Bank Accepted Teamoney

[Johnniey]

But in this particular case, if the facts are true (and whenever are they?)
No one in their right minds does business 'outside' the bank. I have acquired plenty of money from UK banks...but alldone at a desk inside the bank!!!.I do not understand how foreigners come to lose their heads when they pass through
Immigration in Swampy
Sure I have made mistakes; but usually because I was in a hurry and did not get the documents translated correctly. In this case how can he get a mortgage from Bualuang?. One of the biggest problems we have had is the "It is not Thai money issue" because even though my wife is Thai, she has businesses in the UK and the money comes from abroad...........and anyway why is he trying to buy property for a woman who does not work??

Did you read the thread? If you had, you'd have noticed I am talking abiut a Thai bank.
The woman is my wife, who I've known for 27 years and been married 24.
I got a mortgage because I work here. Not rocket science.

[Johnniey]

[quote name="Neeranam" post="8224371" timestamp="1407656662"]

[quote name="Johnniey" post="8216024" timestamp="1407484453"]

 [quote name="p_brownstone" post="8215946" timestamp="1407483282"]

 [quote name="Johnniey" post="8215905" timestamp="1407482824"]

 [quote name="Naam" post="8215677" timestamp="1407480087"]

you participated willingly in a "tea money" procedure and now you want to complain? [/quote]
Yes, if you have no useful reply please go away.
 
I have been working here for 26  years and this tea money is the usual way to get things done.
 [/quote]
 
Absolute nonsense!
 
And why on earth did you agree to having the transaction conducted "outside the Bank"??!!
 
Patrick
 [/quote]
Have you ever borrowed money from a bank Patrick?
 
My neighbour paid 20,000 baht to get her mortgage. I paid a very high insurance to get my mortgage. 
 
I know countless people who pay tea money for many things. It is the nor here to pay the bank a little to get more than the house/land is worth, nearly everyone does it.
 [/quote]
I did this last year in order to get a mortgage. Most Thai people I know do exactly this. Basically the builder told the bank the house cost 200k more than it did. The bank gave me a 90% Mortgage so I then paid for the house and had some spare change after to pay for the many hidden costs of buying a house that I had not envisaged.
OP, I'd go to the bank and ask the guy straight, " what is going on? " Start making a big fuss and let the manager know what happened. Take your "poo yai", whoever that may be.[/quote]



Mate, thanks for the advice; much appreciated. I know this practice is common.

Edited August 10, 2014 by Johnniey

[Robert24]

difficult situation but my suggestion would be to have a serious word (off the record) with this guy and mention to him that he needs to honor the agreement you had with him. If he doesn't want that, you can always highlight to him that you can report him to the central auditors of the bank's headquarter in Bangkok. If you/or your wife know his family or where he stays etc, you can mention this as well. 

 

Usually Thais try to avoid having a problem - you can simply ask him whether he needs to have a problem by not honoring the agreement. 

 

hope this helps.

[transam]

 

 

 

 
 


 
I despise playing the "I have been here longer than you Card" -
 
However :
 
I have been in Thailand over 43 years, have run my own Company here for more than 25 of those years; and, yes, at least in the early years of my Business I have "borrowed" money when asking a Bank to finance a Letter of Credit .... many times, for several millions of Baht in many cases, with appropriate Security.
 
I have bought Property here (although never at "more than the house / land is worth" ............. why on earth would anyone do that!?).
 
I deal with Thai Government institutions as my significant Customers on a monthly basis.
 
Never, ever, have I paid "Tea Money" to obtain or facilitate these Financial or Business transactions.
 
Not wishing to be rude to anyone but it's lazy thinking like this which perpetuates the idea that doing business in Thailand depends on Bribes - by and large it does not.
 
Of course if some fool walks into a Bank or a Government Purchasing Office and openly implies that he is willing to pay under the table for the transaction it would take a very principled Official to say "no sir, absolutely no need for that, I am only doing my duty".
 
Patrick
 

 
Well I wouldn't consider myself a newcomer.
So you've never had a mortgage or borrowed money for land.
 
It's pretty obvious -  if you have security, then borrowing money is easy and no bribes are required. I  haven't got security, that's why I paid the *****er at the bank the money.
 
We must mix in different circles mate.  I am a humble university professor, not a rich business owner that sips gin an tonic at the Polo club.  When I bought my house I wanted  more to furnish it and  plant a nice garden. I think I am in the majority
 

What made you think that a humble loan officer can bend the banks loan rules? All this stuff has to go off to somewhere else for approval anyway.

 

Samran, I thought as a Thai you'd understand the way thing work here. I have known of countless people who pay bribes to get 100% mortgages or even 110%.

What the head office see is not the whole story.

I really don't know why I am being insulted by Naam, Patrick, ,Transam and now RegUK. Maybe I should report them. All I asked for was some practical advice.

 

 

Report me for what............?................
 

[p_brownstone]

 

I did this last year in order to get a mortgage. Most Thai people I know do exactly this. Basically the builder told the bank the house cost 200k more than it did. The bank gave me a 90% Mortgage so I then paid for the house and had some spare change after to pay for the many hidden costs of buying a house that I had not envisaged.
OP, I'd go to the bank and ask the guy straight, " what is going on? " Start making a big fuss and let the manager know what happened. Take your "poo yai", whoever that may be.

 

So the bank did not do its own valuation...... I find that hard to believe.

 

 

Absolutely - nonsensical.

 

Anyone who has ever obtained a Mortgage or other type of Loan from a Bank to buy Property knows very well that the Bank itself (at a quite Senior level) decides on the value of the Property based on local Market Values etc. etc..

 

And the Bank will then advance you a percentage of their valuation.

 

To even suggest that the Bank blindly accepted the Builders valuation of the Property at, apparently, WAY over the Market value, and then advanced you 90% of a valuation basically pulled out of thin air makes absolutely no sense at all.

 

Patrick

[Robert24]

@ Patrick: I must admire you, never having to pay any UTM and doing business here. And I was saying the same when I came here first, i.e. whoever has the best product at the best price will get the contract. However you will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way. Whilst I try to avoid paying UTM wherever possible of course, but sometimes it's just not possible. I.e. have you ever tried to obtain a building approval without paying UTM? Or have you ever participated in tenders for being a supplier of one of the various Thai corporate companies? The world here is not as black and white as we want it to be in other countries. 

 

Now I'm not sure about mortgages - fortunately I never had to get any loans or mortgages for my business, but it seems common practice here according to the Op.

 

 

[Johnniey]

 

I did this last year in order to get a mortgage. Most Thai people I know do exactly this. Basically the builder told the bank the house cost 200k more than it did. The bank gave me a 90% Mortgage so I then paid for the house and had some spare change after to pay for the many hidden costs of buying a house that I had not envisaged.
OP, I'd go to the bank and ask the guy straight, " what is going on? " Start making a big fuss and let the manager know what happened. Take your "poo yai", whoever that may be.
 

So the bank did not do its own valuation...... I find that hard to believe.
 

 
Absolutely - nonsensical.
 
Anyone who has ever obtained a Mortgage or other type of Loan from a Bank to buy Property knows very well that the Bank itself (at a quite Senior level) decides on the value of the Property based on local Market Values etc. etc..
 
And the Bank will then advance you a percentage of their valuation.
 
To even suggest that the Bank blindly accepted the Builders valuation of the Property at, apparently, WAY over the Market value, and then advanced you 90% of a valuation basically pulled out of thin air makes absolutely no sense at all.
 
Patrick

It would be nice to hear from people who actually have got a mortgage instead of this know it all who hasn't.
Quite amusing listening to a man who thinks that Thai developers and bankers are not in bed together.

[Johnniey]

@ Patrick: I must admire you, never having to pay any UTM and doing business here. And I was saying the same when I came here first, i.e. whoever has the best product at the best price will get the contract. However you will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way. Whilst I try to avoid paying UTM wherever possible of course, but sometimes it's just not possible. I.e. have you ever tried to obtain a building approval without paying UTM? Or have you ever participated in tenders for being a supplier of one of the various Thai corporate companies? The world here is not as black and white as we want it to be in other countries. 
 
Now I'm not sure about mortgages - fortunately I never had to get any loans or mortgages for my business, but it seems common practice here according to the Op.
 
 

You are correct and mortgages are no different, especially if you want that little bit more.

[Naam]

Samran, I thought as a Thai you'd understand the way thing work here. I have known of countless people who pay bribes to get 100% mortgages or even 110%.
What the head office see is not the whole story.
I really don't know why I am being insulted by Naam, Patrick, ,Transam and now RegUK. Maybe I should report them. All I asked for was some practical advice.

if anybody insulted you (i did not and voiced my positive view on "facilitation cost" et al unambiguously) then it was justified because of your brilliant idea:

 

I was thinking of talking to the police...

i also rendered, based on my experience, the practical advice "if... then grind your teeth". but you go on with your raving, ranting and arguing to divert from your original utmost silly idea which (i assume) is based on your 26 years experience in the Land of Smiles.  

[p_brownstone]

@ Patrick: I must admire you, never having to pay any UTM and doing business here. And I was saying the same when I came here first, i.e. whoever has the best product at the best price will get the contract. However you will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way. Whilst I try to avoid paying UTM wherever possible of course, but sometimes it's just not possible. I.e. have you ever tried to obtain a building approval without paying UTM? Or have you ever participated in tenders for being a supplier of one of the various Thai corporate companies? The world here is not as black and white as we want it to be in other countries. 

 

Now I'm not sure about mortgages - fortunately I never had to get any loans or mortgages for my business, but it seems common practice here according to the Op.

 

 

 

I deal regularly with :

 

PTT (all subsidiaries), Esso, Shell, Alliance Refining, Charoen Karnchank, Italthai, CTCI, Foster Wheeler, Mitsui, Mitsubishi and a few dozen others - often Bidding on a Tender, other times simply selling directly after receiving an enquiry.

 

As mentioned in an earlier Post I have never either given or even been approached for a Bribe in over 25 years of running my business here (so I can't imagine within what timescale you envisage "(I) will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way").

 

Patrick

[samran]

 

 

I did this last year in order to get a mortgage. Most Thai people I know do exactly this. Basically the builder told the bank the house cost 200k more than it did. The bank gave me a 90% Mortgage so I then paid for the house and had some spare change after to pay for the many hidden costs of buying a house that I had not envisaged.
OP, I'd go to the bank and ask the guy straight, " what is going on? " Start making a big fuss and let the manager know what happened. Take your "poo yai", whoever that may be.

 

So the bank did not do its own valuation...... I find that hard to believe.

 

 

Absolutely - nonsensical.

 

Anyone who has ever obtained a Mortgage or other type of Loan from a Bank to buy Property knows very well that the Bank itself (at a quite Senior level) decides on the value of the Property based on local Market Values etc. etc..

 

And the Bank will then advance you a percentage of their valuation.

 

To even suggest that the Bank blindly accepted the Builders valuation of the Property at, apparently, WAY over the Market value, and then advanced you 90% of a valuation basically pulled out of thin air makes absolutely no sense at all.

 

Patrick

 

 

Exactly my expereince too. Valuer came from the bank. Spent a good bit of time. Assessed the property at 80% of the selling price then offered us 80% of their valuation for the loan.

 

Thought I could pull some strings to get a better valuation. One of my mums friends who owns good portions of Sukhumvit Soi 13 in BKK and has has a personal private banker at the same insitution went down with me to the bank to speak to him...answer: nice smile....but nada.

 

 

 

 

[robblok]

 

 

 

I did this last year in order to get a mortgage. Most Thai people I know do exactly this. Basically the builder told the bank the house cost 200k more than it did. The bank gave me a 90% Mortgage so I then paid for the house and had some spare change after to pay for the many hidden costs of buying a house that I had not envisaged.
OP, I'd go to the bank and ask the guy straight, " what is going on? " Start making a big fuss and let the manager know what happened. Take your "poo yai", whoever that may be.
 

So the bank did not do its own valuation...... I find that hard to believe.
 

 
Absolutely - nonsensical.
 
Anyone who has ever obtained a Mortgage or other type of Loan from a Bank to buy Property knows very well that the Bank itself (at a quite Senior level) decides on the value of the Property based on local Market Values etc. etc..
 
And the Bank will then advance you a percentage of their valuation.
 
To even suggest that the Bank blindly accepted the Builders valuation of the Property at, apparently, WAY over the Market value, and then advanced you 90% of a valuation basically pulled out of thin air makes absolutely no sense at all.
 
Patrick

It would be nice to hear from people who actually have got a mortgage instead of this know it all who hasn't.
Quite amusing listening to a man who thinks that Thai developers and bankers are not in bed together.

 

Patrick got his mortgage and so did I no tea money and yes people are calling you a fool. Why because you got screwed over and are moaning about it. If you are doing something illegal like this you have no recourse and they can screw you over if they can't get it done.

 

Like the other knowledgeable member Samran has said the clerk is not the guy who approves the loans that is someone else. So he needs more people to be in on this to let this work. When he can't your screwed. Then don't bitch about it you knew the risk when you started.

 

The only tea-money I paid is with traffic problems and then only because I can;t be bothered to go to the police station in an unfamiliar place. I heard someone say you can pay at the post office too. 

 

Unlike you I have been here a mere 10 years

[Spoonman]

5555 Robblok, Lil jonnyboy is gunna come along now and call you a f*&king Idiot and you should go F*&k yourself.

[robblok]

5555 Robblok, Lil jonnyboy is gunna come along now and call you a f*&king Idiot and you should go F*&k yourself.

 

I assume as much, but come one if your paying a bribe and the other party does not deliver what recourse do you have. I mean everyone realizes that when they bribe don't they ?

 

Maybe university professors are not as smart as they used to be. 

 

I am not going to get into the moral debate that is up to him but complaining online about something like this is like putting your own foolishness in the spotlight. 

 

Not saying it never happens.. but i doubt it happens at the bank clerk level. You need someone with some cloud to get this done.

 

Also saying that when they cant deliver they might have spend the money already without result or just cheat you. 

[Johnniey]

5555 Robblok, Lil jonnyboy is gunna come along now and call you a f*&king Idiot and you should go F*&k yourself.

 
I assume as much, but come one if your paying a bribe and the other party does not deliver what recourse do you have. I mean everyone realizes that when they bribe don't they ?
 
Maybe university professors are not as smart as they used to be. 
 
I am not going to get into the moral debate that is up to him but complaining online about something like this is like putting your own foolishness in the spotlight. 
 
Not saying it never happens.. but i doubt it happens at the bank clerk level. You need someone with some cloud to get this done.
 
Also saying that when they cant deliver they might have spend the money already without result or just cheat you. 

I am not complaining about losing the bribe money but simply asking for advice. Getting ignorant replies like yours is my annoyance.
The 2 "knowledgeable members" are simply wrong to say bribes in regard to mortgages don't regulary happen.
It wasn't a bank clerk. Read the thread properly. I'll ignore your insults and put it down to the side effect of the steroids.
The bank in question has a loan approval officer according to my wife. We're going to the bank tomorrow with my wife's 'uncle' who is an ex provincial police chief and senator, who I despise but he has some power still despite the last coup. Should be interesting.
Samran; you obviously didn't need 100% loan or your "friend" could have helped if she'd wanted.

[Johnniey]

5555 Robblok, Lil jonnyboy is gunna come along now and call you a f*&king Idiot and you should go F*&k yourself.

 
I assume as much, but come one if your paying a bribe and the other party does not deliver what recourse do you have. I mean everyone realizes that when they bribe don't they ?
 
Maybe university professors are not as smart as they used to be. 
 
I am not going to get into the moral debate that is up to him but complaining online about something like this is like putting your own foolishness in the spotlight. 
 
Not saying it never happens.. but i doubt it happens at the bank clerk level. You need someone with some cloud to get this done.
 
Also saying that when they cant deliver they might have spend the money already without result or just cheat you. 

I am not complaining about losing the bribe money but simply asking for advice. Getting ignorant replies like yours is my annoyance.
The 2 "knowledgeable members" are simply wrong to say bribes in regard to mortgages don't regulary happen.
It wasn't a bank clerk. Read the thread properly. I'll ignore your insults and put it down to the side effect of the steroids.
The bank in question has a loan approval officer according to my wife. We're going to the bank tomorrow with my wife's 'uncle' who is an ex provincial police chief and senator, who I despise but he has some power still despite the last coup. Should be interesting.
Samran; you obviously didn't need 100% loan or your "friend" could have helped if she'd wanted.

[Johnniey]

@ Patrick: I must admire you, never having to pay any UTM and doing business here. And I was saying the same when I came here first, i.e. whoever has the best product at the best price will get the contract. However you will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way. Whilst I try to avoid paying UTM wherever possible of course, but sometimes it's just not possible. I.e. have you ever tried to obtain a building approval without paying UTM? Or have you ever participated in tenders for being a supplier of one of the various Thai corporate companies? The world here is not as black and white as we want it to be in other countries. 
 
Now I'm not sure about mortgages - fortunately I never had to get any loans or mortgages for my business, but it seems common practice here according to the Op.
 
 

 
I deal regularly with :
 
PTT (all subsidiaries), Esso, Shell, Alliance Refining, Charoen Karnchank, Italthai, CTCI, Foster Wheeler, Mitsui, Mitsubishi and a few dozen others - often Bidding on a Tender, other times simply selling directly after receiving an enquiry.
 
As mentioned in an earlier Post I have never either given or even been approached for a Bribe in over 25 years of running my business here (so I can't imagine within what timescale you envisage "(I) will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way").
 
Patrick

Unbelievable but admirable if true.
The companies you mention could't say the same.

[robblok]

 

 

5555 Robblok, Lil jonnyboy is gunna come along now and call you a f*&king Idiot and you should go F*&k yourself.

 
I assume as much, but come one if your paying a bribe and the other party does not deliver what recourse do you have. I mean everyone realizes that when they bribe don't they ?
 
Maybe university professors are not as smart as they used to be. 
 
I am not going to get into the moral debate that is up to him but complaining online about something like this is like putting your own foolishness in the spotlight. 
 
Not saying it never happens.. but i doubt it happens at the bank clerk level. You need someone with some cloud to get this done.
 
Also saying that when they cant deliver they might have spend the money already without result or just cheat you. 

I am not complaining about losing the bribe money but simply asking for advice. Getting ignorant replies like yours is my annoyance.
The 2 "knowledgeable members" are simply wrong to say bribes in regard to mortgages don't regulary happen.
It wasn't a bank clerk. Read the thread properly. I'll ignore your insults and put it down to the side effect of the steroids.
The bank in question has a loan approval officer according to my wife. We're going to the bank tomorrow with my wife's 'uncle' who is an ex provincial police chief and senator, who I despise but he has some power still despite the last coup. Should be interesting.
Samran; you obviously didn't need 100% loan or your "friend" could have helped if she'd wanted.

 

If someone is acting aggressively here its you.. So what kind of steroids are you on. You displayed hostility with anyone not agreeing with you.

 

Yes you know it best and still asking for advise. You complaining about them not living up to their part of the deal and the results of it. Most members see through you its quite easy. Samran is without a question one of the more knowledgeable members so are the others. They figured you out and so did I. 

 

Fact you tried to bribe someone and they did not deliver

Fact you moan about it on an internet forum

Fact you have no recourse when someone you bribe does not do as agreed upon.

Seems the facts speak against you. 

[p_brownstone]

 

 

@ Patrick: I must admire you, never having to pay any UTM and doing business here. And I was saying the same when I came here first, i.e. whoever has the best product at the best price will get the contract. However you will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way. Whilst I try to avoid paying UTM wherever possible of course, but sometimes it's just not possible. I.e. have you ever tried to obtain a building approval without paying UTM? Or have you ever participated in tenders for being a supplier of one of the various Thai corporate companies? The world here is not as black and white as we want it to be in other countries. 
 
Now I'm not sure about mortgages - fortunately I never had to get any loans or mortgages for my business, but it seems common practice here according to the Op.
 
 

 
I deal regularly with :
 
PTT (all subsidiaries), Esso, Shell, Alliance Refining, Charoen Karnchank, Italthai, CTCI, Foster Wheeler, Mitsui, Mitsubishi and a few dozen others - often Bidding on a Tender, other times simply selling directly after receiving an enquiry.
 
As mentioned in an earlier Post I have never either given or even been approached for a Bribe in over 25 years of running my business here (so I can't imagine within what timescale you envisage "(I) will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way").
 
Patrick

Unbelievable but admirable if true.
The companies you mention could't say the same.

 

 

I rather object to being implicitly called a liar however you obviously have serious difficulties in being able to conduct a debate without resorting to anger or profanity so I will gracefully decline to respond in kind.

 

For your information many of the Companies I deal with have firm Policies that any Company found attempting to bribe their staff will be banned from all future business with them - as will the Directors.

 

In a similar vein I am also more than a little puzzled that the Bank Official you have been "dealing with" - apparently a quite senior person in a fairly large Bank Branch - would apparently be prepared to risk his position and indeed his career for a mere Baht 6,000.- .

 

Patrick

 

 

 

[robblok]

 

 

 

@ Patrick: I must admire you, never having to pay any UTM and doing business here. And I was saying the same when I came here first, i.e. whoever has the best product at the best price will get the contract. However you will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way. Whilst I try to avoid paying UTM wherever possible of course, but sometimes it's just not possible. I.e. have you ever tried to obtain a building approval without paying UTM? Or have you ever participated in tenders for being a supplier of one of the various Thai corporate companies? The world here is not as black and white as we want it to be in other countries. 
 
Now I'm not sure about mortgages - fortunately I never had to get any loans or mortgages for my business, but it seems common practice here according to the Op.
 
 

 
I deal regularly with :
 
PTT (all subsidiaries), Esso, Shell, Alliance Refining, Charoen Karnchank, Italthai, CTCI, Foster Wheeler, Mitsui, Mitsubishi and a few dozen others - often Bidding on a Tender, other times simply selling directly after receiving an enquiry.
 
As mentioned in an earlier Post I have never either given or even been approached for a Bribe in over 25 years of running my business here (so I can't imagine within what timescale you envisage "(I) will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way").
 
Patrick

Unbelievable but admirable if true.
The companies you mention could't say the same.

 

 

I rather object to being implicitly called a liar however you obviously have serious difficulties in being able to conduct a debate without resorting to anger or profanity so I will gracefully decline to respond in kind.

 

For your information many of the Companies I deal with have firm Policies that any Company found attempting to bribe their staff will be banned from all future business with them - as will the Directors.

 

In a similar vein I am also more than a little puzzled that the Bank Official you have been "dealing with" - apparently a quite senior person in a fairly large Bank Branch - would apparently be prepared to risk his position and indeed his career for a mere Baht 6,000.- .

 

Patrick

Patrick,

 

There is no logic to that people in that position would not risk it for 6.000 bt. The OP probably got cheated because the one accepting the bribes could not deliver. Those in position to do so would not risk it for such a small fee. Its logical to everyone but the OP

[samran]

 

 

@ Patrick: I must admire you, never having to pay any UTM and doing business here. And I was saying the same when I came here first, i.e. whoever has the best product at the best price will get the contract. However you will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way. Whilst I try to avoid paying UTM wherever possible of course, but sometimes it's just not possible. I.e. have you ever tried to obtain a building approval without paying UTM? Or have you ever participated in tenders for being a supplier of one of the various Thai corporate companies? The world here is not as black and white as we want it to be in other countries. 
 
Now I'm not sure about mortgages - fortunately I never had to get any loans or mortgages for my business, but it seems common practice here according to the Op.
 
 

 
I deal regularly with :
 
PTT (all subsidiaries), Esso, Shell, Alliance Refining, Charoen Karnchank, Italthai, CTCI, Foster Wheeler, Mitsui, Mitsubishi and a few dozen others - often Bidding on a Tender, other times simply selling directly after receiving an enquiry.
 
As mentioned in an earlier Post I have never either given or even been approached for a Bribe in over 25 years of running my business here (so I can't imagine within what timescale you envisage "(I) will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way").
 
Patrick

Unbelievable but admirable if true.
The companies you mention could't say the same.

 

 

To be honest, miles more believable than your OP. I deal with one of these companies, plus a few other similar but not named. Nothing untoward. A bit skeptical of new suppliers perhaps. But that is the same anywhere, but not to be confused with anything else. Once trusted though, you tend to be 'in'.

 

In terms of your story, even if the loan officer took your money, perhaps he simply realised you can't put lipstick on a pig. A dud application is a dud application. Haven't seen that mentioned anywhere yet.

 

 

 

 

[Johnniey]

 

 

@ Patrick: I must admire you, never having to pay any UTM and doing business here. And I was saying the same when I came here first, i.e. whoever has the best product at the best price will get the contract. However you will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way. Whilst I try to avoid paying UTM wherever possible of course, but sometimes it's just not possible. I.e. have you ever tried to obtain a building approval without paying UTM? Or have you ever participated in tenders for being a supplier of one of the various Thai corporate companies? The world here is not as black and white as we want it to be in other countries. 
 
Now I'm not sure about mortgages - fortunately I never had to get any loans or mortgages for my business, but it seems common practice here according to the Op.
 
 

 
I deal regularly with :
 
PTT (all subsidiaries), Esso, Shell, Alliance Refining, Charoen Karnchank, Italthai, CTCI, Foster Wheeler, Mitsui, Mitsubishi and a few dozen others - often Bidding on a Tender, other times simply selling directly after receiving an enquiry.
 
As mentioned in an earlier Post I have never either given or even been approached for a Bribe in over 25 years of running my business here (so I can't imagine within what timescale you envisage "(I) will learn that Thailand doesn't work that way").
 
Patrick

Unbelievable but admirable if true.
The companies you mention could't say the same.
 

 
I rather object to being implicitly called a liar however you obviously have serious difficulties in being able to conduct a debate without resorting to anger or profanity so I will gracefully decline to respond in kind.
 
For your information many of the Companies I deal with have firm Policies that any Company found attempting to bribe their staff will be banned from all future business with them - as will the Directors.
 
In a similar vein I am also more than a little puzzled that the Bank Official you have been "dealing with" - apparently a quite senior person in a fairly large Bank Branch - would apparently be prepared to risk his position and indeed his career for a mere Baht 6,000.- .
 
Patrick
 
 
 

Not sure where you get this "replying with anger or profanity" from. I am as calm as a cucumber.Let's take one of the companies you mentioned, Italthai. To expect the readers of this forum to believe you when you say there is no corruption going on here is, quite frankly, insulting. Anyone who reads a newspaper know differently. Are you lying or covering up, I don't know.Wasn't  Premchai Karnsuta, the boss of Italthai, the main suspect for conspiring with govt. officials in that bomb detector fiasco a few years ago?  Everyone knows the way Italthai got their millions, which obviously some can't be discussed, and for a long time resident of this country  to suggest they are squeaky clean is pathetic. Of course, they have strong links to Thaksin Shinawara , who you'll be praising next for his integrity and transparency.             

[Johnniey]

Went to the bank the other day and spoke to the assistant manager. My wife, our ex senator friend and I. He assured us the loan would be through by the end of the month. We also went and spoke to the woman selling the land who said everything is still on. Time will tell but looks like everything is as originally planned.