (as D. Streckfuss has reminded us) that they want everyone to be held responsible for their actions.

"a rice scheme investigation that is being blocked at every turn": says who?

"a transfer case that awarded yet another Thaksin relative through unconstitutional means": why should not the elected PM be allowed to appoint whomsoever she chooses? who says it was unconstitutional? You?

"a potentially impeached prime minister": oh, Mr Scamper, you exceed yourself!! "Potentially impeached": I have never heard that phrase before! Sadly, however, that "potentially" could turn into an "actually". And if that happens then I suspect that "all Hell will break loose" here in Siam.

Your ammart heroes know not what they do! But everyone else knows it all too well - these misguided out-of-date people are bringing disaster and war on this country, and people like you are encouraging them.

All (or nearly all) the independent international press realises that there is only one reasonable future for Thailand/Siam, and that is to "let democracy rule". Let's say it again:

"Let democracy rule"!

[JAG]

The question is - which is more offensive - grenade attacks against the independent agencies, a push to do away with the independent agencies, a push to impeach six judges of the Constitutional Court and replace them with others, a continual exodus to Hong Kong to receive instructions from a man who was not even elected to run the country, an agency called CAPO that issues intimidating directives to the Constitutional Court and the National Anti-Corruption Commission, a demand from Jatuporn that the Constitutional Court renege from their constitutional duty by considering an article that is already in the Constitution, a UDD rally that called for secession and calling for ten million Thais to arm themselves with guns, an amnesty bill designed to pardon Thaksin and over 25,000 people convicted of corruption, a rice scheme investigation that is being blocked at every turn, a transfer case that awarded yet another Thaksin relative through unconstitutional means, that same judicial process being blocked at every turn - after a two and a half year process through the courts, and a potentially impeached prime minister who refuses to address her defense in court.

So exactly which is more offensive - that - or trying to alert people as to the danger posed by all the preceding ?

Anyone who takes more than two seconds to consider that clearly isn't worth persuading of anything.

There is no question. All those things are very offensive. But, what's your point? Suthep is less offensive when compared to government offenses?

A small turd is still a turd. Comparing him to bigger turds doesn't make him less offensive.

Your alternative to Suthep?

- PTP to carry on ? You think they performed just and well in advantage of the country?

- "democratic" (means here with intimidation and more foul tricks) elections which just continue PTP etc?

The alternative to Suthep is surely democracy and voting. It works in increasing numbers of countries worldwide, so why not in Thailand?

To answer my own question, probably the major reason it doesn't work here is that 'the real powers' do not have a commitment to it. Whenever 'the real powers' sense that things are not going in 'the right way' they close the show down and send in their puppets. Perhaps I miscalculate, but have there been about 20 coups since 1932? Sorry, I'm losing count. You'd have thought that, by now -- after all these coups -- people would realise that this 'coup-coup-coup system' doesn't work. But apparently the obvious hasn't sunk in, so they just keep the rotten quasi-feudal system going - 'we are the wise ones', 'we know best', 'we can't trust you voters (especially in Isaan), so we have to keep the coup option in reserve'.

There is only one way to restore stability in Thailand and that is to have a system that is adhered to. Some would say that that should be absolute rule, and it's a not unreasonable opinion. Others would say it should be democracy. If it is democracy, then the one rule you have to follow is that you follow the rules. If a party gets elected, they get to govern. The same applies to the next elected government. And the next. And the next. And the next. It's not rocket science: you just keep the system going and you trust the people. One man one vote: now, and next year, and next decade etc etc. No coups, no judicial coups, no 'disqualifications of governments'. Just keep asking the voters periodically what they want, and if they decide to kick out a certain party for incompetence, arrogance, corruption, etc - so be it. The people have spoken.

It's actually unbelieveable that, here in Thailand, we have to keep explaining the principles and benefits of democracy, but for some reason the middle-classes here (and many of the Bangkok falangs) just don't get it.

"Democracy " is wonderful !

Please explain that concept in Egypt, Zimbabwe and Iraq !

Democracy is about more than voting !

North Korea holds "elections" and the people vote !

Democracy demands a reasonably well educated population that rejects power hungry , massively corrupt politicians who "buy" votes with promises that cannot be kept .

Read Anteaters rather thoughtful post again, carefully. You will find the answers to your outburst in it.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[anteater]

"Democracy " is wonderful !

Please explain that concept in Egypt, Zimbabwe and Iraq !

Democracy is about more than voting !

North Korea holds "elections" and the people vote !

Democracy demands a reasonably well educated population that rejects power hungry , massively corrupt politicians who "buy" votes with promises that cannot be kept .

Democracy is based on voting. That is its fundamental feature. As for your point that it's "about more than voting", well what more do you want to add in? 15 extra features, 18 features? Why do people want to complicate it? It's basically simple: democracy means that all the adult people in a country get to vote and decide. It is, as you say, a "wonderful" thing. I cannot express how wonderul it is: it changes societies, it brings so many benefits...

Clearly there are some extreme cases where voting is just a showcase, as in North Korea, but in other cases, actually voting does tend to get people what they want. I know Zimbabwe. Sure Mugabe is a tyrant, but basically he has got the black people in control, whereas back in the 1980s (as I know) the rich whites were in control. They owned most of the farms and took most of the profits. They told people that only they, the whites, could run the farms efficiently, and that seemed a reasonable view at the time. But if you look at the situation now, with loads of black farmers in control, well maybe things are actually better. (Yes, I said it, 'better'). However, it is clear that Mugabe killed many many people in his process of change. This transformation could have been handled so much more reasonably.

Egypt/Iraq: dunno. I don't think Thailand is comparable - as yet.

However, war could be coming to Thailand, developing from the low-grade insurgency (grenades etc) that we see right now. It just needs a few more hardliners like Suthep and this obsessional monarchist hospital manager to light the fuse - and then we'll be off. Bombs, terrorism, killings! All because no-one explained about democracy.

And meanwhile the flood of propaganda continues. BlueskyTV: they have learned the lesson from Goebbels, for sure!

[northernjohn]

Suthep has already admitted openly that he has been surprised at the just how stubborn this government is.....

BTW this is the same final push from the last 2 months, not a different one. This is the one based on the constitutional court case and NACC negligence cases. Which both seem to be getting constantly stretched out... So of course the final battle is constantly getting stretched out the same.

If these cases end up in YL's favour as I am starting to suspect through constant intimidation, then Suthep should call everything off and declare that it is officially over for Thailand, and they are all going to head down the toilet, and do not come crying when it all happens.... and we all know he will be right.

Thaksin will be back, and the country will go bankrupt, and Thailand will see a massive civil war.

What is even more boring than constant 'final battle' headlines.... is the same old faces spewing out the same old 'not another final battle' boll-ox and not offering up a debate.

The limit of their intelligence maybe?... who knows??

While I back Suthep to the hilt in what he is trying to accomplish I do admit the last battle and what not is getting old. He needs a new format. In this case the NACC has awarded the Thaksin/Yingluck clone 15 more days so it will not be decided legally until after April 30. He will have no alternative than to make a new last battle. I strongly suggest he switch from Rhetoric to positive action such as he has been doing with his visits to the various government offices where he has been warmly welcomed.

Having the backing of the bureaucracy is defiantly a plus factor in his campaign. Now I see where unions are backing him.

The sad part of the whole thing as far as Thai Visa posters go is that some of them back Yingluck who has no other Thai support than the red shirts who are a violent group. In the pay of her brother. Where as Suthep has the backing of the Thai people. Amazing how these foreigners can over look the fact that it was peaceful grass root Thai's that started this whole thing.

They throw their support in with the corrupt side. Most of them are as clueless as to the facts. They ramble on about in such and such a year or so and so did this in such and such a year and on and on they go. Any thing except the corruption and the people responsible for it in 2014.

I am not being naive and saying that corruption will be eliminated under a new leadership. It is a fact of life in every country in the world some worse than others. Under the present regime it has grown and the country has moved 14 countries closer to the most corrupt. They have become so sure of their power that they do not even try to hide it until the courts step in then it is Oh we need time. Time given and once again we need time They won't need time if they don't have to doctor the books. Now they want the NACC to take an inventory. That is their job not the NACC and they should have a current running balance that can easily be established in a week. It is right in your face corruption with no remorse for it. The only remorse they have shown is do to fear they will loose their power.

The writing is on the wall. Thaksin see's it and is offering to call an end to it with a condition that will allow him to save face. He says if justice is returned to the country. Mr. Thaksin Shinawatra that is exactly what will happen if you and your clan including hired thugs and bribed politicians leave politics and no longer try to influence them. You have your money and your dream castle in the sand now go. Give Thailand a chance to recover and put in stops to wannabe dictators like you so that it will never happen again.

Thailand will over look the justice of chasing you down and imprisoning you for life. That is justice and you defiantly don't want it.

In your country would you back a slimey little weasel like Suthep the biggest moron to be born on the planet to lead your country? The guy doesn't even know what he had for breakfast and is calling for his 250th final push. They fool is a full on idiot and doesn't even know when the sun is shinning. How on earth does this tool attract likewise idiots to him.

Well two things you are obviously not aware of.

1 He is not running for office and

2 He is suggesting a way to better Thailand.

Now you may not agree with his way or you may enjoy the corruption that is your own personnel choice.

I back the man for what he is trying to do. Yes I would suggest a few changes to his methods but it makes no difference. Thailand would still come out the winner.

Now would I back him in my country if he was as bad as you say or even twice as bad. Yes I would if the alternative was what we have here in Thailand. What thinking person wouldn't?

You are making it a personal thing where as I am thinking of the greater good for Thailand. I personally don't feel it will make any difference to foreigners who wins unless they are in on the graft.

Them I understand backing Thaksin.

[northernjohn]

After PM Yingluck today has agreed for a possible meeting with Abhisit i would say the days of Suthep are numbered.

He will fall like a hot potaeto.

You also are missing the whole point.

It is not about Suthep it is about the principle's that are good for Thailand about getting rid of as much corruption as they can.

Suthep may very well fall by the way side but the principle's he has been fighting for will live on.

[larsjohnsson]

After PM Yingluck today has agreed for a possible meeting with Abhisit i would say the days of Suthep are numbered.

He will fall like a hot potaeto.

You also are missing the whole point.

It is not about Suthep it is about the principle's that are good for Thailand about getting rid of as much corruption as they can.

Suthep may very well fall by the way side but the principle's he has been fighting for will live on.

Why use a man like Suthep then? He is known for being involved in corruption

[Torkmada]

"Democracy " is wonderful !

Please explain that concept in Egypt, Zimbabwe and Iraq !

Democracy is about more than voting !

North Korea holds "elections" and the people vote !

Democracy demands a reasonably well educated population that rejects power hungry , massively corrupt politicians who "buy" votes with promises that cannot be kept .

Mentioning North Korea and democracy in the same statement shows your complete level of ignorance on the subject matter.

Stop trying to dress up your bigotry and discrimination against the majority of Thais.

They are not too dumb to vote, you only think they are because you're a prejudicial fascist anti-democratic small minded nothing.

[tullynagardy]

.

Now you may not agree with his way or you may enjoy the corruption that is your own personnel choice.

Simple question -

Do you agree Suthep is one of the most corrupt politicians in recent Thai history? yes or no?

Dont reply about Thaskin etc as we know hes a bit of a shit, the question is about Suthep.

If you are in any way read up on the subject you will know he is. As such is he the best person to run an anti corruption campaign?

[Publicus]

After PM Yingluck today has agreed for a possible meeting with Abhisit i would say the days of Suthep are numbered.

He will fall like a hot potaeto.

You also are missing the whole point.

It is not about Suthep it is about the principle's that are good for Thailand about getting rid of as much corruption as they can.

Suthep may very well fall by the way side but the principle's he has been fighting for will live on.

And what are Suthep's principles?

Suthep wants an unelected and still anonymous "People's Council" appointed through him by the Bangkok ammart, accountable to no one, to rule the country in the absence of representative democratic government. One can dare say it likely couldn't be any worse to indefinitely have a caretaker government than to have a council so completely detached from any or all democratic processes and procedures. After all, the caretaker government keeps trying to have an election Suthep and his street thugs twice have violently pillaged.

Suthep's record as the enforcer in Abhisit's ammart and military installed government during the 2010 civil disorder gives us clear evidence of what he might do if citizens demonstrated their protest against this exclusivist and autocratic elitist "People's Council" form of absolute, paternal rule. Should Suthep expect any different than what occurred in 2010.

Suthep wants an appointed and unelected national assembly to solely itself write up and impose "reforms" on everyone else and to which everyone else must adhere, while the pains and penalties of disagreement are unstated. It's well known Suthep doesn't handle disagreement or dissent very well, or well at all. Suthep is in fact contemptuous of dissent, disagreement, criticisms, critiques. (Worse yet, he might be oblivious to such.)

Suthep has declared himself the sovereign of the people, placing himself in the position of recommending to the de jure and moral Sovereign those who would have appointed, absolute, unchecked ruling authority over the entire country, to include civil society groups, mass and online media, political parties.

Suthep has made clear he rejects compromise. He's made clear he rejects negotiations. He rejects the rule of law and its processes. Suthep has never as much as admitted to his past and massive corruption. I don't trust or believe a person who will not, cannot, admit to his past faults or wrongful schemes while he bogusly poses anew as the crusader against the kind of crimes from which he himself has been exempted. Exempted by whom? Exempted by the corrupt Bangkok ammart.

[Publicus]

While I back Suthep to the hilt in what he is trying to accomplish I do admit the last battle and what not is getting old. He needs a new format. In this case the NACC has awarded the Thaksin/Yingluck clone 15 more days so it will not be decided legally until after April 30. He will have no alternative than to make a new last battle. I strongly suggest he switch from Rhetoric to positive action such as he has been doing with his visits to the various government offices where he has been warmly welcomed.

Having the backing of the bureaucracy is defiantly a plus factor in his campaign. Now I see where unions are backing him.

The sad part of the whole thing as far as Thai Visa posters go is that some of them back Yingluck who has no other Thai support than the red shirts who are a violent group. In the pay of her brother. Where as Suthep has the backing of the Thai people. Amazing how these foreigners can over look the fact that it was peaceful grass root Thai's that started this whole thing.

They throw their support in with the corrupt side. Most of them are as clueless as to the facts. They ramble on about in such and such a year or so and so did this in such and such a year and on and on they go. Any thing except the corruption and the people responsible for it in 2014.

I am not being naive and saying that corruption will be eliminated under a new leadership. It is a fact of life in every country in the world some worse than others. Under the present regime it has grown and the country has moved 14 countries closer to the most corrupt. They have become so sure of their power that they do not even try to hide it until the courts step in then it is Oh we need time. Time given and once again we need time They won't need time if they don't have to doctor the books. Now they want the NACC to take an inventory. That is their job not the NACC and they should have a current running balance that can easily be established in a week. It is right in your face corruption with no remorse for it. The only remorse they have shown is do to fear they will loose their power.

The writing is on the wall. Thaksin see's it and is offering to call an end to it with a condition that will allow him to save face. He says if justice is returned to the country. Mr. Thaksin Shinawatra that is exactly what will happen if you and your clan including hired thugs and bribed politicians leave politics and no longer try to influence them. You have your money and your dream castle in the sand now go. Give Thailand a chance to recover and put in stops to wannabe dictators like you so that it will never happen again.

Thailand will over look the justice of chasing you down and imprisoning you for life. That is justice and you defiantly don't want it.

In your country would you back a slimey little weasel like Suthep the biggest moron to be born on the planet to lead your country? The guy doesn't even know what he had for breakfast and is calling for his 250th final push. They fool is a full on idiot and doesn't even know when the sun is shinning. How on earth does this tool attract likewise idiots to him.

Well two things you are obviously not aware of.

1 He is not running for office and

2 He is suggesting a way to better Thailand.

Now you may not agree with his way or you may enjoy the corruption that is your own personnel choice.

I back the man for what he is trying to do. Yes I would suggest a few changes to his methods but it makes no difference. Thailand would still come out the winner.

Now would I back him in my country if he was as bad as you say or even twice as bad. Yes I would if the alternative was what we have here in Thailand. What thinking person wouldn't?

You are making it a personal thing where as I am thinking of the greater good for Thailand. I personally don't feel it will make any difference to foreigners who wins unless they are in on the graft.

Them I understand backing Thaksin.

It is clear you fail to realize how self-defeating you are each time you say those of us who support democracy do instead and in fact "enjoy the corruption that is your own personal choice." It appears I need to say to you, as incredible as it is, I oppose corruption, and I oppose it in all forms, ways and in all places at all times. You don't know this?

Is it possible for you to seriously consider and reflect on this and so many other statements of this nature:

You are making it a personal thing where as I am thinking of the greater good for Thailand. I personally don't feel it will make any difference to foreigners who wins unless they are in on the graft.

Them I understand backing Thaksin.

It is clear you need to know that it is just impossible for me to take your actual views seriously while you continue to make out of bounds and self-contradictory statements such as these.