Since the August crackdown date, what reports of problems are there

[oldthaihand99]

Since the August crackdown date, what reports of problems are there, if any, for people from countries that qualify for a visa exempt 30 days on arrival in Thailand's airports, such as in being questioned or denied entry?

Since the August crackdown date, what reports of problems are there, if any, for people from countries that qualify for a visa exempt 30 days on arrival in Thailand's airports, such as in being questioned or denied entry?

As ubonjoe mentioned above already: Only someone doing repeated back-to-back visa exempt entries could be questioned and possibly refused entry.

Back to back? What does that mean, in & out the same day? Out for 2, 3, 7, 14, 30 days? Out for 3 months in every 6?

If i enter on a 30 day exempt, then extend & stay 29 days more, then attempt to get another 30 days visa exempt [out-in] on the same day, is that "back to back" visa exempts even though there was 29 days in between them?

So "repeated back to back...could" lead to problems. What about just "back to back" without repeating it more than once?

Edited October 30, 2014 by oldthaihand99

[ubonjoe]

For one thing the crackdown started in May. Nothing changed in August other than the starting to enforce the guidelines for exempt entries at the airport.

Their have been lots to topics about this.

[oldthaihand99]

For one thing the crackdown started in May. Nothing changed in August other than the starting to enforce the guidelines for exempt entries at the airport.

Their have been lots to topics about this.

Hence my post's reference to August & airports.

I haven't seen any topics started after the August date or reports since then of a single person being denied entry due to "back to back" visa exempts. Such reports might help to clarify the precise meaning or enforcement of "back to back".

So "back to back" visa exempts are a no no, but there is no decree saying people can't do "back to back" with tourist visas? So those who were living in the country on a series of the former will now switch to the latter. Is there a point to all this? More fees coming in? Higher quality tourists?

Edited October 31, 2014 by oldthaihand99

[jacksam]

Oldthaihand.....im on your page. I have done numerous stamps. My thing was to travel for week every month to Vietnam. Loved it. Anyway with the perceived changes to stamps I decided to get a tourist multiple entry.

Point is I have been waiting for ONE member with similar history to mine being refused stamp at airport.

[OJAS]

Not sure whether this constitutes a "problem", but I have seen several reports on here of retirement or marriage extension applicants being required by their local offices since May to sign new forms confirming their awareness of the penalties for overstaying. However, I was most certainly not asked by my local office (Rayong/Maptaput) to sign any such forms when I applied for my latest retirement extension in July, and I gather from a fellow TV member who lives in Chiang Mai that neither was he when he applied for his latest marriage extension!

[sandrew33]

A mate of mine, British, who runs a business outside Thailand in UK/China was "hassled" by immigration at Swampy last night on arrival from HK.

He has been into BKK 8 times this year variously from 6 days to 26 days for a total of about 80 days for the year - so he's kinda like a fly in/fly out oil and gas worker. He was told last night by immigration that he's allowed only 6 visa exempt entries per annum and he's over that, so next time he comes without a visa he'll be refused. It appears though that nothing was written in his passport.

As previously stated, I come in once a month from overseas and do the equivalent of almost a 14/14 rotation .. So 12 exemptions per annum. I've never been asked anything ...

Could just be unlucky?

[sandrew33]

A bit more info. When he presented his passport, he was told he'd been tagged as a "visa runner" and he was taken out to a room out the back. He had been outside Thailand for 19 days but he flew in with his Thai GF who had flown to meet him in HK.

Because he has business in Asia he has been here on his earlier trips and mid trip done a "few" 2 day busibess trips to HK, Malaysia, Singapore. But not to extend an exempt trip.

So it'd be a total 20 day trip with, say, 2 days in HK in the middle. This time though it's straight from HK after 19 days in UK.

I assume the few 2 day trips in and out on exemption earlier in year got him tagged. He explained all this to a more senior official who joined them in the room but they "didn't want to listen and just told me to get visa before next trip" and then let him through.

[Fab5BKK]

Came back to BKK on Wednesday afternoon...

No queue @ immigration...

Lots of Thai stamps in my passport...

No problem!

BTW, I've got visa + extensions + multi re-entry permits ;-)

Sorry for reporting a non-event

[falang07]

good to hear that no queue @ immigration, seems like the tourism authority was (again) telling the "truth" that tourism is recovering, as usual

[oldthaihand99]

A mate of mine, British, who runs a business outside Thailand in UK/China was "hassled" by immigration at Swampy last night on arrival from HK.

He has been into BKK 8 times this year variously from 6 days to 26 days for a total of about 80 days for the year - so he's kinda like a fly in/fly out oil and gas worker. He was told last night by immigration that he's allowed only 6 visa exempt entries per annum and he's over that, so next time he comes without a visa he'll be refused. It appears though that nothing was written in his passport.

As previously stated, I come in once a month from overseas and do the equivalent of almost a 14/14 rotation .. So 12 exemptions per annum. I've never been asked anything ...

Could just be unlucky?

Following is another report, this time at Phuket, where immigration says something similar, that the rule is 6 via visa exempt entries allowed per year. It was posted today. With extensions a person could therefore stay the entire year in Thailand, minus the time out of country on so-called "visa runs".

"Just went through immigration a few days ago in Phuket (I guess this applies nationwide), the officer looks at the arrival form you fill, if you have no visa and you have multiple Thai stamps in your passport he calls the supervisor, this happened quite often, many times I saw them coming and checking, including me."

"A guy ahead of me pulled out and then back to the desk after a quick chat with the supervisor. We talked before and after he said he comes twice a year and he told him that and all was OK."

"Later it was my turn, I quickly turn the page to my exit stamp 1. 5 year ago and showed it to the supervisor and he waved me on and to the desk. They just come around behind the desk or on the side and check."

"Later I asked him what was the criteria / point when he would not permit entry, with his broken English he finally understood what I was saying and said no more than "6 entries per year". I guess they feel you could stay 6 month with 6 entries so that would not be acceptable. This is fair enough I think, even UK (and many countries) has restriction of 6 months limit on tourist visas. Though I am not sure what would happen if you go for visa run, I heard they sometime take you to the office and then you have to "negotiate" before letting you pass !"

Edited October 31, 2014 by oldthaihand99

[paz]

Following is another report, this time at Phuket, where immigration says something similar, that the rule is 6 via visa exempt entries allowed per year. It was posted today.

There is no such rule. It has been repealed Nov. 2008 after being in effect 2 years.

http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/doc/temporarystay/policy778-2551_en.pdf

[oldthaihand99]

Following is another report, this time at Phuket, where immigration says something similar, that the rule is 6 via visa exempt entries allowed per year. It was posted today.

There is no such rule. It has been repealed Nov. 2008 after being in effect 2 years.

http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/doc/temporarystay/policy778-2551_en.pdf

Sure, you posted that the other day, yet the rule is still coming out of the immigration officer's mouths. And they have the power to enforce it.

I suppose one could print that out & show it to the immigration officer, or better yet a copy written in Thai, but i'm not sure what good it would do. Any of you guys here want to give it a try & report back here how it goes? ;

What should be the next course of action, when they are escorting you off to a private room, till you are deported out of the country? And things are written in your passport to inform immigration in case you ever try to come again.

[paz]

Sure, you posted that the other day, yet the rule is still coming out of the immigration officer's mouths. And they have the power to enforce it.

I suppose one could print that out & show it to the immigration officer, or better yet a copy written in Thai, but i'm not sure what good it would do. Any of you guys here want to give it a try & report back here how it goes? ;

What should be the next course of action, when they are escorting you off to a private room, till you are deported out of the country? And things are written in your passport to inform immigration in case you ever try to come again.

You have been repeatedly scaremongering about something with no grounds whatsoever. For example, there is Oil and Gas workers coming visa exempt every other months since years, without a problem. Whatever a rogue officer says is no general rule.

If it about yourself you can behave as you please, but you must avoid spreading uncertainty. You have been corrected already many times by moderators and you should learn from that.

[oldthaihand99]

Sure, you posted that the other day, yet the rule is still coming out of the immigration officer's mouths. And they have the power to enforce it.

I suppose one could print that out & show it to the immigration officer, or better yet a copy written in Thai, but i'm not sure what good it would do. Any of you guys here want to give it a try & report back here how it goes? ;

What should be the next course of action, when they are escorting you off to a private room, till you are deported out of the country? And things are written in your passport to inform immigration in case you ever try to come again.

You have been repeatedly scaremongering about something with no grounds whatsoever. For example, there is Oil and Gas workers coming visa exempt every other months since years, without a problem. Whatever a rogue officer says is no general rule.

Scaremongering? Nonsense, i'm interested in the truth. Are you trying to suppress it.

Re "every other month", what's your point? That means 6 times in a year, which is exactly what the immigration officers above stated. Moreover this thread isn't about years gone by, but since a date in August 2014.

Edited October 31, 2014 by oldthaihand99

[paz]

Scaremongering? Nonsense, i'm interested in the truth. Are you trying to suppress it.

Re "every other month", so what's your point? That means 6 times in a year, which is exactly what the immigration officers above stated.

I'm not trying to suppressing anything, I couldn't even if I wanted. There is zero reports about trouble, anyone can see that.

Again, there is no regulation about the number of allowed visa exempt entries. To further expand on O&G workers, there are ones on 14/14 rotation, than makes 12 entries for year.

Edited October 31, 2014 by paz

[oldthaihand99]

To further expand on O&G workers, there are ones on 14/14 rotation, than makes 12 entries for year.

Then they would only be in Thailand half the year, or 6 months in 12.

This thread isn't about being allowed in in years gone by, but since an announced crackdown date in August 2014.

[paz]

Then they would only be in Thailand half the year, or 6 months in 12.

This thread isn't about being allowed in in years gone by, but since an announced crackdown date in August 2014.

I'm referring to state of things "right now". You can ask in the O&G forum.

[oldthaihand99]

Then they would only be in Thailand half the year, or 6 months in 12.

This thread isn't about being allowed in in years gone by, but since an announced crackdown date in August 2014.

I'm referring to state of things "right now". You can ask in the O&G forum.

Compare posts 6-7 of this thread for the same type of travel pattern of in & outs:

"He was told last night by immigration that he's allowed only 6 visa exempt entries per annum and he's over that, so next time he comes without a visa he'll be refused."

Also, not to scare anyone, but we don't want our heads stuck in the sand, though the following thread is much more suited to halloween horror flicks:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/765275-immigration-at-suvarnaphumi-refused-to-give-visa-on-arrival/page-1

Additionally, BTW, i've read reports of a couple of embassys using their powers to deny tourist visas based on a similar rule they cited, namely 6 months in 12 allowed, no more.

[oldthaihand99]

Following is another report, this time at Phuket, where immigration says something similar, that the rule is 6 via visa exempt entries allowed per year. It was posted today.

There is no such rule. It has been repealed Nov. 2008 after being in effect 2 years.

http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/doc/temporarystay/policy778-2551_en.pdf

That repeal is irrelevant to what the immigration officers recently stated re 6 entries in 12 months. What was repealed was an entirely different rule re a 3 month maximum limit in 6.

Of course immigration officers need to interpet & apply the present rules, which are "general" as you stated, in practical ways for them to be useful. Evidently at least a number of them are ready to enforce a new rule, namely 6 entries in 12 months.

[paz]

That repeal is irrelevant to what the immigration officers recently stated re 6 entries in 12 months. What was repealed was an entirely different rule re a 3 month maximum limit in 6.

Of course immigration officers need to interpet & apply the present rules, which are "general" as you stated, in practical ways for them to be useful. Evidently at least a number of them are ready to enforce a new rule, namely 6 entries in 12 months.

No. That is your opinion only, not backed by facts and reports. Again, confirmation is that O&G workers enter on 14/14 rotation. And please do not counter again with that is "just 6 months in country".

Only repeated, back-to-back visa exempt entries can cause questioning and refusal.

Edited November 1, 2014 by paz

[ubonjoe]

Following is another report, this time at Phuket, where immigration says something similar, that the rule is 6 via visa exempt entries allowed per year. It was posted today.

There is no such rule. It has been repealed Nov. 2008 after being in effect 2 years.

http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/doc/temporarystay/policy778-2551_en.pdf

That repeal is irrelevant to what the immigration officers recently stated re 6 entries in 12 months. What was repealed was an entirely different rule re a 3 month maximum limit in 6.

Of course immigration officers need to interpet & apply the present rules, which are "general" as you stated, in practical ways for them to be useful. Evidently at least a number of them are ready to enforce a new rule, namely 6 entries in 12 months.

There is no such rule. Only an officer stating something that is not a rule. If you can find such a rule please post it.

This from the guidelines that immigration has sent out for exempt entries.

"1.2.2 The alien must not enter the Kingdom by exploiting 30-day visa exemptions undertaking method “in-out” or called by foreigners as “Visa run”. Aliens use the advantage of Tourist Visa Exemption by leaving Thailand and returning immediately for the purpose of extending their stay, which is considered from the tourism point of view to be longer than necessary and not in line with the purpose permitted while entering country."

ImmigratioNotice4-English_PDF (1).pdf

[sandrew33]

That repeal is irrelevant to what the immigration officers recently stated re 6 entries in 12 months. What was repealed was an entirely different rule re a 3 month maximum limit in 6.

Of course immigration officers need to interpet & apply the present rules, which are "general" as you stated, in practical ways for them to be useful. Evidently at least a number of them are ready to enforce a new rule, namely 6 entries in 12 months.

No. That is your opinion only, not backed by facts and reports. Again, confirmation is that O&G workers enter on 14/14 rotation. And please do not counter again with that is "just 6 months in country".

Only repeated, back-to-back visa exempt entries can cause questioning and refusal.

Sorry, I'm roughly a 14/14 guy and I've not had a problem but my mate - who I posted about in this thread on Friday - most certainly did. He has less visits per year than me and he stays less days than me.

He had just flown in from HK after 19 days in the UK (and a couple in HK). He said he'd been flagged as an in/out visa runner, which he simply isn't, was taken out to a back room where he was advised that next time he came he must have a visa or he'd be denied entry.

He was also told about the 6 visa exempts per annum.

I agree with you there is no such law. I agree that this crackdown is focused on visa runners BUT this example, which I've discussed with him further since I posted, causes me some concern. He's a well off business man with no activity in Thailand. He's absent for long periods and has never done a visa run in his life. It's weird ...

[paz]

Sorry, I'm roughly a 14/14 guy and I've not had a problem but my mate - who I posted about in this thread on Friday - most certainly did. He has less visits per year than me and he stays less days than me.

He had just flown in from HK after 19 days in the UK (and a couple in HK). He said he'd been flagged as an in/out visa runner, which he simply isn't, was taken out to a back room where he was advised that next time he came he must have a visa or he'd be denied entry.

He was also told about the 6 visa exempts per annum.

I agree with you there is no such law. I agree that this crackdown is focused on visa runners BUT this example, which I've discussed with him further since I posted, causes me some concern. He's a well off business man with no activity in Thailand. He's absent for long periods and has never done a visa run in his life. It's weird ...

The incident occurred to your friend is regrettable but does not indicate a rule or a generalized policy, as your own experience indicate.

There are even posts of people that was extorted money at BKK airport to be allowed entry. These are relatively rare but do happen, there are rogue officers and if one runs in one of them they can cause grief for no valid reason.

Edited November 1, 2014 by paz

[oldthaihand99]

That repeal is irrelevant to what the immigration officers recently stated re 6 entries in 12 months. What was repealed was an entirely different rule re a 3 month maximum limit in 6.

Of course immigration officers need to interpet & apply the present rules, which are "general" as you stated, in practical ways for them to be useful. Evidently at least a number of them are ready to enforce a new rule, namely 6 entries in 12 months.

No. That is your opinion only, not backed by facts and reports. Again, confirmation is that O&G workers enter on 14/14 rotation. And please do not counter again with that is "just 6 months in country".

Only repeated, back-to-back visa exempt entries can cause questioning and refusal.

That is merely your opinion, just one of several possible theories to explain the reports, one of several possible interpretations of the mere "guidelines", not rules, and not what they say word for word.

For all we know immigration is already widely applying an unwritten 6 entries a year rule & the 14/14 reports are an exception to it, as is the case described in posts 6-7 of this thread which detail another exception to the rule. Rules generally have exceptions as this one has.

It is a rule supported by at least 2 separate witnesses in 2 different airport locations. Do you think they just pulled it out of the air & it was blind luck they both said exactly the same thing [rhetorical question].

[paz]

That is merely your opinion, just one of several possible theories to explain the reports, one of several possible interpretations of the mere "guidelines", not rules, and not what they say word for word.

For all we know immigration is already widely applying an unwritten 6 entries a year rule & the 14/14 reports are an exception to it, as is the case described in posts 6-7 of this thread which detail another exception to the rule. Rules generally have exceptions as this one has.

It is a rule supported by at least 2 separate witnesses in 2 different airport locations. Do you think they just pulled it out of the air & it was blind luck they both said exactly the same thing [rhetorical question].

You are now climbing on mirrors with exceptions and stuff to prove your point. Since you've already received the answers, and all the people that should be in country is, I will refrain from replying again to you.

[mngmn]

Sorry, I'm roughly a 14/14 guy and I've not had a problem but my mate - who I posted about in this thread on Friday - most certainly did. He has less visits per year than me and he stays less days than me.

He had just flown in from HK after 19 days in the UK (and a couple in HK). He said he'd been flagged as an in/out visa runner, which he simply isn't, was taken out to a back room where he was advised that next time he came he must have a visa or he'd be denied entry.

He was also told about the 6 visa exempts per annum.

I agree with you there is no such law. I agree that this crackdown is focused on visa runners BUT this example, which I've discussed with him further since I posted, causes me some concern. He's a well off business man with no activity in Thailand. He's absent for long periods and has never done a visa run in his life. It's weird ...

The incident occurred to your friend is regrettable but does not indicate a rule or a generalized policy, as your own experience indicate.

There are even posts of people that was extorted money at BKK airport to be allowed entry. These are relatively rare but do happen, there are rogue officers and if one runs in one of them they can cause grief for no valid reason.

This happened to me last night at Don Muang. I was told the limit is 6 entries. Any advice on what to do? Especially if I encountered a rogue officer. Is there an avenue of appeal or does one need to talk to Prayut directly?

Try to keep my sense of humour but in reality I was quite shocked at being told I cannot come back again unless I get a visa.

[sandrew33]

Sorry, I'm roughly a 14/14 guy and I've not had a problem but my mate - who I posted about in this thread on Friday - most certainly did. He has less visits per year than me and he stays less days than me.

He had just flown in from HK after 19 days in the UK (and a couple in HK). He said he'd been flagged as an in/out visa runner, which he simply isn't, was taken out to a back room where he was advised that next time he came he must have a visa or he'd be denied entry.

He was also told about the 6 visa exempts per annum.

I agree with you there is no such law. I agree that this crackdown is focused on visa runners BUT this example, which I've discussed with him further since I posted, causes me some concern. He's a well off business man with no activity in Thailand. He's absent for long periods and has never done a visa run in his life. It's weird ...

The incident occurred to your friend is regrettable but does not indicate a rule or a generalized policy, as your own experience indicate.

There are even posts of people that was extorted money at BKK airport to be allowed entry. These are relatively rare but do happen, there are rogue officers and if one runs in one of them they can cause grief for no valid reason.

This happened to me last night at Don Muang. I was told the limit is 6 entries. Any advice on what to do? Especially if I encountered a rogue officer. Is there an avenue of appeal or does one need to talk to Prayut directly?

Try to keep my sense of humour but in reality I was quite shocked at being told I cannot come back again unless I get a visa.

Any more info? How long were you outside thailand? Any 1-3 day trips that might look like Visa Runs? Anything?

On the appeal thing, the IM officer and their boss have a fair bit of power and I'm not sure that being right would actually help you much

[mngmn]

Sorry, I'm roughly a 14/14 guy and I've not had a problem but my mate - who I posted about in this thread on Friday - most certainly did. He has less visits per year than me and he stays less days than me.

He had just flown in from HK after 19 days in the UK (and a couple in HK). He said he'd been flagged as an in/out visa runner, which he simply isn't, was taken out to a back room where he was advised that next time he came he must have a visa or he'd be denied entry.

He was also told about the 6 visa exempts per annum.

I agree with you there is no such law. I agree that this crackdown is focused on visa runners BUT this example, which I've discussed with him further since I posted, causes me some concern. He's a well off business man with no activity in Thailand. He's absent for long periods and has never done a visa run in his life. It's weird ...

The incident occurred to your friend is regrettable but does not indicate a rule or a generalized policy, as your own experience indicate.

There are even posts of people that was extorted money at BKK airport to be allowed entry. These are relatively rare but do happen, there are rogue officers and if one runs in one of them they can cause grief for no valid reason.

This happened to me last night at Don Muang. I was told the limit is 6 entries. Any advice on what to do? Especially if I encountered a rogue officer. Is there an avenue of appeal or does one need to talk to Prayut directly?

Try to keep my sense of humour but in reality I was quite shocked at being told I cannot come back again unless I get a visa.

Any more info? How long were you outside thailand? Any 1-3 day trips that might look like Visa Runs? Anything?

On the appeal thing, the IM officer and their boss have a fair bit of power and I'm not sure that being right would actually help you much

Posted the details here http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/774944-new-rule-limiting-the-number-of-30-day-visa-exemption-entries-to-six-only/ to a fair chorus of incredularity (and some abuse).

This really happened! Am beginning to feel not much help is available on this forum. Will just need to accept their decision and work around it aye?

[paz]

This really happened! Am beginning to feel not much help is available on this forum. Will just need to accept their decision and work around it aye?

What help do you expect from an Internet forum beside information ? In this case the information is not available because it's a new issue.

Anyway you're not the first and not the last being given an hard time and then eventually let in. At Don Mueang especially.