Halal processed food taking over our supermarkets...

[giddyup]

The OP doesn't understand business practice.

Nothing to do with Islamificaiton and everything to do with rationalizing product lines.

Halal food will be eaten by all Muslims and the vast majority of non Muslims

Non Halal food will not be eaten by the vast majority of Muslims.

Non Halal food either requires two product lines (double the supply costs) or acceptance of giving up the Muslim portion of the market.

Halal food only lines risk losing the trade of people who object to Halal food on animal welfare grounds and bigots ( a significant proportion of the former will be the latter).

OP. You are on the losing side of market forces.

Halal procured meat is Religious cruelty, pure and simple as in that awful video (i have actually witnessed worse animal suffering due to Halal in the Middle East than the video).

The world has moved on from the stone age and more humane methods exist for killing animals for food.

Evidently not everyone has moved on from the stone age :-)

Don't be too harsh. Plenty here on this thread clearly have problems moving on from the attitudes of the 1950s and the dying days of empire.

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I doubt they are beheading or stoning anyone, stuck in the 50's or not.

[samran]

The OP doesn't understand business practice.

Nothing to do with Islamificaiton and everything to do with rationalizing product lines.

Halal food will be eaten by all Muslims and the vast majority of non Muslims

Non Halal food will not be eaten by the vast majority of Muslims.

Non Halal food either requires two product lines (double the supply costs) or acceptance of giving up the Muslim portion of the market.

Halal food only lines risk losing the trade of people who object to Halal food on animal welfare grounds and bigots ( a significant proportion of the former will be the latter).

OP. You are on the losing side of market forces.

Halal procured meat is Religious cruelty, pure and simple as in that awful video (i have actually witnessed worse animal suffering due to Halal in the Middle East than the video).

The world has moved on from the stone age and more humane methods exist for killing animals for food.

Evidently not everyone has moved on from the stone age :-)

Don't be too harsh. Plenty here on this thread clearly have problems moving on from the attitudes of the 1950s and the dying days of empire.

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I doubt they are beheading or stoning anyone, stuck in the 50's or not.

Graduate to lethal injection and drones I guess.

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[Seastallion]

Maybe I am a bit slow, but I did not get your point if you had one, sorry.

Anyway, while I am sure lots of people are judged based on their looks, I was referring to muslims who say themselves where their allegiance lies, hence no judgement. I assume it is ok to believe what they say.

there are plenty of christians who will tell you their first allegiance is to god rather than their government or country.

Hey but that us okay, cause they are generally white.

Which country has their motto 'In God We Trust' put on their money... United States of something. Someone remind me...

You guys can keep deflecting. At the end of the day, there are very few problems in the world due to someone being catholic,christian, hindu, buddhist or whatever, yet in many if not most countries where muslim minorities exist there are major problems with these muslim minorities. Further, in countries where the majority is muslim, there is quite often civil war as even the different muslim factions cannot live together. I wonder why that is? :-)

If one seems to have the same problem with every person one meets, odds are it is not everyone else that has a problem, but oneself :-)

You could have said that about the Jews in history.

But lets talk about the present....

In Burma, Muslims are mistreated and killed...simply for being Muslim.

In Israel, Muslims are treated as second class citizens, and non citizen Muslims are mistreated and killed.

In the US, Muslim minorities suffer at the hands of rednecks.

France....where do I start?

.......

[monkeycountry]

Maybe I am a bit slow, but I did not get your point if you had one, sorry.

Anyway, while I am sure lots of people are judged based on their looks, I was referring to muslims who say themselves where their allegiance lies, hence no judgement. I assume it is ok to believe what they say.

there are plenty of christians who will tell you their first allegiance is to god rather than their government or country.

Hey but that us okay, cause they are generally white.

Which country has their motto 'In God We Trust' put on their money... United States of something. Someone remind me...

You guys can keep deflecting. At the end of the day, there are very few problems in the world due to someone being catholic,christian, hindu, buddhist or whatever, yet in many if not most countries where muslim minorities exist there are major problems with these muslim minorities. Further, in countries where the majority is muslim, there is quite often civil war as even the different muslim factions cannot live together. I wonder why that is? :-)

If one seems to have the same problem with every person one meets, odds are it is not everyone else that has a problem, but oneself :-)

You could have said that about the Jews in history.

But lets talk about the present....

In Burma, Muslims are mistreated and killed...simply for being Muslim.

In Israel, Muslims are treated as second class citizens, and non citizen Muslims are mistreated and killed.

In the US, Muslim minorities suffer at the hands of rednecks.

France....where do I start?

.......

So it seems we agree. Pretty much anywhere muslims encounter other people there is trouble :-)

[giddyup]

Perhaps if they tried to assimilate and contribute to the country that has accepted them instead of trying to push their beliefs and customs down everyone's throats there would be less hostility towards them. They can't even get on with each other with all the different factions/tribes continuously fighting, so please don't try and feed me the BS that muslims are persecuted the world over. Most host countries bend over backwards to cater to their demands to avoid offending them in any way, it's only when the hosts are at risk of losing their own cultural identity that the problems arise.

Edited July 23, 2014 by giddyup

[simple1]

Maybe I am a bit slow, but I did not get your point if you had one, sorry.

Anyway, while I am sure lots of people are judged based on their looks, I was referring to muslims who say themselves where their allegiance lies, hence no judgement. I assume it is ok to believe what they say.

there are plenty of christians who will tell you their first allegiance is to god rather than their government or country.

Hey but that us okay, cause they are generally white.

Which country has their motto 'In God We Trust' put on their money... United States of something. Someone remind me...

You guys can keep deflecting. At the end of the day, there are very few problems in the world due to someone being catholic,christian, hindu, buddhist or whatever, yet in many if not most countries where muslim minorities exist there are major problems with these muslim minorities. Further, in countries where the majority is muslim, there is quite often civil war as even the different muslim factions cannot live together. I wonder why that is? :-)

If one seems to have the same problem with every person one meets, odds are it is not everyone else that has a problem, but oneself :-)

you seem strangely unaware of northern ireland terrorism, sikh terrorist activity, hindu massacres of muslims, tutsis and hutus, lebanese christian massacres, the stern and irgun gangs etc etc. I wonder why that is?

No you are right, I did not say other religions were saints, they sometimes cause trouble too. However they are generally minor isolated issues and even if they are all combined they are still insignificant compared with the enormous problems between muslims and the rest of the world.

Bina, hopefully you will permit the following.

Not attempting justification for Islamic radicalisation, but there are certain realities that some people seem to have their minds firmly shut to causal contributions. Conflict in Muslim areas is not a black & white proposition.

"The rest of the world" has continuously and aggressively interfered in Muslim majority regions for the past 150 years or so. Creation of new countries, for zones of imperialist control, in complete disregard of the traditional Sunni/Shia tribal territorial divisions, broken promises for supporting independence, creation of Israel against the wishes of the local Muslim majority, unwarranted invasion of Iraq etc. I suggest all these actions have contributed to radicalisation. Perhaps with the withdrawal of Western engagement in the regions, matters will slowly stablise during the coming decade/s.

Arab dictatorships, supported by the West,solely acting in self-interest, also contributes to the current mess.

[chappie1207]

This thread was about my dislike at the way animals were slaughtered under halal and supermarkets stocking halal products as a majority product. I have been called a bigot and other interesting things. I don't want to buy halal, simple. Now let me ask this, if halal products were removed from the shelves to cater to the non halal (majority) group, would the Muslim community accept this and buy non halal foods or would they complain? And if they complained at being forced to buy non halal products, would they be called bigots?

[simple1]

This thread was about my dislike at the way animals were slaughtered under halal and supermarkets stocking halal products as a majority product. I have been called a bigot and other interesting things. I don't want to buy halal, simple. Now let me ask this, if halal products were removed from the shelves to cater to the non halal (majority) group, would the Muslim community accept this and buy non halal foods or would they complain? And if they complained at being forced to buy non halal products, would they be called bigots?

Why are you just focussing on the Islamic community, same questions should also apply to those of the Jewish faith who follow Jewish dietry / food processing requirements.

if your interested a FAQ on Kosher food in the UK that indicates very strict compliance requiremens at:

http://www.kosher.org.uk/faqs.htm

Edited July 25, 2014 by simple1

[samran]

This thread was about my dislike at the way animals were slaughtered under halal and supermarkets stocking halal products as a majority product. I have been called a bigot and other interesting things. I don't want to buy halal, simple. Now let me ask this, if halal products were removed from the shelves to cater to the non halal (majority) group, would the Muslim community accept this and buy non halal foods or would they complain? And if they complained at being forced to buy non halal products, would they be called bigots?

Really such a nonsensical reply.

I shop at all the same places you do. Tops, Big C, all the same supermarkets. I haven't noticed halal as being stocked as the 'majority product' as you seem to state. But let's give you the benefit of the doubt for a second, and also ignore the fact that all these places sell pork, alcoholic drinks and shellfish by the truckload: it doesn't seem the buying public cares very much.

We aren't seeing protests out the front of stores, we don't hear these dog whistle protests of the nature of your OP. So it seems as if the majority of consumers actually don't give a toss.

So in reality the only minority you are asking people to bend backwards for is, well, the minority of you and your intolerant ilk.

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Edited July 25, 2014 by samran

[chappie1207]

Samran I agree that the majority of people in Asia don't give a toss, this was never about that, as stated in my original post this was about my personal belief....

[samran]

Samran I agree that the majority of people in Asia don't give a toss, this was never about that, as stated in my original post this was about my personal belief....

Which is fine. Though irrational in my book.

The video you linked to is nothing to do with halal and everything to do with animal cruelty. That halal slaughter happens every day in 'western' countries with strict animal welfare laws makes me think your posting it was dog whistle disingenuousness at its best.

But has been pointed out time and again this isn't about one minority imposing their personal beliefs over another. It is purely a commercial decision of a company to sell their products to the widest possible audience. If you have problems with that, do the perfectly acceptable commercial choice and shop elsewhere. As a Catholic, I've got no problem with halal certification.

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[monkeycountry]

This thread was about my dislike at the way animals were slaughtered under halal and supermarkets stocking halal products as a majority product. I have been called a bigot and other interesting things. I don't want to buy halal, simple. Now let me ask this, if halal products were removed from the shelves to cater to the non halal (majority) group, would the Muslim community accept this and buy non halal foods or would they complain? And if they complained at being forced to buy non halal products, would they be called bigots?

Why are you just focussing on the Islamic community, same questions should also apply to those of the Jewish faith who follow Jewish dietry / food processing requirements.

if your interested a FAQ on Kosher food in the UK that indicates very strict compliance requiremens at:

http://www.kosher.org.uk/faqs.htm

Another deflection, but fine, assume the question is also applied to jews, will you then answer it? :-)

[samran]

This thread was about my dislike at the way animals were slaughtered under halal and supermarkets stocking halal products as a majority product. I have been called a bigot and other interesting things. I don't want to buy halal, simple. Now let me ask this, if halal products were removed from the shelves to cater to the non halal (majority) group, would the Muslim community accept this and buy non halal foods or would they complain? And if they complained at being forced to buy non halal products, would they be called bigots?

Why are you just focussing on the Islamic community, same questions should also apply to those of the Jewish faith who follow Jewish dietry / food processing requirements.

if your interested a FAQ on Kosher food in the UK that indicates very strict compliance requiremens at:

http://www.kosher.org.uk/faqs.htm

Another deflection, but fine, assume the question is also applied to jews, will you then answer it? :-)

Why would one care if a food at the supermarket has a kosher certification on it?

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[simple1]

This thread was about my dislike at the way animals were slaughtered under halal and supermarkets stocking halal products as a majority product. I have been called a bigot and other interesting things. I don't want to buy halal, simple. Now let me ask this, if halal products were removed from the shelves to cater to the non halal (majority) group, would the Muslim community accept this and buy non halal foods or would they complain? And if they complained at being forced to buy non halal products, would they be called bigots?

Why are you just focussing on the Islamic community, same questions should also apply to those of the Jewish faith who follow Jewish dietry / food processing requirements.

if your interested a FAQ on Kosher food in the UK that indicates very strict compliance requiremens at:

http://www.kosher.org.uk/faqs.htm

Another deflection, but fine, assume the question is also applied to jews, will you then answer it? :-)

Isn’t a deflection, do you seriously propose the OP is unaware of the similarity of dietary requirements for religious Jews & Muslims.

The question by the OP is at best naïve. There would be an outpouring of hate/bigotry/intolerance expressed by some people if Jews / Muslims complained about the removal of their respective food stuffs.

I agree with Samran’s observations.

EDIT: After re-reading the OP's original post he expresses strong anti Muslim sentiment, so I'll withdraw my use of the word 'naive'.

Edited July 25, 2014 by simple1

[harrry]

Maybe I am a bit slow, but I did not get your point if you had one, sorry.

Anyway, while I am sure lots of people are judged based on their looks, I was referring to muslims who say themselves where their allegiance lies, hence no judgement. I assume it is ok to believe what they say.

there are plenty of christians who will tell you their first allegiance is to god rather than their government or country.

And they get immediately refered to their own bible and told that if it was good enough (according to that book) to render unto Ceasar that which is due to him they can just pay up the fine and obey and respect Australian laws.

[JesseFrank]

I wonder where all those muslims bought their food before the Halal certificate hype started.

[samran]

I wonder where all those muslims bought their food before the Halal certificate hype started.

given they are all cave dwellers according to people on this thread they probably just hunted it.

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[JesseFrank]

I wonder where all those muslims bought their food before the Halal certificate hype started.

given they are all cave dwellers according to people on this thread they probably just hunted it.

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Also a possibility of course is that they hadn't such an oppressive footprint on non-muslim societies yet, and just ate what everyone eats.

[samran]

Oppressive? Oh, sorry, forgot this was the end of empire pity party club - motto: we used to rule the darkies and now they rule us!!

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[JesseFrank]

Oppressive? Oh, sorry, forgot this was the end of empire pity party club - motto: we used to rule the darkies and now they rule us!!

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Must have missed the time that christians tried to rule a muslim society .

[nidieunimaitre]

I wonder where all those muslims bought their food before the Halal certificate hype started.

given they are all cave dwellers according to people on this thread they probably just hunted it.

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Also a possibility of course is that they hadn't such an oppressive footprint on non-muslim societies yet, and just ate what everyone eats.

My niece has a (modern) Turkish boyfriend.

The older brother of the boyfriend is a "born again muslim".

I asked them if they ever eat commercial cookies.

They replied yes, so I asked if the non halal cheap fats in cookies were not a problem.

The modern Turk laughed, and replied "if I don't know, I don't sin" ( where did I hear that before?).

His brother is still upset with me.

[monkeycountry]

This thread was about my dislike at the way animals were slaughtered under halal and supermarkets stocking halal products as a majority product. I have been called a bigot and other interesting things. I don't want to buy halal, simple. Now let me ask this, if halal products were removed from the shelves to cater to the non halal (majority) group, would the Muslim community accept this and buy non halal foods or would they complain? And if they complained at being forced to buy non halal products, would they be called bigots?

Why are you just focussing on the Islamic community, same questions should also apply to those of the Jewish faith who follow Jewish dietry / food processing requirements.

if your interested a FAQ on Kosher food in the UK that indicates very strict compliance requiremens at:

http://www.kosher.org.uk/faqs.htm

Another deflection, but fine, assume the question is also applied to jews, will you then answer it? :-)

Why would one care if a food at the supermarket has a kosher certification on it?

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Dunno, but I am guessing you completely misunderstood the question asked? :-)

[samran]

Oppressive? Oh, sorry, forgot this was the end of empire pity party club - motto: we used to rule the darkies and now they rule us!!

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Must have missed the time that christians tried to rule a muslim society .

Sounds like it.

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[monkeycountry]

This thread was about my dislike at the way animals were slaughtered under halal and supermarkets stocking halal products as a majority product. I have been called a bigot and other interesting things. I don't want to buy halal, simple. Now let me ask this, if halal products were removed from the shelves to cater to the non halal (majority) group, would the Muslim community accept this and buy non halal foods or would they complain? And if they complained at being forced to buy non halal products, would they be called bigots?

Why are you just focussing on the Islamic community, same questions should also apply to those of the Jewish faith who follow Jewish dietry / food processing requirements.

if your interested a FAQ on Kosher food in the UK that indicates very strict compliance requiremens at:

http://www.kosher.org.uk/faqs.htm

Another deflection, but fine, assume the question is also applied to jews, will you then answer it? :-)

Isnt a deflection, do you seriously propose the OP is unaware of the similarity of dietary requirements for religious Jews & Muslims.

The question by the OP is at best naïve. There would be an outpouring of hate/bigotry/intolerance expressed by some people if Jews / Muslims complained about the removal of their respective food stuffs.

I agree with Samrans observations.

EDIT: After re-reading the OP's original post he expresses strong anti Muslim sentiment, so I'll withdraw my use of the word 'naive'.

The OP is simply asking if the situation was reversed and everything was non halal/kosherfood, would muslims (or jews) complain and subsequently be called bigots. A very straightforward question that seems noone wants to answer :-)

[monkeycountry]

I wonder where all those muslims bought their food before the Halal certificate hype started.

given they are all cave dwellers according to people on this thread they probably just hunted it.

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I know you are being funny, and it is, but you are not far off. There has been plenty of examples of muslims living in modern apartments in the west halal killing goats or similar on the balcony :-)

[JesseFrank]

I wonder where all those muslims bought their food before the Halal certificate hype started.

given they are all cave dwellers according to people on this thread they probably just hunted it.

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I know you are being funny, and it is, but you are not far off. There has been plenty of examples of muslims living in modern apartments in the west halal killing goats or similar on the balcony :-)

I strongly doubt that Samran tried to be funny.

[sustento]

Oppressive? Oh, sorry, forgot this was the end of empire pity party club - motto: we used to rule the darkies and now they rule us!!

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Must have missed the time that christians tried to rule a muslim society .

The Crusades perhaps?

[nidieunimaitre]

Oppressive? Oh, sorry, forgot this was the end of empire pity party club - motto: we used to rule the darkies and now they rule us!!

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Must have missed the time that christians tried to rule a muslim society .

The Crusades perhaps?

We could make a list of all countries or groups that invaded other places.

That would be a loooong list.

It would cover the entire history of mankind.

It would be a most interesting list, but unfortunately, completely irrelevant to this thread.

Back to topic.

Killing animals halal style adds to the cost, why would non halallers pay extra?

[sustento]

Oppressive? Oh, sorry, forgot this was the end of empire pity party club - motto: we used to rule the darkies and now they rule us!!

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Must have missed the time that christians tried to rule a muslim society .

The Crusades perhaps?

We could make a list of all countries or groups that invaded other places.

That would be a loooong list.

It would cover the entire history of mankind.

It would be a most interesting list, but unfortunately, completely irrelevant to this thread.

It might be irrelevant to the thread - it wasn't irrelevant to the off topic question that I answered though.

[JesseFrank]

We could make a list of all countries or groups that invaded other places.

That would be a loooong list.

It would cover the entire history of mankind.

It would be a most interesting list, but unfortunately, completely irrelevant to this thread.

It might be irrelevant to the thread - it wasn't irrelevant to the off topic question that I answered though.

To be correct, it wasn't a question, but rather an answer to a poor excuse of an answer for a very valid and on topic comment.