US Paypal -> Bangkok Bank vs. NY Branch ACH fees ?

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 26, 2014

Re the OP's posts...

--a person can use Paypay to send funds from the U.S. to Thailand, but doing so is going to be far more expensive than going the Bangkok Bank New York route. Principal reason is Paypal's reduced exchange rate (the cut they take of your funds).

--I see no attraction to using a Cap One 360 debit card in Thailand. Cap One is not expat friendly when it comes to their banking (as opposed to credit card) products, and the 360 card if I recall right is a MC with a lower exchange rate and a small foreign currency fee, while a no fee VISA debit card would be a better option.

--The ranks of no foreign currency fee (FCF) U.S. credit cards have been growing some lately.

My list of those includes the following, all with no annual fee:

--Most of Pentagon Federal's cards, including the excellent Promise VISA card.

--Most of Cap One's VISA cards, particularly the rewards ones mentioned above.

--Cap One's Sony VISA card

--BofA's Cash Rewards and Travel Rewards VISA Cards (though most/all of BofA's other CCs have 3% FCFs).

There are also some "premium" traveler oriented cards with no FCFs, but a lot of those tend to have annual fees and are branded with airlines or other travel related businesses. Perhaps of value if one travels a lot, but not so much for the more settled down expat.

Here's a link that includes info on both types of CC's:

http://www.cardhub.com/credit-cards/foreign-transaction-fee/

Edited May 26, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

Pib · May 26, 2014

chubby,

You might want to consider joining the Pentagon Federal Credit Union as they have NFT fee credit cards and anyone can join even if having no military/veteran status; instead, you just join one of the National Military Family Association or Voices of America's Troops organizations with a one-time $15-$20 membership fee. See this link for more info.

PenFed is expat-friendly since many of their members are active duty/military retirees assigned/living all over the world. i've been using one of their Visa no foreign transaction fee, no cash advance fee credit cards to get my cash in Thailand ever since AEON ATMs started charging the Bt150 fee. One of the few credit cards out there than does not charge a cash advance fee. I go and get a cash advance via over the counter bank withdrawal up to $2,000/day, you get the Visa exchange rate, no foreign transaction fee, no cash advance fee, and I come back to the house, log-on to my PenFed account and make a same day payment in full of the cash advance to avoid any interest charge. While doing the cash advance I just have the money put directly into my Thai bank account in a combo counter withdrawal and deposit transaction...only takes a few minutes. Summary: money immediately in-hand from the U.S. up to $2,000/day with no fees....plus you can use the credit card for day-to-day buys in Thailand if also desired.

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 26, 2014

PFCU's Promise VISA card is their card with no FCF AND no cash advance flat fee (though they will charge interest if there's any lag time between your cash advance and payment into the CC account).

Pib · May 26, 2014

TallGuy,

"All" PFCU credit cards (6 total I think) are no foreign transaction fee and no cash advance fee cards, not just their Promise card which your above post implies.

On the PFCU credit card overview web page it may not mention the "no cash advance fee" part like for the Platinum Cash Rewards Card like I have or the Promise card like you have, but if you click the Summary of Terms (PDF) link for each card it will show what fees apply or don't apply....they all say "no cash advance and no foreign transaction" fees. As long as you initiate the ACH payment same day for the cash withdrawal via you PFCU online account, the payment is credited immediately even through the actual ACH payment/funds from one of your "other" banks may not arrive PFCU for days....that's what I been during my initiating a transfer same day via my PFCU online account to my USAA bank account since I keep very little money at PFCU at least so far...I'm primarily just using their credit card. And of course a person could just transfer payment from their PFCU Savings or Money Market account (internal bank transfer) versus doing the external bank transfer like I'm doing.

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 26, 2014

TallGuy,

"All" PFCU credit cards (6 total I think) are no foreign transaction fee and no cash advance fee cards, not just their Promise card which your above post implies.

Thanks for the clarification, Pib. I hadn't realized PFCU had gone to no cash advance fees (as well as no FCFs) on their various other credit card products.

chubby · May 28, 2014

Pib,

I follow most of what your saying, but:

1) What do you mean by "As long as you initiate the ACH payment same day for the cash withdrawal via you PFCU online account,"

Seems like your saying 'outside bank' , I've never done cash advance, so not sure how the steps typically involved....

2) do you also have a PFCU checking & savings account? and a Schwab savings account? maybe If I ditch Cap One 360, it would be good to have 2 online savings accounts...

TallGuy,

"All" PFCU credit cards (6 total I think) are no foreign transaction fee and no cash advance fee cards, not just their Promise card which your above post implies.

On the PFCU credit card overview web page it may not mention the "no cash advance fee" part like for the Platinum Cash Rewards Card like I have or the Promise card like you have, but if you click the Summary of Terms (PDF) link for each card it will show what fees apply or don't apply....they all say "no cash advance and no foreign transaction" fees. As long as you initiate the ACH payment same day for the cash withdrawal via you PFCU online account, the payment is credited immediately even through the actual ACH payment/funds from one of your "other" banks may not arrive PFCU for days....that's what I been during my initiating a transfer same day via my PFCU online account to my USAA bank account since I keep very little money at PFCU at least so far...I'm primarily just using their credit card. And of course a person could just transfer payment from their PFCU Savings or Money Market account (internal bank transfer) versus doing the external bank transfer like I'm doing.

chubby · May 28, 2014

TG, yeah, the 360 debit is MC, so the PFCU debit cards are Visa-based but: had thought, one of the goals would be to diversify between MC & Visa debit cards, in case things change in the future, Unless, I'm just going to start collecting so many CC and debit cards, at some point, seems to be bad idea, to have so many open low balance accounts ......... ?

Re the OP's posts...

--a person can use Paypay to send funds from the U.S. to Thailand, but doing so is going to be far more expensive than going the Bangkok Bank New York route. Principal reason is Paypal's reduced exchange rate (the cut they take of your funds).

--I see no attraction to using a Cap One 360 debit card in Thailand. Cap One is not expat friendly when it comes to their banking (as opposed to credit card) products, and the 360 card if I recall right is a MC with a lower exchange rate and a small foreign currency fee, while a no fee VISA debit card would be a better option.

--The ranks of no foreign currency fee (FCF) U.S. credit cards have been growing some lately.

My list of those includes the following, all with no annual fee:

--Most of Pentagon Federal's cards, including the excellent Promise VISA card.

--Most of Cap One's VISA cards, particularly the rewards ones mentioned above.

--Cap One's Sony VISA card

--BofA's Cash Rewards and Travel Rewards VISA Cards (though most/all of BofA's other CCs have 3% FCFs).

There are also some "premium" traveler oriented cards with no FCFs, but a lot of those tend to have annual fees and are branded with airlines or other travel related businesses. Perhaps of value if one travels a lot, but not so much for the more settled down expat.

Here's a link that includes info on both types of CC's:

http://www.cardhub.com/credit-cards/foreign-transaction-fee/

Edited May 28, 2014 by chubby

wooloomooloo · May 28, 2014

If you submit a SWIFT wire request using the SWIFT code for Bangkok Bank in Thailand it will go directly to Bangkok Bank in Thailand. ( BKKBTHBK )

If you submit a SWIFT wire request using the SWIFT code for Bangkok Bank in New York it will go directly to Bangkok Bank in New York ( BKKBUS33 )

The sender will always be BKKBUS33 whatever happens in this instance. If you remit USD the correspondent will definitely be BKKBUS33 and if you send THB then the sender will be BKKBUS33 and the correspondent BKKBTHBK and receiver BKKBTHBK.

Hope this clarifies.

Pib · May 29, 2014

Pib, 

I follow most of what your saying, but: 

1) What do you mean by "As long as you initiate the ACH payment same day for the cash withdrawal via you PFCU online account," 

Seems like your saying 'outside bank' , I've never done cash advance, so not sure how the steps typically involved.... 

2) do you also have a PFCU checking & savings account? and a Schwab savings account? maybe If I ditch Cap One 360, it would be good to have 2 online savings accounts... 

TallGuy,

"All" PFCU credit cards (6 total I think) are no foreign transaction fee and no cash advance fee cards, not just their Promise card which your above post implies.

On the PFCU credit card overview web page it may not mention the "no cash advance fee" part like for the Platinum Cash Rewards Card like I have or the Promise card like you have, but if you click the Summary of Terms (PDF) link for each card it will show what fees apply or don't apply....they all say "no cash advance and no foreign transaction" fees. As long as you initiate the ACH payment same day for the cash withdrawal via you PFCU online account, the payment is credited immediately even through the actual ACH payment/funds from one of your "other" banks may not arrive PFCU for days....that's what I been during my initiating a transfer same day via my PFCU online account to my USAA bank account since I keep very little money at PFCU at least so far...I'm primarily just using their credit card. And of course a person could just transfer payment from their PFCU Savings or Money Market account (internal bank transfer) versus doing the external bank transfer like I'm doing.

My initiate I mean I'm using the ACH transfer link I already have setup on my PFCU account to "pull" money from one of my other banks. This is called an external bank or outside bank pull transfer. Of course I could also use my PFCU account to initiate a transfer "to" one of my other banks if I wanted to send money from my PFCU to one of my other bank accounts like to my Bangkok Bank account....kinda like how you transferred money "to" your Bangkok Bank account (an external/outside bank to CapOne 360). My "initiating" the transfer on my PFCU account then PFCU credits my credit card account with the ACH payment immediately; if I had initiated the payment say on my USAA account "to" my PFCU credit card account well it would have taken a few days to arrive PFCU and I would not get payment credit until PFCU received it thereby racking up some credit card interest charges for a cash advance.

A cash advance is just terminology for a "loan." Even when you just buy something like a computer component using your credit card the credit card company is basically loaning you the money to buy the componet via the card company paying for the component for you...they pay the merchant thereby you just borrowed money from the credit card company.

But unlike like buying something with a credit card where you are given around around a 25 day grace period to pay the bill in full to avoid any interest charge, for a "cash advance" interest charges start immediately--no grace period. So, if you walk into a bank and get a cash advance/counter withdrawal, interest on the cash advance will start racking up immediately unless you make payment in full the same day. And like I mentioned earlier, almost all credit cards charge an upfront cash advance fee usually of 3% (not to be confused with interest charges), but PFCU credit cards do not charge a cash advance fee...they just start charging interest from the day you get the cash advance just like other credit card companies.

When you open a credit union account like a PFCU account, you must open a Shares accounts (it's what credit unions call their basic savings account) usually a $5 to $25 minimum balance and you can't withdraw this minimum balance until you close the account...you can also open up checking, Money Market, and other type of accounts also.

Up to you whether you open other bank/credit union/credit card accounts....I only have multiple accounts at various banks and card companies in order to get the best overall deal and to have redundancy in case one bank/company changes some policy like deciding to start charging a foreign transaction fee, something goes wrong with one account which prevents me from using it for a while (of course that will always occur at the worst possible time), etc. I don't want to have all my eggs in one basket...plus I've never found one basket that gives me every thing I want in a bank/card account so I have multiple baskets.

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 29, 2014

TG, yeah, the 360 debit is MC, so the PFCU debit cards are Visa-based but: had thought, one of the goals would be to diversify between MC & Visa debit cards, in case things change in the future, Unless, I'm just going to start collecting so many CC and debit cards, at some point, seems to be bad idea, to have so many open low balance accounts ......... ?

Re your comments above:

1. In general, I see no advantage to having or adding MC logo debit cards except perhaps in some unusual, unique situation. Even if they have no FCF, they will inherently have a lower exchange rate than a comparable VISA logo card, because VISA simply tends to have a better exchange rate on an ongoing basis.

2. Similarly regarding credit cards, there MIGHT be some situation where the perks of a particular MC logo credit card -- such as cash back or other features/rewards -- might offset the inherent exchange rate disadvantage. But my feeling is, most of the time, there's probably a comparable VISA branded alternative to almost anything you're going to find out there.

3. However, as Pib alluded to above, I do see a great advantage to maintaining a diverse stable of different debit and credit cards that each meet my essential criteria, such as not having any annual fee or charging any FCF. It's individual banks and bank companies that sometimes change their policies and fees, not the card networks so much. So it pays to diversify among banks and card issuers.

4. Lastly, while PFCU has gone to no foreign currency fee credit cards, I don't believe they've done so with their debit/ATM cards. Last time I checked, the straight ATM card (no POS) that comes with their regular share/savings account had a 2% FCF for ATM withdrawals . And it appears to be the same with their VISA checking account debit card.

https://www.penfed.org/service-fees/

So while I like PFCU's credit cards and they've often had very good CD deals in the past, I'm not a fan or user of their ATM/check cards.

5. Lastly, as for numbers of cards/accounts, I think you need to distinguish between debit cards/checking accounts vs. credit cards. I don't keep a lot of unused debit cards/checking accounts, but I do keep various ones for various specific reasons/uses. And I keep enough so that if I lose one or two (due to fee or interest rate changes), I always have a suitable backup available.

But for credit cards, there's no harm in keeping a larger number of accounts and just using them periodically or rotating use to keep them active and alive. In fact, the more cards you have and the larger your total credit line, that's generally considered a good thing for your credit rating/score -- provided you manage your credit responsibly by always making payments on-time and never carrying a balance of more than 30-40% of any card's individual credit limit. And preferably no carry-over balances at all. And, the higher your credit score, the better offers and terms you're likely to get on your various accounts.

When it comes to credit cards, there also might be cards / use cases that are very different for Thailand vs U.S. use. For example, in Thailand, you don't want to use cards with FCFs. But, in the U.S. if someone expects to be back there periodically, I'd have no problem using a 3% FCF card (which has no impact there) that also happens to have a 5% rebate on gas purchases. So I have one set of cards mainly for Thailand use, and a somewhat different set for U.S.-only use.

Edited May 29, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

chubby · May 29, 2014

OK, I joined PFCU, it seems, I thought ACH was for banking not for "pulling" money from an external linked account, ?directly to a credit card (as a payment), I would think it would be a two-step process, pull ACH to PFCU checking, then pay the PFCU credit card from the PFCU checking .

this is my 1st credit union, maybe that has some advantages, i know they had a 3% 5 year CD end of last year , etc .....

Pib, 

I follow most of what your saying, but: 

1) What do you mean by "As long as you initiate the ACH payment same day for the cash withdrawal via you PFCU online account," 

Seems like your saying 'outside bank' , I've never done cash advance, so not sure how the steps typically involved.... 

2) do you also have a PFCU checking & savings account? and a Schwab savings account? maybe If I ditch Cap One 360, it would be good to have 2 online savings accounts... 

TallGuy,

"All" PFCU credit cards (6 total I think) are no foreign transaction fee and no cash advance fee cards, not just their Promise card which your above post implies.

On the PFCU credit card overview web page it may not mention the "no cash advance fee" part like for the Platinum Cash Rewards Card like I have or the Promise card like you have, but if you click the Summary of Terms (PDF) link for each card it will show what fees apply or don't apply....they all say "no cash advance and no foreign transaction" fees. As long as you initiate the ACH payment same day for the cash withdrawal via you PFCU online account, the payment is credited immediately even through the actual ACH payment/funds from one of your "other" banks may not arrive PFCU for days....that's what I been during my initiating a transfer same day via my PFCU online account to my USAA bank account since I keep very little money at PFCU at least so far...I'm primarily just using their credit card. And of course a person could just transfer payment from their PFCU Savings or Money Market account (internal bank transfer) versus doing the external bank transfer like I'm doing.

My initiate I mean I'm using the ACH transfer link I already have setup on my PFCU account to "pull" money from one of my other banks. This is called an external bank or outside bank pull transfer. Of course I could also use my PFCU account to initiate a transfer "to" one of my other banks if I wanted to send money from my PFCU to one of my other bank accounts like to my Bangkok Bank account....kinda like how you transferred money "to" your Bangkok Bank account (an external/outside bank to CapOne 360). My "initiating" the transfer on my PFCU account then PFCU credits my credit card account with the ACH payment immediately; if I had initiated the payment say on my USAA account "to" my PFCU credit card account well it would have taken a few days to arrive PFCU and I would not get payment credit until PFCU received it thereby racking up some credit card interest charges for a cash advance.

A cash advance is just terminology for a "loan." Even when you just buy something like a computer component using your credit card the credit card company is basically loaning you the money to buy the componet via the card company paying for the component for you...they pay the merchant thereby you just borrowed money from the credit card company.

But unlike like buying something with a credit card where you are given around around a 25 day grace period to pay the bill in full to avoid any interest charge, for a "cash advance" interest charges start immediately--no grace period. So, if you walk into a bank and get a cash advance/counter withdrawal, interest on the cash advance will start racking up immediately unless you make payment in full the same day. And like I mentioned earlier, almost all credit cards charge an upfront cash advance fee usually of 3% (not to be confused with interest charges), but PFCU credit cards do not charge a cash advance fee...they just start charging interest from the day you get the cash advance just like other credit card companies.

When you open a credit union account like a PFCU account, you must open a Shares accounts (it's what credit unions call their basic savings account) usually a $5 to $25 minimum balance and you can't withdraw this minimum balance until you close the account...you can also open up checking, Money Market, and other type of accounts also.

Up to you whether you open other bank/credit union/credit card accounts....I only have multiple accounts at various banks and card companies in order to get the best overall deal and to have redundancy in case one bank/company changes some policy like deciding to start charging a foreign transaction fee, something goes wrong with one account which prevents me from using it for a while (of course that will always occur at the worst possible time), etc. I don't want to have all my eggs in one basket...plus I've never found one basket that gives me every thing I want in a bank/card account so I have multiple baskets.

Pib · May 29, 2014

OK, I joined PFCU, it seems, I thought ACH was for banking not for "pulling" money from an external linked account, ?directly to a credit card (as a payment), I would think it would be a two-step process, pull ACH to PFCU checking, then pay the PFCU credit card from the PFCU checking .

Depending on the bank, ACH transfers can be setup a Push or Pull......or as Push Only. Like at BoA and USAA you can setup an ACH transfer link as Push & Pull...or Push Only. Push/Pull will go through the trial deposits validation process where Push Only usually don't. All depends on the bank. But one note of caution, never try to do an ACH Pull from Bangkok Bank because Bangkok Bank will reject it and then your U.S. bank may temporarily block the transfer link as they look closer at the reason for the rejection, make sure there is not fraudulent activity being attempted, etc. Bangkok Bank is just complying with Bank of Thailand regulations which has rules on money outflow....but pretty no rules on money inflow. Thailand: Land of Smiles for Incoming Money; can be the Land of Frowns for outgoing money. And the Bangkok Bank website regarding use of the ACH transfer method clearly says do not attempt an ACH Pull.

The ACH pull your are doing to your PFCU credit card is a payment directly to your credit card account....no two step process involved by first pulling money into your PFCU savings account and then doing an internet transfer from that account to your PFCU credit card account. No different than the "Bill Pay" most ibanking sites have where an ebill comes and you make a payment which is nothing more than an ACH transfer to that billing account.

Now I will tell you unless something has changed from several years ago when I joined PFCU for the first 6 months your daily ACH push/pull limit will be a mere $50 (fifty)...not several thousand like a person is use to. It seems to be like a probationary period. After 6 months the daily ACH transfer limit is bumped up to $5,000. So, if this policy is still in effect, then to pay your PFCU credit card bill you would need to have enough money in your PFCU savings account to do an "internal" transfer. You can just setup a transfer link "from" one of your other banks to plus up the PFCU account...push the money to the PFCU account. Maybe PFCU does this (if they still do it) in order to motivate people to deposit more money into their PFCU savings account(s). This policy didn't impact me because I initially only got their credit card because it was a no foreign transaction fee credit and I wanted a credit card from another company other than CapOne in case CapOne ever decided to start charging a foreign transaction fee.

PFCU has at least 6 different credit cards....no cash advance and no foreign transaction fee....which one you may want to apply for will depend which card appeals to you since each offers different benefits (i.e., points, cash back, discounts, etc), some minor differences in misc fees, interest rates, etc. So be sure to determine which one best meets your needs/desires. See their website for full details.

chubby · May 29, 2014

the online PFCU credit card allows you to initiate ("pull") ACH transfers from your 'external' bank ?

i'm familiar with push/pull for billpay-banking, but never seen it for a credit card , if that is what your saying, thanks for your patience...

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 30, 2014

With PFCU, their online banking functions give you access to all of your PFCU accounts together -- share/savings, any CDs and credit cards with them. By logging in, you can transfer funds from your share account to pay your PFCU credit card balance, or otherwise move funds around.

That includes using PFCU's online banking ACH function to move funds from an external bank account you've linked with PFCU online banking into the PFCU account of your choice, including a PFCU credit card.

Pib · May 30, 2014

^^^^What TallGuy said. You can even do an online cash advance from your PenFed credit card into you shares/savings account as far as I know.

At most banks ACH transfer links are setup as "two-way"....From and To (a.k.a., Send and Pull, Push and Pull). Don't think of ACH transfer as only a one-way soi...can only "send" money because depending on your bank the link is "usually" setup as a From/To but some banks do allow yo to setup an ACH link as Send only. Since most ACH links can be setup as From/To, if you have one bank that can be painful/paperwork intensive to setup transfer links, like Schwab Savings and Checking accounts, and you really only wanted to occasionally "deposit" money to that account then just use one of your other bank accounts where's it's easy/painless to setup of transfer link to "push" money to those other accounts.

Note: for a Schwab Brokerage account setting up transfer links is easy...can do it online with trial deposits...but with their Savings and Checking accounts transfer setup they make it harder/mail-in paperwork involved unless something has changed from around 3 years ago...but a person can work around that paperwork drill by just using the brokerage account to do From/To ACH transfers and then use the "internal" transfer function to move funds between the brokerage account and the Savings/Checking account. Schwab just makes money transfer setup easier/no or less paperwork involved for its brokerage account....just one of their little ways to nudge you towards using the brokerage account to do stock trades which earns Schwab commissions....their banking products are pretty much treated like "in support of their brokerage business."

chubby · May 30, 2014

small problem, cap one 360 pays 0.75%, Schwab Savings 0.12% PenFed Savings 0.05% ! what a world for a retiree..

Pib · May 30, 2014

small problem, cap one 360 pays 0.75%, Schwab Savings 0.12% PenFed Savings 0.05% ! what a world for a retiree..

A good example of of having accounts are multiple banks....one bank may offer outstanding savings rates but charge a foreign transaction fee on their cards or have other drawbacks like maybe not being expat friendly...another bank may have average savings interest rates but do not charge a foreign transaction fee on their cards....one bank may be expat friendly but the another no so much...in-bank (brick and mortar) services may be outstanding but online banking (which an expat needs) may suck....etc...etc...etc. Some financial products/services are fine when living in your home country but if using the products/services overseas they are not so great & turn into fee-laden monsters. Expat living can change what you thought was a great bank into a so-so bank.

I think to get the best overall financial fruit basket you must combine several fruit baskets from different financial sources/banks/card companies....this also provides backup in case one of your other banks/card companies changes some policies that hike fees, work against expats, etc. It would be nice if "one" financial company provided the best service, lowest fees, highest interest rates, best online banking, promise to never change policies/fees, etc. for home country and expat living, but I haven't found it yet....when you find such financial company be sure to tell us.

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 30, 2014

small problem, cap one 360 pays 0.75%, Schwab Savings 0.12% PenFed Savings 0.05% ! what a world for a retiree..

Best Bank Account Interest Rates - Summary for Week Ending May 25, 2014

http://www.depositaccounts.com/blog/2014/05/best-bank-account-interest-rates-summary-week-25-2014.html

Lots of options. Scroll down a bit on the page for the best rates nationally and options for looking by state. But be aware, this site (like most) doesn't deal with the issue of foreign currency fees that any particular bank/CU account may have. So if you see an account that looks promising, you need to check on the FCF issue yourself as part of a vetting process, along with various other details.

Rewards checking accounts, which have their own section in the link I posted above, also are a good option for getting better interest rates on balances, provided you expect to be and are comfortable using a U.S. debit card for POS purchases abroad. The rewards accounts also are more likely to have some ATM fee reimbursement and little or no FCF.

Edited May 30, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

IMA_FARANG · May 30, 2014

Do not know what ACH is ?

I have a BKK account which has Internet Banking, so I have all my Consultant Fees sent to NYC Branch of BKK. I then can use ATM or Internet Banking to transfer to my Family and/or friends. Very small fee taken for BKK out of the funds which originate in USA. I have not had any luck with Western Union in BKK.

Jerry

I told my bank in the U.S exactly who to contact and how to set up a monthly ACH tranfer to my Thai Bangkok Bank account through Bankok Bank in New York and my U.S bank's answer was, "that is only available for those with business accounts but not for personal accounts.

A business accout needs to maintain a ballnce of $5000 a month.

My pension is bout $1700 a month.

P.S. Bangkok Bank New York is not a U.S. comercial bank.

A U.S. citizen can not hold a deposit account with Bangkok Bank in New York except under sprcial circumstances.

But you can supposedly set up an ACH transfer through them if your U.S. bank allows it.

Edited May 30, 2014 by IMA_FARANG

Pib · May 30, 2014

Do not know what ACH is ?

I have a BKK account which has Internet Banking, so I have all my Consultant Fees sent to NYC Branch of BKK. I then can use ATM or Internet Banking to transfer to my Family and/or friends. Very small fee taken for BKK out of the funds which originate in USA. I have not had any luck with Western Union in BKK.

Jerry

I told my bank in the U.S exactly who to contact and how to set up a monthly ACH tranfer to my Thai Bangkok Bank account through Bankok Bank in New York and my U.S bank's answer was, "that is only available for those with business accounts but not for personal accounts.

A business accout needs to maintain a ballnce of $5000 a month.

My pension is bout $1700 a month.

P.S. Bangkok Bank New York is not a U.S. comercial bank.

A U.S. citizen can not hold a deposit account with Bangkok Bank in New York except under sprcial circumstances.

But you can supposedly set up an ACH transfer through them if your U.S. bank allows it.

You need to switch banks...seems your bank may be too restrictive/fee hungry. I have several U.S. bank accounts (too many really) and I have ACH transfer links to Bangkok Bank setup with all of them...no problem at all setting up the transfer links...Bangkok Bank is treated just as any other U.S. domestic bank for ACH transfers. Here's a Bangkok Bank link describing its New York branch. Link.

chubby · May 30, 2014

one time, I went to my local bank, walked in and asked them about "ACH" transfers, and iirc, they were probably puzzled, then gave me a fudged type answer, then asked for a manager, who then probably gave me another strange answer, and I probably just forgot about the whole mess.

bank probably needs to be big enough to have a developed web interface, to avoid, interacting with real people

Do not know what ACH is ?

I have a BKK account which has Internet Banking, so I have all my Consultant Fees sent to NYC Branch of BKK. I then can use ATM or Internet Banking to transfer to my Family and/or friends. Very small fee taken for BKK out of the funds which originate in USA. I have not had any luck with Western Union in BKK.

Jerry

I told my bank in the U.S exactly who to contact and how to set up a monthly ACH tranfer to my Thai Bangkok Bank account through Bankok Bank in New York and my U.S bank's answer was, "that is only available for those with business accounts but not for personal accounts.

A business accout needs to maintain a ballnce of $5000 a month.

My pension is bout $1700 a month.

P.S. Bangkok Bank New York is not a U.S. comercial bank.

A U.S. citizen can not hold a deposit account with Bangkok Bank in New York except under sprcial circumstances.

But you can supposedly set up an ACH transfer through them if your U.S. bank allows it.

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 30, 2014

Do not know what ACH is ?

I have a BKK account which has Internet Banking, so I have all my Consultant Fees sent to NYC Branch of BKK. I then can use ATM or Internet Banking to transfer to my Family and/or friends. Very small fee taken for BKK out of the funds which originate in USA. I have not had any luck with Western Union in BKK.

Jerry

I told my bank in the U.S exactly who to contact and how to set up a monthly ACH tranfer to my Thai Bangkok Bank account through Bankok Bank in New York and my U.S bank's answer was, "that is only available for those with business accounts but not for personal accounts.

A business accout needs to maintain a ballnce of $5000 a month.

My pension is bout $1700 a month.

P.S. Bangkok Bank New York is not a U.S. comercial bank.

A U.S. citizen can not hold a deposit account with Bangkok Bank in New York except under sprcial circumstances.

But you can supposedly set up an ACH transfer through them if your U.S. bank allows it.

In order to utilize the BKK Bank New York international transfer service that has the low fees, your U.S. bank account thru its online banking function needs to allow you to send domestic ACHs to other U.S. banks.

If your bank's online banking will allow you to send a domestic ACH to another U.S. bank, then you'll also be able to send a domestic ACH to Bangkok Bank New York.

However, there's no mandate that U.S. banks have to offer their customers online ACH transfers. Many do, but some don't. And some allow only in or outbound (usually inbound) transfers, but not both. But in today's world, online ACHs are a convenience I would think most U.S. bank customers would expect of their bank.

Also, re setting up the BKK Bank link with your other U.S. bank account, there's no one for you or your bank to contact. You can either do it yourself through your other bank's online banking setup, or you can't.

As stated, BKK Bank New York doesn't host any deposit accounts for normal retail customers. For retail customers like you or I, it's simply a passthrough destination that enables convenient, low-cost transfers from customers' U.S. to BKK Bank accounts.

Pib · May 30, 2014

I use to have an account at a small credit union that didn't provide ACH online transfers capability (joined the credit union just to get a low cost car loan many years ago and use some of their free services like free notary); but you could do a counter ACH for ridiculous fee. I figure the credit union had a nice little fee cash cow going with only allowing counter-generated transfers...providing the capability in their bare bones ibanking for no fee or a low fee which is typical at most banks/larger credit unions would have caused them to lose fee revenue. This little credit union is a good place to borrow money and get other free services, but a bad place to transfer funds due to the high fee.

JimGant · May 30, 2014

OK, I joined PFCU, it seems, I thought ACH was for banking not for "pulling" money from an external linked account, ?directly to a credit card (as a payment), I would think it would be a two-step process, pull ACH to PFCU checking, then pay the PFCU credit card from the PFCU checking .

The two ACH push/pull systems we're most familiar with involve paying bills. Terminology gets entangled, as both systems pay bills, but most commonly you'll see "bill pay" as the push sytem. And "direct debit" as the pull system.

For a push bill pay, you set this up with your bank, naming the payee, his ABA and account number (or other payment designation), and your method of payment. This may be completely manual, whereby you log into your online bank account and designate amount and timing of (push) payment. Or, you can designate a fixed amount to be paid, and automate its frequency to be paid. Most recently, with e-billing, you can go completely 'hands off' if you like to pay in full, thus automating both time and amount (including latest bill balance) to be paid by your bank to the payee.

For a pull bill pay, you authorize the biller (payee) to debit your bank account for a designated amount, including latest balance. You provide him with your bank's ABA and your account number -- but you don't deal with your bank directly with this system. You've given the payee authorization to conclude the billing directly with your bank. (And, if there's a wrong amount problem with this, you deal with the payee, not your bank.)

With e-billing, both systems allow hands off bill paying -- nice when you're off treking for a few months. And, some with control freakitis, go the push route, as they don't like the idea of not being immediately in the loop with bill payments. I guess this would come in handy if you're right on the edge of having insufficient funds in your bank account. And, there might be other reasons to go this route -- but I can't think of any.

chubby · May 30, 2014

so, in essence the PF credit card is a 'linked account' with the 'external bank'

1st time, i've heard of such, when i think linked accounts i think bank/bank not cc/bank ; but i suppose if one thinks of push/pull as you said it's a different concept, i'm not sure i'm smart enough, to conceptualize the repercussions of the ability for things to be pulled, or like the idea, pushing (eg i login into the place where the money is originated from), makes more sense to me. Part of what is confusing, is the hidden-ness of the link for pulling money, though apparently there is an ability to pull money there is nothing on the puller website to indicate the link....

and i'm not sure I trust it further, eg my investment company is able to push money to my online bank, but there is no "link" setup on the online bank webpage , and my investment company apparently can't pull money from the online bank, so I guess to get money to the investment bank i'd have to wire the money to them, or possibly billpay myself via the online webpage, might work , which would write a papercheck...

at one point, I wanted to get rid of all credit cards, though, because of the various 1 thing, benefits, starting to seem like i'll have to keep at least 3 , maybe two of them would be visa's with no FTF if that matters, the other has FTFs , but it generates 1 time use number, i use for most online purchases.....

With PFCU, their online banking functions give you access to all of your PFCU accounts together -- share/savings, any CDs and credit cards with them. By logging in, you can transfer funds from your share account to pay your PFCU credit card balance, or otherwise move funds around.

That includes using PFCU's online banking ACH function to move funds from an external bank account you've linked with PFCU online banking into the PFCU account of your choice, including a PFCU credit card.

Edited May 30, 2014 by chubby

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 30, 2014

I don't think PFCU's setup is particularly unique or unusual in terms of transferring capability.

Cap One is pretty similar, in that you can move money/make payments between Cap One bank accounts and credit card accounts. And you certainly can link external bank accounts to use inside Cap One to pay your Cap One CC bill.

Likewise, with Schwab, you can use their online banking to either pull money into your Schwab bank or brokerage accounts from linked outside banks, or do the reverse, and use their online banking to xfer money out of Schwab and into linked external bank accounts.

As for credit cards in general, they're hard for a retiree to obtain from Thai banks. And the credit terms and consumer protections aren't comparable to those from the U.S. Best to keep and hold what you'll need from the U.S. before making any move. They're part of your ongoing U.S. credit profile and score, which is worth keeping intact.

Edited May 30, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

chubby · May 31, 2014

I don't do auto-payments, as I like to reconcile for charges, etc, so I do get auto-bills and auto-payments, don't think of it as a "link" , but more like a bill and a payment, which now that I think 'bout it , must be ACH, perhaps with auto-payment, it is functioning more like a link.

thanks for making me think about it

I don't think PFCU's setup is particularly unique or unusual in terms of transferring capability.

Cap One is pretty similar, in that you can move money/make payments between Cap One bank accounts and credit card accounts. And you certainly can link external bank accounts to use inside Cap One to pay your Cap One CC bill.

Likewise, with Schwab, you can use their online banking to either pull money into your Schwab bank or brokerage accounts from linked outside banks, or do the reverse, and use their online banking to xfer money out of Schwab and into linked external bank accounts.

As for credit cards in general, they're hard for a retiree to obtain from Thai banks. And the credit terms and consumer protections aren't comparable to those from the U.S. Best to keep and hold what you'll need from the U.S. before making any move. They're part of your ongoing U.S. credit profile and score, which is worth keeping intact.

TallGuyJohninBKK · May 31, 2014

As I think Jim addressed above, online bill-pays and/or auto debit arrangements are not the same thing as having linked accounts for purposes of doing ACH transfers.

In the auto debit arrangement, you're giving a third party the right/ability to pull funds out of your account each month or whatever timeframe is involved, without your having to execute or approve that each time. I've never particularly liked or done that kind of arrangement.

But in the area of moving money from one of your accounts to a different of your accounts via domestic ACH transfer, not only do you usually have to specifically set up and maintain the link, usually via verifying trial deposits. But then you also have to log-into the initiating account and verify yourself each time in order to push or pull your own funds. And of course, you also have complete control to remove/unlink any account-to-account connection at any time you might decide to.

chubby · May 31, 2014

So, Pib goes into his local BBL branch, cash advances $5,000, goes home logs into PFCU, and same day (say ?before midnight EST) "pays" his PFCU via an ACH "link" from an "external bank account" ? ;

If so, to me doesn't sound like a "link" but more like a "bill-pay" ; my bill-pay, don't immediately credit whomever I pay with 360.....

Even if it was/is a "link"; with 360->Schwab HYC it is not immediate, there is a few days delay, but ?not at PFCU?

chubby · May 31, 2014

Are you sure they all have no "cash advance" fee; I don't see that in the small print for the 'platinum signature' https://www.penfed.org/VPS_Benefits_Guide/ says nothing, perhaps, it's not an "advance", if you pay it immediately for their purposes, though, I guess I prefer the 'promise card' explicitly saying so.....

OK, I joined PFCU, it seems, I thought ACH was for banking not for "pulling" money from an external linked account, ?directly to a credit card (as a payment), I would think it would be a two-step process, pull ACH to PFCU checking, then pay the PFCU credit card from the PFCU checking .

Depending on the bank, ACH transfers can be setup a Push or Pull......or as Push Only. Like at BoA and USAA you can setup an ACH transfer link as Push & Pull...or Push Only. Push/Pull will go through the trial deposits validation process where Push Only usually don't. All depends on the bank. But one note of caution, never try to do an ACH Pull from Bangkok Bank because Bangkok Bank will reject it and then your U.S. bank may temporarily block the transfer link as they look closer at the reason for the rejection, make sure there is not fraudulent activity being attempted, etc. Bangkok Bank is just complying with Bank of Thailand regulations which has rules on money outflow....but pretty no rules on money inflow. Thailand: Land of Smiles for Incoming Money; can be the Land of Frowns for outgoing money. And the Bangkok Bank website regarding use of the ACH transfer method clearly says do not attempt an ACH Pull.

The ACH pull your are doing to your PFCU credit card is a payment directly to your credit card account....no two step process involved by first pulling money into your PFCU savings account and then doing an internet transfer from that account to your PFCU credit card account. No different than the "Bill Pay" most ibanking sites have where an ebill comes and you make a payment which is nothing more than an ACH transfer to that billing account.

Now I will tell you unless something has changed from several years ago when I joined PFCU for the first 6 months your daily ACH push/pull limit will be a mere $50 (fifty)...not several thousand like a person is use to. It seems to be like a probationary period. After 6 months the daily ACH transfer limit is bumped up to $5,000. So, if this policy is still in effect, then to pay your PFCU credit card bill you would need to have enough money in your PFCU savings account to do an "internal" transfer. You can just setup a transfer link "from" one of your other banks to plus up the PFCU account...push the money to the PFCU account. Maybe PFCU does this (if they still do it) in order to motivate people to deposit more money into their PFCU savings account(s). This policy didn't impact me because I initially only got their credit card because it was a no foreign transaction fee credit and I wanted a credit card from another company other than CapOne in case CapOne ever decided to start charging a foreign transaction fee.

PFCU has at least 6 different credit cards....no cash advance and no foreign transaction fee....which one you may want to apply for will depend which card appeals to you since each offers different benefits (i.e., points, cash back, discounts, etc), some minor differences in misc fees, interest rates, etc. So be sure to determine which one best meets your needs/desires. See their website for full details.

Sign In

US Paypal -> Bangkok Bank vs. NY Branch ACH fees ?

Recommended Posts

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Posted Images

Create an account or sign in to comment

Create an account

Sign in

Recently Browsing 0 members

Announcements

Topics

Latest posts...

Popular in The Pub

ASEANNOW

MORE INFO

POPULAR AREAS

CONTACT US