Phuket Airport Immigration - No Welcome for Tourists

[stevenl]

Isn't England one of the countries with visa exempt entry?

Sure, but on her first visa free entry she should have shown a ticket out of the country within 30 days.

Simon did say "On her return late this afternoon, she (and others in the immigration line) were 'grilled' by the immigration officer. She had to show her hotel booking, ticket out of the country etc." so I have to assume she did indeed have a return ticket when she flew out of England to Thailand, else she would not have been allowed to board the flight to Thailand.

From this in the OP "knowing that her 30-day stamp was due to expire, she took a daytrip today to KL, including a prebooked tour of some caves near to KL airport." it seems quite clear to me that she did not.

This entry she did, was questioned and met the requirements, a.o. by having a ticket, so was allowed to enter. Nothing wrong with that IMO. Maybe the attitude of the officer was a bit rude, no idea.

[NamKangMan]

Isn't England one of the countries with visa exempt entry?

Sure, but on her first visa free entry she should have shown a ticket out of the country within 30 days.

Simon did say "On her return late this afternoon, she (and others in the immigration line) were 'grilled' by the immigration officer. She had to show her hotel booking, ticket out of the country etc." so I have to assume she did indeed have a return ticket when she flew out of England to Thailand, else she would not have been allowed to board the flight to Thailand.

From this in the OP "knowing that her 30-day stamp was due to expire, she took a daytrip today to KL, including a prebooked tour of some caves near to KL airport." it seems quite clear to me that she did not.

This entry she did, was questioned and met the requirements, a.o. by having a ticket, so was allowed to enter. Nothing wrong with that IMO. Maybe the attitude of the officer was a bit rude, no idea.

And if she was a backpacker, and planned to catch the bus from Chiang Mai across to Udon Thani, then to Nong Khai and across Friendship Bridge into Laos, thus, no air ticket out of Thailand, where would that have left her - possibly detained and deported, and why, because she was leaving Thailand by bus, and not by air.

What does an air ticket out of Thailand prove anyway - nothing.

Edited June 13, 2014 by NamKangMan

[stevenl]

And if she was a backpacker, and planned to catch the bus from Chiang Mai across to Udon Thani, then to Nong Khai and across Friendship Bridge into Laos, thus, no air ticket out of Thailand, where would that have left her - possibly detained and deported, and why, because she was leaving Thailand by bus, and not by air.

What does an air ticket out of Thailand prove anyway - nothing.

Not all rules make sense.

But yes, this a rule that must be met in order to gain access to Thailand. Don't like the rule, don't come to Thailand. Or gain entry with a visa, which appears to have been the easiest option in this case.

[NamKangMan]

And if she was a backpacker, and planned to catch the bus from Chiang Mai across to Udon Thani, then to Nong Khai and across Friendship Bridge into Laos, thus, no air ticket out of Thailand, where would that have left her - possibly detained and deported, and why, because she was leaving Thailand by bus, and not by air.

What does an air ticket out of Thailand prove anyway - nothing.

Not all rules make sense.

But yes, this a rule that must be met in order to gain access to Thailand. Don't like the rule, don't come to Thailand. Or gain entry with a visa, which appears to have been the easiest option in this case.

"Not all rules make sense." - no, they don't, and for the sake of increasing tourism, you would think the Thai Government would have a better attitude than what you have, with "Don't like the rule, don't come to Thailand" especially since you are in business here. sadly, they seem to have the same attitude, and one they can ill afford to have in the tourism industry at the moment.

In relation to getting a visa, some Thai Embassies ask for a copy of an air ticket out of Thailand before granting a visa. They really are making it difficult on a large segment of tourists to Thailand, the backpackers, who "overland" around South East Asia.

Now, i know they may not spend as much money per day as a 2 week holiday maker, but they will stay in Thailand for around 2 months, and their money will be spread across the country, and probably will end up being equal, or greater than those coming here on a 2 week holiday.

[stevenl]

"some Thai Embassies ask for a copy of an air ticket out of Thailand before granting a visa"

That is an official requirement for a visa application. AFAIK no (Western) embassies refuse a visa if people don't have it. That is single entry tourist visa, multiple entries can be more difficult to obtain.

Oh, and please please please, just for once, try to refrain from making this personal.

Edited June 13, 2014 by stevenl

[simon43]

She did not meet the entry requirements for visa exempt entry when she came in first time

Huh?? She is a tourist, visiting Thailand. She didn't come her to stay with friends. She has been travelling around Thailand and staying in hotels.

Please explain where she did not meet the visa-exempt requirements.

[simon43]

Don't like the rule, don't come to Thailand.

That's a terrible attitude! You can argue until you are blue in the face about tourists should know better etc etc, but the bottom line is that other south-east Asian countries will welcome them (and their money) with open arms!

I flew to KL last month and am given a 90-day visa-exempt without any questions nor fingerprints. Just smiles........

[FritsSikkink]

Immigration officers in Phuket are a pretty surly lot for the most part, with the occasional friendly officer that either just got a promotion or was just transferred here. They love exercising their two minutes of power, and now with the new guidelines, I can only imagine it getting worse.

I have witnessed this surly behavior by immigration officials on a number of occasions and it really is pathetic.

A small group of young Japanese males waited in the queue and when the first one got to the desk he obviously hadn't completed the form correctly so the official gesticulated madly at him to go away, no explanation given. The guy turned to others in the group and they had no idea what to do, so another approached and was also given short shrift. He then angrily shooed them away and they had no idea what to do.

I watched a young French lady also get shooed away all because of a signature, so she duly stepped back a little and signed the form and reapproached the official, who would not have anything to do with her, motioning her angrily to the back of the very long queue.

It also happened to me when the official wanted to see my arrival/dep card when I was going overseas and barked a question at me. I told her it was in the passport, so she flicked through it and said it wasn't, telling me I was wrong and in no uncertain terms, very rude in fact. So I took the passport back and opened it up at the page where it had been previously stapled by immigration, and she snatched it back, growled at me and let me through.

These officials are an embarrassment to Thailand and the human race in general.

I think it is pathetic that someone can't correctly fill in the form before going to immigration and cause a lot of delay. You have loads of time in the plane to ask someone to help you.

[xylophone]

Immigration officers in Phuket are a pretty surly lot for the most part, with the occasional friendly officer that either just got a promotion or was just transferred here. They love exercising their two minutes of power, and now with the new guidelines, I can only imagine it getting worse.

I have witnessed this surly behavior by immigration officials on a number of occasions and it really is pathetic.

A small group of young Japanese males waited in the queue and when the first one got to the desk he obviously hadn't completed the form correctly so the official gesticulated madly at him to go away, no explanation given. The guy turned to others in the group and they had no idea what to do, so another approached and was also given short shrift. He then angrily shooed them away and they had no idea what to do.

I watched a young French lady also get shooed away all because of a signature, so she duly stepped back a little and signed the form and reapproached the official, who would not have anything to do with her, motioning her angrily to the back of the very long queue.

It also happened to me when the official wanted to see my arrival/dep card when I was going overseas and barked a question at me. I told her it was in the passport, so she flicked through it and said it wasn't, telling me I was wrong and in no uncertain terms, very rude in fact. So I took the passport back and opened it up at the page where it had been previously stapled by immigration, and she snatched it back, growled at me and let me through.

These officials are an embarrassment to Thailand and the human race in general.

I think it is pathetic that someone can't correctly fill in the form before going to immigration and cause a lot of delay. You have loads of time in the plane to ask someone to help you.

So you've never made a mistake in completing a form?? Get real cos we all make them, but maybe you are perfect!!

[NamKangMan]

"some Thai Embassies ask for a copy of an air ticket out of Thailand before granting a visa"

That is an official requirement for a visa application. AFAIK no (Western) embassies refuse a visa if people don't have it. That is single entry tourist visa, multiple entries can be more difficult to obtain.

Oh, and please please please, just for once, try to refrain from making this personal.

It's never personal with me, I just post it as I see it.

It's unusual for you to post a negative comment such as, "Don't like the rule, don't come to Thailand." Anyway, it's your comment and I think it reflects the poor attitude of the Thai Immigration and Thai Governmnet in general.

Of course, one door closes and another one opens. Pehaps a Thai bus company will start selling tickets over the internet that meets the requirement of showing proof you are leaving Thailand before your visa expires - who knows?

As you well know, I'm a visa runner, and the only Thai Embassy I have come across, in recent times, that ask for a photocopy of the air ticket out of Thailand is the Thai Embassy in Ho Chi Minh City - Vietnam. I haven't been asked for it at other Embassies, pre crackdown / military coup.

[NamKangMan]

Immigration officers in Phuket are a pretty surly lot for the most part, with the occasional friendly officer that either just got a promotion or was just transferred here. They love exercising their two minutes of power, and now with the new guidelines, I can only imagine it getting worse.

I have witnessed this surly behavior by immigration officials on a number of occasions and it really is pathetic.

A small group of young Japanese males waited in the queue and when the first one got to the desk he obviously hadn't completed the form correctly so the official gesticulated madly at him to go away, no explanation given. The guy turned to others in the group and they had no idea what to do, so another approached and was also given short shrift. He then angrily shooed them away and they had no idea what to do.

I watched a young French lady also get shooed away all because of a signature, so she duly stepped back a little and signed the form and reapproached the official, who would not have anything to do with her, motioning her angrily to the back of the very long queue.

It also happened to me when the official wanted to see my arrival/dep card when I was going overseas and barked a question at me. I told her it was in the passport, so she flicked through it and said it wasn't, telling me I was wrong and in no uncertain terms, very rude in fact. So I took the passport back and opened it up at the page where it had been previously stapled by immigration, and she snatched it back, growled at me and let me through.

These officials are an embarrassment to Thailand and the human race in general.

I think it is pathetic that someone can't correctly fill in the form before going to immigration and cause a lot of delay. You have loads of time in the plane to ask someone to help you.

Of course, everyone understands the Roman alphabet, right????

[stevenl]

She did not meet the entry requirements for visa exempt entry when she came in first time

Huh?? She is a tourist, visiting Thailand. She didn't come her to stay with friends. She has been travelling around Thailand and staying in hotels.

Please explain where she did not meet the visa-exempt requirements.

Flight ticket out of Thailand within 30 days is a visa exempt requirement.

"Pehaps a Thai bus company will start selling tickets over the internet that meets the requirement of showing proof you are leaving Thailand before your visa expires - who knows?"

Won't help because the requirement is an airticket.

Edited June 13, 2014 by stevenl

[FritsSikkink]

Immigration officers in Phuket are a pretty surly lot for the most part, with the occasional friendly officer that either just got a promotion or was just transferred here. They love exercising their two minutes of power, and now with the new guidelines, I can only imagine it getting worse.

I have witnessed this surly behavior by immigration officials on a number of occasions and it really is pathetic.

A small group of young Japanese males waited in the queue and when the first one got to the desk he obviously hadn't completed the form correctly so the official gesticulated madly at him to go away, no explanation given. The guy turned to others in the group and they had no idea what to do, so another approached and was also given short shrift. He then angrily shooed them away and they had no idea what to do.

I watched a young French lady also get shooed away all because of a signature, so she duly stepped back a little and signed the form and reapproached the official, who would not have anything to do with her, motioning her angrily to the back of the very long queue.

It also happened to me when the official wanted to see my arrival/dep card when I was going overseas and barked a question at me. I told her it was in the passport, so she flicked through it and said it wasn't, telling me I was wrong and in no uncertain terms, very rude in fact. So I took the passport back and opened it up at the page where it had been previously stapled by immigration, and she snatched it back, growled at me and let me through.

These officials are an embarrassment to Thailand and the human race in general.

I think it is pathetic that someone can't correctly fill in the form before going to immigration and cause a lot of delay. You have loads of time in the plane to ask someone to help you.

Of course, everyone understands the Roman alphabet, right????

You probably don't :

You have loads of time in the plane to ask someone to help you.

[simon43]

Of course, everyone understands the Roman alphabet, right????

As a point of interest, (and based on my experiences working as a TPV at the airport), one of the main reasons for delays in the immigration queues during the night hours, is because the vast majority of inbound passengers are mainland /Chinese, and many (most?) of them are unable to read/write Thai or English - the only 2 languages on the immigration card...

[technologybytes]

This topic is a lot of fuss about nothing. It's not like they refused her entry!

Mistake 1) She came to Thailand without a visa.

Mistake 2) When she realised that she should go and get a visa she decided not to, and instead to try a re-entry under the 30 day exempt scheme.

Mistake 3) Expect sympathy for being asked a couple of questions by an immigration officer who was within rights to refuse enty.

Mistake 4) To imagine anyone on this forum really cares.

[DerkMR]

What happened to the 'smile' lessons that the officers attended some time back?

"The land formerly known as Land of Smiles"...

Bye,

Derk

[khrab]

I get grilled in Australia every time i visit, but its hardly a grilling more like a standard procedure(perhaps random but still standard)

Do they ask you if you have any criminal background?

Rest assured. It's not necessary anymore.

[ggt]

The General has more important matters than making sure foreign tourist are happy with immigration...I like the scrutiny of people coming into the country...should have been done long ago...it is good for the country to change its image...of allowing all manner of people a safe haven...

[Mudcrab]

^{No-one has commented on my assertion about the bad 'PR' for the junta . I really don't think the General wants tourists to assume that the heavy-handed treatment that some receive is because the military don't want foreign tourists to visit Phuket.}

^{It is time for smiles (lots of them!) from these immigration officers as they politely request to see the relevant documents.}

^{(I was going to add a photo of a smiling immigration officer, but not surprisingly, Google didn't seem to find one.....)}

Nobody commented because nobody sees it as relevant.

[IsaanUSA]

Reminds me of my first trip to Vietnam. Very unwelcoming agent and I didnt think I would be allowed entry.

In the end, everything worked out okay. It's not the immigration officer's job to welcome people or to be polite.

[Mudcrab]

From this in the OP "knowing that her 30-day stamp was due to expire, she took a daytrip today to KL, including a prebooked tour of some caves near to KL airport." it seems quite clear to me that she did not.

Simon did say "On her return late this afternoon, she (and others in the immigration line) were 'grilled' by the immigration officer. She had to show her hotel booking, ticket out of the country etc." so I have to assume she did indeed have a return ticket when she flew out of England to Thailand, else she would not have been allowed to board the flight to Thailand.

This entry she did, was questioned and met the requirements, a.o. by having a ticket, so was allowed to enter. Nothing wrong with that IMO. Maybe the attitude of the officer was a bit rude, no idea.

And if she was a backpacker, and planned to catch the bus from Chiang Mai across to Udon Thani, then to Nong Khai and across Friendship Bridge into Laos, thus, no air ticket out of Thailand, where would that have left her - possibly detained and deported, and why, because she was leaving Thailand by bus, and not by air.

What does an air ticket out of Thailand prove anyway - nothing.

it can provide evidence that the tourist will leave the country within 30 days if you expect a 30 day visa exempt stamp at immigration.

If you want to tour around the various localities then get a tourist visa. For the vast majority of people who want to spend a couple of weeks in Thailand the visa exemption is all that is required.

I would hazard a guess that most or many longer term "tourists" using this system are just rorting the system and are now being found out and refused re-entry and rightly so

[edwardflory]

Last time I flew in to BKK, ( LOADED plane 45+ days ago ) the very nice helpful person at the "start" of the ropes ( female ) asked me "DO you have a visa", -- yes--, "What type of visa sir", -- retirement --, "Please go to Thailand citizen line sir." ( admitted: I had my passport opened to visa page so they could see ) I by passed probably 40+ people in the "other" line

I have ALWAYS had a good experience with the Immigration Officers.

===========

From what I have heard, ( and seen ) if either PARTNER is a THAI CITIZEN and YOU ARE MARRIED, have the THAI PARTNER take BOTH passports ( and children's passports if with you ) to THAI line, CITIZENS passport presented 1st, have CITIZEN explain married to non-Thai and we travel together, here is their passport, and the non-citizen is USUALLY allowed to go through the Thai line ------ ESPECIALLY GOOD if you have children with you...OR...Children have THAI passports and you are non-citizen.

It all depends on the Immigration Officer

[RonanTheBarbarian]

To all those people saying "just get the right Visa beforehand", i would point out that it is still permissable (and a valid choice to make)to travel to Thailand with a Visa exemption, and to make two back-to-back Visa exempt trips if you wish and are flying in and out of the country each time.

The last time i was in SE Asia , I was there for slightly over 30 days, and I used used Bangkok as a base. (ie, I started and ended my trip with a Suvarnabhumi flight)

At first i thought I would have to get a tourist Visa, which involves shelling out €35 in my case, as I would be in SE Asia for more than 30 days in total, and I knew my flight out would be more than 30 days in the future on the day i first arrived in BKK airport.

However, as I had a flight booked out to Bali in the middle of that period, prior to the 30 days, I realised that this would suffice as my exit for visa exemption purposes, and I flew out of BKK and back, getting the second visa exempt entry on my arrival back from Bali.

This way I was able to avoid having to shell out for a Visa, which I believed to be a perfectly respectable thing to do.

But now it seems a day trip to KL is seen as abusing the system by some on here, even for a woman who seems like bona fide tourist (base on the OP).

How long does one have to be away to count as a bona fide tourist for all those who are criticising the woman?

I presume they think my trip to Bali was ok as I stayed 5 days.

But what if i stayed three?

Or only one?

Surely if one has onward tickets that seem to show that one will be less than 90 days in the kingdom in a 6 month period, it is perfectly fine to do as many visa exempt entries as one wants in that time?

I am thinking of a friend who was in Thailand last year, and in a 40 day stay, went to Laos, Cambodia,Malaysia, and Vietnam, all on separate trips with flights out of Bangkok.

Presumably when the new rules come in for airport arrivals, that will be impossible without a visa (triple entry at that - €105).

[Lokie]

and has been mentioned, arriving at HKT as an international, you come down the escalator into the immigration area and get your first glimpse of ques, ok, fair enough, but then you wait, and wait, and then you count the number of empty booths, and the amount of immigration officers doing Sweet FA, and the unpleasant, unfriendly attitude put forward by these people who for many are their first contact with Thai people.... a tad embarrassing really for Thailand, but hey who gives a to$$ as long as farang brings his (our - Thai) money, They can[t even stamp your passport in a decent fashion, in/out stamps should easily fit 4 lots neatly on one page, the average is three and sometimes down to two lots of stamps because they do an incorrect entry/date stamp, ammend and no apology... Cretins!

[Mab]

Officers could be under stress from military but generally all are more than welcoming.

[jacko45k]

Her actions were not really those of a tourist,flying into KL and straight back.

That was what I did when working here years ago.

Visiting a few caves is as relevant as visiting a bar in KL.

Good to see that immigration are imposing their new mandate without consideration of race or gender, or consideration full stop.

But she got in......

Perhaps she should have got a tourist visa, since she planned staying more than 30 days!

[PhillyBoy]

No one mentioned anything about the Junta because most of us don't believe this is wrong. They asked questions and she provided answers. Did they conduct a strip search? Did they somehow embarrass her or demean her? I did not hear any of that. Why didn't she get a TV from KL? She did it to circumvent the process and we all know they are taking a new look at people who do this type of maneuver. I for one like what the Junta is doing and hope they do a lot more. When you enter another Country....answer the questions and provide the documents...that's it!

[stevenl]

To all those people saying "just get the right Visa beforehand", i would point out that it is still permissable (and a valid choice to make)to travel to Thailand with a Visa exemption,<snip>

However, as I had a flight booked out to Bali in the middle of that period, prior to the 30 days, I realised that this would suffice as my exit for visa exemption purposes, and I flew out of BKK and back, getting the second visa exempt entry on my arrival back from Bali.<snip>

Yes, it is, but one has to meet the requirements. You had a flightticket out of Thailand, she did not on her first entry.

So some questions get asked and she is allowed to enter, what is the big deal? I think the only big deal here is a TPV making a problem about something that is really SOP, and rightfully so. He should know better.

Edited June 14, 2014 by stevenl

[stevenl]

No one mentioned anything about the Junta because most of us don't believe this is wrong. They asked questions and she provided answers. Did they conduct a strip search? Did they somehow embarrass her or demean her? I did not hear any of that. Why didn't she get a TV from KL? She did it to circumvent the process and we all know they are taking a new look at people who do this type of maneuver. I for one like what the Junta is doing and hope they do a lot more. When you enter another Country....answer the questions and provide the documents...that's it!

Agree with you, except for one thing: she did not circumvent the system, because she appears to be a genuine tourist.

[Benmart]

I wasn't there and it appears neither was the OP. If possible, perhaps the British lady could make the call or otherwise contact the General. Nothing better than a first hand report to gets the "facts" straight.