US Paypal -> Bangkok Bank vs. NY Branch ACH fees ?

[chubby]

I'm just looking for a backup to the ACH NY Branch route via Schwab Brokerage.

I am checking with Schwab on setting up the ability to wire transfer before I leave the US.

But, perhaps something besides Schwab as a backup, and so far haven't found anything.... is the point (paypal, domestic vs international wires, etc)

[Pib]

Just open another bank account which provides ACH transfers....many have been identified in other threads.

[chubby]

Pib, I'm curious if many of them will require a BBL Checking account, which I'm guessing I need a WP or O-A/extension to open ? As this is what Cap One 360 is saying is required for ACH.

Maybe, what I need is a 2nd Brokerage-> BBL Savings Link instead. Or as I was alluding to, using the NY Branch. Cap One 360 just wrote back to me the following:

---

At Capital One 360, funds can only be transferred to banks chartered within the United States. If you need to transfer funds internationally, we recommend transferring the funds to your linked external checking account, and initiating the transaction from there.

---

Hence, kind of confirms my question about whether a wire sent via the NY Branch would be considered "Domestic" or not for them, I hate to ask them, as I don't know if they will give any reliable answer, whatever, they might say...... thx

[Langsuan Man]

Who said anything about a checking account ?

You can EFTS or ACH to a savings account, so long as you have a routing and account number

I think that you are reading too much into what Capital One 360 is saying. If you use Bangkok Banks routing number 026008691, followed by your Bangkok Bank account number, as far as any US bank is concerned it is a domestic transfer and is just like adding any US Bank to your "external" transfers

If you use Bangkok Banks SWIFT number, which I listed above, then of course Cap One is going to know that it is not a Domestic transfer and will treat it as an International transfer

EDIT: Seems to me that you don't understand the difference between a "Wire" and a Electronic Funds Transfer System or Automated Clearing House (both terms mean the same thing)

Edited May 16, 2014 by Langsuan Man

[slipperylobster]

XE works well enough. I lock in a rate and buy baht (money is drafted from my usa acct and converted by XE the same day...but then XE wires it to BBK (takes 7 to 10 days total)

21 usd is the cost....but I do it only every two months...so my actual cost is 10 usd per month or close to that.

My bank limits me to usd per ATM transaction daily. So 4000 usd would cost me way more than 21 usd (XE), as I would need 7 withdrawals (about double XE)

Edited May 16, 2014 by slipperylobster

[Pib]

XE works well enough. I lock in a rate and buy baht (money is drafted from my usa acct and converted by XE the same day...but then XE wires it to BBK (takes 7 to 10 days total)

21 usd is the cost....but I do it only every two months...so my actual cost is 10 usd per month or close to that.

My bank limits me to usd per ATM transaction daily. So 4000 usd would cost me way more than 21 usd (XE), as I would need 7 withdrawals (about double XE)

Is that $21 the XE.com wire cost only? Sounds within the ballpark for a wire fee...actually on the lower end of the ballpark cost which is good...wire/SWIFT fees can typically cost much more...up to $50 in some cases, but $25 to $40 is probably typical range.

If the $21 is the XE.com wire cost only, then you also still have the in-Thailand Bangkok Bank branch (or any Thai bank branch) currency receipt/conversion cost of 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max) whether the funds arrive in foreign currency or already converted to baht...this fee will not reflect on you bank account statement/passbook as the fee is applied before posting of the funds.

And if routing the money through Bangkok Bank New York branch using "ACH" then you also have that fee which is probably going to be $5 or $10 depending on the amount you are transferring...ditto regarding the fee will not appear on your account statement/passbook as it was applied before final posting to your in-Thailand bank account. However, but, you did say you are "wiring" the money so I expect in this case it goes directly to your Thailand branch versus being routed through the NY branch and the NY branch fee will not apply....but you will still have the 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max) in-Thailand currency receipt/conversion fee.

One more question, the last time you did an XE.com transfer what specific exchange rate did you get and what date was it on? Would like to see how that compared to the Bangkok Bank TT Buying Rate on that date. When looking a XE.com it just reflects the midpoint rate of the buying and selling rates...and since the midpoint rate is info only and never used any any buy or sell action (only the buy or sell rate is used) I'm curious as to what "actual" rates a person would get...I expect it would always be south of the midpoint rate. Thanks.

[wjuranek]

So have money sent to me via SWIFT wire transfer, which cost $50 fee with a better exchange rate than PayPal. Cost more but guaranteed to be in my account within 2 business days.

Yes, SWIFT is the fastest way to send money to Thailand, but at a cost. And ACH transfer times vary widely, many banks using a middleman (including Bank of America). And since ACH transfers are batch processed, if your bank slow cycles these batches, well, you'll be waiting several days for your money.

Other banks, besides not even charging for an ACH transfer, are fairly quick. USAA takes no more than 33 hours, in my experience (if no weekends/holidays): Go on-line at midnight Monday, Thai time (noon San Antonio) and initiate the transfer. And at 0900 on Wednesday, your money should be there. And like a SWIFT, you'll get the buying TT rate, plus the .0025 backend fee. But, you won't be paying a frontend fee of $50. Only $5 or $10.

Yes, USAA has a $5000 transfer cap -- but this can be tripled, even for relatively new customers. Or, if you've been with them for 47 years, you can raise it to $30k (maybe more, but why?).

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Pib]

Pib, I'm curious if many of them will require a BBL Checking account, which I'm guessing I need a WP or O-A/extension to open ? As this is what Cap One 360 is saying is required for ACH. Maybe, what I need is a 2nd Brokerage-> BBL Savings Link instead. Or as I was alluding to, using the NY Branch. Cap One 360 just wrote back to me the following: --- At Capital One 360, funds can only be transferred to banks chartered within the United States. If you need to transfer funds internationally, we recommend transferring the funds to your linked external checking account, and initiating the transaction from there. --- Hence, kind of confirms my question about whether a wire sent via the NY Branch would be considered "Domestic" or not for them, I hate to ask them, as I don't know if they will give any reliable answer, whatever, they might say...... thx

Who said anything about a checking account ?

You can EFTS or ACH to a savings account, so long as you have a routing and account number

I think that you are reading too much into what Capital One 360 is saying. If you use Bangkok Banks routing number 026008691, followed by your Bangkok Bank account number, as far as any US bank is concerned it is a domestic transfer and is just like adding any US Bank to your "external" transfers

If you use Bangkok Banks SWIFT number, which I listed above, then of course Cap One is going to know that it is not a Domestic transfer and will treat it as an International transfer

EDIT: Seems to me that you don't understand the difference between a "Wire" and a Electronic Funds Transfer System or Automated Clearing House (both terms mean the same thing)

@ chubby....^^^^what Langsuan Man said. I have ACH transfer setup between my different banks going and coming from different Savings accounts...and Checking accounts. When setting up the funds transfer link to Bangkok Bank treat it purely as a "domestic" transfer because the Bangkok Bank New York branch is registered as a U.S. commercial bank. Each bank's online funds transfer setup is a little different...if your CapOne 360 account asks for the banks address use the NY branch's address; not the in-Thailand branch address. Usually they don't even ask for address anymore because they use the routing number to look up the address automatically. If it asks are you sending a Savings or Checking account select Savings....if they don't ask don't worry about because the bank ain't worrying about it. Use your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank savings account number--remember, continue to think "domestic transfer" because the money is going to the NY branch who will relay it to the in-Thailand branch. You should be able to setup an ACH transfer link no problem...I don't remember reading any other post saying CapOne 360 wouldn't allow ACH transfers to Bangkok Bank.;b++){var>

[chubby]

Believe me , I have tried multiple times, they don't allow online setup, so I must call the security number , for some reason , when I do, that is exactly what they told me clearly it "must be a checking account on the other end of the outgoing ACH transfer"

If someone else has a capital one 360 account and have successfully setup a "linked account" to BBL via NYC, AND they have the SAME type of account I do at BBL , I'd be interested to hear it.

It may very well be that CO.360/ING: have different set of rules that others, sometimes, it makes me nervous that linked account are 2 way, and maybe I should just use the Schwab checking/brokerage to clear the cap one transfers, and keep a small amount there, but then I need a wire relationship from Cap One, which I'm working on, how do-able that one is directly to BBL Asoke....

thx

[Langsuan Man]

The Cap 360 to Bangkok Bank is not two way. It is only one way. You can only transfer into Bangkok Bank, you cannot transfer out of Bangkok Bank

But your last post did reveal something. What do you mean by have the SAME type of account I do at BBL

Do you have anything other than a passbook savings account at Bangkok Bank ?

[chubby]

But your last post did reveal something. What do you mean by have the SAME type of account I do at BBL

..........yes, on a tourist visa someyears ago I got a Be1 debit card with visa logo, and a "savings account"

Do you have anything other than a passbook savings account at Bangkok Bank ?

 

....nope i don't and am not in country, nor do I have a non-o visa at all for now

[Pib]

Believe me , I have tried multiple times, they don't allow online setup, so I must call the security number , for some reason , when I do, that is exactly what they told me clearly it "must be a checking account on the other end of the outgoing ACH transfer"If someone else has a capital one 360 account and have successfully setup a "linked account" to BBL via NYC, AND they have the SAME type of account I do at BBL.

I still find it hard to believe you can only do an ACH transfer to a "checking" account at CapPne 360. At my U.S. banks I can setup online ACH transfers to savings or checking accounts to any domestic bank, to include Bangkok Bank New York.

Savings accounts in Thailand are different than U.S. savings accounts. Savings accounts in Thailand can have money withdrawn unlimited times per month and they come with debit cards, but U.S. savings accounts usually are limited to 6 withdrawals per month and do not come with a debit card. Comparing Thai and U.S. savings accounts is like comparing apples and oranges.

Heck why don't you try setting up the transfer link by identifying the Bkk Bk account as a checking acct.

And as already mentioned never try to do an online "pull" of money from you Thai bank account...it will be rejected/blocked due to Bank of Thailand regulations...money can only flow out of Thailand for certain reasons and with proper approval.

Sent from my Samsung S4

[joealx]

"Savings accounts in Thailand are different than U.S. savings accounts. Savings accounts in Thailand can have money withdrawn unlimited times per month and they come with debit cards, but U.S. savings accounts usually are limited to 6 withdrawals per month and do not come with a debit card. Comparing Thai and U.S. savings accounts is like comparing apples and oranges."

Savings accounts here are the same as interest checking (current account) accounts in the US, but without the checks.

[Pib]

Believe me , I have tried multiple times, they don't allow online setup, so I must call the security number , for some reason , when I do, that is exactly what they told me clearly it "must be a checking account on the other end of the outgoing ACH transfer"If someone else has a capital one 360 account and have successfully setup a "linked account" to BBL via NYC, AND they have the SAME type of account I do at BBL.

I still find it hard to believe you can only do an ACH transfer to a "checking" account at CapPne 360. At my U.S. banks I can setup online ACH transfers to savings or checking accounts to any domestic bank, to include Bangkok Bank New York.

Savings accounts in Thailand are different than U.S. savings accounts. Savings accounts in Thailand can have money withdrawn unlimited times per month and they come with debit cards, but U.S. savings accounts usually are limited to 6 withdrawals per month and do not come with a debit card. Comparing Thai and U.S. savings accounts is like comparing apples and oranges.

Heck why don't you try setting up the transfer link by identifying the Bkk Bk account as a checking acct.

And as already mentioned never try to do an online "pull" of money from you Thai bank account...it will be rejected/blocked due to Bank of Thailand regulations...money can only flow out of Thailand for certain reasons and with proper approval.

Sent from my Samsung S4

From searching on CapOne 360's site they do seem to state/imply ACH transfer are to "checking accounts only." See below cut and paste. But without seeing the link setup menu and what questions/data they ask during the setup I"m still not convinced CapOne360 would not setup a link to a savings account "by just giving the routing number, account number and "If" asked is it a checking account account you just say yes." Then see what happens. It may setup fine, but the worst thing that could happen is the link wouldn't setup.

The reason I'm still not convinced is because with my U.S. banks I have ACH transfer links setup to savings and checking accounts so its not an ACH rule, although CapOne 360 may not allow it for gosh knows what reason. For example, I just looked at the various ACH transfer links I have setup with my USAA bank account and I have 7 ACH links going to/from Savings accounts at my other banks to include Bangkok Bank....3 of those 7 links are to Bangkok Bank Savings accounts. I also have 5 ACH links setup to Checking accounts at various banks.

[chubby]

You know, how it is when you get the run around, I believe Cap One360 said "for security reasons", but maybe it's more about the joelx said, there is a limit to monthly dep/withdrawals...

on one of the other topics, have you no concern, about having ACH accounts with large deposits linked to BBL vs a US bank ?

[Langsuan Man]

The first thing I would do would be to get rid of Capital One 360 and get a more reasonable bank for your Schwab back up

Their security both for the bank and their credit cards is a little over the top, IMHO. My Master Card is set to expire in July and they notified me that they were going to send me a new card now. Even though I had told them I was overseas in October till June (otherwise they would block the card) they responded that they could not stop the new card from being mailed immediately

My point being that sometimes these bank security rules trump common sense and when they do I vote with my feet

on one of the other topics, have you no concern, about having ACH accounts with large deposits linked to BBL vs a US bank ?

Why would anyone have any concerns? Bangkok Bank in New York is a legally chartered bank in the US and is subject to the same rules as any other US Bank. As a Commercial bank it does not have FDIC protection for deposit accounts but since it is more of a clearing house than a brick and mortar bank it doesn't maintain funds in the first place so FDIC insurance is not needed or required

[Langsuan Man]

Looks like another duplicate post day at TV

Edited May 18, 2014 by Langsuan Man

[Pib]

You know, how it is when you get the run around, I believe Cap One360 said "for security reasons", but maybe it's more about the joelx said, there is a limit to monthly dep/withdrawals... on one of the other topics, have you no concern, about having ACH accounts with large deposits linked to BBL vs a US bank ?

Why should I worry, BBL New York is registered as a U.S. bank (not that that makes a big difference) just like any other U.S. bank....does this mean I need to worry about all my U.S. banks doing something bad...moving my money around without me initiating the transfer. What do you think is going to happen???....bad guys at BBL initiating a funds "pull" from my U.S. accounts without my permission to put in my BBL accounts.

Many U.S. banks do have an daily/monthly transfer limit...$5,000 "daily" is a common limit...but these limits can usually be raised by request. And other banks practically have no limits--if you got it in your you can transfer it even if a million dollars....of course their security folks will still be evaluating the transfer. Varies from bank to bank.

You might want to consider dumping CapOne 360 if they are really that chicken sh^t about doing ACH transfers. If you have veteran status or can connect yourself to someone in your family with veteran status you might want to consider opening a USAA bank account as they are very expat friendly since most of their customer base is military related that live all over the world, active duty and retired. Their card products do carry a small foreign transaction fee, but the main reason to join them would not be for their cards but for their excellent banking support which is expat friendly. State Farm Bank may be another one to consider as they have a no foreign transaction fee debit card which reimburses ATM fees...now during logon occasionally you will have to correctly answer 3 or 4 multiple choice answer history questions on yourself to get logged on like what address have you lived at in the past, what was the mortgage loan amount for, a past home phone number, etc...all public records type stuff. So far the questions have been easy enough because the correct answer usually clearly stands out in a person's mind compared to the other wrong answers. I know Langsuan Man loves these pop quizzes especially with his long history of moving around where a person tends to forget info about places they lived before....I can associate as its getting harder for me to remember where I was at yesterday.

[ClutchClark]

You can't open a Bangkok Bank NY branch account as they are a wholesale/cooperate branch...they don't open retail accounts for the common guy. You must have an "in-Thailand" Bangkok Bank account. Then you use the NY branch routing number and your in-Thailand branch account number to do low cost ACH transfers to your in-Thailand branch. With all other Thai banks you are stuck in using pricey wire/SWIFT transfers. Now that you have experience in opening Kbank and SCB account, then opening a Bangkok Bank account should be old hat to you so you can then use the low cost ACH transfer method.

Here's the Bangkok Bank webpage with more info about transferring money to a Bangkok Bank account via their NY Branch.

Do I have to be the account holder of record on the BKK bank account?

Or can the account be in the name of a different recipient than myself?

Thanks.

[chubby]

Guess I think of having a "linked account" to a "thai bank" as having some risk , yes. As I am guessing fraud, and remediation of fraud, could be worse under the thai system in general, albeit, unlikely w/reasonable caution. Not the BBL, but the various online risks(MITM), and identity fraud, etc, but I can see your pretty confident

<br> <br>

I'm a little dubious, on online banking in general, so I asked. thx again pib. <br>

Is USAA only for family, or could I get in as "cousin"(friend) or something not official ; lots of military near where I am......

Edited May 18, 2014 by chubby

[Pib]

Is USAA only for family, or could I get in as "cousin"(friend) or something not official ; lots of military near where I am......

Check it out yourself at: https://www.usaa.com/inet/pages/why_choose_usaa_main?wa_ref=pub_global_usaaandu

[Pib]

You can't open a Bangkok Bank NY branch account as they are a wholesale/cooperate branch...they don't open retail accounts for the common guy. You must have an "in-Thailand" Bangkok Bank account. Then you use the NY branch routing number and your in-Thailand branch account number to do low cost ACH transfers to your in-Thailand branch. With all other Thai banks you are stuck in using pricey wire/SWIFT transfers. Now that you have experience in opening Kbank and SCB account, then opening a Bangkok Bank account should be old hat to you so you can then use the low cost ACH transfer method.

Here's the Bangkok Bank webpage with more info about transferring money to a Bangkok Bank account via their NY Branch.

Do I have to be the account holder of record on the BKK bank account?

Or can the account be in the name of a different recipient than myself?

Thanks.

You need to have an account at a "in-Thailand" Bangkok Bank branch to use the Bangkok Bank New York branch funds transfer routing number. You can't use the service to transfer funds to another Thai bank like to Kbank, SCB, etc. It's purely an "in-house" Bangkok Bank funds transfer thing.

The account would need to be in your name or you as a joint account owner.

To setup an ACH transfer link a bank they will ask if you are the account owner and then usually sends a few trial deposits for you to validate...the trial deposits arrive in your account...you then validate those trial deposits and then the link is established for your use. Otherwise, you are pretty relegated to spending a pricey wire/SWIFT transfer to a specific person...to an account you do not own. But hey, you could try setting up a transfer link to another person's account...the banks may not catch the name mismatch which could indicate "maybe" some money laundering is going on or some other sneaky thing (not to imply anything)...plus there are plenty of posts on ThaiVisa where the Thai bank kicked back certain funds transfer because the name on the Thai bank account did not match the name of the Sender. U.S. banks vary in the requirements to setup a funds transfer link.

[chubby]

ya, if thats for me, i'm already setup on Schwab, but I just remembered my deceased father, was in the army in the 1950s, I wonder if that would work or if they'd have proof or want proof, I'll call USAA and think about ditching the 'big bank' , though ING used to be known for its customer service too, and is paying 0.75% for their savings account last I checked

[lomatopo]

What is the fee schedule skimmed at BBL/NY?

I think it is $10 up to some amount, then $20 over that, but I can remember the thresholds. And is there a fee greater than $20 over some amount?

[Pib]

What is the fee schedule skimmed at BBL/NY?

I think it is $10 up to some amount, then $20 over that, but I can remember the thresholds. And is there a fee greater than $20 over some amount?

Bangkok Bank New York branch fees are:

And then when the funds arrive your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank branch there is a currency receipt/conversion fee of 0.25% (Bt200 mn, Bt500 max) whether the funds arrive in a foreign currency or already converted to baht.

[chubby]

for the record capital one does not do "wires" , but their ACH may go through it seems , and USAA is only if your parents were insurance members in the past, for the banking part of it, hence i'm not eligible.....

[chubby]

Is there a way to "pin" the summary of US banks and NFT credit cards to this forum , or must I learn to use the search function better?

Right now I have capital one credit cards, which I had thought were fine, but langsuan is saying otherwise, I'm considering Pen-Fed as a backup to Schwab instead of Capital One, but want to make an informed decision etc

thx

[Langsuan Man]

Is there a way to "pin" the summary of US banks and NFT credit cards to this forum , or must I learn to use the search function better?

Right now I have capital one credit cards, which I had thought were fine, but langsuan is saying otherwise, I'm considering Pen-Fed as a backup to Schwab instead of Capital One, but want to make an informed decision etc

thx

Whoa, all I said was that I think that Capitol Ones Credit Card security was pretty two faced in that they were more concerned in getting me a new card in May for one that expired in July, never mind the security consequences of sending a new card when they knew I was not at the card address. Their rewards card is outstanding and I , like Pib , use it for all my purchases here in Thailand

Posted 2014-05-18 08:59:04

The first thing I would do would be to get rid of Capital One 360 and get a more reasonable bank for your Schwab back up

Their security both for the bank and their credit cards is a little over the top, IMHO. My Master Card is set to expire in July and they notified me that they were going to send me a new card now. Even though I had told them I was overseas in October till June (otherwise they would block the card) they responded that they could not stop the new card from being mailed immediately

My point being that sometimes these bank security rules trump common sense and when they do I vote with my feet

[Pib]

You got that right!!!!....the wife and I use our CapOne Visa and Mastercard credit cards which pay 1.5% cash back "as much as we can/almost every day." I use the Visa card mostly since its exchange rate is usually a little better than Mastercard...the wife uses the Mastercard for occasional buys. I use both cards for online buys like at Ebay. First got the CapOne Mastercard when it was paying 2% cash back but once it dropped to 1.5% I also got a CapOne Visa card paying 1.5% cash back. I just wish I could use the cards at Makro since we by a lot of food there, but noooooo, the only credit card accepted by Makro is their Citibank-Makro credit card. Been using the CapOne credit cards for years in Thailand....never a problem.

Using the cards greatly reduces the amount of cash I need to bring into Thailand from the U.S. via ACH transfers/ATM withdrawals....when the credit card ebill comes monthly I pay it off in full online. Good way to keep your U.S. credit score/rating in good standing also by using your no foreign transaction fee U.S. credit card(s)....plus you are covered under U.S. consumer protection laws compared to the weaker Thai consumer protection laws....and if fraudulent transactions ever occur against your card you will be dealing with English speaking customer support reps at your U.S. credit card company/bank versus dealing with the Thai-English communications challenge here in Thailand in having a Thai credit card (if you can get one...very hard to get an unsecured Thai credit card unless having a work permit...easy to get a secured credit card with a locked deposit as collateral).

[Pib]

Is there a way to "pin" the summary of US banks and NFT credit cards to this forum , or must I learn to use the search function better?

There are other threads that have talked U.S. NFT debit/credit cards to the best of peoples' ability, knowledge, and use of the cards. Use the Search function. Plus, card policies frequently change which can OBE previous info. I wish there was about a 1,000 pinned topics on ThaiVisa about various topics but it ain't going to happen for various reasons such as knowledge level, policies/things always changing, someone willing to put the time and effort into keeping the Pinned item up to date, etc. Use of the Search function is easy...put in a few words and hit Enter.