Meeting with Chief of CM Immigration

[Rinrada]

Started to attend CM-ExPs a bit more often (handy for a night in town and their coffee and sarnies...not bad)

..anyway bit of info : up and coming meeting with Pol Col.Rutjapong,

Chief of Chiang mai Immigration..Oct 22nd...FYI..Q & A

General Meeting (date change):

Wednesday, October 22 at Le Méridien hotel.
Arrive 10 am for 10:30 start.
Speaker: Pol. Col. Rutjapong,

Chief of Chiang Mai Immigration.

Please submit your questions in advance to:

[kalbo123]

Does he speak English?

[Thailand]

Does he speak English?

Do you speak Thai?

Interesting opportunity to see if certain questions get answered. I will submit a couple, if I can see where?

Edited September 21, 2014 by Thailand

[iancnx]

Still waiting to read about the outcome of the TV meeting with the Director Immigration in Bangkok, or did I miss it?

[NancyL]

Thanks for the kind words about the CM Expats Club, Rinrada. I'm sorry, though, but the window of opportunity to submit questions has passed. We sent a special edition e-newsletter to all subscribers a few weeks ago and needed input on topics for the presentation by Sept 19. That's because Pol Col Rutjapong needs time to prepare his presentation. Two of us CEC Board members have had several meetings at CM Immigration already, and I suspect there will be several more before October 22 to be sure he's adequately addressing the concerns raised in the over 200 email questions I received from the CEC members (and others) who read the CEC e-newsletter.

Col. Rutjapong does speak English, but it's not his native language. This is not going to be a Q & A open forum. He's carefully preparing a presentation based on over 200 questions already received.

The presentation is open to the public, both CEC members and guests. We hope everyone understands our meetings are in a five star hotel and dress accordingly -- neat casual. This is a regular CEC meeting with an entry fee of 120 baht for members, 200 baht for guests.

Edited September 21, 2014 by NancyL

[masuk]

Good on you Nancy and fellow Committee members for organising the upcoming meeting with the Colonel, and also the delightful morning tea (breakfast) by the river on Friday. Also I thought the video which was presented is excellent, and hope we can forward this to friends when it's on the Expat's web site.

One point I wanted to ask is this; as Immigration and its rules and laws are government and thus political decisions, and I presume the Colonel is a senior public servant, do our concerns go through the Colonel to the government, or do things work differently here?

Is there such a person as Minister for Immigration, as in Western countries?

[NancyL]

Masuk, your question about whether there's a Minister of Immigration in Thailand, might be best posed in ThaiVisa.com's visa forum -- the first forum on the list of forums. I didn't find such an office when I consulted Google. The Embassies are under the control of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. The local immigration offices are considered police functions. Thus Col. Rutjapong is a "Police Colonel", a law enforcement official.

CEC initiated the meeting. No one approached us because they are interested in what's on the minds of expats with regard to Thai immigration policy. Col. Rutjapong job is enforcing Immigration regulations, not setting policy. He is the chief of the CM office and can best answer questions about the activities of that office, rather than speculate about what's happening high up the chain of command.

There were multiple questions about "why don't they have a five year retirement visa like Malaysia", but we phrased it instead as "can you share any developments or changes where Thailand may be offering a multi-year retirement visa in the near future"

[khwaibah]

Good on you Nancy and fellow Committee members for organising the upcoming meeting with the Colonel, and also the delightful morning tea (breakfast) by the river on Friday. Also I thought the video which was presented is excellent, and hope we can forward this to friends when it's on the Expat's web site.

One point I wanted to ask is this; as Immigration and its rules and laws are government and thus political decisions, and I presume the Colonel is a senior public servant, do our concerns go through the Colonel to the government, or do things work differently here?

Is there such a person as Minister for Immigration, as in Western countries?

Thai immigration is still a part of the Thai Royal Police. Same as the local police. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Thai_Police

[Tywais]

Good on you Nancy and fellow Committee members for organising the upcoming meeting with the Colonel, and also the delightful morning tea (breakfast) by the river on Friday. Also I thought the video which was presented is excellent, and hope we can forward this to friends when it's on the Expat's web site.

One point I wanted to ask is this; as Immigration and its rules and laws are government and thus political decisions, and I presume the Colonel is a senior public servant, do our concerns go through the Colonel to the government, or do things work differently here?

Is there such a person as Minister for Immigration, as in Western countries?

Thai immigration is still a part of the Thai Royal Police. Same as the local police. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Thai_Police

Believe it falls under the Director General of Police. And as suggested above, it is planned to separate immigration from the RTP and become an independent authority.

[hml367]

Masuk,

I think Tywais has something with the indication that things may change. The attached Immigration Act is not available right now on the main Immigration site.

The first 2 pages include what and who is responsible for Immigration.

Immigration_Act.pdf

Edited September 21, 2014 by hml367

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Does he speak English?

He can, but prefers not to.

[masuk]

Masuk,

I think Tywais has something with the indication that things may change. The attached Immigration Act is not available right now on the main Immigration site.

The first 2 pages include what and who is responsible for Immigration.

Thanks.

It could certainly have done with some proof-reading before printing.

[laolover88]

Does he speak English?

He can, but prefers not to.

Why should he?. It might be politic and considerate; but why?

Am not aware the the UK Border Agency conducts public consultation in Thai or any other language.

[Torrens54]

Good for you Nancy L. Glad you mentioned the matter of a Dress Code.

Sadly, all too many Expats in Chiang Mai have little or no concept of dressing appropriately. Just have a look at some of them any day when they front up at the Immigration Office.

Can only trust that they'll show some respect now that you've mentioned the requirement.

[Lizard2010]

Nancy L

Can you keep us informed as to what was said

It will be interesting to hear if any new happening at Immigration

[onthedarkside]

Troll post removed.

[Nowisee]

I'd like clarification on the cost of the certificate of residency. Is it free or not? If it's free then stop profiteering from me by making available within 24 hours for 500 baht versus making me wait 30 days for free.

IF I have to pay 500 baht, make it a multi-use valid for one year....I'm good with that.

[harrry]

Aanother threade which came to a full stop just like George's promised report of his meeting with immigration.

[NancyL]

I'd like clarification on the cost of the certificate of residency. Is it free or not? If it's free then stop profiteering from me by making available within 24 hours for 500 baht versus making me wait 30 days for free.

IF I have to pay 500 baht, make it a multi-use valid for one year....I'm good with that.

Nowisee, had you been a subscriber to the CEC newsletter you would have learned that we needed to receive all the questions by September 19. No, you don't need to be a member of CEC to subscribe to the e-newsletter. I'm sorry, but the Chief of Immigration is preparing his talk in advance and there were absolutely no questions about certificates of residency to our newsletter request for questions.

Are you a member of Chiang Mai Expats Club? Perhaps you should join.

[searcher22]

Good for you Nancy L. Glad you mentioned the matter of a Dress Code.

Sadly, all too many Expats in Chiang Mai have little or no concept of dressing appropriately. Just have a look at some of them any day when they front up at the Immigration Office.

Can only trust that they'll show some respect now that you've mentioned the requirement.

Trend forecaster Gerald Celente laments today's slobiness "Look back to old photos of America. Even the poorest immigrants dressed sharp, had respect for themselves, held their head high and had dignity."

"Once upon a time in America, not too long ago, from the captains of industry to the janitorial staff, dignity and style were essential elements of self respect. Whether it was a night at the opera or “take me out to the ball game,” theatergoers and sports fans dressed with the appropriate degrees of formality and care."

Nowadays: "Air travel? It’s a flying circus. The unkempt, ungroomed, the just-rolled-out-of-bed could care less if their smelly bare feet and grotesque appearance offends fellow flyers."

[Mapguy]

Of all of the concerns expressed by the resident Chiang Mai expats on this forum, the most fundamental is most likely being able to stay in Thailand. So, if expats are to be at all served by the the local expats' club, then it should have been routine for regular gab fests with the resident chief of immigration. But that's not the way things work!

Over the years I have been to a few sessions sponsored by different expat organizations and at least one sponsored by and including very high-level spokesmen from the Bangkok ministries. The general range of concerns has routinely come up before, as I recall, at the CEC, but primarily in informal questioning and (a few years ago addressed to local business-seeking local hacks sollicitng legal business), and such sessions didn't include official spokespersons.

There was recently a meeting for a "select" few, consular types and a few others, to listen to the "official line." It was reported on this forum by NancyL as well as by Chiang Mai News, which sollicited questions beforehand. IMHO it was poorly represented and poorly reported by the News, which later seemed transfixed by literal translation of their "tapes," in very poor knowledgeable experienced journalistic practice.

Nevermind, there will be another meeting. The local chief of Immigration must be a brave sort! Such regional officials are simply not used to doing this sort of thing, especially not doing it well! They are policemen, not PR spokesmen. They are cops with limited discretion from Bangkok, especially in these times!

I appreciate the intercession of the Expats Club in editing questions which are submitted in advance. The approach being made is very sensible given the situation and the ever-continuing interest in it and the personal angst of many people. I don't believe in nor really admire self-appointed foreign mavens and interpreters of reality (especially of foreigners with very limited experience except as tourists) including the Chiangmai Expats Club leaders, but the current direction of that group is much more constructive than the self-serving leadership of earlier days.

Anyway, don't expect too much! Crass challenges based on the various personal exigencies of foreign transplants in Thailand are not productive. Ever! Even on this forum! So, submit your questions! In advance! In the end, a sensibly-phrased response to difficulties people encounter will be helpful. This does not mean that all problems will be rectified or ameliorated immediately. They won't be. But concerns will be heard and transmitted.

Remember this: Foreigners are here at the pleasure of Thailand, Appreciate the privilege!

Edited September 25, 2014 by Mapguy

[masuk]

Of all of the concerns expressed by the resident Chiang Mai expats on this forum, the most fundamental is most likely being able to stay in Thailand. So, if expats are to be at all served by the the local expats' club, then it should have been routine for regular gab fests with the resident chief of immigration. But that's not the way things work!

Over the years I have been to a few sessions sponsored by different expat organizations and at least one sponsored by and including very high-level spokesmen from the Bangkok ministries. The general range of concerns has routinely come up before, as I recall, at the CEC, but primarily in informal questioning and (a few years ago addressed to local business-seeking local hacks sollicitng legal business), and such sessions didn't include official spokespersons.

There was recently a meeting for a "select" few, consular types and a few others, to listen to the "official line." It was reported on this forum by NancyL as well as by Chiang Mai News, which sollicited questions beforehand. IMHO it was poorly represented and poorly reported by the News, which later seemed transfixed by literal translation of their "tapes," in very poor knowledgeable experienced journalistic practice.

Nevermind, there will be another meeting. The local chief of Immigration must be a brave sort! Such regional officials are simply not used to doing this sort of thing, especially not doing it well! They are policemen, not PR spokesmen. They are cops with limited discretion from Bangkok, especially in these times!

I appreciate the intercession of the Expats Club in editing questions which are submitted in advance. The approach being made is very sensible given the situation and the ever-continuing interest in it and the personal angst of many people. I don't believe in nor really admire self-appointed foreign mavens and interpreters of reality (especially of foreigners with very limited experience except as tourists) including the Chiangmai Expats Club leaders, but the current direction of that group is much more constructive than the self-serving leadership of earlier days.

Anyway, don't expect too much! Crass challenges based on the various personal exigencies of foreign transplants in Thailand are not productive. Ever! Even on this forum! So, submit your questions! In advance! In the end, a sensibly-phrased response to difficulties people encounter will be helpful. This does not mean that all problems will be rectified or ameliorated immediately. They won't be. But concerns will be heard and transmitted.

Remember this: Foreigners are here at the pleasure of Thailand, Appreciate the privilege!

Well, I for one really appreciate the work being done by our Expat's Committee. Things are moving along well, and judging by the 200 or more members who attend monthly meetings, we represent a good cross-section of the expat community living in Chiang Mai.

We have been kept well-informed of the planned meeting with the head of Immigration in Chiang Mai, and the need to submit questions in advance so he might respond to these in a language which is foreign to him.

I think it's churlish to criticise a group of people who are making an effort to ensure we have good communication with Immigration, and in a gentle way, let the folk in Bangkok know that we want to stay here with the least possible grief. If you want a say in future events, read the newsletter which is open to all, or even join the Expats' Group.

Meeting with Immigration officials also opens the way to modernise the existing system, and hopefully change the much despised 90day reporting system which might have been appropriate for a pre-computer age, but not now, and hopefully work towards an ID card for long-stay residents.

But we all know and understand that the final decision rests with the politicians in Bankgkok, who then have their Immigration Police administer and regulate the rules, the same as in most Western countries. As expats, we do not elect the politicians, and as such can only make requests, such as the committee is doing at present.

I am not a committee member, but certainly support the work they're doing.