Patong is dead.

[phuketjock]

32 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

"You dont seem to realize that the demographics have changed." - you're joking, right???? 

 

I am clearly saying the tourist numbers are up, but the money from them is down, way down.  I really can't be any clearer than that.  I know the demographics have changed.

 

"Just because "you" dont see westerners spending in bars doesn't mean money is not being spent." - sure, but is more or less being spent by the new tourist demographic?  This is crucial to Patong's future, is it not?

 

"have a look at restaurant No 6 , there will be a queue of Chinese stretching down the street" - I live in Patong.  I see it whenever I am out.  Once again, and I can't be any clearer, does ten Chinese tourist at a cheap Thai restaurant spend the same as a western couple eating at a mid to high end restaurant having steak and having a bottle of wine?  I would suggest you would need a lot more Chinese tourists to replace the lost western couples for the same amount of money to be injected into the local Phuket economy.

 

"Chinese, Russians etc spend money, they spend money at ground level, they eat in cheap Thai restaurants, They shop at Thai night markets" - once again, I don't disagree, but compare them to western tourists and I suggest they do not spend as much, despite their higher numbers.

 

"Maybe you need to get out more" - no, I don't.  I see it on a daily basis.  Do the math, how many Chinese equals one westerner for daily spend?

 

"The economy of Phuket is no longer westerners propping up bar stools in Bangla Rd" - I agree, but they were more lucrative than the current demographic.  This thread is "Patong is dead" and Bangla Road  is the main tourist strip in Patong.  So, by your comment, are you agreeing that "Patong is dead?" 

 

"My Condo block has 2 buses every morning taking Russian kids to school." - you are now talking about expats.  This thread is discussing tourists and tourism.  This comment is better suited on another thread currently running.

 

Once again, I know what TAT's business model is for the new demographic.  Basically, for example, they have said we need ten Chinese to come to Phuket to replace the one western tourist Phuket has lost.  (less profits per tourist but more tourists to keep the same profits)  Due to the fact they eat and shop on the cheap, I would suggest they need even more numbers to cover the losses from the western market.

 

I'll say it clearly, and feel free to quote me on it.  The tourist numbers are up, but the money from them in Patong is down. 

Wrong again. "This thread is discussing tourists and tourism."

No where in the OP is tourism or tourists even mentioned, this thread is about Patong,

and how quiet it is/was.

Edited May 24, 2017 by phuketjock

[NamKangMan]

Just now, phuketjock said:

Wrong again. "This thread is discussing tourists and tourism."

No where in the OP is tourism or tourists even mentioned, this thread is about Patong,

and how quite is is/was.

 

Patong / Bangla Road is Phuket's BIGGEST tourist attraction, and if it's "quiet" or "dead" then what does that say about tourism here?

 

You are embarrassing yourself now. 

[NamKangMan]

7 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Its the end of high season, isnt some empty hotels and shutters down, normal for this time of year ? I have some Thai friends who only open their shops for high season, and mothball a few rooms in the guest house until next year.

 

Interested to know where you get the sold figures for some condo blocks ? I have friends who are in the real estate business and they are the first to admit, that unless you are the developer or work at the land office, then actual sales figures are hard to come by

 

"Its the end of high season, isnt some empty hotels and shutters down, normal for this time of year ?" - you do realize this thread was started on the 31 Jan 2015. 

 

That's two and half "high seasons" and lot more "For Sale" signs and empty commercial properties ago. 

[LivinginKata]

Jeez .... how far and sad has this topic gone so low. Mirrors the state of Thaivisa Phuker Forum. Hardly worth reading any more.

[phuketjock]

5 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

Patong / Bangla Road is Phuket's BIGGEST tourist attraction, and if it's "quiet" or "dead" then what does that say about tourism here?

 

You are embarrassing yourself now. 

Hmmm you think?

Once again the OP is about Patong not Bangla, not tourists or tourism.

No mention of either in the OP.

[NamKangMan]

4 minutes ago, phuketjock said:

Hmmm you think?

Once again the OP is about Patong not Bangla, not tourists or tourism.

No mention of either in the OP.

 

Ahhh, Bangla Road is in Patong. 

 

Are you suggesting Bangla Road is dead but the rest of Patong is not? 

[phuketjock]

8 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

Ahhh, Bangla Road is in Patong. 

 

Are you suggesting Bangla Road is dead but the rest of Patong is not? 

I will leave the suggesting to the likes of yourself, you seem to think you are good at it.

 

[Rimmer]

Multiple off topic posts and replies have been removed, topic is about:

Patong is dead.

 

Not fruit farmers

[NamKangMan]

1 hour ago, xylophone said:

Getting away from fruit, farmers, who has been here the longest and who's got the longest dong........tourist arrivals seem up but there is very little money flowing into the local economy AND quite where these people are staying is a mystery??

 

I've always been one for testing stats by getting down to the ground level to check them out................two examples where this worked: Rank Xerox gave my team the highest sales targets in the uk based on 2200 older copiers in my region which were ripe for upgrading, but my guys weren't selling anything, No good for them and no good for paying the mortgage so went out with them and found there were only 800 copiers in existence so no chance of reaching targets.

 

So the head office data collection,  sales info, service records and monthly usage sheets were all wrong, terribly so.

 

When I started with Amex as Director of sales and establishment marketing in NZ the agency and the marketing team had all the stats showing that 24,000 establishments (businesses)  accepted the Amex card, but I was suspicious of the number so did some of my own groundwork, then set up a call centre to check the numbers. Sure enough the numbers were well over the top with actually 13,000  accepting it and live.

 

The point is that I don't believe the numbers put out by TAT or who ever, and getting out ön the ground supports my argument..............A Thai friend is the maintenance engineer on a resort just near beach road and it has 100 rooms of which ONE is currently occupied; a hotel owner by Thai chinese in new middle road were once very busy catering for the chinese market. Not now as business has dropped off sharply.

 

Rooms just off the main drag can be had for 8000 baht a month, shutters down on many shops in new middle road and Nanai, the Large Chang Residence Hotel and restaurant in Nanai hasn't served a meal there in almost 2 years and the hotel is almost empty. two Italian restaurants closed near me.............and the story is similar elsewhere.

 

As for property again the spruikers would have you believe all is fine and dandy. Not so...............Ace and Phanason Park have gone bust; seen no action on Dinso apts for nearly 2 years.the second phase of a development off Phra Baramee has come to a grinding halt; The Deck apts/condos are under 50% sold and I believe its the same story with The Charm.

 

Houses I know off have been for sale for 10 years now and not moved and in desperation a friend sold his 62sqm apt on a golf course for 1.55m baht.

 

None of the above are signs of a booming economy no matter what colour glasses you're wearing.

 

PS. please forgive any spellers etc as writing this from a hospital bed!!

 

"A Thai friend is the maintenance engineer on a resort just near beach road and it has 100 rooms of which ONE is currently occupied" - how long before this guy loses his full time job and the hotel starts using contractors on an hourly rate?

 

Shouldn't this Thai guy be one of the workers benefiting from the big increase in Chinese tourists coming to Phuket / Patong????   

Edited May 24, 2017 by NamKangMan

[phuketjock]

7 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

"A Thai friend is the maintenance engineer on a resort just near beach road and it has 100 rooms of which ONE is currently occupied" - how long before this guy loses his full time job and the hotel starts using contractors on an hourly rate?

I feel sorry for you mate everything you say is doom and gloom all the way, why don't you go down

Bangla and drown your sorrows??

What happened to always look on the bright side of life?? 

[LivinginKata]

NKM is always on a fishing expedition .... and so many members take the bait/hook. Just ignore him ..... serial troller for his own amusement.

[NamKangMan]

8 minutes ago, phuketjock said:

I feel sorry for you mate everything you say is doom and gloom all the way, why don't you go down

Bangla and drown your sorrows??

What happened to always look on the bright side of life?? 

 

Save your pity for those with property and / or a business here.  Unfortunately, they are along for the ride.  As stake holders, it's sad they are not allowed to have an input into the direction of Phuket / Patong. 

 

I've got nothing invested here, which wasn't just "luck" but an informed decision.  How many would like to wind back the clock and change their decision????  Perhaps a question for another thread, although pride does tend to get in the way of honesty here. 

 

I have a positive outlook on life, but I do have a laugh at some on here that refuse to face the economic realities of Phuket / Patong.  An economic reality that has no effect on me, for the time being.

 

Only time will tell, but I have never seen more "For Sale" signs on residential and commercial premises, not to mention closures, in the whole time I have been coming to Phuket, and then living here full time. 

 

I'm sure each sign and closure has a story. 

 

 

[NamKangMan]

2 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

NKM is always on a fishing expedition .... and so many members take the bait/hook. Just ignore him ..... serial troller for his own amusement.

 

Rubbish post from you LIK.

 

More often than not I post links to support my comments.  Many times these links contain news reports, graphs, statistics etc.  You know this.

 

No one has to agree with my posts, but to personally attack me, after I have posted a link to question their claim, says more about them than it does about me. 

 

That said, on occasions I do like to poke some fun, like most on the forum. 

[LivinginKata]

12 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

<snip>

  How many would like to wind back the clock and change their decision????  Perhaps a question for another thread, although pride does tend to get in the way of honesty here. 

 

 

 

Not me ...best decision I ever made. Our bank account is very healthy, as is my own personal bank account (before NKM bangs away),  Sure the rental business is challenging, even poor.  But we (wife and I) did very Ok over the years. I would not wind back my clock other than the 'age/health' clock.

Edited May 24, 2017 by LivinginKata

[NamKangMan]

5 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Not me ...best decision I ever made. Our bank account is very healthy, as is my own personal bank account (before NKM bangs away),  Sure the rental business is challenging, even poor.  But we (wife and I) did very Ok over the years. I would not wind back my clock other than the 'age/health' clock.

 

Didn't you sell some off a while ago and move the money to Singapore????  If so, doesn't that show a lack of confidence, on many levels?

 

Haven't you stated on this forum in the past that you wouldn't contemplate doing what you have done, today????  If so, why?

 

Before you "bang away" these are serious questions and I am not trolling or baiting.

Edited May 24, 2017 by NamKangMan

[xylophone]

1 hour ago, Peterw42 said:

Its the end of high season, isnt some empty hotels and shutters down, normal for this time of year ? I have some Thai friends who only open their shops for high season, and mothball a few rooms in the guest house until next year.

 

Interested to know where you get the sold figures for some condo blocks ? I have friends who are in the real estate business and they are the first to admit, that unless you are the developer or work at the land office, then actual sales figures are hard to come by

again please excuse spellers etc................but this has been happening for well over a year, perhaps 2 now and business owners I know all say the same; business is and has been bad. Other past times would see business still good at the end of April. Not so now and more closed shops than ever,

 

Yes sales figs for apts/condos are closely guarded, but not too hard to get if you think outside the square.

[phuketjock]

14 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

Save your pity for those with property and / or a business here.  Unfortunately, they are along for the ride.  As stake holders, it's sad they are not allowed to have an input into the direction of Phuket / Patong. 

 

I've got nothing invested here, which wasn't just "luck" but an informed decision.  How many would like to wind back the clock and change their decision????  Perhaps a question for another thread, although pride does tend to get in the way of honesty here. 

 

I have a positive outlook on life, but I do have a laugh at some on here that refuse to face the economic realities of Phuket / Patong.  An economic reality that has no effect on me, for the time being.

 

Only time will tell, but I have never seen more "For Sale" signs on residential and commercial premises, not to mention closures, in the whole time I have been coming to Phuket, and then living here full time. 

 

I'm sure each sign and closure has a story. 

 

 

I have property and business here in Patong as it happens and apart from the usual annual

low season we are doing alright despite all the naysayers and their profoundly negative

outlooks. When I finally "shuffle off this mortal coil" the wife and her family will have nothing

to worry about, financially anyway. 

[LivinginKata]

3 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

Didn't you sell some off a while ago and move the money to Singapore????  If so, doesn't that show a lack of confidence, on many levels?

 

Haven't you stated on this forum in the past that you wouldn't contemplate doing what you have done, today????  If so, why?

 

Before you "bang away" these are serious questions and I am not trolling or baiting.

 

Oh dear .. you dragged me in as you like to do. But I need to correct your record.

 

We have never sold any property off here in Thailand.  We just chose not to build any more despite buying 2 prime building plots in Kata which we still own and like to look at the trees on virgin land that we are the only owners off along our sea view land in Kata.  Sure we moved monthly profits to Singapore to a fund that now generates more monthly income than would have been the case in failing Phuket. You NKM well know I agree that Patong is failing. We were lucky that we entered this market well ahead of the down curve. And I do not regret investing in Phuket. 

[NamKangMan]

2 minutes ago, phuketjock said:

I have property and business here in Patong as it happens and apart from the usual annual

low season we are doing alright despite all the naysayers and their profoundly negative

outlooks. When I finally "shuffle off this mortal coil" the wife and her family will have nothing

to worry about, financially anyway. 

 

"I have property and business here in Patong" - really?  I couldn't tell.   

 

Seriously though, and I have mentioned this in other threads, and I am not trolling or baiting.  Apart from cash at bank, if one was to leave a property and / or business to their spouse, and given their are so many properties for sale that aren't moving, and given the massive and rapid change of the tourist demographic, what would that individual actually be leaving?

 

I hear it a lot from expats, "When I die the missus gets the house."  Given houses are not selling here, even at fire sale prices, what would he be leaving her?  Even long term tenants are hard to find now. 

 

I ask this question because, whilst I can see a direct benefit to the widow if she is from Phuket, with family here, I would suggest the majority of wives are not Phuket natives, so their thoughts may be to sell and move home. 

 

I personally know a guy who has had his property on the market here for over 5 years, with many price reductions, so, given the current property market, when would the widow be able to turn their inheritance into a cash asset, rather than keeping a bricks and mortar liability, in the form of taxes and fees?

 

 

 

 

[NamKangMan]

10 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

 

Oh dear .. you dragged me in as you like to do. But I need to correct your record.

 

We have never sold any property off here in Thailand.  We just chose not to build any more despite buying 2 prime building plots in Kata which we still own and like to look at the trees on virgin land that we are the only owners off along our sea view land in Kata.  Sure we moved monthly profits to Singapore to a fund that now generates more monthly income than would have been the case in failing Phuket. You NKM well know I agree that Patong is failing. We were lucky that we entered this market well ahead of the down curve. And I do not regret investing in Phuket. 

 

LIK, I'm not dragging you into anything. 

 

There's no problem. I just remembered something along the lines of you decreasing business here and moving money offshore.  Information you volunteered, not information I dragged out of you. 

 

So, it sounds like you chose not to expand your business, due to a declining market, or harsher economic times. 

 

I have never suggested every expat here has, or will lose, money.  Some did quite well here in the boom years.

 

That said, Phuket is now a vastly different place, as we all know, and I am simply saying there is little to no money to be made in business and property here these days, given the way Phuket is currently being administrated. 

[phuketjock]

2 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

LIK, I'm not dragging you into anything. 

 

There's no problem. I just remembered something along the lines of you decreasing business here and moving money offshore.  Information you volunteered, not information I dragged out of you. 

 

So, it sounds like you chose not to expand your business, due to a declining market, or harsher economic times. 

 

I have never suggested every expat here has, or will lose, money.  Some did quite well here in the boom years.

 

That said, Phuket is now a vastly different place, as we all know, and I am simply saying there is little to no money to be made in business and property here these days, given the way Phuket is currently being administrated. 

You, as usual, are talking nonsense.

You don't own anything here, you don't do any business here, in short everything 

you say is hearsay and secondhand info.

You, sir have no idea what you are talking about so until you do have some hard 

and fast experience about actually owning and doing business in Patong your 

opinion is nothing more than an opinion and supposition no facts involved.

[phuketjock]

22 minutes ago, NamKangMan said:

 

"I have property and business here in Patong" - really?  I couldn't tell.   

 

Seriously though, and I have mentioned this in other threads, and I am not trolling or baiting.  Apart from cash at bank, if one was to leave a property and / or business to their spouse, and given their are so many properties for sale that aren't moving, and given the massive and rapid change of the tourist demographic, what would that individual actually be leaving?

 

I hear it a lot from expats, "When I die the missus gets the house."  Given houses are not selling here, even at fire sale prices, what would he be leaving her?  Even long term tenants are hard to find now. 

 

I ask this question because, whilst I can see a direct benefit to the widow if she is from Phuket, with family here, I would suggest the majority of wives are not Phuket natives, so their thoughts may be to sell and move home. 

 

I personally know a guy who has had his property on the market here for over 5 years, with many price reductions, so, given the current property market, when would the widow be able to turn their inheritance into a cash asset, rather than keeping a bricks and mortar liability, in the form of taxes and fees?

 

 

 

 

There you go again supposition, supposition to fit your case, who said anything about my missus selling up after I am gone.

I have just about exhausted the time I am willing to spend on your clown like behaviour. have a nice day.

 

[Flustered]

2 minutes ago, phuketjock said:

You, as usual, are talking nonsense.

You don't own anything here, you don't do any business here, in short everything 

you say is hearsay and secondhand info.

You, sir have no idea what you are talking about so until you do have some hard 

and fast experience about actually owning and doing business in Patong your 

opinion is nothing more than an opinion and supposition no facts involved.

Don't you think you should tone it down a bit?

 

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and to be honest, NKM makes a lot of sense when he posts.

[phuketjock]

4 minutes ago, Flustered said:

Don't you think you should tone it down a bit?

 

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and to be honest, NKM makes a lot of sense when he posts.

I don't believe I was addressing you, are you a digital bodyguard?

I have no problem with anyone giving their opinion but I take umbridge when they 

represent their opinion as facts when they have no experience whatsoever in the

subject they claim to be expressing their " opinion " on.

It is difficult to make sense when you don't know what you are talking about.

[beechbum]

12 minutes ago, Flustered said:

Don't you think you should tone it down a bit?

 

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and to be honest, NKM makes a lot of sense when he posts.

You should clean your nose.

[Flustered]

If you are only posting with NKM on a personal basis, you should use the PM and not a public forum.

 

We are all entitled to an opinion and I think the NKM's posts make far more sense than many others. He seems to have his finger on the pulse.

 

Just noticed, it looks like the kindergarten kids are home now.

Edited May 24, 2017 by Flustered

[phuketjock]

2 minutes ago, Flustered said:

If you are only posting with NKM on a personal basis, you should use the PM and not a public forum.

 

We are all entitled to an opinion and I think the NKM's posts make far more sense than many others. He seems to have his finger on the pulse.

 

Just noticed, it looks like the kindergarten kids are home now.

How's the weather up North?

[Flustered]

2 minutes ago, phuketjock said:

How's the weather up North?

Thanks for asking. Better than Phuket right now which is why we summer in the UK and winter in Thailand. best of both worlds

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2654728

Edited May 24, 2017 by Flustered

[LivinginKata]

28 minutes ago, Flustered said:

Don't you think you should tone it down a bit?

 

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and to be honest, NKM makes a lot of sense when he posts.

How I wish TV had a not like button. This post deserves a huge down thumb.

[Flustered]

16 minutes ago, LivinginKata said:

How I wish TV had a not like button. This post deserves a huge down thumb.

Push the ignore button, don't whinge.