Ebola outbreak: Second Texas health worker 'tests positive'

[JDGRUEN]

1 Texas Ebola patient will move to Atlanta

The first Dallas health care worker with Ebola, Nina Pham, is in "improved condition today," and the second Dallas health care worker with Ebola is "ill but clinically stable," CDC Director Dr. Tom Frieden said Wednesday. Frieden said it's still to be determined whether Pham will be transferred to another facility; Frieden earlier said the second patient will be transferred to Emory University Hospital.

http://www.click2houston.com/lifestyle/health/nurses-slam-texas-hospital-for-no-ebola-plan/29135524

[F430murci]

Yes very disconcerting that hospital workers contracted Ebola, not because of outbreak or pandemic concerns. My heart goes out to people that work in the health care industry and harmed while helping people.

Hard to tell if some of you guys are reveling in the fact more are contracting Ebola to feed some personal want or desires or are just scarred it may impact you. I am saddened by the health care workers going through this while trying to care for some piece of <deleted> from a piece of <deleted> country that shouldn't be here in the first place.

RE: outbreak and pandemic fears

The fact remains that none of 48 exposed to Duncan while he was sick between the first and second trips to the hospital have contracted Ebola. Zero. Not family in apartment with Duncan, not the judge giving them a ride, not the police and paramedicas entering the apartment and etc.

2 of the 77 health care workers involved in Dumcan's care have contracted Ebola. That sucks and it is unclear whether contraction was due to not taking appropriate precautions or if appropriate precautions failed. Some of you banging on CDC and pronouncing airborne are a bit inconsistent on this point.

If airborne, everyone it that apartment with Duncan would be sick by now.

Agree with first half of your posting.

Any idea which stage of Duncan's care this second nurse was present and risked exposure? I recall the first nurse was there on the last day and post mortem?

Ofcourse, the virus multiplies from the moment it enters the host; I wouldn't be surprised if the ebola virus is found to multiply so rapidly at some point in its life cycle and it becomes so concentrated that two things occur-- the first is the obvious onset of death and immediately prior to death becoming airborne in respirations and coughing attacks. This would account for Duncan's family not testing positive while nursing staff did.

Or as JD has pointed out about the claim the patient's room was also used to store Duncan's "waste", its possible it resulted in heavy enough concentration to emit airborne particulates. In other words, if healthcare workers PPE prevented any chance of skin-to-skin contact or skin-to-object-to-skin vector then you have to accept airborne risk.

I recall the nurses were wearing face shields but those are not airtight. Does anyone know if goggles or safety glasses were worn under faceshields?

At this point, I could care less what anyone says about mode of transmission. I will accept airborne or extreme cause for concern as plausible when rate of transmission suggests such a mechanism. That is why I read both sides and try to form my own conclusions after disregarding hysteria, fruit loops, CYA explanations and political rhetoric.

Right now we have 2 out of 125 monitored contacts with many having a very high level of unprotected exposure. The 48 personal contacts are getting close to the all clear stage. If this number starts to increase dramatically for the community acquired contacts, my level of concern will start to rise from simply concerned to potentially worried or scared.

Perhaps I stepped into some ongoing argument you are having with some other poster? Regardless, my post was not intended to provoke but only to ask for clarity.

All I know is what you have yourself stated, that numerous individuals that were exposed to Duncan in the early stages of his infection and who were not wearing any PPE to wit, have not become infected. I also know that two nurses who were exposed to Duncan in the later stages of his infection while wearing full hospital PPE and practicing some amount of HazMat protocol have become infected.

I also know that the original claim that the nurse was responsible for her own exposure by not following protocol has now been withdrawn as an incorrect assumption. It also appears the CDC and hospital staff are still in a learning stage as to how virulent Ebola is and what modes of transmission are possible.

It is of zero concern to me if someone wants to become worried or scared. I just like to be informed so I come here to listen to intelligent posters like yourself and others. Without a confirmed method of transmission and a provable failure of nurses to follow HazMat protocols then airborne vector of transmission can not be ruled out.

Cheers

I apparently just come across too crass. Bad habit of being blunt and direct I suppose which is the way I practice law.

I do see you as being objective and weighing all sides.

Were the nurses is full protective gear? Some on here post reports that they were not and had no idea as to what precautions to follow.

I am open to other means of transmission when facts, not hysteria, bear that out. I am focusing more on rate of transmission and not speculation about what health care workers did or didn't do to catch it because WE don't know.

I take everything I read and hear with skepticism. I get the competing interests and, having represented nurses since 1998 under CNA insurance E&O nurse policies, I "get it" when we get their Union statements and view those statements with skepticism based on what is really driving that ship.

None of our resident experts here explain why none of the 48 exposed to Duncan prior to his second hospital trip and while he symptomatic and puking have Ebola if it is airborne or so dang contagious.

What we do get is a bunch of breitbart type stuff that tends to distort facts or politicize everything.

[F430murci]

Nightmare on USA Street ... as if it couldn't get worse...

2nd health care worker with Ebola flew from Cleveland to Dallas on Frontier Airlines the day before presenting symptoms, according to CDC, Frontier - @NBCNews

http://www.breakingnews.com/item/2014/10/15/2nd-health-care-worker-with-ebola-flew-from-clevel/

"Nightmare on USA Street ... as if it couldn't get worse... "

Do you have any idea how this sounds. Zombie apocalyptic like. Wow!!! And you are a scientist or work in the health care industry?!? Yep, that is certainly how they usually talk . . .

Edited October 15, 2014 by F430murci

[ClutchClark]

Agree with first half of your posting.

Any idea which stage of Duncan's care this second nurse was present and risked exposure? I recall the first nurse was there on the last day and post mortem?

Ofcourse, the virus multiplies from the moment it enters the host; I wouldn't be surprised if the ebola virus is found to multiply so rapidly at some point in its life cycle and it becomes so concentrated that two things occur-- the first is the obvious onset of death and immediately prior to death becoming airborne in respirations and coughing attacks. This would account for Duncan's family not testing positive while nursing staff did.

Or as JD has pointed out about the claim the patient's room was also used to store Duncan's "waste", its possible it resulted in heavy enough concentration to emit airborne particulates. In other words, if healthcare workers PPE prevented any chance of skin-to-skin contact or skin-to-object-to-skin vector then you have to accept airborne risk.

I recall the nurses were wearing face shields but those are not airtight. Does anyone know if goggles or safety glasses were worn under faceshields?

At this point, I could care less what anyone says about mode of transmission. I will accept airborne or extreme cause for concern as plausible when rate of transmission suggests such a mechanism. That is why I read both sides and try to form my own conclusions after disregarding hysteria, fruit loops, CYA explanations and political rhetoric.

Right now we have 2 out of 125 monitored contacts with many having a very high level of unprotected exposure. The 48 personal contacts are getting close to the all clear stage. If this number starts to increase dramatically for the community acquired contacts, my level of concern will start to rise from simply concerned to potentially worried or scared.

Perhaps I stepped into some ongoing argument you are having with some other poster? Regardless, my post was not intended to provoke but only to ask for clarity.

All I know is what you have yourself stated, that numerous individuals that were exposed to Duncan in the early stages of his infection and who were not wearing any PPE to wit, have not become infected. I also know that two nurses who were exposed to Duncan in the later stages of his infection while wearing full hospital PPE and practicing some amount of HazMat protocol have become infected.

I also know that the original claim that the nurse was responsible for her own exposure by not following protocol has now been withdrawn as an incorrect assumption. It also appears the CDC and hospital staff are still in a learning stage as to how virulent Ebola is and what modes of transmission are possible.

It is of zero concern to me if someone wants to become worried or scared. I just like to be informed so I come here to listen to intelligent posters like yourself and others. Without a confirmed method of transmission and a provable failure of nurses to follow HazMat protocols then airborne vector of transmission can not be ruled out.

Cheers

I apparently just come across too crass. Bad habit of being blunt and direct I suppose which is the way I practice law.

I do see you as being objective and weighing all sides.

Were the nurses is full protective gear? Some on here post reports that they were not and had no idea as to what precautions to follow.

I am open to other means of transmission when facts, not hysteria, bear that out. I am focusing more on rate of transmission and not speculation about what health care workers did or didn't do to catch it because WE don't know.

I take everything I read and hear with skepticism. I get the competing interests and, having represented nurses since 1998 under CNA insurance E&O nurse policies, I "get it" when we get their Union statements and view those statements with skepticism based on what is really driving that ship.

None of our resident experts here explain why none of the 48 exposed to Duncan prior to his second hospital trip and while he symptomatic and puking have Ebola if it is airborne or so dang contagious.

What we do get is a bunch of breitbart type stuff that tends to distort facts or politicize everything.

Dangit, I had to look up breitbart. Nice one.

I am also skeptical of "Union"statements as much as I am "Hospital" statements. Both have agendas.

You have pretty much summed up the big questions:

1) Why aren't the 48 persons exposed to Duncan prior to 2nd hospital visit showing symptoms of exposure?

2) Why are two healthcare professionals exposed later to Duncan, the patient, testing positive for Ebola infection?

I will be less concerned about the risk of Ebola when I am back in the good 'ol USofA.

I don't like being in a population center like BKK. I have great respect for Thai nurses; however the limited financial resources available to Thai hospitals concerns me.

I am hopeful to be stateside within 10 days.

Cheers

Edited October 15, 2014 by ClutchClark

[MJP]

^^ Clarkey,

Likely reasons:

1. Method of PPE decontamination, removal and disposal;

2. Cleaning and wastes disposal, contact with contaminated surfaces after the patient has been moved or has passed away (I think this is highly likely);

3. Inadequate respiratory protection, the virus being airborne within microscopic water droplets.

Remember the medical personnel become covered with vomit and faeces, confined space environments with high viral loads.

[NeverSure]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

So where are Obama and the director of the CDC who promised this would be contained and there would be no outbreak? Now they can't even contain it inside a hospital for 2 employees?

I've read Obama's speech at the CDC and found no such promises. Perhaps you'd be so kind as to link us to them?

What I did find him saying was this:

Now, here’s the hard truth: In West Africa, Ebola is now an epidemic of the likes that we have not seen before. It’s spiraling out of control. It is getting worse. It’s spreading faster and exponentially. Today, thousands of people in West Africa are infected. That number could rapidly grow to tens of thousands. And if the outbreak is not stopped now, we could be looking at hundreds of thousands of people infected, with profound political and economic and security implications for all of us.

That sounds like the opposite of "promised this would be contained and there would be no outbreak".

So where are Obama and the director of the CDC who promised this would be contained and there would be no outbreak? Now they can't even contain it inside a hospital for 2 employees?

Yep. Another Fox News viewer strikes again. He has never said he would contain it nor has he ever promised he can keep it out of America. Now instead of jumping on the "blame it on Obama train " you should think how you could form your own opinion without the aid of Fox News and Co.

Obama said on NBC's Meet The Press

(Hardly a conservative media outlet.)

By Laura Barron-Lopez - 09/07/14 11:42 AM EDT

"President Obama said Americans should not be worried about an outbreak of Ebola in the U.S. in the near future.

"Americans shouldn't be concerned about the prospects of contagion here in the United States, short term," Obama said on NBC's "Meet the Press." "Because this is not an airborne disease."

Obama stressed that the disease can only be transmitted through bodily fluids. And once the person carrying it is isolated and run through a tight protocol, it isn't difficult to contain."

NOW we have two health workers who got in from an isolated patient.

LINK

Over to you guys...

Edited October 15, 2014 by NeverSure

[MJP]

On BBC Radio 4 this afternoon, report of a person who called NHS Direct saying they'd returned from West Africa and had Ebola like symptoms . . . we're told to drive to a hospital.

I don't think either the US or UK is in the least bit prepared in reality for Ebola and that's what could create the situation in which the virus establishes a foothold.

[Loptr]

very strange to say the least - weren't the workers briefed about what they were cleaning up?

Apparently not...

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2014/10/15/Nurses-We-Were-Told-to-Call-Authorities-for-Ebola-Protocol

A statement from National Nurses United on the treatment of Dallas Ebola patient said that “nurses were asked to call the Infectious Disease Department” to learn the policies on how to treat Duncan.

[Credo]

It's a tropical-type disease and is well out of the comfort zone for Western countries to deal with. I would guess that they will get up to speed on protocols, but it will take time. Hopefully, not enough time for it to cause an epidemic in any other countries.

[JDGRUEN]

This report is pending further verification... but it is reported by both news media teams below that Nurse Vinson did communicate with the CDC and the reports indicate or imply that she was given an okay to fly by someone at the CDC.. This is contrary to earlier reports. We will see in forthcoming reports if these reports bear out... It is possible that Nurse Vinson heard what she wanted to hear.

**************************************************************************

CDC OK'd Ebola patient to fly ahead of Frontier Airlines flight

DALLAS (AP) – Officials with the CDC confirmed with FOX 4 Wednesday that they told Ebola patient and Dallas health worker Amber Vinson it was safe for her to fly Monday. Vinson had called and asked if it was OK to fly since she had a low grade fever at the time.

http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/26793235/ebola-patient-recently-flew-on-frontier-airlines

*************************************************************************************************************

CDC: Ebola Patient Traveled By Air With “Low-Grade” Fever

CBS News Medical Correspondent Dr. John LaPook reports that Vinson called the CDC several times before boarding the plane concerned about her fever. “This nurse, Nurse Vinson, did in fact call the CDC several times before taking that flight and said she has a temperature, a fever of 99.5, and the person at the CDC looked at a chart and because her temperature wasn’t 100.4 or higher she didn’t officially fall into the category of high risk.”

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2014/10/15/ebola-patient-traveled-day-before-diagnosis/

[kdw512]

With the number of tourists arriving in Thailand daily, and with high season coming up, I wonder if there are screenings taking place at the airports. I also wonder IF, to protect tourism, hospitals or Thai authorities will be (are) keeping quiet about ebola cases...

[bkkcanuck8]

With the idiots in charge right now it might be time to begin worrying. Might have to reclassify the United States as a 3rd world country based on their ability to manage outbreaks of disease. Which means if they eventually close borders to ebola countries, the US would have to be included - since my confidence in the US being able to implement proper protocols is rapidly evaporating....

[JDGRUEN]

This report is pending further verification... but it is reported by both news media teams below that Nurse Vinson did communicate with the CDC and the reports indicate or imply that she was given an okay to fly by someone at the CDC.. This is contrary to earlier reports. We will see in forthcoming reports if these reports bear out... It is possible that Nurse Vinson heard what she wanted to hear.

**************************************************************************

CDC OK'd Ebola patient to fly ahead of Frontier Airlines flight

DALLAS (AP) – Officials with the CDC confirmed with FOX 4 Wednesday that they told Ebola patient and Dallas health worker Amber Vinson it was safe for her to fly Monday. Vinson had called and asked if it was OK to fly since she had a low grade fever at the time.

http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/26793235/ebola-patient-recently-flew-on-frontier-airlines

*************************************************************************************************************

CDC: Ebola Patient Traveled By Air With “Low-Grade” Fever

CBS News Medical Correspondent Dr. John LaPook reports that Vinson called the CDC several times before boarding the plane concerned about her fever. “This nurse, Nurse Vinson, did in fact call the CDC several times before taking that flight and said she has a temperature, a fever of 99.5, and the person at the CDC looked at a chart and because her temperature wasn’t 100.4 or higher she didn’t officially fall into the category of high risk.”

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2014/10/15/ebola-patient-traveled-day-before-diagnosis/

**************************************************************************************************************

UPDATE to My Earlier Post.... a NBC Dallas affiliate NBCDFW.com reports...

"Vinson was not told that she could not fly," the government spokesperson told NBC News.

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Ebola-Patient-Contacted-CDC-Before-Flight-Agency-Says-279365622.html

[zydeco]

With the idiots in charge right now it might be time to begin worrying. Might have to reclassify the United States as a 3rd world country based on their ability to manage outbreaks of disease. Which means if they eventually close borders to ebola countries, the US would have to be included - since my confidence in the US being able to implement proper protocols is rapidly evaporating....

And, then, Obama's work would be done.

[catweazle]

Ebola + Bath Salts =

[BadBouy]

Maybe now is the time for the countries not permitted travels from the United States

Mr O is tricking Canadians and Mexicans into building fences, he's a Nobel prize winner Don't ya know!

[Chicog]

1 Texas Ebola patient will move to Atlanta

The first Dallas health care worker with Ebola, Nina Pham, is in "improved condition today," and the second Dallas health care worker with Ebola is "ill but clinically stable," CDC Director Dr. Tom Frieden said Wednesday. Frieden said it's still to be determined whether Pham will be transferred to another facility; Frieden earlier said the second patient will be transferred to Emory University Hospital.

http://www.click2houston.com/lifestyle/health/nurses-slam-texas-hospital-for-no-ebola-plan/29135524

The Daily Mail is positively foaming at the mouth over this bloke... under the headline "Who's the idiot with the clipboard"?

[bangon04]

I was call a wag by a member who I respect I want him and other to know I only want to protect mankind

Ban travels from USA to prevent the spread of Ebola

Remember Harry only went to the 3rd grade but he has street smarts

Harry - it means a person who makes jokes... I think he was just kidding, and I don't think he meant any harm by it at all...in fact just the opposite

Great Thanks

But what happens if 50 cases in America is the EU countries going to accept fights from America?

My guess is that Japan will be the first to overreact....

[bangon04]

This report is pending further verification... but it is reported by both news media teams below that Nurse Vinson did communicate with the CDC and the reports indicate or imply that she was given an okay to fly by someone at the CDC.. This is contrary to earlier reports. We will see in forthcoming reports if these reports bear out... It is possible that Nurse Vinson heard what she wanted to hear.

**************************************************************************

CDC OK'd Ebola patient to fly ahead of Frontier Airlines flight

DALLAS (AP) Officials with the CDC confirmed with FOX 4 Wednesday that they told Ebola patient and Dallas health worker Amber Vinson it was safe for her to fly Monday. Vinson had called and asked if it was OK to fly since she had a low grade fever at the time.

http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/26793235/ebola-patient-recently-flew-on-frontier-airlines

*************************************************************************************************************

CDC: Ebola Patient Traveled By Air With Low-Grade Fever

CBS News Medical Correspondent Dr. John LaPook reports that Vinson called the CDC several times before boarding the plane concerned about her fever. This nurse, Nurse Vinson, did in fact call the CDC several times before taking that flight and said she has a temperature, a fever of 99.5, and the person at the CDC looked at a chart and because her temperature wasnt 100.4 or higher she didnt officially fall into the category of high risk.

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2014/10/15/ebola-patient-traveled-day-before-diagnosis/

**************************************************************************************************************

UPDATE to My Earlier Post.... a NBC Dallas affiliate NBCDFW.com reports...

"Vinson was not told that she could not fly," the government spokesperson told NBC News.

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Ebola-Patient-Contacted-CDC-Before-Flight-Agency-Says-279365622.html

Logical really - for a nurse who had specific duties treating a highly infectious patient, a disease which has an estimated incubation period of 2-21 days, a nurse who reported her symptoms promptly and asked for advice, then of course the advice should be - yes you are perfectly ok to take a crowded budget flight across the us to visit your family and friends. What could possibly go wrong? Protocols are perfect...

Edited October 16, 2014 by bangon04

[JDGRUEN]

This report is pending further verification... but it is reported by both news media teams below that Nurse Vinson did communicate with the CDC and the reports indicate or imply that she was given an okay to fly by someone at the CDC.. This is contrary to earlier reports. We will see in forthcoming reports if these reports bear out... It is possible that Nurse Vinson heard what she wanted to hear.

**************************************************************************

CDC OK'd Ebola patient to fly ahead of Frontier Airlines flight

DALLAS (AP) Officials with the CDC confirmed with FOX 4 Wednesday that they told Ebola patient and Dallas health worker Amber Vinson it was safe for her to fly Monday. Vinson had called and asked if it was OK to fly since she had a low grade fever at the time.

http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/26793235/ebola-patient-recently-flew-on-frontier-airlines

*************************************************************************************************************

CDC: Ebola Patient Traveled By Air With Low-Grade Fever

CBS News Medical Correspondent Dr. John LaPook reports that Vinson called the CDC several times before boarding the plane concerned about her fever. This nurse, Nurse Vinson, did in fact call the CDC several times before taking that flight and said she has a temperature, a fever of 99.5, and the person at the CDC looked at a chart and because her temperature wasnt 100.4 or higher she didnt officially fall into the category of high risk.

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2014/10/15/ebola-patient-traveled-day-before-diagnosis/

**************************************************************************************************************

UPDATE to My Earlier Post.... a NBC Dallas affiliate NBCDFW.com reports...

"Vinson was not told that she could not fly," the government spokesperson told NBC News.

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Ebola-Patient-Contacted-CDC-Before-Flight-Agency-Says-279365622.html

Logical really - for a nurse who had specific duties treating a highly infectious patient, a disease which has an estimated incubation period of 2-21 days, a nurse who reported her symptoms promptly and asked for advice, then of course the advice should be - yes you are perfectly ok to take a crowded budget flight across the us to visit your family and friends. What could possibly go wrong? Protocols are perfect...

The CDC Director Frieden had previously said she should fly or have flown ... when interviewed ... he was apparently not aware that some lower level CDC worker - took the call - read a temperature chart and we don't know exactly what he or she said to Nurse Vinson... but the nurse took it to mean she could fly to Cleveland... and may well have been correct in her assessment of what she was told... You can bet there will be some backtracking... I also bet who ever it was that talked to Nurse Vinson ... is going to get transferred to some walrus surveillance station in Alaska soon.

[manarak]

very strange to say the least - weren't the workers briefed about what they were cleaning up?

Apparently not...

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2014/10/15/Nurses-We-Were-Told-to-Call-Authorities-for-Ebola-Protocol

A statement from National Nurses United on the treatment of Dallas Ebola patient said that “nurses were asked to call the Infectious Disease Department” to learn the policies on how to treat Duncan.

This is gross negligence if not not worse.

I sympathize with medical personnel when genuine errors are made, but this wasn't an error.

They need to find out who failed to take appropriate measures at the hospital and heads should roll.

[sauvagecheri]

So what about the president Ebama sending 1000 American soldiers in Liberia?Or was it 3000?Without medical training,don't they risk contracting infections,and bringing the virus back home en masse?

Are they going to "fight" the disease and shoot it?

Or is it a preelection show?

[MJP]

So what about the president Ebama sending 1000 American soldiers in Liberia?Or was it 3000?Without medical training,don't they risk contracting infections,and bringing the virus back home en masse?

Are they going to "fight" the disease and shoot it?

Or is it a preelection show?

It was 3000. I would hope there's a quarantine process for those returning.

[bkkcanuck8]

They should implement an intermediate quarantine on health-care workers that are responsible for treating ebola patients.

Move the patients into isolation immediately, preferably away from city centres - i.e. buy a rural warehouse and install hospital equipment. Restrict the number of those that caring for the patient (not 70 per patient). The medical staff goes through some sort of intermediate quarantine (i.e. quarantined for at least 2 weeks after the end of treatment - then allowed to continue monitoring at home). Pay the health care workers that volunteer for it pay for quarantine and danger pay.

[zydeco]

They should implement an intermediate quarantine on health-care workers that are responsible for treating ebola patients.

Move the patients into isolation immediately, preferably away from city centres - i.e. buy a rural warehouse and install hospital equipment. Restrict the number of those that caring for the patient (not 70 per patient). The medical staff goes through some sort of intermediate quarantine (i.e. quarantined for at least 2 weeks after the end of treatment - then allowed to continue monitoring at home). Pay the health care workers that volunteer for it pay for quarantine and danger pay.

Many health workers are devoted to their profession. But if you make them work under those conditions (self imposed quarantine while treating ebola and official quarantine afterwards) most will not do it. You can't pay them enough. They will walk. BTW, does this include the physicians? I'll guarantee you that the number willing to work like that will be miniscule. You'll need to draft them into the military and order them to go.

[bkkcanuck8]

They should implement an intermediate quarantine on health-care workers that are responsible for treating ebola patients.

Move the patients into isolation immediately, preferably away from city centres - i.e. buy a rural warehouse and install hospital equipment. Restrict the number of those that caring for the patient (not 70 per patient). The medical staff goes through some sort of intermediate quarantine (i.e. quarantined for at least 2 weeks after the end of treatment - then allowed to continue monitoring at home). Pay the health care workers that volunteer for it pay for quarantine and danger pay.

Many health workers are devoted to their profession. But if you make them work under those conditions (self imposed quarantine while treating ebola and official quarantine afterwards) most will not do it. You can't pay them enough. They will walk. BTW, does this include the physicians? I'll guarantee you that the number willing to work like that will be miniscule. You'll need to draft them into the military and order them to go.

You will be able to find health-care workers to work in those conditions IF you make it worth their while. 1 month on + big danger pay bonuses / 1 month off.

You have doctors that go into remote locations to work, not much difference. Again, you do it through market mechanisms and not force - so there is no reason to walk.

The number you need to do this is miniscule.... unless you don't control the situation through extraordinary measures.

I would prefer paying a lot for a few patients, than get a bulk discount

Edited October 16, 2014 by bkkcanuck8

[bkkcanuck8]

Many health workers are devoted to their profession. But if you make them work under those conditions (self imposed quarantine while treating ebola and official quarantine afterwards) most will not do it. You can't pay them enough. They will walk. BTW, does this include the physicians? I'll guarantee you that the number willing to work like that will be miniscule. You'll need to draft them into the military and order them to go.

To continue with this thought. I have two sisters that work in the civil service, both of them have taken dangerous postings - even though they are not junior and don't need it. They were also not the only ones applying for posts that were dangerous.

My eldest sister took a posting in Iraq during the worst period of the war (before 2008 - aka Bush era). She would arrive at the airport, fly in a helicopter which would take on fire from ground positions - have to wear a flak-jacket..... live in mobile homes in the green-zone (think the work building was an old palace). Live there - when random incoming mortars would be targeting the area (luckily they were not overly accurate). Lots of people will do work in adverse conditions if they feel a duty to their work, and feel that someone has their back (she had 3 or 4 former SAS as personal security). Yes, she received danger pay - and R&R because it was a combat zone (6 paid R&R periods per year).

My youngest sister was posted to Afghanistan, which although less dangerous she was eager to apply for.

So I have no doubt that you could find enough staff to apply for those positions (doctors and nurses) as long as they felt someone had their back and they were well rewarded for it.

[hawker9000]

So what about the president Ebama sending 1000 American soldiers in Liberia?Or was it 3000?Without medical training,don't they risk contracting infections,and bringing the virus back home en masse?

Are they going to "fight" the disease and shoot it?

Or is it a preelection show?

3900, and he's circulating a draft executive order authorizing call-up of the National Guard... (I'd include a link for the naysayers, but it's too easily Googled.)

[MJP]

Number of Ebola cases doubling every four weeks: WHO

The World Health Organization (WHO) says the number of Ebola infections in West Africa is doubling every four weeks despite efforts to stop the spread of the deadly virus.

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/10/16/382486/ebola-cases-doubling-every-four-weeks/

[hawker9000]

Number of Ebola cases doubling every four weeks: WHO

The World Health Organization (WHO) says the number of Ebola infections in West Africa is doubling every four weeks despite efforts to stop the spread of the deadly virus.

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/10/16/382486/ebola-cases-doubling-every-four-weeks/

I'm also reading about the concern of possible spread to neighboring Ivory Coast. I'd have never guessed this, but their population is apparently equal to Liberia, Sierra Leone, and Guinea all put together, which is why they're worried. If it ever got a foothold there...