A case of from the frying pan into the fire?

[Lite Beer]

EDITORIAL
A case of from the frying pan into the fire?
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- Upset by US criticism, the junta must not let their hurt ego influence foreign policy decisions by embracing China

There has been talk about how the relationship between Thailand and the United States is about to reach a turning point because Washington has been ignoring the political landscape in Asia as it shifts its focus to the Middle East and elsewhere.

Observers and analysts said this shift has been in the making for at least the past decade, paving the way for China's soft power to influence Thailand and the region.

And in light of the May 22, 2014 coup when Thailand could not find a sympathetic ear from Washington, this shift could come faster than people expected, they said.

Thailand has long been important ally of the US for many reasons. During the Cold War, common strategic concerns and interests brought the two countries closer.

During the post-Cold War era the United States saw Thailand's role as the guardian of democratic principles while countries in mainland Southeast Asia were plagued with internal strife and insurgency.

In the 1990s, there was even talk of using Thailand as a model for the generals in Myanmar to emulate. The transition from a Thai military career to the civilian world had interested many.

The rise of regionalism in Southeast Asia also saw the United States playing an active role, balancing China's assertiveness, especially in the South China Sea where Beijing has overlapping territorial claims with other countries in the region.

The world thought Thailand had already reached a point of no turning back from democratisation. Many thought the 1991 coup would be the last.

And then came one of the greatest scam artists in Thailand's modern political history, Thaksin Shinawatra, and the destruction of whatever checks and balances the country had in place following the 1997 Constitution.

A coup was launched in 2006 to oust Thaksin and uproot his deep-rooted support. The mandate was eventually returned to the people and Thaksin's camp returned to power again. And then there was the May 2014 coup.

Of course, all coup plotters have said they wanted to restore democracy. They would justify their actions by warning of the bloody conflict that lay ahead if the coup were not staged.

And now the National Legislative Assembly wants to summon the US charge d'affaires to explain the recent statement by US Assistant Secretary of State Daniel Russel, who said the conviction of Yingluck Shinawatra could be perceived as politically motivated.

In the aftermath of the May 2014 coup, political changes could see Bangkok moving away from the US sphere of influence towards the Chinese faster than expected as the junta could not find an American shoulder to cry on.

But one has to ask whether these countries are really concerned with Thailand's well-being.

It's one thing to point out the obvious - that the current ruling junta, or the previous junta, for that matter - may not have had a mandate from the people.

But where were those huffs and puffs when the so-called democratically elected government grossly violated Thai people's rights - Thaksin's 'War on drugs', extrajudicial killings in the deep South, or the tap dance all over the check-and-balance agencies enshrined in the 1997 people's Constitution?

Like many of us, Western allies like the US and the European Union misjudged Thailand, thinking that the soldiers had come to terms with the concept of civilian supremacy. They thought the 1991 coup would be the last one.

If the 2006 coup was a rude awakening, the 2014 coup broke their hearts. And so they raised objections and voice their disappointment.

Nevertheless, it would not be wise for the current junta to let emotion and ego rage when mapping out Thai foreign policy.

What were the generals expecting to hear from the Americans? "Good job, gentlemen"?

The Thai rulers of the day can throw a fit over Washington's criticism and run into the arms of the Chinese, who will embrace them.

But the junta will have to ask itself if these are the arms you want to be held in. The Chinese charm offensive could quickly lose its panda warmth if and when it's time for payback on debts deemed to be owed.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/opinion/A-case-of-from-the-frying-pan-into-the-fire-30253116.html

-- The Nation 2015-02-01

[Thai at Heart]

As yet, no real explanation why they are so upset.

Its like your mate being pissed off for you telling him his fly is undone.

[ChrisY1]

This is getting to be like a school yard spat......why can't these childish generals, and many Thais, just accept that what has happened here simply isn't accepted by the global community.....with the exception of Cambodia, North Korea and China...?

[Reigntax]

If the General believes he is the person, the shinning light of the Thai military with the answers to solve Thailands internal problems, how low must be his opinion of the level of intellegence of his subjects and fellow cohorts.

[MaxLee]

Easier to make corrupt deals with China....

there you have it....

[noitom]

This piece of tripe Thai writing is a prime illustration of Thai hubris. The Thai self absorbed fantasy, filled with ego, and quick to run over to the other side. Just like they did in WWII, when they allied with Japan to help build the death railway, and declared war on the US and Great Britain.

[Thai at Heart]

And then came one of the greatest scam artists in Thailand's modern political history, Thaksin Shinawatra,

Of course, all coup plotters have said they wanted to restore democracy

Seems to me it might not be just Thaksin who tells the odd porkie pie. These guys currently just seem the tiniest bit reluctant to get moving on the democracy bit

[NanLaew]

As long as the focus remains solely on ridding Thai politics of Thaksin and not on the great enabler of Thaksin's latter-day largesse, the social divide will only widen and deepen. The "tap dance all over the check-and-balance agencies enshrined in the 1997 people's Constitution" was only possible because the NON-ELECTED people entrusted with running these agencies were easily bought. They didn't (probably never will) like Thaksin and what he stood for but the paycheck was simply irresistable.

The junta must repair the mechanisms that were trampled under Thaksin's watch and bolster them. Making this a personal vendetta appears to the west as simply that; a politically motivated witch hunt. Meanwhile the fox is still watching the chickens.

Beyond that, I consider that Thailand has always been at best a rather fickle ally of the US and Europe. The military are merely maintaining the same fence-sitting posture as previous elected and non-elected Thai governments where they cherry-pick the bits of any alliance that serves them best. It's just that the white picket fence has now been defined as the Great Wall.

Edited February 1, 2015 by NanLaew

[canuckamuck]

Such a lame argument. The writer is basically saying that sure the coups are a bad idea, but look at how bad Thaksin was. Why are the other countries not upset with him?

What they don't seem to understand is, a country needs to have a foundation in order to avoid irreconcilable differences every election cycle. Firstly you need to make laws and hold everyone accountable to them (rule of law). Secondly you need transparency so the people can make informed decisions (media freedom). Thailand's current libel laws are skewed to protect criminals. How can the people know how bad the government is behaving if it is illegal to report bad behavior? And thirdly you need to allow the people to choose and stand by their decision until the next cycle or until the leadership is in breach of the law.

And all three of these things need to be vigorously defended, by the people, through law enforcement and the judicial system. The army should be concerned about external threats. These things should be as important to the people as their national identity and all the things they hold sacred..

Because Thailand cannot grasp the importance of these three things, they are forever in a situation of do-overs, with all the privileged hungry piggys at the trough. And the country looking more ridiculous by the decade.

[Thai at Heart]

As long as the focus remains solely on ridding Thai politics of Thaksin and not on the great enabler of Thaksin's latter-day largesse, the social divide will only widen and deepen. The "tap dance all over the check-and-balance agencies enshrined in the 1997 people's Constitution" was only possible because the NON-ELECTED people entrusted with running these agencies were easily bought. They didn't (probably never will) like Thaksin and what he stood for but the paycheck was simply irresistable.

The junta must repair the mechanisms that were trampled under Thaksin's watch and bolster them. Making this a personal vendetta appears to the west as simply that; a politically motivated witch hunt. Meanwhile the fox is still watching the chickens.

Beyond that, I consider that Thailand has always been at best a rather fickle ally of the US and Europe. The military are merely maintaining the same fence-sitting posture as previous elected and non-elected Thai governments where they cherry-pick the bits of any alliance that serves them best. It's just that the white picket fence has now been defined as the Great Wall.

Well they may be fickle, but when u consider what happened to royal families in neighbouring countries over the last 50 years or so, that was a very serious reason to stay democratic and allied with the USA.

[Thai at Heart]

Such a lame argument. The writer is basically saying that sure the coups are a bad idea, but look at how bad Thaksin was. Why are the other countries not upset with him?

What they don't seem to understand is, a country needs to have a foundation in order to avoid irreconcilable differences every election cycle. Firstly you need to make laws and hold everyone accountable to them (rule of law). Secondly you need transparency so the people can make informed decisions (media freedom). Thailand's current libel laws are skewed to protect criminals. How can the people know how bad the government is behaving if it is illegal to report bad behavior? And thirdly you need to allow the people to choose and stand by their decision until the next cycle or until the leadership is in breach of the law.

And all three of these things need to be vigorously defended, by the people, through law enforcement and the judicial system. The army should be concerned about external threats. These things should be as important to the people as their national identity and all the things they hold sacred..

Because Thailand cannot grasp the importance of these three things, they are forever in a situation of do-overs, with all the privileged hungry piggys at the trough. And the country looking more ridiculous by the decade.

And none of the issues you raise are being solved by the junta and so the cycle will continue.

There comes a moment where the country chooses to go through with democracy or allow itself to be dragged back to a coup. One day the people will fight back against the coups and go with democracy.

It is inevitable. The red or blue pill and once it happens Thailand will progress very quickly. Until then, the cycle of false democracy will continue.

[chainarong]

A straight forward view and I think it answered it's own questions , to say no-one gives a toss about Thailand is not correct, Thailand is like a spoilt brat and needs a good kick in the behind, call it Love with stern management, , you have shown to others what not to do, if anything can be gleaned from a decade of turmoil, Thailand's management needs to reach out for help but I doubt that China will be sympathetic in the long term , not when Thailand's sitting Elected Government fully understands the bloody mess Prayuth - O - Cha has placed the country in.

[NanLaew]

As long as the focus remains solely on ridding Thai politics of Thaksin and not on the great enabler of Thaksin's latter-day largesse, the social divide will only widen and deepen. The "tap dance all over the check-and-balance agencies enshrined in the 1997 people's Constitution" was only possible because the NON-ELECTED people entrusted with running these agencies were easily bought. They didn't (probably never will) like Thaksin and what he stood for but the paycheck was simply irresistable.

The junta must repair the mechanisms that were trampled under Thaksin's watch and bolster them. Making this a personal vendetta appears to the west as simply that; a politically motivated witch hunt. Meanwhile the fox is still watching the chickens.

Beyond that, I consider that Thailand has always been at best a rather fickle ally of the US and Europe. The military are merely maintaining the same fence-sitting posture as previous elected and non-elected Thai governments where they cherry-pick the bits of any alliance that serves them best. It's just that the white picket fence has now been defined as the Great Wall.

Well they may be fickle, but when u consider what happened to royal families in neighbouring countries over the last 50 years or so, that was a very serious reason to stay democratic and allied with the USA.

And herein lies another part of Thailands "problem" with democracy.

[Thai at Heart]

As long as the focus remains solely on ridding Thai politics of Thaksin and not on the great enabler of Thaksin's latter-day largesse, the social divide will only widen and deepen. The "tap dance all over the check-and-balance agencies enshrined in the 1997 people's Constitution" was only possible because the NON-ELECTED people entrusted with running these agencies were easily bought. They didn't (probably never will) like Thaksin and what he stood for but the paycheck was simply irresistable.

The junta must repair the mechanisms that were trampled under Thaksin's watch and bolster them. Making this a personal vendetta appears to the west as simply that; a politically motivated witch hunt. Meanwhile the fox is still watching the chickens.

Beyond that, I consider that Thailand has always been at best a rather fickle ally of the US and Europe. The military are merely maintaining the same fence-sitting posture as previous elected and non-elected Thai governments where they cherry-pick the bits of any alliance that serves them best. It's just that the white picket fence has now been defined as the Great Wall.

Well they may be fickle, but when u consider what happened to royal families in neighbouring countries over the last 50 years or so, that was a very serious reason to stay democratic and allied with the USA.

And herein lies another part of Thailands "problem" with democracy.

Indeed, it has been abused in order to maintain a status quo, whereas democracy is normally a messy and unordered business.

[Thai at Heart]

To all those out there applauding the junta, what system would you like Thailand to have at the completion of their reform project and do you think they will complete it.

I would like a more robust version of the 97 system.

Will they achieve it? No hope.

[mikemac]

I would like to see free and fair elections (no vote buying allowed !) with no Democrat or Shinawatra parties involved, and any "system" as long as it is not "bent"...........................

[crusty]

This piece of tripe Thai writing is a prime illustration of Thai hubris. The Thai self absorbed fantasy, filled with ego, and quick to run over to the other side. Just like they did in WWII, when they allied with Japan to help build the death railway, and declared war on the US and Great Britain.

And then asked to be able to join the end of war victory march !

[Thai at Heart]

I would like to see free and fair elections (no vote buying allowed !) with no Democrat or Shinawatra parties involved, and any "system" as long as it is not "bent"...........................

Who's left?

Banharn versus Chavalit?

[Robby nz]

A straight forward view and I think it answered it's own questions , to say no-one gives a toss about Thailand is not correct, Thailand is like a spoilt brat and needs a good kick in the behind, call it Love with stern management, , you have shown to others what not to do, if anything can be gleaned from a decade of turmoil, Thailand's management needs to reach out for help but I doubt that China will be sympathetic in the long term , not when Thailand's sitting Elected Government fully understands the bloody mess Prayuth - O - Cha has placed the country in.

Do you believe the US is the one to administer a 'kick in the butt' ?

Look what their kicks in the butt have done to other countries where they have tried to impose their will and systems.

You seem to forget the mess that he inherited from the previous administration and has had the unenviable job of attempting to sort out.

What was ever done by PT about corruption, equal enforcement of the rule of law or human trafficking, look at the mess farming has been left in with the rice mountain and other pledging schemes.

They are trying to do something but unfortunately are making many mistakes along the way and not making full use of the resources they have.

The fact that the usual A holes who are only there for there own self interest are doing their best to disrupt is not helping.

[Strangebrew]

As with anyone power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. The military knows if democracy takes hold in Thailand there power trip is over. But on the other hand if they jump into the arms of China then it is all over. Stuck between a rock and a hard place huh? But in regards to comment from knucklehead I feel personally he was out of line not knowing how Thai's are for one and Not seeing that a people so use to corruption it is hard to teach them another way. But what do you expect from an Obama crony? There afraid to call terrorist, terrorist or extremists, extremists for fear it may insult Muslims, But them's politics. Maybe the General should view it as this The US would love to see as soon as possible the return of democracy to Thailand where freedom of the press and freedom of speech Help mold the future of the people. And the military defends the country from enemy's from outside. Not set political goals of the country or least that is IMO. Either way General take what that idiot said with a grain of salt, for in the end history will write the tale.

[Thai at Heart]

As with anyone power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. The military knows if democracy takes hold in Thailand there power trip is over. But on the other hand if they jump into the arms of China then it is all over. Stuck between a rock and a hard place huh? But in regards to comment from knucklehead I feel personally he was out of line not knowing how Thai's are for one and Not seeing that a people so use to corruption it is hard to teach them another way. But what do you expect from an Obama crony? There afraid to call terrorist, terrorist or extremists, extremists for fear it may insult Muslims, But them's politics. Maybe the General should view it as this The US would love to see as soon as possible the return of democracy to Thailand where freedom of the press and freedom of speech Help mold the future of the people. And the military defends the country from enemy's from outside. Not set political goals of the country or least that is IMO. Either way General take what that idiot said with a grain of salt, for in the end history will write the tale.

These numpties think they are equal if not superior to mainland Chinese.

Before a fall and all that......

If anything there should be a coup against this coup if these guys really start to cosy up very close to China versus the USA.

[WhizBang]

One thing that seems to be conspicuously absent from the 'reform' agenda, is military reform. Or did I miss something?

As I stated in another thread, the military is just as corrupt as the RTP and the Thaksin/PTP scum, but somewhat less conspicuous about it.

Not that I think any real meaningful reforms will ever actually occur. Far too many vested interests involved.

[Tatsujin]

... the junta must not let their hurt ego influence foreign policy decisions by embracing China ...

Too late on that score, it's already a done deal.

[cgphuket]

Yes, China would be a much better role model. Considering how the Chinese have always had Thailand and Thai people's best interest at heart.

[Jeremy50]

The 2014 coup 'broke their hearts'. Most other countries have lost interest in Thailand, as a mother learns to ignore a child that throws a temper tantrum every five minutes.

[trainman34014]

They love to cuddle up to China because, after all, that's where most of them came from in the first place. But; China has grown up and Thailand hasn't and big Brother up the road is only self interested in whatever it see's of any use or interest in this Dinosaur of a country.

Overall; the majority of Asian countries still fear the White Man and Western domination and that's why the Thai's in particular are so xenophobic and racist in attitude.

[MaxLee]

... the junta must not let their hurt ego influence foreign policy decisions by embracing China ...

Too late on that score, it's already a done deal.

And North Korea is next on the agenda...

[Roadman]

Had to laugh at this one. It's a bit like those early immature teenage dates where the control freak ass hole guy is getting obsessive with his beautiful girl friend talking to another guy.

Here's a thought surely a Thailand with many friends or read trading partners including the USA and China is a far better option than worrying about who is getting the best lick of the ice cream. Seems to work well for Aussie and Kiwiland who have open relationships with both countries. But then we also don't have the US snooping around our countries arranging meetings with our current and future criminals and convicts.

Edited February 1, 2015 by Roadman

[NanLaew]

As long as the focus remains solely on ridding Thai politics of Thaksin and not on the great enabler of Thaksin's latter-day largesse, the social divide will only widen and deepen. The "tap dance all over the check-and-balance agencies enshrined in the 1997 people's Constitution" was only possible because the NON-ELECTED people entrusted with running these agencies were easily bought. They didn't (probably never will) like Thaksin and what he stood for but the paycheck was simply irresistable.

The junta must repair the mechanisms that were trampled under Thaksin's watch and bolster them. Making this a personal vendetta appears to the west as simply that; a politically motivated witch hunt. Meanwhile the fox is still watching the chickens.

Beyond that, I consider that Thailand has always been at best a rather fickle ally of the US and Europe. The military are merely maintaining the same fence-sitting posture as previous elected and non-elected Thai governments where they cherry-pick the bits of any alliance that serves them best. It's just that the white picket fence has now been defined as the Great Wall.

Well they may be fickle, but when u consider what happened to royal families in neighbouring countries over the last 50 years or so, that was a very serious reason to stay democratic and allied with the USA.

And herein lies another part of Thailands "problem" with democracy.

Indeed, it has been abused in order to maintain a status quo, whereas democracy is normally a messy and unordered business.

Status quo? You mean fait accompli surely.

[yardrunner]

I would like to see free and fair elections (no vote buying allowed !) with no Democrat or Shinawatra parties involved, and any "system" as long as it is not "bent"...........................

How can it be a free and fair election if you block parties from standing