More Scandinavians die in Thailand

[webfact]

More Scandinavians die in Thailand


Photo: Lasse Henriksen

BANGKOK: -- The last 5 years more Swedes and Norwegians have died in Thailand, while the death of Danes seems to be somewhat constant. A rising number of deaths do not seem to correspond with a stagnant number of Scandinavian visitors to Thailand, so the explanation is to be found elsewhere.

Despite a decrease in Swedish visitors in Thailand from 2013 to 2014 the amount of Swedes that died in the country rose with 26 percent. According to Senior Consular Officer at the Swedish Embassy in Bangkok Par Kageby there is a quite obvious answer as to why this is happening. More Scandinavians live in Thailand and these residents are growing older.

“If you go back 5 years then 70 percent of the (Swedish) deaths were accidents and 30% percent were natural. In 2014 70 percent of the deaths were due to natural causes,” he says. According to Par Kageby some of the most common natural death causes are heart attacks and liver cirrhosis.

The total number of Scandinavian deaths in 2014 went up to 270 from 245 deaths in 2013. The last five years Norway like Sweden have experience a steady growth in deaths, from 68 Norwegian deaths in 2010 to 102 in 2014. The relatively new Danish consul Birgit S. Kondrup-Palmquist Carlstedt, were not able to go into details about the historic development when ScandAsia called her, but she assessed that the amount of deceased is somewhat constant. In 2014 a total of 58 Danes died in Thailand, two less than the year before.

“It’s almost, always some sort of disease, last year we experienced one suicide and one fatal traffic accident (among the Danish citizens who died in Thailand red.), the rest died of natural causes,” Consul Birgit S. Kondrup-Palmquist Carlstedt says.

Dead Norwegians are mostly old men

At the Norwegian Embassy their statistics paints a clear image of the average deceased, 64 percent are over 60 years old and some 98 percent are men. 75 percent of them have other insurance policies than travel insurances and according to Brita Ve Magnusson, Counsellor at the Norwegian Embassy’s Consular and Administrative Section, this might indicate that they live in Thailand. So all in all it looks like most of the Norwegians, that die in Thailand are elderly men that resides in the country.

“Last year only 2 of the Norwegians who died in Thailand were women, and none of them died of natural causes,” Brita Ve Magnusson told ScandAsia and added that last year some 12 percent of the Norwegian deaths were caused by drowning- and traffic accidents.

Nobody knows how many Scandinavians live in Thailand
It is not as easy for Par Kageby to figure out how many Swedes live in Thailand. 379 Swedes have registered themselves at the Swedish Embassy, but Par Kageby estimates that the population is 10.000 to 15.000 and currently growing. Brita Ve Magnusson cautiously estimates that around 4000 to 6000 Norwegians live in Thailand one year at a time, but can’t say what the total number of Norwegians who resides here might be.

According to Danish Consul Birgit S. Kondrup-Palmquist Carlstedt, the Danish embassy does not want to make an estimate, because they “do not stand a chance to guess the number, when there is no requirement to register”.

One of the main sources to the estimates is the number of people that goes to the embassies and consulates to apply for a special certificate they need to get a 1 year visas for Thailand. In the light of the amount of deaths Par Kageby thinks the current estimate of Swedish residents in Thailand might even be conservative.

“If you compare how many people die here with the number of certificates we do and see that the number of Swedes that travels to Thailand has gone down the last two years, while the number of our consular cases is still increasing. So it is not connected to how many people comes to Thailand but the number of Swedes who lives here,” Par Kageby says and adds “When you compare the number of people that die with the number of certificates we make, something doesn’t add up.”

In case of an emergency
No one is required to register at their embassies website when they move to Thailand. But in the unlikely event of a disaster it is difficult for the embassies to know where and with what strength they should strike with an effort to find and help people, if they don’t know where and who to search for.

This has been an issue for Sweden before. A slow and inadequate handling of the 2004 Tsunami in Thailand, where more than 500 Swedes died, was considered one of the main reasons for the Foreign Minister Laila Frievald’s 2006 resignation. According to Par Kageby the lack of information will be challenging the Swedish Embassy in case of a new catastrophe.

“If a natural disaster happened somewhere in the northeast of Thailand, we don’t have a clue how many Swedish people live there, if it is 2 or 150 people we are looking for,” Par Kageby says.

Source: http://scandasia.com/more-scandinavians-die-in-thailand/

-- ScandAsia 2015-01-29

[Pib]

At the Norwegian Embassy their statistics paints a clear image of the average deceased, 64 percent are over 60 years old and some 98 percent are men.

RIP. Hopefully they passed with a smile on their face.

[jaltsc]

"The last 5 years more Swedes and Norwegians have died in Thailand, while the death of Danes seems to be somewhat constant. A rising number of deaths do not seem to correspond with a stagnant number of Scandinavian visitors to Thailand, so the explanation is to be found elsewhere."

I knew TAT needed to develop a new tourist campaign. However, I don't think this one will work and bring in more tourists

Edited January 29, 2015 by jaltsc

[55Jay]

Nice photo.

[talktomarty]

"the most common natural death causes are heart attacks and liver cirrhosis" ...Probably how I'll go too

[jalansanitwong]

If the Scandinavians want to find out how many of their citizens are here a good place to start is Khon Khaen,. There are loads of old Swedes and Danes etc living in small villages with Isaan wives.

The villages bring in millions of baht every month in pension cheques from Sweden .

Its no wonder Europe's going broke. Sweden is nothing more than a welfare state.

[kieran2698]

If the Scandinavians want to find out how many of their citizens are here a good place to start is Khon Khaen,. There are loads of old Swedes and Danes etc living in small villages with Isaan wives.

The villages bring in millions of baht every month in pension cheques from Sweden .

Its no wonder Europe's going broke. Sweden is nothing more than a welfare state.

Sweden is the 1/3 highest contributor per person to the EU. Their economy is one of the strongest in Europe and despite being a "welfare state" they manage to also have the 4th highest employment rate in the EU and that is behind the 3 countries with the most generous benefits.

It is no wonder that Europe is going broke but it has nothing to do with Sweden or Swedes living off their pensions abroad or indeed welfare in general, it is purely down to poor banking practices and nothing else.

[Strangebrew]

It is smart to register with your Embassy just incase something happens that way there better able to prepare better for your needs. anytime I enter a new country I always register only takes 2 minutes online. If un forseen events happened I get instant text to cell phone.

[Jingthing]

Older people, yes.

Accidents, yes.

Too much booze, yes.

I also wonder if the Northern folk have a problem with the HEAT.

[kieran2698]

Couldn't they just ask Thai immigration, they say "no one knows" but actually surely Thailand does know.

[FangFerang]

It's because Swedes and Norwegians are allergic to 'Thainess'...

[HiSoLowSoNoSo]

I take passing away with a cold Chang beer in my hand and a smile on my face any day over freezing to death in a dark and cold Scandinavian winter.

[Bernard Flint]

Older people, yes.

Accidents, yes.

Too much booze, yes.

I also wonder if the Northern folk have a problem with the HEAT.

rUBBISH

We all know that there is a thai mass murderer, who hates danish people.

[Prbkk]

Older people, yes.

Accidents, yes.

Too much booze, yes.

I also wonder if the Northern folk have a problem with the HEAT.

rUBBISH

We all know that there is a thai mass murderer, who hates danish people.

Yes, need Nina Borg on this case. Harry Hole and Wallander for the others.

[EyesWideOpen]

So as of right now, Thailand is the top spot for Aussies and Brit tourists to

die in. Can Scandinavian countries now be added to that list ??

[skildpadden]

It is smart to register with your Embassy just incase something happens that way there better able to prepare better for your needs. anytime I enter a new country I always register only takes 2 minutes online. If un forseen events happened I get instant text to cell phone.

Yep, couldn't agree more. People should register at the embassy, so in case of emergency they will actually know where and who to look for.

[bapoboy]

No wonder they are so many deaths, but can not bear to hear more about all that crap that happens at home, islam, muslims, quran, greedy government, no democracy

[bapoboy]

"The last 5 years more Swedes and Norwegians have died in Thailand, while the death of Danes seems to be somewhat constant. A rising number of deaths do not seem to correspond with a stagnant number of Scandinavian visitors to Thailand, so the explanation is to be found elsewhere."

I knew TAT needed to develop a new tourist campaign. However, I don't think this one will work and bring in more tourists

bashing thailand, why do pepole love that? lost all money from bar girls, or not have anything better to do, no country is perfect understand, and i think the most death are from pattaya

[bapoboy]

i would rather die in thailand then cold scandinavia, the reason there are som many death, because thailand have most toruist and expats in the world.

[Jeremy50]

Drinking yourself to death sure sounds like suicide to me. Call poisoning yourself natural if you want to. The boredom, sitting around all day, and the constant demands for money from the Thai 'wife' would be enough to bring on a heart attack in a lot of old folks.

[NancyL]

Couldn't they just ask Thai immigration, they say "no one knows" but actually surely Thailand does know.

Yes, one way to determine how many foreigners are here is to look at the statistics for one-year visa extensions, but that doesn't tell the entire story. Some people "live" (and die) here, but don't have one-year visa extensions. They could return to their home country annually an apply for triple-entry tourist visas. Or they could obtain tourist visas in the region and travel extensively. Or they could simply be on long-term overstay and totally off the radar of Immigration.

[kieran2698]

Couldn't they just ask Thai immigration, they say "no one knows" but actually surely Thailand does know.

Yes, one way to determine how many foreigners are here is to look at the statistics for one-year visa extensions, but that doesn't tell the entire story. Some people "live" (and die) here, but don't have one-year visa extensions. They could return to their home country annually an apply for triple-entry tourist visas. Or they could obtain tourist visas in the region and travel extensively. Or they could simply be on long-term overstay and totally off the radar of Immigration.

The only people here who are not on the system would be people who have entered illegally not overstayers, they entered legally and so are on the system. As for the various visa's, so what, cant they add up?

[Lupatria]

"The last 5 years more Swedes and Norwegians have died in Thailand, while the death of Danes seems to be somewhat constant. A rising number of deaths do not seem to correspond with a stagnant number of Scandinavian visitors to Thailand, so the explanation is to be found elsewhere."

I knew TAT needed to develop a new tourist campaign. However, I don't think this one will work and bring in more tourists

This "article' is probably based on an idea of one of those geniuses at the TAT:

Let's split up the death's in nationalities so the total number won't look too embarrassing...

[wwest5829]

If the Scandinavians want to find out how many of their citizens are here a good place to start is Khon Khaen,. There are loads of old Swedes and Danes etc living in small villages with Isaan wives.

The villages bring in millions of baht every month in pension cheques from Sweden .

Its no wonder Europe's going broke. Sweden is nothing more than a welfare state.

Sweden is the 1/3 highest contributor per person to the EU. Their economy is one of the strongest in Europe and despite being a "welfare state" they manage to also have the 4th highest employment rate in the EU and that is behind the 3 countries with the most generous benefits.

It is no wonder that Europe is going broke but it has nothing to do with Sweden or Swedes living off their pensions abroad or indeed welfare in general, it is purely down to poor banking practices and nothing else.

Thank you. I continuously try to educate friends in the U.S. that there are reasonable other ways of operating.

[MrY]

If the Scandinavians want to find out how many of their citizens are here a good place to start is Khon Khaen,. There are loads of old Swedes and Danes etc living in small villages with Isaan wives.

The villages bring in millions of baht every month in pension cheques from Sweden .

Its no wonder Europe's going broke. Sweden is nothing more than a welfare state.

Sweden is the 1/3 highest contributor per person to the EU. Their economy is one of the strongest in Europe and despite being a "welfare state" they manage to also have the 4th highest employment rate in the EU and that is behind the 3 countries with the most generous benefits.

It is no wonder that Europe is going broke but it has nothing to do with Sweden or Swedes living off their pensions abroad or indeed welfare in general, it is purely down to poor banking practices and nothing else.

The stress caused by the 'strong' Swedish economy could be a contributing factor:

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=SEK&to=THB&view=1Y

Powerhouse of European economy? :

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=SEK&to=EUR&view=1Y

[Dannybigboy]

If the Scandinavians want to find out how many of their citizens are here a good place to start is Khon Khaen,. There are loads of old Swedes and Danes etc living in small villages with Isaan wives.

The villages bring in millions of baht every month in pension cheques from Sweden .

Its no wonder Europe's going broke. Sweden is nothing more than a welfare state.

.....That is correct.....Sweden is a Welfare state who take care of its Citizens....even when they live abroad. Maybe one day Thailand will become a wellfare state as well - not !!!

[jcisco]

Couldn't they just ask Thai immigration, they say "no one knows" but actually surely Thailand does know.

Yes, one way to determine how many foreigners are here is to look at the statistics for one-year visa extensions, but that doesn't tell the entire story. Some people "live" (and die) here, but don't have one-year visa extensions. They could return to their home country annually an apply for triple-entry tourist visas. Or they could obtain tourist visas in the region and travel extensively. Or they could simply be on long-term overstay and totally off the radar of Immigration.

If they have a total coverage and total capture, load and match process for travel documents for those entering the kingdom, it should be trivial to discover the balance of entries for which a exit has yet to of been recorded. Of course there are many edge cases but if its in a database its trivial to discover this information.

Furthermore I would imagine that this information is being generated for someone somewhere in government in order to generate policy and or integrate with statistical data.

[temlosluis]

Actually we have in Sweden really big problem with muslims and other free travellers whos life we pay. Soon we dont have anymore money to us own peoples. Everyone know this but it is rasism to speak about this.

If some isaan city have lot of swedish that is still small part when we have already villages where have like 100 Swedish and 100-150 muslims. And we pay their all life in old schools, hotels etc where us country want bring them. Sometimes they stop eat because they have come from Syrian and scary wolf, dark and quiet and want go to bigger cities, after few days eating break us country promise everone of them own room and +50k baht per month party money.

Most funny is that this is not even joke.

[kieran2698]

If the Scandinavians want to find out how many of their citizens are here a good place to start is Khon Khaen,. There are loads of old Swedes and Danes etc living in small villages with Isaan wives.

The villages bring in millions of baht every month in pension cheques from Sweden .

Its no wonder Europe's going broke. Sweden is nothing more than a welfare state.

Sweden is the 1/3 highest contributor per person to the EU. Their economy is one of the strongest in Europe and despite being a "welfare state" they manage to also have the 4th highest employment rate in the EU and that is behind the 3 countries with the most generous benefits.

It is no wonder that Europe is going broke but it has nothing to do with Sweden or Swedes living off their pensions abroad or indeed welfare in general, it is purely down to poor banking practices and nothing else.

The stress caused by the 'strong' Swedish economy could be a contributing factor:

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=SEK&to=THB&view=1Y

Powerhouse of European economy? :

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=SEK&to=EUR&view=1Y

OK, I missed that! So, this time last year they had about 120,000 baht and now they have only 100,000, it makes a difference but they are still doing better than most nationalities living here off a state pension!

[catweazle]

I'd like to propose to the TAT to use the OP photo as poster for their "Discover Thainess" campaign since it literally hits the nail on the head...

Edited January 30, 2015 by catweazle