French man found dead in Koh Tao – incident being treated as suicide not homicide

[Gerard052]

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

You tie your hands round your front and then step through them - after 12 hours of drinking it's simple.

Lol, really. I would love to see someone tie their hands together WITHOUT any drinks. Everyone thinks it's easy so someone please do a reenactment and make a video to show how simple it is and post it on here. If you can do it, please have a few beer and try it again. If you can do it still, have a few more beer and try it again.

Then we can compare the knots to the one around this guy's hands. Keep in mind he was drinking for 12 hours.

Until then I call bullshit

I agree 100%.

[Thaiready]

In Merchant Marine school they teach to tie all knots behind your back. I just tied both arms behind my back moments ago. Not that hard.

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

that answers it......the victim was a former Merchant Marine.

[Gerard052]

In Merchant Marine school they teach to tie all knots behind your back. I just tied both arms behind my back moments ago. Not that hard.

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

And you managed to type on the PC as well. WOW lets all swan off to merchant marine school. Jim you must be a lonely man up there.

Excellent answer.

[johna]

In Merchant Marine school they teach to tie all knots behind your back. I just tied both arms behind my back moments ago. Not that hard.

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

Why would the Merchant Marine teach you to tie knots behind your back, and we know Dmitri learned these skills how??

It would depend on the type of knot, was it loose or tightly bound around his wrists.

[Jonmarleesco]

Conventional bungalows don't generally have balconies. And if he was hanging from any sort of railing, how - other than simply wrapping it around a few times - did he manage to to tie string around his hands? And why would he?

[Nemesis7]

no respect for the deceased even by the RTP

Who the hell on earth ever attempted to commit suicide with his hands tied on the back? and how the hell on earth you tie your hands at your back by self and later hang yourself????

There is a limit for everthing, but i guess this crosses everything.

[Dannybigboy]

No way he could have done this after a 12 hour drinking binge......tie his own hands and step thru.....No way. my friend is thin and about same height....we tried yeaterday and we were not even Close !!!

[fullcave]

In Merchant Marine school they teach to tie all knots behind your back. I just tied both arms behind my back moments ago. Not that hard.

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

Why would the Merchant Marine teach you to tie knots behind your back, and we know Dmitri learned these skills how??

It would depend on the type of knot, was it loose or tightly bound around his wrists.

Tying knots behind your back is NOT the same as tying your hands behind your back...

[Alwyn]

http://www.academia.edu/903627/Precautions_Taken_to_Avoid_Abandoning_the_Act_of_Hanging_and_Reducing_Pain_in_Suicidal_Hanging_Cases

This is quite interesting, it seems that people do elect to tie their hands before this method of suicide, bit graphic this link so if you don't want to look at dead bodies best not use it.

NO NOOOO this cant be.. Thaivisa detectives say its impossible.

After +12 hours of solid drinking, pretty much impossible..

[Alwyn]

RIP.. I am interested to know if again the suicide note was in English as it appears in the story? He was a Frenchman and Iris I'm guessing isn't Thai. Strange story which won't go any further now suicide has been called by the police team with equipment and skills that are so great the British police want them to visit and teach them (according to a past post here) BTW, aren't the British police due to release their findings today or tomorrow re the B2 case?

[biplanebluey]

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

I have already been through this.I personally think it not suicide,but as I have stated,it is possible to tie your hands in front of you and put a noose around your neck.Then you step through your tied hands and away you go.MUST REMEMBER TO STAND ON A CHAIR OR TABLE FIRST THOUGH

[sgtsabai]

People do commit suicide with their hands tied behind their back. Self bondage people tie their hands behind their backs. Ah, some go a little too far, case-Carradine in BKK. I saw some real sad pictures/films in our study of suicide vs homicide in New Mexico Law Enforcement Academy. This could be a suicide, but I don't think any of us have enough information to make a real conclusion. There are far too many "things" here that just don't add up. Was he on meds? Did he act depressed? If indeed he was standing on a railing, especially after all those hours of drinking, he would have had to have balanced himself quite well and long enough to put the noose, thanks for some info sabaitoo, over his head and tighten the knots, yes it can be done, while his hands are behind his back, tie one hand first then slip the other through a slip type knot that tightens itself and will not loosen. Ask the merchant marine, he is right. Perhaps our resident "island" trolls could demonstrate exactly how it could be done while they are defending their island murderers, oops, employers, oops again, fellow islanders, sorry 'bout that the computer ("P") did it. Would anybody in their right mind trust the RTP on this, especially the RTP on KT? There is a morgue and facilities to do a proper autopsy there?, maybe Ko Samui? I doubt it. Would you trust the KT RTP, the autopsy? I for one don't. I've never worked a hanging suicide, so no expert by any means there, but I damn sure worked suicide investigation, 7mm Mag in the mouth and out the back. I knew her, she was a friend. I picked up the burnt bones of a friend that did a "suicide by accident". Yea, and I know one hell of a lot more about death.

[ThaiUser]

Before we start to develop our own conclusions based on how much drink we had or how much we like or dislike Thai government agencies I would suggest to read a book edited by Michael Tsokos MD who is I quote “Professor Michael Tsokos is the Director of the Institute of Forensic Sciences and Legal Medicine, Charite – Universitatsmedizin Berlin, in Berlin, Germany.

He is also the Director of the Governmental Institute of Forensic and Social Medicine in Berlin, Germany. He is the primary or senior author of more than 200 scientific publications in international peer-reviewed journals and the author as well as editor of a number of books dealing with topics of forensic pathology.

I wonder what he would have to say about it when reading the comments made by the armchair police officers here on this forum or the hobby pathologists.

Michael Tsokos was here after the Tsunami hit Thailand working side by side with international teams and Thai pathologists to identify the victims. No criticism from his end but only praise for their abilities.

The book contains contributions from pathologists from around the world and even Asia, which might shock the TV commentators. Reading these publications one might find that stranger things have happened as someone tying his hands and placing his head through noose to commit suicide. But that wouldn’t go down to well on this forum, would it?

Instead of that one prefers to insult the RTP and declare Thai pathologists incompetent. I find that pathetic.

Edited January 5, 2015 by ThaiUser

[ThaiUser]

People do commit suicide with their hands tied behind their back. Self bondage people tie their hands behind their backs. Ah, some go a little too far, case-Carradine in BKK. I saw some real sad pictures/films in our study of suicide vs homicide in New Mexico Law Enforcement Academy. This could be a suicide, but I don't think any of us have enough information to make a real conclusion. There are far too many "things" here that just don't add up. Was he on meds? Did he act depressed? If indeed he was standing on a railing, especially after all those hours of drinking, he would have had to have balanced himself quite well and long enough to put the noose, thanks for some info sabaitoo, over his head and tighten the knots, yes it can be done, while his hands are behind his back, tie one hand first then slip the other through a slip type knot that tightens itself and will not loosen. Ask the merchant marine, he is right. Perhaps our resident "island" trolls could demonstrate exactly how it could be done while they are defending their island murderers, oops, employers, oops again, fellow islanders, sorry 'bout that the computer ("P") did it. Would anybody in their right mind trust the RTP on this, especially the RTP on KT? There is a morgue and facilities to do a proper autopsy there?, maybe Ko Samui? I doubt it. Would you trust the KT RTP, the autopsy? I for one don't. I've never worked a hanging suicide, so no expert by any means there, but I damn sure worked suicide investigation, 7mm Mag in the mouth and out the back. I knew her, she was a friend. I picked up the burnt bones of a friend that did a "suicide by accident". Yea, and I know one hell of a lot more about death.

As much as I like the opening sentences you make but the rest is nothing else as bashing the RTP and Thai pathologists. Trust me the majority of them do their job to their best of their abilities despite what is most of the time said on this forum.

[Lancashireman]

Police and physicians carried out an autopsy and believe the cause of death was asphyxiation, the case is being treated as a suicide and not as a homicide. The mans body has been taken to Koh Tao temple.

Why would they return the mans body to KT?

I would assume they did not perform the autopsy on the island.

.

Probably because the local proctologist did the autopsy, and Pancake Man catered the affair.

Proctologist, my arse. Maple syrup please...

[scorecard]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Police and physicians carried out an autopsy and believe the cause of death was asphyxiation, the case is being treated as a suicide and not as a homicide. The man’s body has been taken to Koh Tao temple.

Why would they return the mans body to KT?

I would assume they did not perform the autopsy on the island.

.

Probably because the local proctologist did the autopsy, and Pancake Man catered the affair.

And it's reported that the body is already at the temple.

Question: Any guesses how quick the burning will be?

[jlwilliamsjr18]

The writing is on the wall. Never piss off anyone, so bad they want you dead. Now that's suicidal.

[IAMHERE]

In Merchant Marine school they teach to tie all knots behind your back. I just tied both arms behind my back moments ago. Not that hard.

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

Now try it after drinking for about 12 hours, and climb over a balcony, and write a suicide note. Heck, wonder what his penmanship looked like after drinking all night.

[Lancashireman]

Before we start to develop our own conclusions based on how much drink we had or how much we like or dislike Thai government agencies I would suggest to read a book edited by Michael Tsokos MD who is I quote Professor Michael Tsokos is the Director of the Institute of Forensic Sciences and Legal Medicine, Charite Universitatsmedizin Berlin, in Berlin, Germany.

He is also the Director of the Governmental Institute of Forensic and Social Medicine in Berlin, Germany. He is the primary or senior author of more than 200 scientific publications in international peer-reviewed journals and the author as well as editor of a number of books dealing with topics of forensic pathology.

I wonder what he would have to say about it when reading the comments made by the armchair police officers here on this forum or the hobby pathologists.

Michael Tsokos was here after the Tsunami hit Thailand working side by side with international teams and Thai pathologists to identify the victims. No criticism from his end but only praise for their abilities.

The book contains contributions from pathologists from around the world and even Asia, which might shock the TV commentators. Reading these publications one might find that stranger things have happened as someone tying his hands and placing his head through noose to commit suicide. But that wouldnt go down to well on this forum, would it?

Instead of that one prefers to insult the RTP and declare Thai pathologists incompetent. I find that pathetic.

Educated and astute retort.

TV is awash with armchair amateur experts who seemingly enjoy their name in lights; nothing on upstairs, just a light.

[Lancashireman]

Before we start to develop our own conclusions based on how much drink we had or how much we like or dislike Thai government agencies I would suggest to read a book edited by Michael Tsokos MD who is I quote Professor Michael Tsokos is the Director of the Institute of Forensic Sciences and Legal Medicine, Charite Universitatsmedizin Berlin, in Berlin, Germany.

He is also the Director of the Governmental Institute of Forensic and Social Medicine in Berlin, Germany. He is the primary or senior author of more than 200 scientific publications in international peer-reviewed journals and the author as well as editor of a number of books dealing with topics of forensic pathology.

I wonder what he would have to say about it when reading the comments made by the armchair police officers here on this forum or the hobby pathologists.

Michael Tsokos was here after the Tsunami hit Thailand working side by side with international teams and Thai pathologists to identify the victims. No criticism from his end but only praise for their abilities.

The book contains contributions from pathologists from around the world and even Asia, which might shock the TV commentators. Reading these publications one might find that stranger things have happened as someone tying his hands and placing his head through noose to commit suicide. But that wouldnt go down to well on this forum, would it?

Instead of that one prefers to insult the RTP and declare Thai pathologists incompetent. I find that pathetic.

Educated and astute retort.

TV is awash with armchair amateur experts who seemingly enjoy their name in lights; nothing on upstairs, just a light.

[Aussieroaming]

insane outcome

[micmichd]

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

No problem if you know how to tie a sailor's knot.

[sambum]

Before we start to develop our own conclusions based on how much drink we had or how much we like or dislike Thai government agencies I would suggest to read a book edited by Michael Tsokos MD who is I quote “Professor Michael Tsokos is the Director of the Institute of Forensic Sciences and Legal Medicine, Charite – Universitatsmedizin Berlin, in Berlin, Germany.

He is also the Director of the Governmental Institute of Forensic and Social Medicine in Berlin, Germany. He is the primary or senior author of more than 200 scientific publications in international peer-reviewed journals and the author as well as editor of a number of books dealing with topics of forensic pathology.

I wonder what he would have to say about it when reading the comments made by the armchair police officers here on this forum or the hobby pathologists.

Michael Tsokos was here after the Tsunami hit Thailand working side by side with international teams and Thai pathologists to identify the victims. No criticism from his end but only praise for their abilities.

The book contains contributions from pathologists from around the world and even Asia, which might shock the TV commentators. Reading these publications one might find that stranger things have happened as someone tying his hands and placing his head through noose to commit suicide. But that wouldn’t go down to well on this forum, would it?

Instead of that one prefers to insult the RTP and declare Thai pathologists incompetent. I find that pathetic.

I (and probably all of the TV posters) am not doubting the qualifications of Dr Tsokos, or his assessment of the work carried out by the Thai pathologists after the Tsunami. However, there was probably not much doubt as to the cause of death in the majority of the Tsunami victims, suicide certainly not being one of them. In this particular case, most people doubt that it was suicide because of the victim's hands tied behind his back, and also the cuts present on the body. Most posters would probably agree that It would be POSSIBLE for the victim to have inflicted the cuts on himself, tied his hands behind his back, put his head through a noose and hung himself, but is it PROBABLE? Especially bearing in mind that he had been drinking for more than 12 hours previously, and the possibility of a drunk man being capable of the "step through" technique described in previous posts seems unlikely. Add to that, the botched up RTP investigations into the murders of the 2 English backpackers, the contamination of the crime scene, the contradictory statements put out by very high ranking police officers, dubious DNA findings/results, and numerous substantiated reports of corruption in the highest ranks of the RTP, is it any wonder that people are a bit cynical about any findings?

[lil fluffy clouds]

Before we start to develop our own conclusions based on how much drink we had or how much we like or dislike Thai government agencies I would suggest to read a book edited by Michael Tsokos MD who is I quote Professor Michael Tsokos is the Director of the Institute of Forensic Sciences and Legal Medicine, Charite Universitatsmedizin Berlin, in Berlin, Germany.

He is also the Director of the Governmental Institute of Forensic and Social Medicine in Berlin, Germany. He is the primary or senior author of more than 200 scientific publications in international peer-reviewed journals and the author as well as editor of a number of books dealing with topics of forensic pathology.

I wonder what he would have to say about it when reading the comments made by the armchair police officers here on this forum or the hobby pathologists.

Michael Tsokos was here after the Tsunami hit Thailand working side by side with international teams and Thai pathologists to identify the victims. No criticism from his end but only praise for their abilities.

The book contains contributions from pathologists from around the world and even Asia, which might shock the TV commentators. Reading these publications one might find that stranger things have happened as someone tying his hands and placing his head through noose to commit suicide. But that wouldnt go down to well on this forum, would it?

Instead of that one prefers to insult the RTP and declare Thai pathologists incompetent. I find that pathetic.

Personally I am not jumping to any conclusions on this case, although I find your sym-"pathetic" post absent of what is called street wise...

[stephen terry]

Before we start to develop our own conclusions based on how much drink we had or how much we like or dislike Thai government agencies I would suggest to read a book edited by Michael Tsokos MD who is I quote “Professor Michael Tsokos is the Director of the Institute of Forensic Sciences and Legal Medicine, Charite – Universitatsmedizin Berlin, in Berlin, Germany.

He is also the Director of the Governmental Institute of Forensic and Social Medicine in Berlin, Germany. He is the primary or senior author of more than 200 scientific publications in international peer-reviewed journals and the author as well as editor of a number of books dealing with topics of forensic pathology.

I wonder what he would have to say about it when reading the comments made by the armchair police officers here on this forum or the hobby pathologists.

Michael Tsokos was here after the Tsunami hit Thailand working side by side with international teams and Thai pathologists to identify the victims. No criticism from his end but only praise for their abilities.

The book contains contributions from pathologists from around the world and even Asia, which might shock the TV commentators. Reading these publications one might find that stranger things have happened as someone tying his hands and placing his head through noose to commit suicide. But that wouldn’t go down to well on this forum, would it?

Instead of that one prefers to insult the RTP and declare Thai pathologists incompetent. I find that pathetic.

I (and probably all of the TV posters) am not doubting the qualifications of Dr Tsokos, or his assessment of the work carried out by the Thai pathologists after the Tsunami. However, there was probably not much doubt as to the cause of death in the majority of the Tsunami victims, suicide certainly not being one of them. In this particular case, most people doubt that it was suicide because of the victim's hands tied behind his back, and also the cuts present on the body. Most posters would probably agree that It would be POSSIBLE for the victim to have inflicted the cuts on himself, tied his hands behind his back, put his head through a noose and hung himself, but is it PROBABLE? Especially bearing in mind that he had been drinking for more than 12 hours previously, and the possibility of a drunk man being capable of the "step through" technique described in previous posts seems unlikely. Add to that, the botched up RTP investigations into the murders of the 2 English backpackers, the contamination of the crime scene, the contradictory statements put out by very high ranking police officers, dubious DNA findings/results, and numerous substantiated reports of corruption in the highest ranks of the RTP, is it any wonder that people are a bit cynical about any findings?

Yes, I agree 100%. Thai User is comparing apples with pears. Both are fruits, but the scenario is completely different. The main difference is that after 12 hours or more of drinking the victim was able to carry out this 'suicide' as described. I would also suggest that Thai User familiarise herself with the murders of David and Hannah before making an ill-judged comment on this suspicious death.

My own opinion is that the RTP are willing to take the easy way out, whatever the cause of death. It could be suicide or it could be murder, but they don't care as has been proven before.

[Si Thea01]

The whole story stinks ...

Why would he tie his hands together and then hang himself ?

To stop themselves from stopping the process in case of second thoughts. There have been cases where people have attempted suicide but had second thoughts and with their free hands have stopped their attempt.. If you want to go all the way, tying ones hands stops you from doing so.

[MiKT]

In Merchant Marine school they teach to tie all knots behind your back. I just tied both arms behind my back moments ago. Not that hard.

How does one tie string around their hands behind their back?

Must have been a dam good school if they taught you to type with your hands tied behind your back. Was a H H. mentioned in the list of teachers by any chance.

[stephen terry]

re // 104.

Instead of that one prefers to insult the RTP and declare Thai pathologists incompetent. I find that pathetic.

Your opinion is noted, but you are a long way from understanding what goes on in Thailand.

[ggt]

At least this...so called suicide...did not have his head cut from his body like the couple who were found dead and floating in the water near their boat...headless...police speculated that it was a possible double suicide...case closed...as most farang cases are...

This convenient suicide for all suspicious farang deaths is a disgrace to this country...

[micmichd]

In your Farang countries you would probably say "case closed = good police job".

Why different in Thailand?

Oh sorry, I forgot: Dead Farang smells like a God was killed.