Thailand visa: Missing MH370 ‘behind visa run crackdown’. Fingerprints next?

[Jonathan Fairfield]

Thailand visa: Missing MH370 ‘behind visa run crackdown’. Fingerprints next?

PHUKET: A senior Immigration officer has given a clue as to the reasons for the current crackdown on tourists doing “out-in visa hops” from Ranong to Myanmar and back, and across all other land borders with Thailand’s neighbours: MH370.

Pol Lt Col Tauthong Thitchai of Surin Immigration, in whose territory is the busy Chong Jom crossing into Cambodia, told The Phuket News today, “Bangkok Immigration published an order to be more strict. All immigration officers have to do the same.

“The main reason is the lost Malaysian Airlines flight MH370.” Two people on that flight were carrying passports reported lost or stolen in Phuket.

“So Thailand is being watched by other countries because the passports went missing in Thailand. And Immigration [in Bangkok] felt they had to do something about this. Yes, we have to do it.”

Another officer contacted by The Phuket News warned that border crossings may now involve the taking of fingerprints.

The Deputy Superintendent of Immigration Police in Mukhdahan Province, which is linked to Laos by the Second Thai-Lao Friendship Bridge, said, “We will be strict in our checking of [tourists] and we will add a fingerprinting process for checking people.”

He explained that this was because the current blacklist of people barred from Thailand comprises only names “and we can’t check if someone changes their name.

“But with fingerprints we can check and identify people. All the information will be linked through a central Immigration database.”

Technically, the full weight of the rules is due to be applied from August 12, but reports from Mae Sai in the north of Thailand, where there is a crossing point into Myanmar, indicate the new rules are being rigidly applied there already. A would-be visa runner reported on the Thai Visa website that Immigration officers were turning everyone back on Saturday (May 10), and were apparently feeling the pressure themselves. “So every westerner that had approached the Thai exit border to Myanmar they have refused to let leave no matter how many stamps you have and what country,” he wrote.

“All they said is that you now have to fly out only. No more exit by land via a new regulation passed.

“When we asked for more information they got aggressive and angry, even though we are being nice and just confused. I have evidence of money and address if need be but no matter who you are they aren’t allowing it.

“They keep saying ‘Talk to my boss in Bangkok’ and shoo us off and when we ask for the phone number they say ‘No, no number!’ And when we asked where the Immigration office is they refused to tell us where.”

Pol Col Sit Siriwankul, Superintendent of the Chiang Rai Immigration Office, whose responsibility includes the Mae Sai crossing said, “We are following the same action because I really want the foreigners to get the right visa according to their purpose [in coming into Thailand].”

In Yala Province – which includes the Su’ngai Golok crossing into Malaysia, Pol Col Preemadet Sarakul seemed to be taking a different tack. “Actually, Yala Immigration is checking and doing the same action [as other crossings], such as checking the blacklist.

“But we are being strict with just four nationalities: Lao, Korean, Vietnamese and Russian.” So far at Ranong, the closest border crossing to Phuket, the big crackdown has yet to arrive, though tourists who have done multiple “out-in” trips to Myanmar are being given just seven days when they come back in.

They also get a warning that they must fly out of the country before that time expires and “get a proper visa from a Thai consulate” if they want to come back in.

The reaction from visa run companies, who shuttle mostly tourists to the border and back so that they can do visa runs, has been equally mixed.

Vijaree Makjan, owner of Phuket Visa Run, told the Phuket News, “I already knew about the Ranong action – tourists can still renew three times.

“This concerns tourists directly. It will affect my company, but not much because the company is also set up to take people to Penang [in Malaysia] as well as for out-ins at Ranong.

“It will have an effect on our company and others but this is the Immigration rule. I have to respect it.” Hareuthai Keninn, owner of KBB Visa Run said, “It is good for people who live here. The rule is being applied because of problems that have happened [with tourists working illegally or committing crimes].

“The staff will ask tourists for information about the timings of their visas. So far we have not been affected by this [tightened] rule.”

But Benjama Mansa, proprietor of Penphet Visa Run said, “ Yes! It has certainly affected me. I hope that Immigration will discuss their concerns with the Tourist Authority of Thailand and the Office of the National Security Council before they decide to apply this rule. In the long term it will affect tourism.

“After this rule was published on the Immigration website most customer asked us, ‘Doesn’t Thailand have visa runs anymore?’ I had to spend days explaining the situation to them.

“I feel really sorry for the Filipinos. They have a harder time than any other nationality because they can get only a 15-day tourist visa, and their employers don’t help to get them work permits.

“But in the end, I have to follow the law and adapt my business the best I can.”

-- Phuket News 2014-05-12

[kurnell]

So as with every crack down it will blow over in a matter of days

[millwall_fan]

One could suggest that they 'clamp down' on the theft of passports in Phuket, rather than tarring everyone with the same brush, but I suppose that would smack too much of hard work.

[barryofthailand]

If you plan to stay in Thailand for an extended period of time, then get a proper Visa. Too many people have been circumventing the visa laws and it's about time that new rules are brought into affect.

[DrTuner]

Right, so after about 1-2 months from when they find the plane it and this crackdown will became ancient history.

[zydeco]

First step. I think this country intends to keep squeezing and squeezing and squeezing until they force out most Westerners of whatever visa status. Both sides of the political debate want Westerners out. Anyone working here is seen as someone taking a Thai's money and job. And, as this policy shows, they can change the rules on a moment's notice. Retirement visa. Non-immigrant work visa? They could decide next week to kick everybody out of the country starting the next morning. And most Thais would probably celebrate.

Edited May 12, 2014 by zydeco

[taony]

Someone needs to explain the difference between an apple and an orange to this guy.

[TallPalm]

The World dared criticize our incompetence regarding the missing flight MH370, so this is our way of getting our own back. 'It's my ball and you're not playing' mentality.

[lungbing]

One could suggest that they 'clamp down' on the theft of passports in Phuket, rather than tarring everyone with the same brush, but I suppose that would smack too much of hard work.

And perhaps tread on important people's toes.

[englishoak]

Border fingerprinting ? I dont think so somehow

[Soutpeel]

Border fingerprinting ? I dont think so somehow

why not the American's do it...the equipment to do this is not expensive/electronic and info just goes into the immigration data base they are already using, you already have your photo taken coming into Swampy, so implementation of this is not so difficult

[Josh88]

So they were only turning back every white person at Mae Sai on tourist visas, or other visas as well? The quote is a little unclear about that.

[zydeco]

BTW, I wonder if this is also already trickling into other immigration functions. Just last week, I went in for my 90 day. Usually the immigration officer glances at it, rips off the bottom part, and staples it in my passport. This time, she took it to a computer and spent four or five minutes looking something up, then went to a printout and checked through that. I had no idea why a process that usually takes about 30 seconds stretched out to almost 10 minutes. Maybe this is the reason?

Edited May 12, 2014 by zydeco

[Josh88]

Border fingerprinting ? I dont think so somehow

why not the American's do it...the equipment to do this is not expensive/electronic and info just goes into the immigration data base they are already using, you already have your photo taken coming into Swampy, so implementation of this is not so difficult

Doesn't Cambodia already do this as well?

[Soutpeel]

BTW, I wonder if this is also already trickling into other immigration functions. Just last week, I went in for my 90 day. Usually the immigration officer glances at it, rips off the bottom part, and staples it in my passport. This time, she took it to a computer and spent four or five minutes looking something up, then went to a printout and checked through that. I had no idea why a process that usually takes about 30 seconds stretched out to almost 10 minutes. Maybe this is reason?

Because all the data they have on you is computerized these days on a central database , as is your 90 day check in, one of these days, if you haven't done your 90 day report they may catch you out at the airport and want money off you.

[cacruden]

I think they started attacking the issue from the wrong side, they should be looking to implement systems procedures so that you can make sure that the person you are dealing with matches the passport (i.e. fingerprint) - the first time someone enters you try to get more information on them. Then trying to gather profile information about that individual to see if they are security issues that person (The US can access [without NSA help ] the Canadian fingerprint database, Wants & Warrants etc.). Even if this information is not immediately available - i.e. monthly .... you can add the results to the profile so that it is on hand for the next entry/exit. It can also be used to speed the processing..... you go in and scan the passport, scan your fingers and it prints a "exit" stub which queues people according to criteria (those that are overstay get routed to a different line, those that are blacklisted get held, and the rest go through by just handing in the ticket and matching passport and stamped out.

Less people manning exits, means more people available for processing entries.

Edited May 12, 2014 by cacruden

[wileycoyote]

Logical ?

[GregBahder]

Border fingerprinting ? I dont think so somehow

why not the American's do it...the equipment to do this is not expensive/electronic and info just goes into the immigration data base they are already using, you already have your photo taken coming into Swampy, so implementation of this is not so difficult

Doesn't Cambodia already do this as well?

Yes Cambodia does finger printing in the capital at the airport.

[NoshowJones]

First step. I think this country intends to keep squeezing and squeezing and squeezing until they force out most Westerners of whatever visa status. Both sides of the political debate want Westerners out. Anyone working here is seen as someone taking a Thai's money and job. And, as this policy shows, they can change the rules on a moment's notice. Retirement visa. Non-immigrant work visa? They could decide next week to kick everybody out of the country starting the next morning. And most Thais would probably celebrate.

I don't think we need to worry about that, they need our money too much.

[easybullet3]

What a load of rubbish !!!! lol

this "Visa Crackdown" is only ONE THING: its to get 1000 baht from as many tourists as possible!!!

the Malaysian Missing Plane is a convenient story for them to hide under.

how much more secure is a 60 days tourist visa (compared to a 15 or 30 day free visa?????

in BOTH situations they process the details on your passport.

The 60 days tourist visa costs 1000 and you get a nice shiny sticker.

the 15 or 30 day visa is FREE and you have no sticker.

but the immigration computer is updated the SAME (with your SAME passport details).

so how can they say this is a security measure...

if only they could admit it and say its a MONEY MAKING SCHEME!!! Lol

PS: I have no problems about this as I dont mind doing visa-runs every 3 or 6 months.

in reality its not so hard for all the back-2-back visa runners to get a real visa.

[zydeco]

First step. I think this country intends to keep squeezing and squeezing and squeezing until they force out most Westerners of whatever visa status. Both sides of the political debate want Westerners out. Anyone working here is seen as someone taking a Thai's money and job. And, as this policy shows, they can change the rules on a moment's notice. Retirement visa. Non-immigrant work visa? They could decide next week to kick everybody out of the country starting the next morning. And most Thais would probably celebrate.

I don't think we need to worry about that, they need our money too much.

I'm not quite so sure, anymore. This country seems determined to follow a course of economic folly. Sure, these visa runners are low lying fruit and make for lots of publicity and not much initial economic impact. But, as some have noticed in the other thread on this in the visa forum per se, it will effect tourists who are using Bangkok, dare I say it, as the hub of their vacation to several countries in SE Asia. And the general anger building up in Thai society towards each other will likely eventually find a soft target at easily identifiable minorities in Thailand, especially those perceived as wealthy and those who receive salary on a Western pay scale--forgetting that these Westerners often have bills they must continue to pay back home in dollars or other currencies where the cost of living is much higher.

[badmedicine]

Don't see why the Immigration officials are sounding so apologetic about it. Well past time they enforced their own rules. Many foreign criminals stay here by doing border runs as they can't get a legitimate visa to stay here with a record that shows they did prison time. That includes paedophiles and other scum we can do without.

If you're a tourist, come for your 30 days then politely go home till next year. If you want to stay here longer than that, go through the proper channels. If you're a crim' and can't get a legit' visa, good riddance.

Edited May 12, 2014 by badmedicine

[phuketrichard]

Border fingerprinting ? I dont think so somehow

why not:

they do it in Cambodia in and out

and flying into Malaysia

[AJBangkok]

What a load of rubbish !!!! lol

this "Visa Crackdown" is only ONE THING: its to get 1000 baht from as many tourists as possible!!!

the Malaysian Missing Plane is a convenient story for them to hide under.

how much more secure is a 60 days tourist visa (compared to a 15 or 30 day free visa?????

in BOTH situations they process the details on your passport.

The 60 days tourist visa costs 1000 and you get a nice shiny sticker.

the 15 or 30 day visa is FREE and you have no sticker.

but the immigration computer is updated the SAME (with your SAME passport details).

so how can they say this is a security measure...

if only they could admit it and say its a MONEY MAKING SCHEME!!! Lol

PS: I have no problems about this as I dont mind doing visa-runs every 3 or 6 months.

in reality its not so hard for all the back-2-back visa runners to get a real visa.

I think it's a load or rubbish as well but they have to think of something to blame it on.

More than likely it has something to do with the Police General and Police Major from Immigration that were transferred to inactive posts 2 weeks ago for owning or having shares in a company that was a front for a visa run scam.

They're cleaning house after these two guys were caught gaming they system and now Joe Farang the visa runner is just collateral damage.

Edited May 12, 2014 by AJBangkok

[spacemand]

Give me a 1 year visa and I will show.

1) I have income from abroad only and can support myself.

2) Clean criminal record in Thailand and my home country.

3) Pretty much anything else, I got nothing to hide.

Just give me a chance to stay here.

[Soutpeel]

Don't see why the Immigration officials are sounding so apologetic about it. Well past time they enforced their own rules. Many foreign criminals stay here by doing border runs as they can't get a legitimate visa to stay here with a record that shows they did prison time. That includes paedophiles and other scum we can do without.

If you're a tourist, come for your 30 days then politely go home till next year. If you want to stay here longer than that, go through the proper channels. If you're a crim' and can't get a legit' visa, good riddance.

Er...to be issued at Thai visa with the exception of the O-A visa, you don't need to show a police report to get a visa, so your logic saying criminals visa run because they cant get a visa is somewhat flawed.

[Pralaad]

May be i am crazy, but how does missing plane, stolen passports relate to visa runs?

So a stolen passport is ok if they get a tourist visa?

I am pretty certain, those dealing with stolen passports do not do visa runs and pretty certain some locals are involved in the trade

[londonthai]

entry stamp doesn't bring any money to the state, getting a tourist visa at consulates costs around $30/piece, and much more for other visas.

on top of it - flying in/out, instead of crossing land border, bring up to 25% of the airfare in taxes.

Edited May 12, 2014 by londonthai

[Soutpeel]

Give me a 1 year visa and I will show.

1) I have income from abroad only and can support myself.

2) Clean criminal record in Thailand and my home country.

3) Pretty much anything else, I got nothing to hide.

Just give me a chance to stay here.

What's stopping you getting a 1 year visa now ?

[belg]

so it is not because passports are being stole on an industrial scale, or that they are copied so easely for a small fee ?