Should Thai Partner Pass Away With No Will...

[baitoey]

Just out of interest, if properties are in Thai spouse's name, with children listed on the tabien baan, would the children automatically inherit?

[Dragonman]

Just out of interest, if properties are in Thai spouse's name, with children listed on the tabien baan, would the children automatically inherit?

There is no out of Court probate in Thailand, thus nothing is automatic! Whilst children are in the first line of Statutory Heirs, it is quite likely that parents and spouse will get shares. Always get a Will written. Do not leave it in the hands of a Thai Court. For a Thai it is simple enough to go to the Amphur and get a Public Will certified for a very small fee. No need for a lawyer if you just want to ensure the property is left to the children.

[backflip]

Not just written, but typed and properly signed and witnessed. My father passed away in the US leaving a halographic will that was deemed invalid. Eighteen months of probate hel_l ensued.

[GuestHouse]

A particular issue, and this affects very many foreigners married to Thai women, is where the wife has a child or children from a former Thai marriage relationship and where the child/children are minors.

Under those circumstances, the children may inherit leaving the property at risk of the children's natural father turning up and demanding parental rights.

I think under these circumstances the best option is for the foreign partner to have a 30 year lease on the property, with the wife making a will leaving the house to her children, but stating in her will that she has provided her husband with a lease and it is her absolute wish for that lease to remain in place.

[thaigene2]

A particular issue, and this affects very many foreigners married to Thai women, is where the wife has a child or children from a former Thai marriage relationship and where the child/children are minors.

Under those circumstances, the children may inherit leaving the property at risk of the children's natural father turning up and demanding parental rights.

I think under these circumstances the best option is for the foreign partner to have a 30 year lease on the property, with the wife making a will leaving the house to her children, but stating in her will that she has provided her husband with a lease and it is her absolute wish for that lease to remain in place.

This whole house/land thing just keeps getting worse doesn't it....this is all way too much for me. So I've decided it will be a condo or continual renting..with a faint glimmer of hope that one day we can buy a home in both our names. All my other assets - as few as they are - will be in a Western country.

[Charma]

I thought a foreigner could inherit a small piece of land in a will? Or is it that they then have to dispose of the land within a certain amount of time?

[Dragonman]

Not just written, but typed and properly signed and witnessed. My father passed away in the US leaving a halographic will that was deemed invalid. Eighteen months of probate hel_l ensued.

No such problem in Thailand! Holographic OK. In US it's also OK in some States.

Charma. A foreigner who is Statutory Heir can inherit. It is up to the Minister of Interior if you can keep it, but generally in the past sale within a year is the norm. Of course unless someone complains you could be "executor of the estate" and not apply to Minister, as some Land Offices have even suggested.

[birdbirdbat]

So if you are foreign woman married to a Thai man – No need for a fancy expat lawyer-but a simple “Public Will “ can be drafted and filed for the foreign wife to inherit? Can you explain what a Public Will in Thailand is?

Thanks VERY much!

[Nawtilus]

Yes, would like to know about local Amphur Will etc.

As father of my Thai children, I was led to believe from a lawyer here, that I can be the inheritor of my partners estate if it is left to me in a Will, it is then up to the authorities as mentioned if I can keep it or not. If forced to sell, i wonder what the time frames are if for example it does not sell in the 12 month period.

I had thought to just leave it or put it in the kids name, but as minors, when I do want to sell it and move or whatever, it is a major head ###### because as guardian you have to go to court to get anything you want to do on their behalf approved by the courts first. Not an easy straight forward and more importantly quick process.

Several Lawyers I enquired with Will costs here were from 12k baht to 23k baht, ######ing ridiculous considering the same Will back home that is relatively simple and straight forward is around 5 or 6k baht.

[Dragonman]

So if you are foreign woman married to a Thai man – No need for a fancy expat lawyer-but a simple “Public Will “ can be drafted and filed for the foreign wife to inherit? Can you explain what a Public Will in Thailand is?

Thanks VERY much!

A form may be obtained, or the Will can just be made "holographic". Forms can be obtained from District Chief, normally Registration Office of Local Amphur. 2 witnesses, not spouse. Fee was about 100 baht, but may have increased.

Nawtilus. Public or Ordinary Will, as above. Less open to challenge than that drafted by a lawyer.

The provisions of inheritance prescribe for auction if not sold within 12 months, but this is not often followed.

I agree with the crazy fees for drafting a Will, why most lawyers will put you off a Public Will.

[Loom]

I'd assume the "local" will works well with assets located in Thailand. I'm wondering about assets held outside Thailand. I believe I've seen advice in other threads about using an English language will for non-Thai assets and then referring in that document to a Thai language will covering the Thai-based assets.

Would the recommendation on an English language version for assets out of Thailand have been made in order to avoid translating the Thai document? Or would it have more to do with the definition of what constitutes a properly executed will? Probably a combination of both...

[Dragonman]

I'd assume the "local" will works well with assets located in Thailand. I'm wondering about assets held outside Thailand. I believe I've seen advice in other threads about using an English language will for non-Thai assets and then referring in that document to a Thai language will covering the Thai-based assets.

Would the recommendation on an English language version for assets out of Thailand have been made in order to avoid translating the Thai document? Or would it have more to do with the definition of what constitutes a properly executed will? Probably a combination of both...

I would not advise a "Public Will" if you have assets abroad. However any way of having separate Wills for each Country, English Will translated into Thai, or Will drafted in Thailand are OK. As long as the lawyers know what they are doing. Depends really where prime assets are!

[birdbirdbat]

Sorry dumb question.

Just to be clear.... can the farang Wife or Husband draft a holographic or public will (in Thai of course) at the Amphur and leave their assets: Car, Motorbike, Condo and House (lets say the farang has pulled it off and put it in his name) to their surviving spouse as well? Or must it be filed by a lawyer and registered "aproved" first somewhere else, What would one need... a certified or notarized passport copy I would assume?

I too, was quoted 20k for a simple will.

Thanks! BBB

BTW Dragoman YOU ROCK!

[Nawtilus]

What is a holographic Will, do you appear in 3d in front of the audience upon the reading of the Will and do it yourself or what ??

[birdbirdbat]

a hol·o·graph (h?l'?-gr?f, h?'l?-) Of or being a document written wholly in the handwriting of the person whose signature it bears: a holographic will.

[Nawtilus]

oh I see, thanks. Thought it might be some star trek kinda thing these days and if it was I doubted the Thai local amphur would have it

[Dragonman]

oh I see, thanks. Thought it might be some star trek kinda thing these days and if it was I doubted the Thai local amphur would have it

Lots of things they come out with at Amphur, and especially Land Office, sound totally alien to me.

birdbirdbat. Thanks for the compliment! I was a great Deep Purple and Uriah Heep fan Now I've gone and given away my age.

No problem with the Public Will for farang as long as you are sure of the Thai language and either have a separate Will in your own Country to exclude assets abroad, or have no assets abroad like me. Come to think of it I don't have any assets, period.

[deadman]

can someone expand on the public will concept?? where would one go to do this, from wot i can gather its in thai, so would need at the very least a thai speaker/writer...but wot about legal language, or can it just be stated in simple language (i leave my condo to my brother+name)?

is there a copy kept at some office somewhere?? has anyone done this. I was quoted 10K by SB, which seemed a lot to me for wot it is, though i noticed somepeople on this thread were quoted more.

any futher elaboration would be appreciated

cheers

dm

[Dragonman]

can someone expand on the public will concept?? where would one go to do this, from wot i can gather its in thai, so would need at the very least a thai speaker/writer...but wot about legal language, or can it just be stated in simple language (i leave my condo to my brother+name)?

is there a copy kept at some office somewhere?? has anyone done this. I was quoted 10K by SB, which seemed a lot to me for wot it is, though i noticed somepeople on this thread were quoted more.

any futher elaboration would be appreciated

cheers

dm

Going by your name a Will is too late for you.

There should be adverts in the Registration Section of your local Amphur office, where you change ID, put name on Tabien Baan, etc. You need, or someone you trust, needs to be fluent Thai speaker/writer. No need for legal language. A form and instructions should be available at the office as stated.

[Loom]

Thanks Dragonman, We've got assets in four separate countries, including Thailand, and currently live in Singapore. I'm thinking that the wife will have a Thai will done by the lawyer translated into English. English translation should be valid for the countries outside Thailand, but I'll let our lawyer figure it out. I hope it won't be necessary to do separate wills for each country.

[bluedragon]

Ok, what if I want to leave my condo etc. to my Farang sons. i.e. I own a condo and other assets in thailand, and want to leave them to my sons. Will a Thai "will" suffice ???

Regards, BD

[Dragonman]

Ok, what if I want to leave my condo etc. to my Farang sons. i.e. I own a condo and other assets in thailand, and want to leave them to my sons. Will a Thai "will" suffice ???

Regards, BD

Yes, but they would really need a fluent, trustworthy thai speaker to appear at probate with them.

[bluedragon]

Ok, what if I want to leave my condo etc. to my Farang sons. i.e. I own a condo and other assets in thailand, and want to leave them to my sons. Will a Thai "will" suffice ???

Regards, BD

Yes, but they would really need a fluent, trustworthy thai speaker to appear at probate with them.

Dragonman, Thanks. BD

[Loom]

Just a quick update on my situation after discussing it with lawyers. We're currently domiciled in Singapore and the advice from the Singapore lawyer was to execute a single will here in order to avoid any possible questions about more than one wills being the "last" will and testament. We'll translate the original into Thai and consult a Thai lawyer to make sure any provisions for Thai assets to comply with thai law. The original English language version should be recognized in the US or HK. To avoid headaches later, just converting as many assets as possible to joint ownership.

[Dragonman]

Just a quick update on my situation after discussing it with lawyers. We're currently domiciled in Singapore and the advice from the Singapore lawyer was to execute a single will here in order to avoid any possible questions about more than one wills being the "last" will and testament. We'll translate the original into Thai and consult a Thai lawyer to make sure any provisions for Thai assets to comply with thai law. The original English language version should be recognized in the US or HK. To avoid headaches later, just converting as many assets as possible to joint ownership.

Yes your lawyer is correct in that sometimes confusion can take place. There should always be clauses in each Will which mention the other. If the lawyer is aware, this should be automatic.

[Loom]

Much appreciated...

[JimGant]

Dragonman,

The wife's 'last will and testament' was prepared in the States and includes all her property, both here and in the States. A summary of the aspects related to Thailand were written in longhand by her and serve as a coversheet for this will (it's signed). I'm assuming this handwritten coversheet can serve as her 'holographic' will for Thai legal purposes(?). If a Thai court had any questions, they could refer to the attached 'official' (witnessed/notarized) will, albeit in English.

In your opinion, are we good-to-go?

(Also, I thought a holographic will in Thailand would stand up with only her signature? (Although obtaining 2 witnesses is no problem, so will probably do so as added assurance.))

[Dragonman]

Dragonman,

The wife's 'last will and testament' was prepared in the States and includes all her property, both here and in the States. A summary of the aspects related to Thailand were written in longhand by her and serve as a coversheet for this will (it's signed). I'm assuming this handwritten coversheet can serve as her 'holographic' will for Thai legal purposes(?). If a Thai court had any questions, they could refer to the attached 'official' (witnessed/notarized) will, albeit in English.

In your opinion, are we good-to-go?

(Also, I thought a holographic will in Thailand would stand up with only her signature? (Although obtaining 2 witnesses is no problem, so will probably do so as added assurance.))

It would really be better to get the Will drafted in the States officially translated into Thai, and the holographic element attached to this. Also get the holographic section translated to english. This will ensure there are no anomalies, however innocuous which may lead to problems.

Witnesses for Thai holographic Wills are not essential, but add to security if challenged.

[TBWG]

Several Lawyers I enquired with Will costs here were from 12k baht to 23k baht, ######ing ridiculous considering the same Will back home that is relatively simple and straight forward is around 5 or 6k baht.

Hi

See extract from e-mail to me sent by a friend who recently arranged a will......................

William White [email protected] will do land lease for 4000, 1st will 4000, additional wills for 2000 baht plus VAT. All in Thai and English. I first had an initial free consultation with him at a modern office in the NEW ITF TOWER 17th floor in Silom part of Bangkok.

Hope this helps

TBWG

[JimGant]

Thanx, Dragonman.

All the back-and-forth translations of translations should be interesting -- but, I guess, better to find out a mistranslation before "all rise" is called.