National parks up entrance fees

[chrissables]

Well i'll be on Dartmoor this week and Thais are welcome without paying the equivalent of a locals daily wage. Never been to an impressive national park in Thailand and certainly not one worth 500 baht.

Local wage isn't the issue now is it? (Park admission here would still be less than an hour's wage for me if I had to pay the tourist rate which with my WP I don't have to pay)

Well i would think if the park charges what is a days salary for a Thai, they are bang out of order.

People living here pay tax all the time, even tourists do. VAT!

[Fairynuff]

Took my Thai wife and her friends to the Melbourne zoo yesterday and they didn't charge them extra simply because they are tourists, we all paid exactly the same price. No discrimination all treated equally as human beings I wasn't considered superior to them or got a discount for being Australian. The cashier didn't even look twice at them or turn her nose up.

Just read your post and I must add you are correct I took my Wife, Brother in Law and Nephew to the

Zoo as well (not in Melbourne but Perth) I got a discount for having an pensioner card which includes

my wife (Thai Citizen) my nephew is Thai citizen as well he produced his Student card,got discount

as well and my BIL who is here on holidays paid the same as we all did because he is a tourist.

They should have paid more because they are tourists, don't have a work permit and don't pay tax. (you know I'm kidding right?)

That's my idea of morality!

[jdinasia]

Well i'll be on Dartmoor this week and Thais are welcome without paying the equivalent of a locals daily wage. Never been to an impressive national park in Thailand and certainly not one worth 500 baht.

Local wage isn't the issue now is it? (Park admission here would still be less than an hour's wage for me if I had to pay the tourist rate which with my WP I don't have to pay)

Well i would think if the park charges what is a days salary for a Thai, they are bang out of order.

People living here pay tax all the time, even tourists do. VAT!

Parks do not charge Thai people nor income tax payers a day's wage for admission. There is a difference between VAT and income tax.

Edit

Even retirees can get the local rate with a Thai DL almost every time.

Worth noting.. Tourists can get VAT refunds for significant purchases ; which I cannot get.

Edited October 12, 2014 by jdinasia

[spidermike007]

I pay tax here too. What relevance is my nationality?

Because it is quite likely that in your home country you charge foreigners/non residents more as well.

Well in my country that would be illegal ! I've been to a couple of places where locals (ie local district residents) get a reduced price to encourage return visits, but all tourists of whatever nationality pay the same price.

That sounds like a policy that was created by someone with "vision". How often do you see that here? A policy that is written with concern for the long term view? One that is written by somebody with wisdom, who is able to say "what are the long term implications of charging foreigners 5 to 10 times what the locals pay?" I would not mind paying 100 baht, for instance. But, when they are charging me 200, 300, even 500 baht for an entrance fee to a palace, or a museum, or a park, I tend to feel abused, taken for granted, and taken advantage of. Are any of these feelings that a visionary nation would want it's visitors to feel? Thailand has to examine some of these policies sooner or later. It is no longer the "greatest place on earth". There are countless problems facing the country. I am sure they would say they have more important things to consider at the moment. And they do. But, ignoring a problem does not make it go away.

Fair is fair. If you can prove you live here, there is no justification for paying more of an entrance fee, than local Thais. I understand their desire to fleece tourists. But ex-pats who live here and support the economy on a hundred different levels? That is just ignorant policy., created by non-visionary "leaders".

Are you a visitor or an income tax payer?

A million baht plus in expenditures, per year retiree, thank you very much. Sorry, but the income tax argument does not pass my sniff test. I contribute on dozens of levels.

[jdinasia]

I pay tax here too. What relevance is my nationality?

Because it is quite likely that in your home country you charge foreigners/non residents more as well.

Well in my country that would be illegal ! I've been to a couple of places where locals (ie local district residents) get a reduced price to encourage return visits, but all tourists of whatever nationality pay the same price.

That sounds like a policy that was created by someone with "vision". How often do you see that here? A policy that is written with concern for the long term view? One that is written by somebody with wisdom, who is able to say "what are the long term implications of charging foreigners 5 to 10 times what the locals pay?" I would not mind paying 100 baht, for instance. But, when they are charging me 200, 300, even 500 baht for an entrance fee to a palace, or a museum, or a park, I tend to feel abused, taken for granted, and taken advantage of. Are any of these feelings that a visionary nation would want it's visitors to feel? Thailand has to examine some of these policies sooner or later. It is no longer the "greatest place on earth". There are countless problems facing the country. I am sure they would say they have more important things to consider at the moment. And they do. But, ignoring a problem does not make it go away.

Fair is fair. If you can prove you live here, there is no justification for paying more of an entrance fee, than local Thais. I understand their desire to fleece tourists. But ex-pats who live here and support the economy on a hundred different levels? That is just ignorant policy., created by non-visionary "leaders".

Are you a visitor or an income tax payer?

A million baht plus in expenditures, per year retiree, thank you very much. Sorry, but the income tax argument does not pass my sniff test. I contribute on dozens of levels.

So.. Not an income tax payer. User fees and income tax pay for national parks. Don't pay one.. Then you pay the other

[jdinasia]

I pay tax here too. What relevance is my nationality?

Because it is quite likely that in your home country you charge foreigners/non residents more as well.

Well in my country that would be illegal ! I've been to a couple of places where locals (ie local district residents) get a reduced price to encourage return visits, but all tourists of whatever nationality pay the same price.

That sounds like a policy that was created by someone with "vision". How often do you see that here? A policy that is written with concern for the long term view? One that is written by somebody with wisdom, who is able to say "what are the long term implications of charging foreigners 5 to 10 times what the locals pay?" I would not mind paying 100 baht, for instance. But, when they are charging me 200, 300, even 500 baht for an entrance fee to a palace, or a museum, or a park, I tend to feel abused, taken for granted, and taken advantage of. Are any of these feelings that a visionary nation would want it's visitors to feel? Thailand has to examine some of these policies sooner or later. It is no longer the "greatest place on earth". There are countless problems facing the country. I am sure they would say they have more important things to consider at the moment. And they do. But, ignoring a problem does not make it go away.

Fair is fair. If you can prove you live here, there is no justification for paying more of an entrance fee, than local Thais. I understand their desire to fleece tourists. But ex-pats who live here and support the economy on a hundred different levels? That is just ignorant policy., created by non-visionary "leaders".

Are you a visitor or an income tax payer?

A million baht plus in expenditures, per year retiree, thank you very much. Sorry, but the income tax argument does not pass my sniff test. I contribute on dozens of levels.

So.. Not an income tax payer. User fees and income tax pay for national parks. Don't pay one.. Then you pay the other

Edit

Do you have a Thai DL? That almost always gets you the Thai rate.

Edited October 12, 2014 by jdinasia

[Fairynuff]

@moderators. Perhaps jdinasia could host his own forum where he could patronise pontificate and tell (the interested) members how he's always right and everyone else is always wrong, and not or getting his WP

[jdinasia]

Deleted

Edited October 12, 2014 by jdinasia

[spidermike007]

I pay tax here too. What relevance is my nationality?

Because it is quite likely that in your home country you charge foreigners/non residents more as well.

Well in my country that would be illegal ! I've been to a couple of places where locals (ie local district residents) get a reduced price to encourage return visits, but all tourists of whatever nationality pay the same price.

That sounds like a policy that was created by someone with "vision". How often do you see that here? A policy that is written with concern for the long term view? One that is written by somebody with wisdom, who is able to say "what are the long term implications of charging foreigners 5 to 10 times what the locals pay?" I would not mind paying 100 baht, for instance. But, when they are charging me 200, 300, even 500 baht for an entrance fee to a palace, or a museum, or a park, I tend to feel abused, taken for granted, and taken advantage of. Are any of these feelings that a visionary nation would want it's visitors to feel? Thailand has to examine some of these policies sooner or later. It is no longer the "greatest place on earth". There are countless problems facing the country. I am sure they would say they have more important things to consider at the moment. And they do. But, ignoring a problem does not make it go away.

Fair is fair. If you can prove you live here, there is no justification for paying more of an entrance fee, than local Thais. I understand their desire to fleece tourists. But ex-pats who live here and support the economy on a hundred different levels? That is just ignorant policy., created by non-visionary "leaders".

Are you a visitor or an income tax payer?

A million baht plus in expenditures, per year retiree, thank you very much. Sorry, but the income tax argument does not pass my sniff test. I contribute on dozens of levels.

So.. Not an income tax payer. User fees and income tax pay for national parks. Don't pay one.. Then you pay the other

Edit

Do you have a Thai DL? That almost always gets you the Thai rate.

Yes. Sometimes works, sometimes does not.

[craigt3365]

Tiered pricing is not unusual. Happens all the time in many countries. India, Honduras, Russia, Indonesia, etc.

Here's an interesting discussion about it:

http://www.brendansadventures.com/should-tourist-pay-more-than-locals-at-tourist-attractions/

Congrats to the EU for making this illegal. Though I did find this a bit interesting:

http://www.the-colosseum.net/around/visit.htm

PRICE FOR THE TICKET TO COLOSSEO, FORO ROMANO and PALATINO valid 2 days:
ADULTS € 12,00
REDUCED FEE € 7,50 for European Union members between 18 and 24 years old
FREE ENTRANCE for persons under 18 and over 65 years old from the European Union

FREE TICKETS (from the website http://archeoroma.beniculturali.it/en/free-tickets)
Are eligible for free tickets, upon presentation of suitable documents:
- European Union citizens 17 and under and 65 and over (minor visitors under 12 must be accompanied)

[chrissables]

Well i'll be on Dartmoor this week and Thais are welcome without paying the equivalent of a locals daily wage. Never been to an impressive national park in Thailand and certainly not one worth 500 baht.

Local wage isn't the issue now is it? (Park admission here would still be less than an hour's wage for me if I had to pay the tourist rate which with my WP I don't have to pay)

Well i would think if the park charges what is a days salary for a Thai, they are bang out of order.

People living here pay tax all the time, even tourists do. VAT!

Parks do not charge Thai people nor income tax payers a day's wage for admission. There is a difference between VAT and income tax.

Edit

Even retirees can get the local rate with a Thai DL almost every time.

Worth noting.. Tourists can get VAT refunds for significant purchases ; which I cannot get.

Edit! I mean parks charge non Thai nationals a Thai persons daily wage.

VAT is paid by anyone who buys anything here. Maybe i could be spending 2 million baht a year living here, so that is a lot of tax. (I don't by the way!)

Yes the driving license works, but it's up to the person working at the park if he will accept it. Which is wrong, is should be accepted by law or not.

[jdinasia]

I agree it should not be arbitrary.

Again VAT is not the source of funding for the National parks.

Did anyone read the article?

[stevenl]

Edit! I mean parks charge non Thai nationals a Thai persons daily wage.

VAT is paid by anyone who buys anything here. Maybe i could be spending 2 million baht a year living here, so that is a lot of tax. (I don't by the way!)

Yes the driving license works, but it's up to the person working at the park if he will accept it. Which is wrong, is should be accepted by law or not.

Isn't the fact that many things are not laid down in a law but more flexible one of the attractions of Thailand?

[jdinasia]

Tiered pricing is not unusual. Happens all the time in many countries. India, Honduras, Russia, Indonesia, etc.

Here's an interesting discussion about it:

http://www.brendansadventures.com/should-tourist-pay-more-than-locals-at-tourist-attractions/

Congrats to the EU for making this illegal. Though I did find this a bit interesting:

http://www.the-colosseum.net/around/visit.htm

PRICE FOR THE TICKET TO COLOSSEO, FORO ROMANO and PALATINO valid 2 days:

ADULTS € 12,00

REDUCED FEE € 7,50 for European Union members between 18 and 24 years old

FREE ENTRANCE for persons under 18 and over 65 years old from the European Union

FREE TICKETS (from the website http://archeoroma.beniculturali.it/en/free-tickets)

Are eligible for free tickets, upon presentation of suitable documents:

- European Union citizens 17 and under and 65 and over (minor visitors under 12 must be accompanied)

You left out the US... Your sarcasm covered the EU quite nicely though!

Note that non UK residents may not tour Big Ben at all for any price.

[craigt3365]

Tiered pricing is not unusual. Happens all the time in many countries. India, Honduras, Russia, Indonesia, etc.

Here's an interesting discussion about it:

http://www.brendansadventures.com/should-tourist-pay-more-than-locals-at-tourist-attractions/

Congrats to the EU for making this illegal. Though I did find this a bit interesting:

http://www.the-colosseum.net/around/visit.htm

PRICE FOR THE TICKET TO COLOSSEO, FORO ROMANO and PALATINO valid 2 days:

ADULTS € 12,00

REDUCED FEE € 7,50 for European Union members between 18 and 24 years old

FREE ENTRANCE for persons under 18 and over 65 years old from the European Union

FREE TICKETS (from the website http://archeoroma.beniculturali.it/en/free-tickets)

Are eligible for free tickets, upon presentation of suitable documents:

- European Union citizens 17 and under and 65 and over (minor visitors under 12 must be accompanied)

You left out the US... Your sarcasm covered the EU quite nicely though!

Note that non UK residents may not tour Big Ben at all for any price.

I did a simple google search on "foreigner price tourist attraction"...or something like that. I just linked to what showed up on the first page or two. Didn't go past that. Not sure where the sarcasm comes from?

Tiered pricing is a fact world wide...one way or another.

[jdinasia]

The sarcasm was your illegal remark about the EU and proof that they do indeed do it.

It was something I was admired

[jdinasia]

The sarcasm was your illegal remark about the EU and proof that they do indeed do it.

It was something I was admired

My personal experience in the US last month showed it to be true there.

[ericthai]

Just carry on Thailand - fleece all those foreigners that made you and when you all sit at the table ordering the food you thought some foreigner would pay don't be surprised when that foreigner doesn't turn up. Then enjoy your old rice for that is all that is left - and well deserved

Some of you guys have no idea about Thailand. You think Thailand would close up and fail if there was no Tourism? No it will not, tourism is only about 7% of it's GDP. Thailand is heavily industrialized. Exports is about 75% of it's GDP. Also Thailand will still have tourism for a long long time. All the problems in the last few years with protests coups etc and they has not scared away tourists anything less than a full out war will stop them. China has opened up and sending plane loads of tourists to Thailand.

Not correct. Most economists agree that it is really closer to 13% of the total economy. That is alot of money. And there is some debate about whether or not that figure includes all peripheral areas like airlines (both domestic and international), airports, trains, buses, mini vans, border runs, local restaurants that cater at least partially to tourists and the expat population, guest houses, hotels, apartment rentals, condo sales, villa sales, car sales, motorbike sales, bakeries, department stores, grocery stores, medical insurance and patronage of hospitals, clinics, etc, etc. How do you calculate the amount of money the ex-pat sector alone contributes to the economy?

And if you do not think that all the problems of the past few years have effected tourism, you might want to have a chat with some local hotel GMs. It has. For certain. To what extent is debatable, but it has had, and continues to have a serious impact on the economy.

OK say it is 13%, it still would not shut the country down. As stated Thailand manufactures and exports so many products. I worked as an Electrical engineer around South east Asia and mainly Thailand for almost 20 years. Thailand is very strong. I never realized how big the industrial section was until I started working at so many factories. I'm not saying tourism is not important but it wont shut the country down as some people think that it is all Thailand has.

Also I agree tourism is down and Thailand took a hit, but you missed what I said. With everything that happened there are still allot of tourists that are still coming even though there was a coup, killings and bad press. So as I said I think other than full out war you will still have tourists coming to Thailand. Many of the hotels, restaurants etc are hurting due to over expansion in these markets. They are never completely full even during high season so when there is even a small drop in tourists they feel it.

[slipperx]

Just carry on Thailand - fleece all those foreigners that made you and when you all sit at the table ordering the food you thought some foreigner would pay don't be surprised when that foreigner doesn't turn up. Then enjoy your old rice for that is all that is left - and well deserved

Some of you guys have no idea about Thailand. You think Thailand would close up and fail if there was no Tourism? No it will not, tourism is only about 7% of it's GDP. Thailand is heavily industrialized. Exports is about 75% of it's GDP. Also Thailand will still have tourism for a long long time. All the problems in the last few years with protests coups etc and they has not scared away tourists anything less than a full out war will stop them. China has opened up and sending plane loads of tourists to Thailand.

Not correct. Most economists agree that it is really closer to 13% of the total economy. That is alot of money. And there is some debate about whether or not that figure includes all peripheral areas like airlines (both domestic and international), airports, trains, buses, mini vans, border runs, local restaurants that cater at least partially to tourists and the expat population, guest houses, hotels, apartment rentals, condo sales, villa sales, car sales, motorbike sales, bakeries, department stores, grocery stores, medical insurance and patronage of hospitals, clinics, etc, etc. How do you calculate the amount of money the ex-pat sector alone contributes to the economy?

And if you do not think that all the problems of the past few years have effected tourism, you might want to have a chat with some local hotel GMs. It has. For certain. To what extent is debatable, but it has had, and continues to have a serious impact on the economy.

OK say it is 13%, it still would not shut the country down. As stated Thailand manufactures and exports so many products. I worked as an Electrical engineer around South east Asia and mainly Thailand for almost 20 years. Thailand is very strong. I never realized how big the industrial section was until I started working at so many factories. I'm not saying tourism is not important but it wont shut the country down as some people think that it is all Thailand has.

Also I agree tourism is down and Thailand took a hit, but you missed what I said. With everything that happened there are still allot of tourists that are still coming even though there was a coup, killings and bad press. So as I said I think other than full out war you will still have tourists coming to Thailand. Many of the hotels, restaurants etc are hurting due to over expansion in these markets. They are never completely full even during high season so when there is even a small drop in tourists they feel it.

What is the percentage - you can guess - of companies that are Thai only without any foreign investment - which was, partly, my original point? I agree Thailand has an industrial base but the point is whether it is Thai only industry or whether there is actually a huge foreign input to that

[jdinasia]

BTW ... Since I wasn't getting off my bike.. Sarika was free today.

[jdinasia]

well that's more national parks I won't be visiting! Why do you discriminate against foreigners, makes absolutely no sense to me or many other foreigners who have also said they won't visit national parks because of the disparity pricing based on skin color!

Based on nationality.. Not skin color.

if it is based on nationality then that is racism. My Nationality is Australian (Aboriginal decent) and they charge me more so that is blatantly racist because of my ancestry.

I can only say that I hope you are not a teacher!!!!!

No not a teacher why, do you have something against aboriginals being teachers? Are these jobs reserved for you white racist types?

Nope

They should be reserved for people that know the difference between nationality and race.

[spidermike007]

Tiered pricing is not unusual. Happens all the time in many countries. India, Honduras, Russia, Indonesia, etc.

Here's an interesting discussion about it:

http://www.brendansadventures.com/should-tourist-pay-more-than-locals-at-tourist-attractions/

Congrats to the EU for making this illegal. Though I did find this a bit interesting:

http://www.the-colosseum.net/around/visit.htm

PRICE FOR THE TICKET TO COLOSSEO, FORO ROMANO and PALATINO valid 2 days:

ADULTS € 12,00

REDUCED FEE € 7,50 for European Union members between 18 and 24 years old

FREE ENTRANCE for persons under 18 and over 65 years old from the European Union

FREE TICKETS (from the website http://archeoroma.beniculturali.it/en/free-tickets)

Are eligible for free tickets, upon presentation of suitable documents:

- European Union citizens 17 and under and 65 and over (minor visitors under 12 must be accompanied)

That is NOT tiered pricing. That is simply a discount being offer to the young, the students, and the elderly. A decent thing to do. There is no discrimination whatsoever being shown toward foreigners by the Europeans. Also no lack of respect, as they constantly show here in the LOS. The government here has no respect for foreigners, and they show it all the time with these completely idiotic policies, that are completely lacking in vision and wisdom. When Thailand was a dirt poor nation 60 or 70 years ago, and many of the local population suffered from diseases, hunger, and severe poverty, there may have been some justification for charging more to foreigners. But, things have changed alot, and the policies here have not kept up with the changes, due to ignorant politicians.

Edited October 13, 2014 by spidermike007

[stevenl]

That is NOT tiered pricing. That is simply a discount being offer to the young, the students, and the elderly. A decent thing to do. There is no discrimination whatsoever being shown toward foreigners by the Europeans. Also no lack of respect, as they constantly show here in the LOS. The government here has no respect for foreigners, and they show it all the time with these completely idiotic policies, that are completely lacking in vision and wisdom. When Thailand was a dirt poor nation 60 or 70 years ago, and many of the local population suffered from diseases, hunger, and severe poverty, there may have been some justification for charging more to foreigners. But, things have changed alot, and the policies here have not kept up with the changes, due to ignorant politicians.

"That is NOT tiered pricing. That is simply a discount being offer to the young, the students, and the elderly." and the citizens of the EU.

[spidermike007]

That is NOT tiered pricing. That is simply a discount being offer to the young, the students, and the elderly. A decent thing to do. There is no discrimination whatsoever being shown toward foreigners by the Europeans. Also no lack of respect, as they constantly show here in the LOS. The government here has no respect for foreigners, and they show it all the time with these completely idiotic policies, that are completely lacking in vision and wisdom. When Thailand was a dirt poor nation 60 or 70 years ago, and many of the local population suffered from diseases, hunger, and severe poverty, there may have been some justification for charging more to foreigners. But, things have changed alot, and the policies here have not kept up with the changes, due to ignorant politicians.

"That is NOT tiered pricing. That is simply a discount being offer to the young, the students, and the elderly." and the citizens of the EU.

Yes. The discounts are only offered to EU members. But the important part is that adults from other nations are charged the same as from the EU. Not discriminatory.

[Mario2008]

2 flame posts removed.

[White Christmas13]

I don't know if any of you guys ever been to Perth WA and visited Kings Park

Just named as one of the best parks in the world and guess what, there

is no entrance fee what's so ever for anybody

[stevenl]

That is NOT tiered pricing. That is simply a discount being offer to the young, the students, and the elderly. A decent thing to do. There is no discrimination whatsoever being shown toward foreigners by the Europeans. Also no lack of respect, as they constantly show here in the LOS. The government here has no respect for foreigners, and they show it all the time with these completely idiotic policies, that are completely lacking in vision and wisdom. When Thailand was a dirt poor nation 60 or 70 years ago, and many of the local population suffered from diseases, hunger, and severe poverty, there may have been some justification for charging more to foreigners. But, things have changed alot, and the policies here have not kept up with the changes, due to ignorant politicians.

"That is NOT tiered pricing. That is simply a discount being offer to the young, the students, and the elderly." and the citizens of the EU.

Yes. The discounts are only offered to EU members. But the important part is that adults from other nations are charged the same as from the EU. Not discriminatory.

Please reread what you're saying 'adults from other nations are charged the same as from the EU. Not discriminatory.' Of course they are discriminating, in this case between people living in the EU and people living outside the EU because some adults from the EU pay 7,50 Euro, others 12 Euro. And follow the provided link and you will find many more EU people who can enter for free, none non_EU people.

Same as Thais are discriminating between people living in Thailand and people not living in Thailand.

Oh, and you're forgetting the discounts to the young and the elderly, thereby discriminating the rest.

Did you know BTW that in the parks where this thread is about, Similans and Surin national marine parks, hardly ever presents himself in person at the park to pay the park fees? Nearly everybody goes here on a tour, so the agents collect the fees and pay these to the parks. And guess what, there is no price difference between Thais and foreigners for the tours here.

Edited October 13, 2014 by stevenl

[belg]

if the general wants happiness in this country, the national parks SHOULD BE FREE FOR ALL

[Spaniel]

if the general wants happiness in this country, the national parks SHOULD BE FREE FOR ALL

I don't know if you're joking or not but I'll assume you're serious. I don't think they should be free. The money for the upkeep of the parks has to come from somewhere and the admission price collected from those who use the park is the best choice. I think the big argument here is the two tier pricing system not that the parks should be free.

[jdinasia]

if the general wants happiness in this country, the national parks SHOULD BE FREE FOR ALL

Free for all Thai people you mean, I assume.