Is the crackdown on repeat visa runners already fizzling out?

[Suradit69]

One of my main concerns about this governments new enforcement of regulations, has been that they are carried out without any prior research or consultation.

So one conclusion about "visa-runners" might be that in reality there weren't any.....or at least only a negligible amount.

It appears that those holding tourist visas are outside immigrations remit.......so how many people ACTUALLY do a MONTHLY visa run? .Looks like hardly any.

"So one conclusion about "visa-runners" might be that in reality there weren't any.....or at least only a negligible amount."

A somewhat dubious conclusion clearly reached ..."without any prior research or consultation."

Based on the number of businesses that have provided visa/border run services, the congestion at various border crossings and the endless new threads on TV seeking information on doing border/visa runs, I doubt further 'research or consultation" would be needed to demonstrate the obvious.

And that doesn't even begin to address the number of overstayers scurrying about when the lights were turned on.

[sometimewoodworker]

These immigration rules are totally retarded by the way. We live in a world where everything is connected like your pc, laptop,... And they expect to see us to come as a tourist with a Mickey mouse t shirt and a Canon camera around your neck.(stereotype of a tourist), but this world has changed a lot since 1977, still immigration rules are based on old rules fixed by old guys who don't understand anything.

I m a digital nomade and I make mega bucks on the Internet (sometimes when I m lucky) . There is no visa for digital nomade except the tourist visa.

.

You also don't bother to find out all the options.

"I make mega bucks on the Internet." Thailand elite it's only ฿2,000,000 for 20 years so with your mega bucks it's cheap and easy, or if you want it's cheap sibling and your mega bucks are not so mega ฿500,000 for 5 years.

There are many country's who have no visa option for you even with your "mega bucks"

[ColdSingha]

.

So winter lasts 6 months? Where? Siberia?

~

it's pretty grim in northern europe from october to march

[wwest5829]

.

So winter lasts 6 months? Where? Siberia?

Take it easy, Jai yen yen. Retirees in the northern U.S., if they have the means, often look at the year as divided between the cooler "winter" months and the hotter "summer" months. Yes, you are correct, we also have fall and spring in there but, IMHO, the writer was talking about dividing the year in half for retirement living in two different regions for milder weather.

[chrisinth]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

These immigration rules are totally retarded by the way. We live in a world where everything is connected like your pc, laptop,... And they expect to see us to come as a tourist with a Mickey mouse t shirt and a Canon camera around your neck.(stereotype of a tourist), but this world has changed a lot since 1977, still immigration rules are based on old rules fixed by old guys who don't understand anything.

I m a digital nomade and I make mega bucks on the Internet (sometimes when I m lucky) . There is no visa for digital nomade except the tourist visa.

Did immigration knows what internet is? When they continue to stamp entrance cards! So instead to modernise the system, they prefer to change their mind all the time. "no back to back visa run , but tomorrow It s ok..., but in 3 days we want people get visa...Bla bla"

See what I mean? , these people at immigration are totally clueless because they still live in an old system.

Seems they have it pretty much sorted in your case.

Visa for Digital Nomad?

Nomade............................

Immigration has a lot more faces than just making it convenient for tourists, there are serious security issues here as well. IMHO, it is well inside the scope of immigration to have a reasonable handle on who is in their country at any given moment, which I think they achieve well with the current selections for stays in Thailand. Sure, it can be a pain at times, but not impossible to live with.

Something that is often overlooked with immigration.....................

Your complaint Digitalnomade should be addressed at the labor department, not immigration.

[Fab5BKK]

"Mega bucks" for one means pocket money for other... In clear, it means nothing, real figures (USD 100,000, USD 1,000,000, USD 10,000,000 pa) speak much clearer

So Digitalnomade what do you mean when you say I make mega bucks?

These immigration rules are totally retarded by the way. We live in a world where everything is connected like your pc, laptop,... And they expect to see us to come as a tourist with a Mickey mouse t shirt and a Canon camera around your neck.(stereotype of a tourist), but this world has changed a lot since 1977, still immigration rules are based on old rules fixed by old guys who don't understand anything.

I m a digital nomade and I make mega bucks on the Internet (sometimes when I m lucky) . There is no visa for digital nomade except the tourist visa.
.

You also don't bother to find out all the options.
"I make mega bucks on the Internet." Thailand elite it's only ฿2,000,000 for 20 years so with your mega bucks it's cheap and easy, or if you want it's cheap sibling and your mega bucks are not so mega ฿500,000 for 5 years.

There are many country's who have no visa option for you even with your "mega bucks"

[Morphun]

^{It seems there is an expectation of Thailand, which is not expected of most countries. Immigration rules are only questioned in Thailand because of a history of laxity in their enforcement. Now, there is an enforcement procedure which is similar to that in most other developed countries. Tourists are obviously welcomed. Long-stayers are not tourists and simply need to apply for the appropriate visa. It's not so difficult. Being openly critical of your host is very poor form; trying to crawl through loopholes is not a good way to live one's life. Westerners staying more than 30 days are not as important to Thailand as Thailand is to them. The tourists who spend most money here are Japanese. They spend a lot in ten days. Westerners who are claiming to be tourists, but who really are economic refugees, do not spend much money per capital at all. Often, their negative social impact can be greater than their positive financial impact.}

^{If you are a tourist, get a tourist visa.}

^{If you are a long stayer get the visa which Thailand deems to be the one most suited to your needs.}

^{If you can't afford it, you can't afford to stay in Thailand.}

[wilcopops]

One of my main concerns about this governments new enforcement of regulations, has been that they are carried out without any prior research or consultation.

So one conclusion about "visa-runners" might be that in reality there weren't any.....or at least only a negligible amount.

It appears that those holding tourist visas are outside immigrations remit.......so how many people ACTUALLY do a MONTHLY visa run? .Looks like hardly any.

"So one conclusion about "visa-runners" might be that in reality there weren't any.....or at least only a negligible amount."

A somewhat dubious conclusion clearly reached ..."without any prior research or consultation."

Based on the number of businesses that have provided visa/border run services, the congestion at various border crossings and the endless new threads on TV seeking information on doing border/visa runs, I doubt further 'research or consultation" would be needed to demonstrate the obvious.

And that doesn't even begin to address the number of overstayers scurrying about when the lights were turned on.

OK - here's a lesson in reading....... firstly it is a theory, I say it is "one conclusion" - I'm looking at the EVIDENCE or lack of it and putting forward some suggestions as to why that might be, based on some of the input both here and in the media.

You on the other hand have put forward no idea whatsoever apart from a baseless , misunderstood gainsaying of my post.

"Based on the number of businesses providing visa runs" - what "numbers" are those3? Have you not considered that many of their customers have "O" or tourist visas?.....have you ANY evidence of the amount of reduction in border runs - if so you should have alluded to it.

I'm afraid to say I'm not used to discussion with someone who really doesn't appear to know how to put forward a coherent point of view.

If however one can pint to a real and dramatic drop in the business of visa run companies, that would indicate that the "new" enforcements are having a effect....can you do that?

Edited September 3, 2014 by wilcopops

[wilcopops]

^{It seems there is an expectation of Thailand, which is not expected of most countries. Immigration rules are only questioned in Thailand because of a history of laxity in their enforcement. Now, there is an enforcement procedure which is similar to that in most other developed countries. Tourists are obviously welcomed. Long-stayers are not tourists and simply need to apply for the appropriate visa. It's not so difficult. Being openly critical of your host is very poor form; trying to crawl through loopholes is not a good way to live one's life. Westerners staying more than 30 days are not as important to Thailand as Thailand is to them. The tourists who spend most money here are Japanese. They spend a lot in ten days. Westerners who are claiming to be tourists, but who really are economic refugees, do not spend much money per capital at all. Often, their negative social impact can be greater than their positive financial impact.}

^{If you are a tourist, get a tourist visa.}

^{If you are a long stayer get the visa which Thailand deems to be the one most suited to your needs.}

^{If you can't afford it, you can't afford to stay in Thailand.}

off topic - irrelevant

[wilcopops]

There's been a change of government since this was first announced, also the previous head of immigration who announced this 'crackdown' is no longer the head of immigration.

The previous guy in charge had his job changed just after the coup. I don't know why this happened but I'm pretty sure the order to do it came directly from the NCPO.

It looks like the new government has instructed immigration to end their crackdown. Common sense at last ? Maybe...

For a country that wants to attract more and more visitors, any kind of crackdown doesn't really make sense does it ?

If they take this to it's logical conclusion they should change the 3 month tourist visas to accomodate people who come to Thailand for a winter holiday so they can stay for the whole winter.

Don't they realise that a lot of people come to Thailand for a maximum of 60 days because that's what it says on the visa. If they issued 6 month long visas there would be a lot more tourists who come for up to the full 6 months.

There's no way in the world my mother would ever come here for more than 3 months because she would have to do a visa run and I know she wouldn't travel across the country, exit and then enter the country just for the sake of getting a stamp in her passport to stay for another month or two, she won't do it.

I wonder how many thousands of people cut their yearly winter holidays in Thailand short because they won't comply with the ridiculously short visas in a country well known as as place where people go for an extended winter holiday in the sun while it's cold back home.

It's ok for us younger ones to hop on a plane or 'run' across country to a nearby border but when you hit your late 60's and 70's the fact that this still applies is a bit much.

OK - I have the impression this "clampdown" was initiated AFTER the coup.

Can someone clear this up?

So this UK rules is incorrect?

[alyx]

Not related but just a personal off topic thought

How amazing....not that I complain, but it seems so strange, so weird though, that some years ago anyone typing the word "thailandelite" would lead a thousand infuriated posters to tear that concept down ready to have the TEM perpetrators (=Thai Elite Members ) face the firing squad, whereas, today, it seems to be the logical choice.

I am surprised that no one has theorised that all the changes we have seen, were instigated by some powerful mastermind in order to market this option.

This being said, I agree that this membership could very well be taylor cut for the nomads

As for people willing to spend six months away from their country of origin, I tend to agree that some months here and some months somewhere else isn't a killer, especially for European who are only twelve hours from most continents

Edited September 3, 2014 by alyx

[lazygourmet]

There's been a change of government since this was first announced, also the previous head of immigration who announced this 'crackdown' is no longer the head of immigration.

The previous guy in charge had his job changed just after the coup. I don't know why this happened but I'm pretty sure the order to do it came directly from the NCPO.

It looks like the new government has instructed immigration to end their crackdown. Common sense at last ? Maybe...

For a country that wants to attract more and more visitors, any kind of crackdown doesn't really make sense does it ?

If they take this to it's logical conclusion they should change the 3 month tourist visas to accomodate people who come to Thailand for a winter holiday so they can stay for the whole winter.

Don't they realise that a lot of people come to Thailand for a maximum of 60 days because that's what it says on the visa. If they issued 6 month long visas there would be a lot more tourists who come for up to the full 6 months.

There's no way in the world my mother would ever come here for more than 3 months because she would have to do a visa run and I know she wouldn't travel across the country, exit and then enter the country just for the sake of getting a stamp in her passport to stay for another month or two, she won't do it.

I wonder how many thousands of people cut their yearly winter holidays in Thailand short because they won't comply with the ridiculously short visas in a country well known as as place where people go for an extended winter holiday in the sun while it's cold back home.

It's ok for us younger ones to hop on a plane or 'run' across country to a nearby border but when you hit your late 60's and 70's the fact that this still applies is a bit much.

OK - I have the impression this "clampdown" was initiated AFTER the coup.

Can someone clear this up?

So this UK rules is incorrect?

No, UKrules is perfectly correct.

Reports about being denied -including mine!- appeared just after Songkran holidays.

Since May 22nd, I have re-entered Thailand three times on the same passport without any trouble at all.

[Gillyflower]

I'm one of the people that ukrules was talking about. I come for 4 months - end November- end March. Before I leave Europe it is winter and when I get back it is still winter. So one can talk about 6 months. This year in SW of France, we have hardly known what a summer was. Also there are a lot of people who do seasonal work in their countries or can manage their businesses from a distance. They can well come here for 4-5 months every year.

[Tomtomtom69]

^{It seems there is an expectation of Thailand, which is not expected of most countries. Immigration rules are only questioned in Thailand because of a history of laxity in their enforcement. Now, there is an enforcement procedure which is similar to that in most other developed countries. Tourists are obviously welcomed. Long-stayers are not tourists and simply need to apply for the appropriate visa. It's not so difficult. Being openly critical of your host is very poor form; trying to crawl through loopholes is not a good way to live one's life. Westerners staying more than 30 days are not as important to Thailand as Thailand is to them. The tourists who spend most money here are Japanese. They spend a lot in ten days. Westerners who are claiming to be tourists, but who really are economic refugees, do not spend much money per capital at all. Often, their negative social impact can be greater than their positive financial impact.}

^{If you are a tourist, get a tourist visa.}

^{If you are a long stayer get the visa which Thailand deems to be the one most suited to your needs.}

^{If you can't afford it, you can't afford to stay in Thailand.}

The Japanese spend the most? Says who? You're just another misinformed person making up things as you go along. The Japanese are exactly the same as other westerners and other foreigners in general, if your point is accepted to be true. They need Thailand much more than Thailand needs them. How exactly do they spend more than westerners? Most Japanese have a very inferior view of Thailand and only come for recreational purposes, blowing big money on drinking and girls. I know of one Japanese professor who apparently is a co-supervisor of a Thai PhD student's thesis at Chula university. He only ever comes to Thailand for drinking and doesn't get any work done once he's here, whereas my dad, a second supervisor actually cares about said student.

Most westerners on long term stays actually spend a whole lot more money than those 3 day in-out Japanese "executives" that you describe. They own cars (or have purchased them for their spouses) and in an ironic twist most of those cars are Japanese (but obviously Thai made), they've purchased houses, they like good food and wine etc.

If you want to see high spending tourists these days think Chinese or even Australians (certainly the FIFO or business owners). With it's very high wages and relatively short distances to get to Thailand, not to mention low prices once they arrive, many Aussies in these categories live it up here. I have two good friends from school, one is a business owner and the other is in real estate. They recently came to Bangkok all the way from Sydney just for three nights. They stayed at the Novotel Siam Square, which they didn't think was that fancy but anyway, they spent big on meals and drinks, only frequenting the best places, such as the rooftop pool bar at the W hotel. More than 2000 Baht (I think it was) spent on just a couple of drinks, including mine. Now that's big spending, especially for Thailand.

[Tomtomtom69]

There's no way in the world my mother would ever come here for more than 3 months because she would have to do a visa run and I know she wouldn't travel across the country, exit and then enter the country just for the sake of getting a stamp in her passport to stay for another month or two, she won't do it.

O-A visa or extension of stay is not good enough ?

I don't believe it is good enough - it's hoops for people to jump through and people don't like to jump through hoops, especially for a 4 or 5 month stay. It's easier to just stay for less time, no problem.

This is a reason I never go to China any more - too much hassle. No visa on arrival / visa examption = no arrival, I don't go there. I like to keep it simple even if the country doesn't. Of course they have no idea that I would have travelled there if it wasn't for their bullshit visa requirements, obviously they either don't know or don't care, which is no problem for me. I'll accept there's a lot of tit for tat diplomacy by our supposed 'leaders' regarding visa requirements which only adds additional layers of bullshit to the already antiquated system.

Keep it simple and maybe I'll go - even if it's simple maybe I won't bother - it's a buyers market and countries aren't striving to make it easy for the consumer (tourist) and in some cases they're making it harder to visit.

Geez you've got some beef with that attitude. Did you know it's actually a lot easier to get a business visa, or even a longer term tourist visa for China than for Thailand? I applied for a business visa at the Chinese embassy in Bangkok back in May. Needed only 2 documents - a letter from work stating my employment with them (my company is not in Thailand btw) and an invitation letter from my sponsor in China - only got 30 days, but that's all I needed. Double entry would have been possible with an itinerary showing a second entry into China, but I didn't need it. To get a business visa for Thailand requires a mountain of paperwork. If I apply for a Chinese business visa back home, I can get a 1-year multiple entry visa valid for stays of up to 90 days per trip with not much more than 1 introduction letter and nothing else. It would be great if it were that simple for Thailand, but apart from a few consulates in Australia, which might only require a few basic documents (but still more than what China requires), it's no longer easy to get a Thai business visa in the region except for work purposes, but then it's only valid for 3 months (for which you get an extension inside Thailand) and a mountain of paperwork must be submitted first.

It's easy enough to get a double or triple entry Thai visa, unless (as I've heard with non-B multiple entry) things are tightening up in the UK for tourist visas as well, but in other countries it's still fairly easy. It's certainly a lot easier to get a tourist visa valid for the length of stay than to attempt a visa free entry and at the same time be worried about showing onward/return tickets as is the requirement for entry under visa exempt rules.

If that's still too much for you there's always Cambodia. Visa on arrival available at ALL international checkpoints from neighboring countries, airports and the seaport in Sihanoukville (type - ordinary), US$35 (up from US$25 recently), then get a 1-year extension for less than US$300. No need for reporting, visa runs, or any documents submitted other than a photo and the money. You don't even need to lift a pen to fill out a form. If there is a form to fill out, I've never seen it, because the agent you use does everything for you. Unfortunately, that's not an option for Thailand and no visa in Thailand even comes close to the simplicity of the 1-year Cambodian visa extension, but it's there if you need it.

[NoshowJones]

The point I'm making is : Thailand should be doing all it can to encourage these people to come for the winter by making it easy to do so.

Why?

You mean you seriously do not know why?

[alyx]

^{It seems there is an expectation of Thailand, which is not expected of most countries. Immigration rules are only questioned in Thailand because of a history of laxity in their enforcement. Now, there is an enforcement procedure which is similar to that in most other developed countries. Tourists are obviously welcomed. Long-stayers are not tourists and simply need to apply for the appropriate visa. It's not so difficult. Being openly critical of your host is very poor form; trying to crawl through loopholes is not a good way to live one's life. Westerners staying more than 30 days are not as important to Thailand as Thailand is to them. The tourists who spend most money here are Japanese. They spend a lot in ten days. Westerners who are claiming to be tourists, but who really are economic refugees, do not spend much money per capital at all. Often, their negative social impact can be greater than their positive financial impact.}

^{If you are a tourist, get a tourist visa.}

^{If you are a long stayer get the visa which Thailand deems to be the one most suited to your needs.}

^{If you can't afford it, you can't afford to stay in Thailand.}

The Japanese spend the most? Says who? You're just another misinformed person making up things as you go along. The Japanese are exactly the same as other westerners and other foreigners in general, if your point is accepted to be true. They need Thailand much more than Thailand needs them. How exactly do they spend more than westerners? Most Japanese have a very inferior view of Thailand and only come for recreational purposes, blowing big money on drinking and girls. I know of one Japanese professor who apparently is a co-supervisor of a Thai PhD student's thesis at Chula university. He only ever comes to Thailand for drinking and doesn't get any work done once he's here, whereas my dad, a second supervisor actually cares about said student.

Most westerners on long term stays actually spend a whole lot more money than those 3 day in-out Japanese "executives" that you describe. They own cars (or have purchased them for their spouses) and in an ironic twist most of those cars are Japanese (but obviously Thai made), they've purchased houses, they like good food and wine etc.

If you want to see high spending tourists these days think Chinese or even Australians (certainly the FIFO or business owners). With it's very high wages and relatively short distances to get to Thailand, not to mention low prices once they arrive, many Aussies in these categories live it up here. I have two good friends from school, one is a business owner and the other is in real estate. They recently came to Bangkok all the way from Sydney just for three nights. They stayed at the Novotel Siam Square, which they didn't think was that fancy but anyway, they spent big on meals and drinks, only frequenting the best places, such as the rooftop pool bar at the W hotel. More than 2000 Baht (I think it was) spent on just a couple of drinks, including mine. Now that's big spending, especially for Thailand.

Sorry, but I am not quite sure that this is big spending

Novotel is not what one would deem a high end hotel, W hotel is nice but, please, not that expensive either, compared to other spots

One also seem to forget that clubs are full of big spenders and they are ....Thai ( not directly related but a couple of months ago I was at a club in Montreux Switzerland and some Thai kids were partying, one of them picked up the equivalent of the 10,000 euros check for three bottles )

When it comes to money, there is no nationality

There are those on a budget and the others

[AngelsLariat]

I m a digital nomade and I make mega bucks on the Internet (sometimes when I m lucky) . There is no visa for digital nomade except the tourist visa.

Would you be willing to pay the income tax on those megabucks in exchange for a Business Visa?

[Tomtomtom69]

^{It seems there is an expectation of Thailand, which is not expected of most countries. Immigration rules are only questioned in Thailand because of a history of laxity in their enforcement. Now, there is an enforcement procedure which is similar to that in most other developed countries. Tourists are obviously welcomed. Long-stayers are not tourists and simply need to apply for the appropriate visa. It's not so difficult. Being openly critical of your host is very poor form; trying to crawl through loopholes is not a good way to live one's life. Westerners staying more than 30 days are not as important to Thailand as Thailand is to them. The tourists who spend most money here are Japanese. They spend a lot in ten days. Westerners who are claiming to be tourists, but who really are economic refugees, do not spend much money per capital at all. Often, their negative social impact can be greater than their positive financial impact.}

^{If you are a tourist, get a tourist visa.}

^{If you are a long stayer get the visa which Thailand deems to be the one most suited to your needs.}

^{If you can't afford it, you can't afford to stay in Thailand.}

The Japanese spend the most? Says who? You're just another misinformed person making up things as you go along. The Japanese are exactly the same as other westerners and other foreigners in general, if your point is accepted to be true. They need Thailand much more than Thailand needs them. How exactly do they spend more than westerners? Most Japanese have a very inferior view of Thailand and only come for recreational purposes, blowing big money on drinking and girls. I know of one Japanese professor who apparently is a co-supervisor of a Thai PhD student's thesis at Chula university. He only ever comes to Thailand for drinking and doesn't get any work done once he's here, whereas my dad, a second supervisor actually cares about said student.

Most westerners on long term stays actually spend a whole lot more money than those 3 day in-out Japanese "executives" that you describe. They own cars (or have purchased them for their spouses) and in an ironic twist most of those cars are Japanese (but obviously Thai made), they've purchased houses, they like good food and wine etc.

If you want to see high spending tourists these days think Chinese or even Australians (certainly the FIFO or business owners). With it's very high wages and relatively short distances to get to Thailand, not to mention low prices once they arrive, many Aussies in these categories live it up here. I have two good friends from school, one is a business owner and the other is in real estate. They recently came to Bangkok all the way from Sydney just for three nights. They stayed at the Novotel Siam Square, which they didn't think was that fancy but anyway, they spent big on meals and drinks, only frequenting the best places, such as the rooftop pool bar at the W hotel. More than 2000 Baht (I think it was) spent on just a couple of drinks, including mine. Now that's big spending, especially for Thailand.

Sorry, but I am not quite sure that this is big spending

Novotel is not what one would deem a high end hotel, W hotel is nice but, please, not that expensive either, compared to other spots

One also seem to forget that clubs are full of big spenders and they are ....Thai ( not directly related but a couple of months ago I was at a club in Montreux Switzerland and some Thai kids were partying, one of them picked up the equivalent of the 10,000 euros check for three bottles )

When it comes to money, there is no nationality

There are those on a budget and the others

Yes it is - that was just a casual afternoon spent over like 3-4 drinks, mostly non-alcoholic. 225 Baht for a simple orange juice or non-alcoholic cocktail (and that was the cheapest item on the menu) is very expensive by anyone's standards and is more than 2/3 the daily wage of a minimum wage worker. Those guys I know spent I don't know, tens of thousands of Baht the night before partying at some high-end hotel, but I wasn't there.

Anyway, we're talking about Thailand here, which for the most part is obviously less expensive than other countries, which is why the majority come, not for luxury but because it's quite cheap. The equivalent of the Novotel and W would easily be 3-4 times more expensive in any western or Japanese city, Singapore or Hong Kong, for example. Despite the sky high prices, there are plenty of travellers, many Chinese and even European happy to spend A$300-400 a night for accommodation near Ayers Rock (Uluru) in central Australia, some of which isn't even that spectacular for the money you pay. Although Australia sees a fair few international travellers these days, the main reason why it sees 3 times fewer travellers than Thailand (6.8 million compared to around 20 million plus) is due to high prices and of course that includes just getting there in the first place.

[Time Traveller]

There are hundreds of thousands of people coming to Thailand for two month holidays?

Really?

No, but there are hundreds of thousands of people in cold winter locations around the world who are in a position to come for an extended stay each winter.

The point I'm making is : Thailand should be doing all it can to encourage these people to come for the winter by making it easy to do so. They could do a lot more.

If you don't understand this point by now then you never will so give up.

Well what about the people that live in hot summer locations around the world that want to escape the heat. Shouldn't they also be allowed to come to thailand for an extended stay?

Why is it all about the people in cold winter locations?

Edited September 3, 2014 by Time Traveller

[slipperylobster]

.

So winter lasts 6 months? Where? Siberia?

I grew up near the Canadian Border in Northern New York State. First Frost in October, Last Snowfall in April. Do the math. The seasonal calender will tell you 3 months, but your heating bill will tell you six.

I think that is why some folks would prefer a warmer place for those six months.

Edited September 3, 2014 by slipperylobster

[AngelsLariat]

No, but there are hundreds of thousands of people in cold winter locations around the world who are in a position to come for an extended stay each winter.

The point I'm making is : Thailand should be doing all it can to encourage these people to come for the winter by making it easy to do so. They could do a lot more.

If you don't understand this point by now then you never will so give up.

Well what about the people that live in hot summer locations around the world that want to escape the heat. Shouldn't they also be allowed to come to thailand for an extended stay?

Why is it all about the people in cold winter locations?

It that an attempt at irony? There are also penniless hermits in Borneo, why shouldn’t TAT try to attract them?

Edited September 3, 2014 by AngelsLariat

[slipperylobster]

There are hundreds of thousands of people coming to Thailand for two month holidays?

Really?

No, but there are hundreds of thousands of people in cold winter locations around the world who are in a position to come for an extended stay each winter.

The point I'm making is : Thailand should be doing all it can to encourage these people to come for the winter by making it easy to do so. They could do a lot more.

If you don't understand this point by now then you never will so give up.

Well what about the people that live in hot summer locations around the world that want to escape the heat. Shouldn't they also be allowed to come to thailand for an extended stay?

Why is it all about the people in cold winter locations?

Oh.......stop being sensitive. I think he meant that as an example.

[Tony125]

.

So winter lasts 6 months? Where? Siberia?

~

Try Boston, Mass USA

[ericthai]

^{It seems there is an expectation of Thailand, which is not expected of most countries. Immigration rules are only questioned in Thailand because of a history of laxity in their enforcement. Now, there is an enforcement procedure which is similar to that in most other developed countries. Tourists are obviously welcomed. Long-stayers are not tourists and simply need to apply for the appropriate visa. It's not so difficult. Being openly critical of your host is very poor form; trying to crawl through loopholes is not a good way to live one's life. Westerners staying more than 30 days are not as important to Thailand as Thailand is to them. The tourists who spend most money here are Japanese. They spend a lot in ten days. Westerners who are claiming to be tourists, but who really are economic refugees, do not spend much money per capital at all. Often, their negative social impact can be greater than their positive financial impact.}

^{If you are a tourist, get a tourist visa.}

^{If you are a long stayer get the visa which Thailand deems to be the one most suited to your needs.}

^{If you can't afford it, you can't afford to stay in Thailand.}

The Japanese spend the most? Says who? You're just another misinformed person making up things as you go along. The Japanese are exactly the same as other westerners and other foreigners in general, if your point is accepted to be true. They need Thailand much more than Thailand needs them. How exactly do they spend more than westerners? Most Japanese have a very inferior view of Thailand and only come for recreational purposes, blowing big money on drinking and girls. I know of one Japanese professor who apparently is a co-supervisor of a Thai PhD student's thesis at Chula university. He only ever comes to Thailand for drinking and doesn't get any work done once he's here, whereas my dad, a second supervisor actually cares about said student.

Most westerners on long term stays actually spend a whole lot more money than those 3 day in-out Japanese "executives" that you describe. They own cars (or have purchased them for their spouses) and in an ironic twist most of those cars are Japanese (but obviously Thai made), they've purchased houses, they like good food and wine etc.

If you want to see high spending tourists these days think Chinese or even Australians (certainly the FIFO or business owners). With it's very high wages and relatively short distances to get to Thailand, not to mention low prices once they arrive, many Aussies in these categories live it up here. I have two good friends from school, one is a business owner and the other is in real estate. They recently came to Bangkok all the way from Sydney just for three nights. They stayed at the Novotel Siam Square, which they didn't think was that fancy but anyway, they spent big on meals and drinks, only frequenting the best places, such as the rooftop pool bar at the W hotel. More than 2000 Baht (I think it was) spent on just a couple of drinks, including mine. Now that's big spending, especially for Thailand.

Big spending 2000b?? very funny I can spend that on a night out easy. Big spending is 20,000-30,000B in one night. I have several friends that come in from Europe, Tokyo etc that do spend 20-30K in a night out on drinks alone. Chinese the new big spenders? No way most come to Thailand on tours, dont tip and are very cheap. Ask around the tourist areas they will all complain about the Chinese. Rude and cheap. There are allot of Japanese that spend 6 months of more here overseeing manufacturing companies. They have cars with drivers, a condo in BKK and house near the factory. They get extra pay to be here and spend a good amount of cash.

[AYJAYDEE]

These immigration rules are totally retarded by the way. We live in a world where everything is connected like your pc, laptop,... And they expect to see us to come as a tourist with a Mickey mouse t shirt and a Canon camera around your neck.(stereotype of a tourist), but this world has changed a lot since 1977, still immigration rules are based on old rules fixed by old guys who don't understand anything.

I m a digital nomade and I make mega bucks on the Internet (sometimes when I m lucky) . There is no visa for digital nomade except the tourist visa.

Did immigration knows what internet is? When they continue to stamp entrance cards! So instead to modernise the system, they prefer to change their mind all the time. "no back to back visa run , but tomorrow It s ok..., but in 3 days we want people get visa...Bla bla"

See what I mean? , these people at immigration are totally clueless because they still live in an old system.

they understand the modern world and have decided they dont want digital nomads.

[Tony125]

I wonder how many thousands of people cut their yearly winter holidays in Thailand short because they won't comply with the ridiculously short visas in a country well known as as place where people go for an extended winter holiday in the sun while it's cold back home.

How many people get enough time off work that a 30 days is too short for their yearly holiday?

If you are the breadwinner you can send your family over for extended vacaction. A co worker of mine sent his daughter here for 7 weeks as a present for graduating University. She travelled all over Thailand .Another sent his wife and daughter over for 5 --6

weeks while he still worked at home. Plus a lot of retired farangs in Europe , Russia and USA want to get away from the dregs of winter and spend an extended period of time in a warm climate wether it be the Carribean , Florida, or Thailand .

[Wasa]

Not related but just a personal off topic thought

How amazing....not that I complain, but it seems so strange, so weird though, that some years ago anyone typing the word "thailandelite" would lead a thousand infuriated posters to tear that concept down ready to have the TEM perpetrators (=Thai Elite Members ) face the firing squad, whereas, today, it seems to be the logical choice.

I am surprised that no one has theorised that all the changes we have seen, were instigated by some powerful mastermind in order to market this option.

This being said, I agree that this membership could very well be taylor cut for the nomads

As for people willing to spend six months away from their country of origin, I tend to agree that some months here and some months somewhere else isn't a killer, especially for European who are only twelve hours from most continents

No, the Thai Elite Card is not taylor (sic) made for nomads, you cannot work (legally) when staying here via the Elite Card. Under the definition of "working" provided by the Thai Labour Laws, digital nomads are considered to be working and that can only be done here (legally) by obtaining a work permit.

[slipperylobster]

Op, very excellent observation, that many of us missed. I have not heard that many members of TV getting turned back/refused at a border. Some warnings perhaps. Documentation and some verbal preparation might be handy. There might of been one or two reports of special cases. I am taking this as a sign that border runs have ceased altogether (those vans loaded with one hour in and out visa exempt stamp getting guys). My buddy overstayed a month, and was refused an exempt stamp in Nong Khai....got the standard 7 days and is now getting a visa in his home country.

Are we wrong? Anyone still getting stamped in and out back to back? I think not. Most are getting visas. No report on visas being denied back to back, either.

Edited September 3, 2014 by slipperylobster

[Wasa]

I m a digital nomade and I make mega bucks on the Internet (sometimes when I m lucky) . There is no visa for digital nomade except the tourist visa.

Thai Elite visa still too much for your megabucks???

The Thai Elite program is not suitable for him. As a digital nomad he is working and this is not permitted (legally) in Thailand on the Thai Elite program. All this program offers in relation to working here legally is assistance with obtaining a work permit.