ISIS: The first terror group to build an Islamic State?

[Neurath]

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Glen Beck is a nut case. He predicts one or two things that have a sting propensity to occur and it absolves him of not being a nut? True believers not much different than ISIS except we are civilized in that we don't advocate indiscriminate brutal violence only premeditated tactical violence. Chopping off a head droning the shit out of a house. Same same but less barbaric?


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Glenbeckistan - a very strange place inhahited by very strange people advocating very strange things. In Glenbeckistan everyone knows that ISIS is a result of the formation of the Federal Reserve, the reach of the IRS and the liberal socialist agenda that spread like a cancer through an otherwise healthy body politic. I've even seen the diagrams. Oh, and FEMA and Mexicans.

[folium]

Classic put down of Blair and his self-serving drivel re Iraq by the Mayor of London, Boris Johnson (crazy hair, first rate brain):

"I have come to the conclusion that Tony Blair has finally gone mad. He wrote an essay on his website on Sunday that struck me as unhinged in its refusal to face facts. In discussing the disaster of modern Iraq he made assertions that are so jaw-droppingly and breathtakingly at variance with reality that he surely needs professional psychiatric help."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iraq/10901651/Blairs-Iraq-invasion-was-a-tragic-error-and-hes-mad-to-deny-it.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27864603

[folium]

Excellent map showing the oilfields, pipelines etc in Iraq and which areas have been taken (so far) by the insurgents.

The Kurdish move to consolidate the area around Kirkuk is fundamentally important as it secures possession of the massive oil reserves there.

[NeverSure]

Even if roughly 10% of Belgium's call themselves Muslims by 2030, it's a moot point as far as controlling a political landscape. Muslims don't care much for democracy. A few radicals can dominate by intimidation. If harsh words don't suffice, then bullets or bombs can add leverage to their goal: domination. ...by whatever means. Fairness, decency, honesty - are for wimps.

Care to name the last non-muslim majority country that muslims managed to take over?

Londonistan.

[NeverSure]

Glen Beck is a nut case. He predicts one or two things that have a sting propensity to occur and it absolves him of not being a nut? True believers not much different than ISIS except we are civilized in that we don't advocate indiscriminate brutal violence only premeditated tactical violence. Chopping off a head droning the shit out of a house. Same same but less barbaric?

Sent from my mobile

I don't know. Seems the people you are talking about are firing at known terrorists, and sometimes get collateral damage.

Not really like the London Train Bombing, is it? More like trying to take people who would do that, isn't it?

You were talking about all of the drone flying and shooting that the Brits do and have been doing for years in Afghanistan, weren't you? LINK

Edited June 16, 2014 by NeverSure

[englishinsiam]

400 British passport holders fighting there too. I say revoke their Citizenship

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[Yahooka]

A VERY disturbing video of how these ISIL terrorist portray themselves.......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKELtjoNrPU

[Mosha]

I believe Obama will come up with something. He managed to oversee the Bin Laden demise, something Bush had vowed to do before he left office.

Where are. Blair and Bush now? They should be out there rectifying the mess they fomented.

Blair is busy telling anyone who will listen. "It's not my fault".

[shadmo63]

I wonder how Russia is taking this, given that it's their support of Syria that's incubated this organisation in the first place.

Russia happy to see US keep busy and preoccupied elsewhere. Russia and anyone with any sense also knows we cannot afford to be dragged into another conflict. This is the one thing that can hurt our economic recovery.

Love your wording - "we cannot afford to be DRAGGED into another conflict."

Hmm....reap what you sew comes to mind.

[shadmo63]

Soon we'll have "Coalition of the Willing II" - this time with Iran on the same team as the USA. Along with all the other USA lapdog nations.

Palau, Tonga, Micronesia,...etc etc. They must have whole armies that fit in a Toyota Vios!!! And have spare room in the back.

[iancnx]

Thanks Scott.

Guys I'm in Iraq right now and the news flooding in from the North isn't good, the ISIS/ISIL have seized almost half a billion dollars, as well as tens of thousands of weapons left by the Iraqi Army and police, including aircraft, and heavy armour, they have been in control of Fallujah and Ramadi since January, and firmly entrenched, Mosul fell in less than 48 hours, Tikrit less..

Great stuff, as you reap you will sow.

If I were you I would haul my sorry white ass out of there asap, "oil money" hope you are being paid handsomely for being there.

So this is June and you have stayed since this started in Jan?

Blind Pugh could have seen this coming.

I've been working in Iraq for the past 10 years, I'm however based down in the South, the level of violence has never been as bad as Al Anbar and the North. There's nothing sorry about my white ass either, you seem to be inferring that this was brought about by our own doing?

Your lack of knowledge and understanding is understandable, as Iraq has always maintained a level of violence, since the last US Troops left, it just wasn't news worthy or in anyone's interests any longer, to have it reported on mainstream as the public interest was no longer there in a war that cost so many American and coalition lives, not to mention the hundreds of thousand of Iraqi ones since 2003.

I work 6 weeks on 6 weeks off, and blind Pew apparently didn't see this coming, as the Iraqi Intelligence people, nor the American Intelligence people at the US Embassy seen it coming either mate, we're talking about 3-4000 ISIS fighters roaming through the North, the Iraqi Army abandoned their posts as they were given an ultimatum by the ISIS "leave and live, stay and die, as we're willing to die killing you" ... they decided that instead of protecting their own country, they went home..

The Iraqi Government told the US Administration that it could handle the security within their own country and they were no longer needed, they soon started taking down all the defences and not long after that, the ISIL started their terror campaigns against the people of Iraq, since The US Administration decided to start arming and funding the Syrian Rebels, of which the ISIL was part of, they've grown stronger and bolder, and in January of this year, the Iraqi Security Forces have been battling them to try and regain Fallujah and Ramadi, without success, and 2 days ago, they launched a massive strike against key locations in the North, with minimum resistance.

What's happening in Iraq just now,is whats going to happen also in Afghanistan as soon as the pullout is finished.

I haven't read the full thread yet, but want to reiterate the absolute fact of your last paragraph. Failed American foreign policy supported by the lapdog Brits and the yes men and women of Europe are collectively responsible for the millions of lives lost in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Syria, and soon to be Iran! The US will be licking their lips at the opportunity to wage war in a so called coalition (again) with Iran.

[Johpa]

A VERY disturbing video of how these ISIL terrorist portray themselves.......

"I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream. That's my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight razor . . . and surviving."

And as both Kurtzes said: "the horror...the horror".

The west has no possible response in the current western arsenal to this horror unleashed by Bush, Cheney, Blair et al: a horror financed by their close friends and fellow investors in the Carlysle Group the Saudis, and exacerbated by Obama.

[Ulysses G.]

Yeah sure. US foreign policy is responsible for the Sunni and Shia conflict that started in the year 632.

[boomerangutang]

Failed American foreign policy supported by the lapdog Brits and the yes men and women of Europe are collectively responsible for the millions of lives lost in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Syria, and soon to be Iran! The US will be licking their lips at the opportunity to wage war in a so called coalition (again) with Iran.

Gimme a break. The overwhelming reason there is so much human suffering and environmental destruction in those dunes is because of locals. On a macro level, they keep allowing/enabling despots to be their leaders. They're hobbled by mean-spirited belief systems and a complete disregard for environmental husbandry. I won't say they deserve all the misery they create, but I have two bits of advice for them: {A} make less babies, and {B} adopt a less mean-spirited belief system.

[iancnx]

Failed American foreign policy supported by the lapdog Brits and the yes men and women of Europe are collectively responsible for the millions of lives lost in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Syria, and soon to be Iran! The US will be licking their lips at the opportunity to wage war in a so called coalition (again) with Iran.

Gimme a break. The overwhelming reason there is so much human suffering and environmental destruction in those dunes is because of locals. On a macro level, they keep allowing/enabling despots to be their leaders. They're hobbled by mean-spirited belief systems and a complete disregard for environmental husbandry. I won't say they deserve all the misery they create, but I have two bits of advice for them: {A} make less babies, and {B} adopt a less mean-spirited belief system.

You clearly know nothing about Middle East/SW Asian politics. The overwhelming reason for the human suffering you mention is due to the interference in other nations affairs by the US and their cronies who have decided to impose THEIR brand of democracy on the rest of the world. Environmental destruction in those dunes is wholly due to the west insatiable demand for oil. Watch very carefully. Iraqi civil war today is exactly how the Afghan/Pakistani (Borders) conflict of tomorrow will pan out. And all due to American/British and euro lapdog GREED.

[iancnx]

Yeah sure. US foreign policy is responsible for the Sunni and Shia conflict that started in the year 632.

No, the US didn't exist in 632 as you well know. But yes, Uncle Sam is responsible (but not exclusively) for the strife in the Middle East post WW2. Read your recent history, learn, and make your judgements based of facts.

[englishinsiam]

Gimme a break. The overwhelming reason there is so much human suffering and environmental destruction in those dunes is because of locals. On a macro level, they keep allowing/enabling despots to be their leaders. They're hobbled by mean-spirited belief systems and a complete disregard for environmental husbandry. I won't say they deserve all the misery they create, but I have two bits of advice for them: {A} make less babies, and {B} adopt a less mean-spirited belief system.

You clearly know nothing about Middle East/SW Asian politics. The overwhelming reason for the human suffering you mention is due to the interference in other nations affairs by the US and their cronies who have decided to impose THEIR brand of democracy on the rest of the world. Environmental destruction in those dunes is wholly due to the west insatiable demand for oil. Watch very carefully. Iraqi civil war today is exactly how the Afghan/Pakistani (Borders) conflict of tomorrow will pan out. And all due to American/British and euro lapdog GREED.

Absolute rubbish yes the Western Countries have contributed to some of the strife there and some killings by keeping certain despots in power but the overwhelming problem with these people is their cult. Sorry I mean religion. ...

Islam is the main culprit in all of this. The belief system is stuck in the 6th Century. We have tried to impose democracy in these nations and it just won't work because the people aren't used to thinking for themselves. They are used to being ruled by fear. They believe they have to live their lives according to the teachings of a middle ages drugged up paedophilic despot.

Sadly they will kill and rape each other to extinction. If there was no oil there then the world wouldn't care about them and they'd all still be living in tents in the desert.

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[iancnx]

Englishinseam. Can you re-post? Your quotes are garbled!

[boomerangutang]

Failed American foreign policy supported by the lapdog Brits and the yes men and women of Europe are collectively responsible for the millions of lives lost in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Syria, and soon to be Iran! The US will be licking their lips at the opportunity to wage war in a so called coalition (again) with Iran.

Gimme a break. The overwhelming reason there is so much human suffering and environmental destruction in those dunes is because of locals. On a macro level, they keep allowing/enabling despots to be their leaders. They're hobbled by mean-spirited belief systems and a complete disregard for environmental husbandry. I won't say they deserve all the misery they create, but I have two bits of advice for them: {A} make less babies, and {B} adopt a less mean-spirited belief system.

You clearly know nothing about Middle East/SW Asian politics. The overwhelming reason for the human suffering you mention is due to the interference in other nations affairs by the US and their cronies who have decided to impose THEIR brand of democracy on the rest of the world. Environmental destruction in those dunes is wholly due to the west insatiable demand for oil. Watch very carefully. Iraqi civil war today is exactly how the Afghan/Pakistani (Borders) conflict of tomorrow will pan out. And all due to American/British and euro lapdog GREED.

A farang friend blames everything bad that happens to him - on others (he's also highly superstitious). It's like the people living in those dunes: everything bad they're experiencing is brought upon them by others - ....is what they'll tell you. Those 'others' are either infidels like you or me, or other Allah-worshipers who don't worship in the same precise manner as they should.

BTW, what are the big-bucks Saudis doing to try and fix the many problems in the region. Probably doing much the same (about the ISIS problem) as they do with the Palestinian problem: Sit back with their multiple wives (who aren't allowed out to drive, or be independent), eating peeled grapes, and figuring, "it's someone else's problem, let them suffer." It's funny, we never see any Arab or Persian country every arrange a sit-down discussion of how to lessen problems between Israel and their neighbors. It's ALWAYS left up to the US or Europe. Similarly, Chinese are no help (they're just looking for resources to buy), and Russians are just looking for places to sell arms.

[simple1]

There are meetings held in secret between Israeli and Arab representatives. Many meeting have leaked out over time in various publications. I would guess this is a process to avoid the usual negative megaphone diplomacy that plays to domestic political consumption on both sides of the divide. An example of a meeting that was leaked via the media at:

http://english.al-akhbar.com/node/17773

[shadmo63]

"It's ALWAYS left up to the US or Europe."- @Boomerangutang

Q. Do you think the Saudi's would like to see peace in Israel/Palestine?

A. No they couldn't give a rats....and definitely not before every Jew in the place has been exterminated.

[cloghead]

Failed American foreign policy supported by the lapdog Brits and the yes men and women of Europe are collectively responsible for the millions of lives lost in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Syria, and soon to be Iran! The US will be licking their lips at the opportunity to wage war in a so called coalition (again) with Iran.

Gimme a break. The overwhelming reason there is so much human suffering and environmental destruction in those dunes is because of locals. On a macro level, they keep allowing/enabling despots to be their leaders. They're hobbled by mean-spirited belief systems and a complete disregard for environmental husbandry. I won't say they deserve all the misery they create, but I have two bits of advice for them: {A} make less babies, and {B} adopt a less mean-spirited belief system.

You clearly know nothing about Middle East/SW Asian politics. The overwhelming reason for the human suffering you mention is due to the interference in other nations affairs by the US and their cronies who have decided to impose THEIR brand of democracy on the rest of the world. Environmental destruction in those dunes is wholly due to the west insatiable demand for oil. Watch very carefully. Iraqi civil war today is exactly how the Afghan/Pakistani (Borders) conflict of tomorrow will pan out. And all due to American/British and euro lapdog GREED.

'I think you're thoroughly mistaken old chap'

[Chicog]

"It's ALWAYS left up to the US or Europe."- @Boomerangutang

Q. Do you think the Saudi's would like to see peace in Israel/Palestine?

A. No they couldn't give a rats....and definitely not before every Jew in the place has been exterminated.

Depends what you mean by "Saudi's".

Is it:

(I) Members of the Al Saud family who run the country.

(II) Wahabi/Sunni Saudis.

(III) Shi'a Saudis.

Edited June 17, 2014 by Chicog

[Ulysses G.]

Yeah sure. US foreign policy is responsible for the Sunni and Shia conflict that started in the year 632.

No, the US didn't exist in 632 as you well know. But yes, Uncle Sam is responsible (but not exclusively) for the strife in the Middle East post WW2. Read your recent history, learn, and make your judgements based of facts.

I've read plenty of recent history. That is why I understand that most of the Arab' worlds problems are their own fault, even though they constantly blame everyone else. No one is forcing them to murder gays, Christians, Jews and EACH OTHER, but they have done it for centuries.

Edited June 17, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[shadmo63]

"It's ALWAYS left up to the US or Europe."- @Boomerangutang

Q. Do you think the Saudi's would like to see peace in Israel/Palestine?

A. No they couldn't give a rats....and definitely not before every Jew in the place has been exterminated.

Depends what you mean by "Saudi's".

Is it:

(I) Members of the Al Saud family who run the country.

(II) Wahabi/Sunni Saudis.

(III) Shi'a Saudis.

Yes

[Neurath]

Situation with this mob looks very serious. Might be time to stop bitiching over who is most responsible for the current lamentable situation and start considering what, if anything, can or should be done about it. This doesn't mean ignoring recent and historical causes, but probably not a good to spend 90% of the time blaming BlairBush or ObambaBengazi.

[shadmo63]

Situation with this mob looks very serious. Might be time to stop bitiching over who is most responsible for the current lamentable situation and start considering what, if anything, can or should be done about it. This doesn't mean ignoring recent and historical causes, but probably not a good to spend 90% of the time blaming BlairBush or ObambaBengazi.

In my house it's "you made the mess, you clean it up".

[simple1]

Situation with this mob looks very serious. Might be time to stop bitiching over who is most responsible for the current lamentable situation and start considering what, if anything, can or should be done about it. This doesn't mean ignoring recent and historical causes, but probably not a good to spend 90% of the time blaming BlairBush or ObambaBengazi.

In my house it's "you made the mess, you clean it up".

In fairness media reports state that the US Administration has been putting pressure of the Shiite government in Iraq for a number of years to implement reconcillation policies and actions to address Sunni disenfranchisement. The near complete lack of political will by the Iraq government for reconcillation appears to have had a major contribution to the current state of affairs.

[coma]

Situation with this mob looks very serious. Might be time to stop bitiching over who is most responsible for the current lamentable situation and start considering what, if anything, can or should be done about it. This doesn't mean ignoring recent and historical causes, but probably not a good to spend 90% of the time blaming BlairBush or ObambaBengazi.

In my house it's "you made the mess, you clean it up".

In fairness media reports state that the US Administration has been putting pressure of the Shiite government in Iraq for a number of years to implement reconcillation policies and actions to address Sunni disenfranchisement. The near complete lack of political will by the Iraq government for reconcillation appears to have had a major contribution to the current state of affairs.

True. Hence the reluctance by the US to assist the Maliki regime ATM until they get their political house in order. If they were to be seen supporting Maliki at this time, that would be frowned upon and seen as supporting the Shia's by ALL Sunnis in the region. And in turn would promote more radical hostility towards the US.

At last we are starting to see a responsible USA government policy in the middle East.

[capcc76]

I wonder how Russia is taking this, given that it's their support of Syria that's incubated this organisation in the first place.

Russia happy to see US keep busy and preoccupied elsewhere. Russia and anyone with any sense also knows we cannot afford to be dragged into another conflict. This is the one thing that can hurt our economic recovery.

Love your wording - "we cannot afford to be DRAGGED into another conflict."

Hmm....reap what you sew comes to mind.

No, I prefer to give credit where credit is due. These people were disasters long before the US came a long and will continue to be a disaster.

Maliki's leadership is to blame at a grass roots level. This situation is comparable to giving a bum an education, training, a place to live, a car, a job and money to start a new life, but they throw it all away and just return to their bum ways. That should be the lessen the US learns. Some will never change their ways.

http://m.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/collapse-of-iraqi-army-a-failure-for-nations-premier-and-for-us-military/2014/06/12/25191bc0-f24f-11e3-914c-1fbd0614e2d4_story.html

Instead of focusing on training and equipping the military, Maliki has used all of his tools to target his political rivals, said Emma Sky, a top adviser to U.S. generals in Iraq during the latter years of the U.S. occupation. Maliki sought to consolidate power and protect his regime. His opponents fear and distrust him.

In particular, Maliki, a Shiite Muslim, has alienated Sunni tribal leaders in northern and western Iraq who helped shift the course of the war in 2007 when they turned on forces aligned with al-Qaeda in Iraq and backed the U.S. military.