Lpg & Ngv Fuel.

[intumult]

I finally got around to doing the LPG conversion for my old Land Rover several weeks ago. Cost 17,000 Baht and I had a 96 L tank installed, which holds 81 Litres. The power loss is minimal and for some reason I have actually gotten better mileage than I did before! My engine runs cooler and does not diesel on shut off as it was wont to do before. It also runs a bit smoother too. Another benefit is extended range with 81 Litres. Loving it so far, esp. when filling up! The installation will pay for itself in less than 4 months with the amount of driving I do and the crappy mileage I get.

A previous poster mentions having to take care of the LPG registration details within 15 days. I was told that I only had to do that the next time the annual registration expires. I will check that out and report back. If that is true I am not too worried as things like that usually have humongous fines like 100 Baht! I hope I don't have to eat those words.

P.S. The circular tanks that fit into the spare tire wells are now available here, though a bit more expensive. Conversion for our Volvo with a conventional tank was quoted at 17000 Baht, for a circular tank 25,000 Baht. Rated for 60+ litres, can't recall the exact figure.

Can I ask...

1) Was it a diesel Landrover you had converted?

2) where did you get it done at that price and do you hgave a phone number, please?

Currently asking 35,000 Baht here to convert a diesel to LPG and a LOT more for NGV

[qualtrough]

I finally got around to doing the LPG conversion for my old Land Rover several weeks ago. Cost 17,000 Baht and I had a 96 L tank installed, which holds 81 Litres. The power loss is minimal and for some reason I have actually gotten better mileage than I did before! My engine runs cooler and does not diesel on shut off as it was wont to do before. It also runs a bit smoother too. Another benefit is extended range with 81 Litres. Loving it so far, esp. when filling up! The installation will pay for itself in less than 4 months with the amount of driving I do and the crappy mileage I get.

A previous poster mentions having to take care of the LPG registration details within 15 days. I was told that I only had to do that the next time the annual registration expires. I will check that out and report back. If that is true I am not too worried as things like that usually have humongous fines like 100 Baht! I hope I don't have to eat those words.

P.S. The circular tanks that fit into the spare tire wells are now available here, though a bit more expensive. Conversion for our Volvo with a conventional tank was quoted at 17000 Baht, for a circular tank 25,000 Baht. Rated for 60+ litres, can't recall the exact figure.

Can I ask...

1) Was it a diesel Landrover you had converted?

2) where did you get it done at that price and do you hgave a phone number, please?

Currently asking 35,000 Baht here to convert a diesel to LPG and a LOT more for NGV

No, it was a petrol, the old 2.25 litre model used in the Series Land Rovers. LPG conversion for diesel is apparently a more complicated process, so I am not surprised that they ask more for that. I will have to see if I can dig up the number, but there are any number of conversion outfits around so there should be lots of options. Not sure where you are located, but there is a PTT station on Phahonyothin not too far from KM 27 that has about 20 different LPG/NGV kits on display at various price ranges. I don't know anything about diesel/lpg conversion issues.

[intumult]

Thanks for that qualtrough.

Was worth checking.

Seems they change the diesel engine and from what I understand (with limited language) if the diesel engine is good the price drops.

So seems the price is about right.

[intumult]

Update on prices....

Called in at the local place in Nakhonsawan for diesel to LPG conversions. Cheapest was 2500cc @ 48,000 Baht. Most expensice was a 3000cc VVTI engine @ 58000 Baht.

They do minibus conversions with engine exchange for 35 - 45000 Baht!

The garage did not want the 2.8 mitsu engine so would have to sell that elsewhere. No idea what it is worth or where to sell it either ATM.

So, if anyone knows a place here or in BKK that does diesel to LPG conversions cheaper, I would be happy to have their phone numbers as it is something I want to do with the car.

With an engine exchange I understand the price would be abt 35000 Baht.

thanks for any info.

[swain]

Everyone seems very happy with their LPG conversions even with the increase in fuel prices and possible further increases to come. I am looking at NGV at the moment and would like more information on pricing on fuel... ie what is the savings on NGV vs LPG. Is it harder on the engine? Fueling time for an NGV converted car takes how long? I have two cars, both Toyota's .. a camry and a vios and was thinking about converting both, both cars are under four years old. What is the price for a standard gas burning car to be converted to NGV. LPG just seems like the way to go but everything I hear from every source I have looked at says that the price is going to continue to rise.

Edited December 12, 2007 by swain

[macduff]

How much is LPG and diesel in thai now? . In england it's 46p a litre and 1.09p in manchester england

[intumult]

10.5 LPG & 29.5 Diesel 9 / 9.5 NGV

Edited December 13, 2007 by intumult

[macduff]

Thanks intumult. One hel_l of a big difference. Were getting robbed all ends in this country. I suppose the thai's think the same.

[intumult]

Everyone seems very happy with their LPG conversions even with the increase in fuel prices and possible further increases to come. I am looking at NGV at the moment and would like more information on pricing on fuel... ie what is the savings on NGV vs LPG. Is it harder on the engine? Fueling time for an NGV converted car takes how long? I have two cars, both Toyota's .. a camry and a vios and was thinking about converting both, both cars are under four years old. What is the price for a standard gas burning car to be converted to NGV. LPG just seems like the way to go but everything I hear from every source I have looked at says that the price is going to continue to rise.

NGV conversion approx 75,000.

Convert diesel to Petrol/LPG 35,000 - 60,000 approx (all depends on how they value your current engine and IF they want it). Also most come with Auto gearbox. Latest quote for me for a manual box was 8,000 extra. BKK seem happier to do an engine exchange.

[Crossy]

Anyone got any info on diesel to diesel/LPG conversions i.e. retaining the diesel engine?

Apparently not a difficult job because it simply adds the liquid LPG to diesel (called fumigation for some reason) and the existing engine management system takes care of the injection ratio.

No change over switches etc. if the LPG runs out it just runs on pure diesel, sounds like a good solution if it works as well as the blurb says.

NOTE This is most definately not the same as the highly complex diesel NGV conversions.

Edited December 15, 2007 by Crossy

[swain]

Everyone seems very happy with their LPG conversions even with the increase in fuel prices and possible further increases to come. I am looking at NGV at the moment and would like more information on pricing on fuel... ie what is the savings on NGV vs LPG. Is it harder on the engine? Fueling time for an NGV converted car takes how long? I have two cars, both Toyota's .. a camry and a vios and was thinking about converting both, both cars are under four years old. What is the price for a standard gas burning car to be converted to NGV. LPG just seems like the way to go but everything I hear from every source I have looked at says that the price is going to continue to rise.

NGV conversion approx 75,000.

Convert diesel to Petrol/LPG 35,000 - 60,000 approx (all depends on how they value your current engine and IF they want it). Also most come with Auto gearbox. Latest quote for me for a manual box was 8,000 extra. BKK seem happier to do an engine exchange.

I dont have a diesel, I have a regular gas burning car... NGV conversion is still 75,000?

[tigerbeer]

Everyone seems very happy with their LPG conversions even with the increase in fuel prices and possible further increases to come. I am looking at NGV at the moment and would like more information on pricing on fuel... ie what is the savings on NGV vs LPG. Is it harder on the engine? Fueling time for an NGV converted car takes how long? I have two cars, both Toyota's .. a camry and a vios and was thinking about converting both, both cars are under four years old. What is the price for a standard gas burning car to be converted to NGV. LPG just seems like the way to go but everything I hear from every source I have looked at says that the price is going to continue to rise.

NGV conversion approx 75,000.

Convert diesel to Petrol/LPG 35,000 - 60,000 approx (all depends on how they value your current engine and IF they want it). Also most come with Auto gearbox. Latest quote for me for a manual box was 8,000 extra. BKK seem happier to do an engine exchange.

I dont have a diesel, I have a regular gas burning car... NGV conversion is still 75,000?

4 cylinder... NGV conversion is 50k. quoted at 60k actually with a subsidy of 10k from PTT. LPG conversion with multi point injection, Lambda etc etc the works at 30k. Regular mixers below 20k. LPG prices not stable cause its petroleum after all. NGV a lot more stable in price. LPG takes you a lot further with a full tank. NGV a lot less. LPG takes about the same time to fill up as petrol. NGV approx 20mins. LPG a lot more fueling stations around. NGV is still a pain in the ass. like they say in thailand. UP TO YOU. !.

for the driving i do, i think the best thing i can do is a really cheap car fitted with LPG. Hate to lose the warranty on my new car.

edit: LPG is currently priced at 11.50. with some "gurus" stating that the price is due to rise to 15baht (current real value) without subsidy from the govt.

Edited December 15, 2007 by tigerbeer

[monty]

edit: LPG is currently priced at 11.50. with some "gurus" stating that the price is due to rise to 15baht (current real value) without subsidy from the govt.

Strange, I filled up with LPG at my regular station for 9.65 Baht/liter.

In the last year the price was 9.5 Baht/liter for several months, then went to 9.85 Baht/liter, just recently this was upped to 10.5 Baht/liter and now down to 9.65 again.

So I wouldn't say that LPG follows the same price changes as other oil based fuels.

The increase from 9.85 to 10.5 was the result of the government taking away the subsidies! So if you take that out of the equation, price fluctuation has been minimal...

Even if the "guru's" get it right and it would go to 15 BAht/liter, this would still mean a saving of 50% over regular petrol...

[tigerbeer]

edit: LPG is currently priced at 11.50. with some "gurus" stating that the price is due to rise to 15baht (current real value) without subsidy from the govt.

Strange, I filled up with LPG at my regular station for 9.65 Baht/liter.

In the last year the price was 9.5 Baht/liter for several months, then went to 9.85 Baht/liter, just recently this was upped to 10.5 Baht/liter and now down to 9.65 again.

So I wouldn't say that LPG follows the same price changes as other oil based fuels.

The increase from 9.85 to 10.5 was the result of the government taking away the subsidies! So if you take that out of the equation, price fluctuation has been minimal...

Even if the "guru's" get it right and it would go to 15 BAht/liter, this would still mean a saving of 50% over regular petrol...

still 50% cheaper but you forget that you get more mileage with fuel tank of petrol.

its definitely 11.50 here in chiang mai per litre of LPG.

but of course overall you still save quite a bit using LPG. conversion is worth it.

[Plus]

I recon reading somwhere that NGV gives you better mileage from 1kg (or do they sell be liters?) than LPG, even if the price is nearly the same.

So far the government has been promoting NGV/CNG - converting bus fleets and taxis, giving tax breaks to car makers etc. Benz has e-class CNG engine without any loss of power, Volvo offers a similar one in Europe (I heard). Chevrolet was talking about introducing factory build CNG engines too. Toyota was talking about authorised retro-fitting with 50k subsidised and no loss of warrantee.

If this policy gets consistent, CNG will be the winner in the long run.

[madjbs]

Does anybody know a good LPG garage where I can take my car for a tune up, it is not running smooth on LPG at all. It has had a new kit in this year and I was told it would need adjusting after a couple of months, anyone else heard this?

[VocalNeal]

I finally got around to doing the LPG conversion for my old Land Rover several weeks ago. Cost 17,000 Baht

My Suzuki truck has just gone for it's first service and I was quoted 18k for converting to LPG. They even showed me where under the chasis the tank fits.

I just wish to verify where the nearest filing station is to me, I'm on Rama 4 in BKK, no point in going ahead if we have to spend a lot of time getting it refilled.

[monty]

I recon reading somwhere that NGV gives you better mileage from 1kg (or do they sell be liters?) than LPG, even if the price is nearly the same.

So far the government has been promoting NGV/CNG - converting bus fleets and taxis, giving tax breaks to car makers etc. Benz has e-class CNG engine without any loss of power, Volvo offers a similar one in Europe (I heard). Chevrolet was talking about introducing factory build CNG engines too. Toyota was talking about authorised retro-fitting with 50k subsidised and no loss of warrantee.

If this policy gets consistent, CNG will be the winner in the long run.

NGV gives the same mileage as regular petrol.

Old style LPG systems (vacuum based) take a 10% hit in mileage/liter over regular fuel, and lpg injection systems (oxygen sensor controlled) gives you a 3-5% reduction in mileage.

However on LPG you can advance your ignition (LPG has a much higher octane number then petrol) which makes the difference in mileage between LPG and petrol very small, and in the case of the electronically controlled systems often an improvement over petrol can be had.

In this scenario there is however a high danger of pre-detonation when switching over to regular petrol! Modern ignition systems with ping detection should however be able to take away the risk (even the old electronic ignition on my Volvo is able to sufficiently retard ignition when running on petrol, I do this very seldom though)

There are still two very big drawbacks with NGV/CNG, namely long refueling times (15 minutes for 1 tank), and short range unless you can install a huge tank.

Fuel efficient cars like a Vios can still manage a bit over 200km on 1 tank, but my gas guzzling Volvo would only last maybe 150km, which would be unusable for me...

[swain]

I recon reading somwhere that NGV gives you better mileage from 1kg (or do they sell be liters?) than LPG, even if the price is nearly the same.

So far the government has been promoting NGV/CNG - converting bus fleets and taxis, giving tax breaks to car makers etc. Benz has e-class CNG engine without any loss of power, Volvo offers a similar one in Europe (I heard). Chevrolet was talking about introducing factory build CNG engines too. Toyota was talking about authorised retro-fitting with 50k subsidised and no loss of warrantee.

If this policy gets consistent, CNG will be the winner in the long run.

NGV gives the same mileage as regular petrol.

Old style LPG systems (vacuum based) take a 10% hit in mileage/liter over regular fuel, and lpg injection systems (oxygen sensor controlled) gives you a 3-5% reduction in mileage.

However on LPG you can advance your ignition (LPG has a much higher octane number then petrol) which makes the difference in mileage between LPG and petrol very small, and in the case of the electronically controlled systems often an improvement over petrol can be had.

In this scenario there is however a high danger of pre-detonation when switching over to regular petrol! Modern ignition systems with ping detection should however be able to take away the risk (even the old electronic ignition on my Volvo is able to sufficiently retard ignition when running on petrol, I do this very seldom though)

There are still two very big drawbacks with NGV/CNG, namely long refueling times (15 minutes for 1 tank), and short range unless you can install a huge tank.

Fuel efficient cars like a Vios can still manage a bit over 200km on 1 tank, but my gas guzzling Volvo would only last maybe 150km, which would be unusable for me...

I am seriously looking at doing the NGV conversion for my vios. The price is either being subsidized or has gone down in price. I have been quoted 17k for my vios. This is much cheaper than the 30-60k I have read about in here. 15 minutes for fill up is doable as long as your not in a long line and then it could take hours. I am going for the long term. If I make this conversion I want to know that my fuel price will be stable for some time to come. I still would like to be talked out of this by you die hard lpg people if you feel its a mistake.

[John 1]

There is no way you will get NGV fitted to your Vios for 17K, maybe they mean labour 17k plus the kit.

[tigerbeer]

There is no way you will get NGV fitted to your Vios for 17K, maybe they mean labour 17k plus the kit.

yeah. Most main components for the NGV kit are imported. They were talking about producing them locally but even then with a reduction of 10k. which would set you to around 40k on a vios.

nevertheless, ngv prices are stable and better for the future. don't know how serious they are about getting more refueling stations. otherwise its just not workable. especially here in chiang mai.

LPG just seems all so practical right now. a multi point injection LPG kit is quoted at 29k. super efficient and safe. lighter tank. more mileage per tank. lots of refueling stations. only main drawback? price of LPG : not stable.

best solution if you travel a lot: cheap car at 50k, and LPG tank. - cheapo solution for you cheapskates. err i mean me

[trader1]

I had lpg intstalled in my nissan sunny yesterday. 14,000 baht, and automatically goes to lpg after 2000 rpm, or to petrol if it lpg tank is empty.

Runs very well but slightly harder to start and idles a little rougher.

[HobbsTheFerociousTiger]

So how about conversion from diesel? Then you can only run on NGV right?

[Plus]

There was an article in today's Nation about Omnitec, an American company, starting diesel conversion business here.

At the moment the only option is replacing diesel with second hand gasoline engine and LPG/CNG conversion, I think.

[monty]

You can put LPG on a diesel engine, but it"ll run I think about 70% diesel and 30% LPG, so the savings are much smaller!

Mostly done by transport companies with a big fleet. 30% constitutes a big saving for them!

[tigerbeer]

you can do conversion to NGV with a diesel engine. called DDF (Diesel Dual Fuel). about the same price for conversion of petrol cars. according to my list here, its 60k for 70lit tank installation and 65k for 100lit tank.

[wimster]

Have you been able to do this, on a Civic 1.8? I have a 2 year old one and considering it also.

What was the costs for the LPG conversion?

Thanks.

i have been considering moving to either LPG or NGV for my Honda Civic 1.8. its still relatively new car (below one year) but i drive a lot and the prices for fuel is killing me. my brother in law drives an Audi 2.4 v6 and i worked out his mileage to be 2.3baht to a km. mine is 2.7 baht per km. i am sure with my car, i can do about 1.5-1.7baht to a km. that is still a good saving but doing it on a new car? what do you guys think? more worthwhile just to run on petrol?

NGV is out of the question cause, installation too expensive, too few filling stations in chiang mai, huge and heavy tank, too long of a wait to fill up. LPG seems perfect.

my main question: would u do it on a new car? LPG conversion. also can someone recommend a good professional installer here in chiang mai. the place my bro in law did doesnt seem very professional. then again it was an audi and had some problems initially. now its working alright.

[tigerbeer]

Have you been able to do this, on a Civic 1.8? I have a 2 year old one and considering it also.

What was the costs for the LPG conversion?

Thanks.

wimster, i have decided to go with NGV since its more stable than LPG on price. seems like ngv is the better option for the future. prices in chiang mai set at 10.35 per kilo for the next two years guaranteed. bkk : 8.50 per kilo. conversion price is 61k for a 100lit tank with a discount of 5k. so i pay 56k. there is a queue to fit it at S.O. NGV chiang mai and we got the date at 18th of feb for the conversion. collect car on 21st. they do all the paperwork. something to do with registering an NGV car with the government. only problem is the lack of refueling stations but seems like some Jiffy stations would start selling NGV under the PTT brand.

[Citra]

After conversion, the regular Diesel fuel tank remains available right? So if you'd find yourself in an area without an NGV filling station then you could just continue on diesel?

[lannarebirth]

I had some friends up from Bangkpok for the holidays. One had a Honda accord and the other a Fortuner. My friend with the Accord had converted to LPG and asked me to drive, being unfamiliar with the area. On a drive to Chiang Rai, he instructed that I should flip to petrol for 1-2 kms every 50-70 kms of driving, which would serve to lubricate the engine. I haven't heard any mention of this practice here before. Is he just being extra careful or might he have any early, less sophisticated conversion kit? Is it really necessary to do the switching back and forth between fuels?

I also drove the other friends Fortuner, which I think has a 2.7 liter petrol engine. I suggested he might benefit from an LPG conversion, but he said he didn't want to remove his 3rd seat. Is that the only place an LPG tank could be mounted on a Fortuner? TIA for any replies.