Deep trouble with non-B extension

[kawaiimomo]

Hi all,

the past June 24th I posted on here about renewing my WP which expired on June 19th http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/737189-expired-work-permit-what-happens-with-the-visa-extension/

My company tried to renew it but Labour said we needed to apply for a new one. My boss said he called immigration and they told him the visa would be fine if we applied for a new WP in less than 30 days. What a big mistake to believe that. I read in many places that after WP cancellation or expiry one must leave the country in 24 h or apply for a 7 day extension, and that's exactly what the officer told me today: That WP and visa extension are linked, so no WP = no permission to stay.

So on July 4th I got my new WP and everything seemed fine. Some weeks after that I went to immigration for my 90 day report and fine again. Today I went to do the visa extension based on the WP, as the current extension is expiring on September 9th. The officer face was like "<deleted>, this WP is new and the visa has been extended for almost 3 years now". After explaining that we forgot about the previous WP expiration date and that we applied for a new one, she told us that I would be fine if the gap between both WP is less than 40 days and that I should just pay the overstay for that gap (luckily this is the case, just 15 days). But then she got more strict checking even the office pictures.

She also found out that the company revenue document was not the latest updated one and required it. She told us to come back on Monday with a copy of the previous WP from Labour and the updated revenue document. She actually told me I got 2 options, get the copy of the old WP, that revenue doc and pay the overstay, or leave the country and apply for a new non-B. First question that comes to mind is: Does overstay still apply if I leave the country? I guess this overstay is not something that will be noticed unless the WP is checked (but it looks like they are currently checking it based on several posts here).

The funny (although I want to cry not laugh) is that my current company didn't yet submit the updated revenue, and it takes about 7 days upon submission. So now I don't know what to do :-( I got the feeling that the current overstay is since the last WP expiration unless they accept the visa extension application, which will then be just the gap between both WP. She showed me that document about the 90 days overstay = 1 year blacklisted, and she told me I would be blacklisted.

I know this is a tough question but what would you do?

To add more variables, I am moving to another company by next month. This visa extension has been processed in order to cover part of my 30 day notice period because my current extension will expire in the middle of it. I guess my question is: Should I wait for this revenue doc and risk to get into deeper trouble, or should I just explain this situation to the new company and apply for WP, go to Vientiane and get a new non-B with this company and $@# the current one?

I am really lost and scared about the blacklisting. I have a soon-to-be wife and my cats here, I could go back to my country and bring her with me but for sure I don't want to put the cats through the long flight and the quarantine period.

Help please! Any advice will be more than welcomed!!!

[Mario2008]

The new overstay rules are not in effect yet and pending ministerial approval.

[kawaiimomo]

The new overstay rules are not in effect yet and pending ministerial approval.

Thanks Mario, but I was told by the officer that they started enforcing them today. Is there any truth on that?

[paz]

If I was you I would leave country and come back with a non-imm 'B' if possible. Then hang on somehow until the paperwork from the new company is ready and go from there.

That will you will put a firm end to any possibility of overstay and fine. In any case a 15 days overstay would never be punished with banning.

By the way the rules with with they are unduly menacing for overstay will actually make easier for people to switch jobs.

[kawaiimomo]

If I was you I would leave country and come back with a non-imm 'B' if possible. Then hang on somehow until the paperwork from the new company is ready and go from there.

That will you will put a firm end to any possibility of overstay and fine. In any case a 15 days overstay would never be punished with banning.

By the way the rules with with they are unduly menacing for overstay will actually make easier for people to switch jobs.

Thanks paz, I actually find this to be the most safe practice. The real issue I guess it is how the overstay is counted: Is it the 15 days between WP? Or is it the 71 days since the first WP expired? Because, technically speaking I feel that the visa extension stopped being valid since the first WP expired but that, somehow, they can overlook this if you pay the WPs gap overstay if it's less than 40 days. My understanding is that until I don't get the extension sorted the real overstay is since the first WP expiration (and it is uncomfortably close to those 90 days).

To be honest, I feel like applying for the new company WP, leave and get a new non-B, collect my WP and screw the current company for putting me in this situation. I guess the only thing that holds me is to thing that it was also my fault to not realize the WP was about to expire.

[paz]

Just take enough money to cover any eventuality and leave from BKK. They won't look and won't care for the WP, just the "allowed until" date. The extensions of stay does not cancel automatically with your WP permit expiring, that needs a specific step performed manually.

[digitalchromakey]

The fact that your employer couldn't persuade labour to keep the old WP alive meant that your Case 2.1 Extension expired back on June 19th, which sets you up for a 20,000 THB overstay.

Option 1:

Don't go back to Immigration.

Your current extension expires on the 9th September, so plan to exit Thailand around then with the papers to apply for a single entry non 'b' from your new employer along with an introduction letter stating that you will start work in October.

Take your current WP and keep your fingers crossed, you might just get away with it.

Problem is that your local immigration dept is on to you and wants to nail you for an overstay, this could come back to haunt you.

Option 2:

Go back to immigration and bite the bullet - insist that your employer pays the overstay as it's 100% their fault.

Option 1 is risky because immigration will probably catch up with you when you go back for an extension with your new employer.

Option 2 gives you a 'clean sheet' and as Mario has pointed out, black listing is not yet on the statute books.

There is always Option 3 (the Star Wars Obi Wan approach) which is of course illegal and should not be pursued.

Stormtrooper: Let me see your identification.
Obi-Wan: [with a small wave of his hand] You don't need to see his identification.
Stormtrooper: We don't need to see his identification.
Obi-Wan: These aren't the droids you're looking for.
Stormtrooper: These aren't the droids we're looking for.
Obi-Wan: He can go about his business.
Stormtrooper: You can go about your business.
Obi-Wan: Move along.
Stormtrooper: Move along... move along.

Good luck - you have some difficult choices, all thanks to a totally useless employer.

Enjoy your new job and next time put those critical dates in your diary!

Edited August 29, 2014 by digitalchromakey