webfact Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Bangkok's bus fleet procurement: why Scania, Volvo opt outScania has demonstrated its ED95 bus on the streets of Bangkok in an unsuccessful attempt to persuade the BMTA to switch to more environmentally-friendly and sustainable ethanol-fueled vehicles. Photo: King Mongkut’s University of Technology Thonburi.BANGKOK: -- The deadline for the submission of tenders to supply Bangkok Mass Transit Authority (BMTA) with a new fleet of 3,183 buses, was finally scheduled for January 2015. Conspicuously absent from the race to secure the orders worth about THB28.9 billion to deliver natural gas-fueled public transport vehicles will be two major Swedish bus manufacturers, Scania and Volvo.Lack of transparency in the drafting of the project’s terms of reference and multiple subsequent revisions by the BMTA did not bode well for the Scandinavian manufacturers of high-quality bus chassis and their bus assembly partners. The on-again, off-again procurement project had been dragged on for over eight years.Politicians, who had supervisory control over the financially-ailing Bangkok city bus agency, did not seem to be able to agree on the simple task of drawing up a coherent and clear-cut TOR to ensure a fair bidding process. A process that would produce winners capable of delivering brand new city buses which are cost-effective to operate, meet high environmental standards and provide comfort to passengers.Not to mention the fact that dubious changes made during the drafting and subsequent multiple revisions made to the TOR also gave rise to widely-publicized allegations that the whole procurement process has been rigged in favour of certain manufacturers.Senior executives of both Scania and Volvo, in separate interviews with ScandAsia, stopped short of pointing an accusing finger at anyone. But both Scania Siam and Volvo Truck & Bus Co., Ltd. gave a number of compelling reasons why they have decided to opt out.Mr. Phuriwat Rak-Intr, General Manager of Scania Siam Co., Ltd., said Scania Siam had been invited to a series of public hearings and present Scania bus products that met all the basic requirements, such as NGV-fueled powerhouses, low-floor bus chassis.“We had full confidence in our products,” the Scania Siam executive said, adding that at that time the draft TOR was still more than a bit hazy.Scania had held several meetings with the BMTA with the Swedish Embassy acting as a facilitator, following an official visit to Sweden by then-prime minister Yingluck Shinawatra in August 2013.“When the TOR came out following a series of public hearings, we found ourselves facing insurmountable barriers. We could not go on,” Phuriwat said.The TOR, among other things, requires bidders to have prior experience in Thailand, meaning having their products in use in this country on commercial basis, while at the same having prior experience providing repair and maintenance services on the said products, the Scania Siam general manager said.“Scania never had NGV product in the Thai market before. But we have had our high quality city bus products, including those with NGV-fueled engines elsewhere, in Europe, for instance. Apparently that doesn’t qualify us to participate in this bidding process,” he said.Phuriwat also said the median prices specified by the BMTA at THB4.5 million for air-conditioned, low-floor bus and THB3.8 million for regular, non-air-conditioned bus, are way too low for Scania Siam, which offers high quality bus products, to participate.The Scania Siam executive lamented the fact that the BMTA clearly does not put enough emphasis on environmental standards or quality and reliability issues. The TOR does not specifically require quantifiable up-time and reliability, nor does it refer to high environmental standards as key criteria, he said.“To appreciate the kind of value that Scania bus products have to offer, we challenge BMTA to look at total life cycle cost, which is the purchasing price plus fuel cost and maintenance cost over, say 10 or 15 years,” Phuriwat said. “The price of our finished city bus products that meet international emission standards, high fuel-efficiency, high up-time and durability would be in the tune of THB6.5 million.”Scania city bus products, which meet the highest environmental standards, fuel-efficiency, reliability and durability, are popular among bus operators all over the world. In Asia, Singapore and Malaysia, city bus operators have purchase big fleets of Scania buses.“Another thing we would like to tell the Thai public is: we have on offer cutting-edge technologies, including a diesel engine Scania bus running on ED95 (95% sugarcane or cassava ethanol plus an ignition improver). This could hugely benefit Thailand, which has great potential as producer of ethanol, which is a more environmentally friendly than diesel and more economical and sustainable than imported natural gas,” Phuriwat said, “If only Thailand had a more coherent national energy policy.”Scania had been so hopeful of its fighting chance to supply the BMTA with its bus running on ED95 as alternative to natural gas that it sponsored a pilot projects in June and July 2011 and in mid-2013 to demonstrate the viability of its products in Bangkok together with King Mongkut’s University of Technology Thonburi, the Energy Ministry, Industry Ministry and PTT. But its hope was dashed when BMTA insisted in the TOR that initial purchase price of buses is to be the overriding factor.A sales manager of Volvo Group’s Truck and Bus (Thailand) Co., Ltd., who is familiar with the BMTA bidding process, echoed Phuriwat’s sentiments, saying the specified low median prices were a major factor that prevented Volvo from competing.“The TOR that the BMTA came up with made it impossible for high quality European manufacturers to participate. We simply cannot compete at those price points.”Besides, the sales manager said Volvo had very few natural gas-fueled bus products as the company has concentrated its efforts in developing mainly diesel-fueled bus products that conform to the highest environmental credentials, from Euro 4, 5 and 6 emission standards and diesel/electric hybrid models or fully electric ones.“Volvo Truck and Bus is not familiar with the bidding process that makes us feels like we have to compete with others to lower prices in order to get the contract. We would prefer submitting sealed bid and then to negotiate specifications with the buyer,” he said.Source: http://scandasia.com/bangkoks-bus-fleet-procurement-why-scania-volvo-opt-out/-- ScandAsia 2014-12-15 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Stradavarius37 Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 ..... 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post clockman Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 Not enough brown envelopes. Nothing to do with the best choice! 17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post worgeordie Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 They will be buying Chinese made crap,as it will be more about "commissions",than getting the best bus for the job. regards Worgeordie 34 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExPratt Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Volvo can't really complain if they didn't fit the brief. The problem is in many Asian countries is they know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. If the price for the contract is as low a Volvo and Scania think it is then the other tender bids must be lower quality Materials 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ricklev Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) Yes, those yellow Chinese buses on the streets now turned into rolling pieces of shit within a year. Loud and uncomfortable seats with the worst shocks of any bus I've ever been in. Shame that they are likely to buy more of them. Edited December 15, 2014 by ricklev 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post WhizBang Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 Quality is never high on the agenda in Thailand. It is all about the brown envelopes. 13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huahinjoe Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 its about time to replace those many decade old smoky buses poising the bangkok population everyday... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKKBrit Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Delighted to see our Scandinavian friends throwing some light on the way in the which public TORs are manipulated here....but it will be wasted because of who the BMA is. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Loles Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 So, the Chinese wreck comes as usually .... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post tomyummer Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) They don't know how to draw up TOR's or contracts or anything legal. Never follows them anyways. They only know how to collect their portion of commissions. Too bad for Thailand but good on Scania and Volvo for not partaking in the corrupt system. Edited December 15, 2014 by tomyummer 18 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post jpeg Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 And so, once again the Thai citizenry loses out, this time on essential quality public transport due to corruption. There really is NO hope for this country, none 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caveat Emptor Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 China is pressuring Taiwan to rejoin the Motherland and Thailand can't wait to rush into their arms on every front. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kartman Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Maybe it will be a fleet of MB Citaro's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artisi Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 You get what you pay for (less the graft content of course which comes off the top), you want high quality you pay - you want crap, pay less. It's the decision of the buyer entirely - simply based on brown envelopes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorecard Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Where's the NACC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExPratt Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Wait for the rail project tendering, This part of the world instead of using one uniform track components system , they'll use several different systems, Each man at the top has his own "Sponsorship deal" with each manufacturer , so if they use several different ones they will all get their money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FangFerang Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Fire engines! Buses! Blimps! Lions, tigers and bears! Oh My!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samsensam Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 remember the fire trucks? probably still sitting in a field somewhere... the majority suffers so a few can benefit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FangFerang Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Nice to see the NACC has things well under control. A new bid round could have been run now -- the entire procurement mechanism got at least that far, but sorry, no new buses without lots of tea money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Politicians, who had supervisory control over the financially-ailing Bangkok city bus agency, did not seem to be able to agree on the simple task of drawing up a coherent and clear-cut TOR to ensure a fair bidding process. Loosely translated: "Politicians don't want a fair bidding process". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inzman Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Scandia is a sore loser. They don't make the product Thailand is requesting, "Cng/NGV powered", so they trash the buyer. I wonder does Volvo make a Cng buss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CantSpell Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) Politicians, who had supervisory control over the financially-ailing Bangkok city bus agency, did not seem to be able to agree on the simple task of drawing up a coherent and clear-cut TOR to ensure a fair bidding process. Loosely translated: "Politicians don't want a fair bidding process". 30% of "brown" out of 3000 buses priced at 4M THB each is 4 Billions THB in the envelop.... Around 100 Mils $ , enough to secure a lot of new mia noi... They don't want a fair bidding, fair and transparent process, fair TOR; they just want their fair share of that brown.... Edited December 15, 2014 by CantSpell 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupatria Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Once again Thailand: welcome to the real world! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Johnnie99 Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 Scandia is a sore loser. They don't make the product Thailand is requesting, "Cng/NGV powered", so they trash the buyer. I wonder does Volvo make a Cng buss? Goodness. Are you even reading the same story as the rest of us? 23 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ezzra Posted December 15, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2014 It has to do a lot with China-Thailand trade balance and investments and mutual ass kissing of each other than how good really Volvo and Scandia are, there is no argument that those buses put any other bus brand to shame, but this is more about politics than safety and common sense... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masuk Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 remember the fire trucks? probably still sitting in a field somewhere... the majority suffers so a few can benefit. Tell us about the fire trucks please. I'm curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bongoz Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 remember the fire trucks? probably still sitting in a field somewhere... the majority suffers so a few can benefit. Tell us about the fire trucks please. I'm curious. They are sitting in a field somewhere... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muratremix Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Imagine Chinese-made Bus crash in Thailand, a real massacre. We all know how strong chinese made cars (Cherry?) from NCAP yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwyn Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Thailand expect to buy eco friendly ac buses at 4.5 mill baht? The price of a decent car, they are mad. The proviso that bidders have to have product already operational in Thailand is basically limiting competition to the manufacturers of the <deleted> already on the streets. Nice way to ensure the brown envelopes keep coming I guess because the Swedes won't be interested in bribing their way into this contract Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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