Growing roses in Chiang Mai

[BonnieandClyde]

We're new at this, and looking for information, advice, and tips - especially about soil and fertilizer.

The rose bushes will be planted so as to climb the fence on either side of our front gate on a cul-de-sac soi.

Any help would be appreciated.

[junglechef]

Can't give you any real technical info but we buy rose plants and just stick em' in the ground and they grow beautifully. Of course we water 2x day as well as keep in a sunny place and keep clear of grass etc. and do fertilize with cow manure occassionaly if we have some around. It's the same as we do with our veg. Things grow here wonderfully so might want to try the Thai way (when in Rome and all that), just do it and see what happens. It works for falangs too

[chingmai331]

To see many, many roses of all kinds go to Bhu Ping Palace. Pay the fee, wear long pants and enjoy the blooms.

Yeah, full sun. Not too much fert, no watering at night. Water at daybreak to keep leaves dry and minimize any fungal leaf diseases.

[BonnieandClyde]

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Can't give you any real technical info but we buy rose plants and just stick em' in the ground and they grow beautifully. Of course we water 2x day as well as keep in a sunny place and keep clear of grass etc. and do fertilize with cow manure occassionaly if we have some around. It's the same as we do with our veg. Things grow here wonderfully so might want to try the Thai way (when in Rome and all that), just do it and see what happens. It works for falangs too

To see many, many roses of all kinds go to Bhu Ping Palace. Pay the fee, wear long pants and enjoy the blooms.

Yeah, full sun. Not too much fert, no watering at night. Water at daybreak to keep leaves dry and minimize any fungal leaf diseases.

Thanks to you both for the helpful replies.

The pamphlet, Flower Gardening in Chiang Mai, by R.W.Wood, has been recommended and we will try to get it.

[pgrahmm]

We buy them at the BIG nursery/market behind Tesco & at the local markets and Saturday market....get the dirt at local nursery/vendors in Hang Dong and they grow beautifully....like weeds....

[BonnieandClyde]

We buy them at the BIG nursery/market behind Tesco & at the local markets and Saturday market....get the dirt at local nursery/vendors in Hang Dong and they grow beautifully....like weeds....

Agreed.

Kamthieng is great, and as you say, BIG.

[chiang mai]

Water more than sun is important, be sure to dead head the previous flower in order to promote new growth.

[pizzachang]

#1 Choose healthy plants at the garden center - thick stems, well shaped form, no obvious disease or insects, good dark green color leaves.

#2 Plant a bit higher than level ground and make sure that you prepare the hole; if it is clay or fill, replace with the bagged type soil. Make sure you have some sand mixed in...around 10% is good. Roses don't like standing water and overwatering.

#3 When you plant, remove the rice husks in the plastic bags by knocking off and just plant a bare root rose into your prepared hole.

#4 Next time you have fresh shrimp shells - dig them into the soil around the rose. Initial planting - use a mild analysis fertilizer mixed into your soil mix.

#5 Check that the soil doesn't get to compacted around the base of the rose and keep the weeds away

As others have noted, water in the mornings and remove old flowers. Roses also benefit from cutting back, after the plant is well-established. Like a grape vine, you can cut back more than you think. Any time you see yellowed leaves, dead branches, insect damage - cut it back. Watch for white mealy bugs, snails and aphids.

[Dannyboy666]

Water more than sun is important, be sure to dead head the previous flower in order to promote new growth.

. Hi, CM , what exactly do you mean by deadheading, is it removal, where do u make the cut, thx

[BonnieandClyde]

#1 Choose healthy plants at the garden center - thick stems, well shaped form, no obvious disease or insects, good dark green color leaves.

#2 Plant a bit higher than level ground and make sure that you prepare the hole; if it is clay or fill, replace with the bagged type soil. Make sure you have some sand mixed in...around 10% is good. Roses don't like standing water and overwatering.

#3 When you plant, remove the rice husks in the plastic bags by knocking off and just plant a bare root rose into your prepared hole.

#4 Next time you have fresh shrimp shells - dig them into the soil around the rose. Initial planting - use a mild analysis fertilizer mixed into your soil mix.

#5 Check that the soil doesn't get to compacted around the base of the rose and keep the weeds away

As others have noted, water in the mornings and remove old flowers. Roses also benefit from cutting back, after the plant is well-established. Like a grape vine, you can cut back more than you think. Any time you see yellowed leaves, dead branches, insect damage - cut it back. Watch for white mealy bugs, snails and aphids.

That sounds like a pretty good summary of how to successfully grow roses, and it is much appreciated.

The TVCM Forum and its informed members can be quite helpful.

[SOUTHERNSTAR]

You should also prune the plant as the blooms only form on new stems. As roses grow much faster than in colder climates you should prune atleast once but if they are cared for atleast twice a year.

[bitterbatter]

Can anyone explain why the roses that the old ladies sell on the street don't smell? Is this because of the type of hybrid theey are growing or is it just inadequate fertilizers? I have asked this of many people but nobody could tell me for sure.

[BonnieandClyde]

Can anyone explain why the roses that the old ladies sell on the street don't smell? Is this because of the type of hybrid theey are growing or is it just inadequate fertilizers? I have asked this of many people but nobody could tell me for sure.

The rose bushes on sale at Kamthieng have fragrant flowers mostly, but some are not.

It would be interesting to know why that is.

[xen]

#1 Choose healthy plants at the garden center - thick stems, well shaped form, no obvious disease or insects, good dark green color leaves.

#2 Plant a bit higher than level ground and make sure that you prepare the hole; if it is clay or fill, replace with the bagged type soil. Make sure you have some sand mixed in...around 10% is good. Roses don't like standing water and overwatering.

#3 When you plant, remove the rice husks in the plastic bags by knocking off and just plant a bare root rose into your prepared hole.

#4 Next time you have fresh shrimp shells - dig them into the soil around the rose. Initial planting - use a mild analysis fertilizer mixed into your soil mix.

#5 Check that the soil doesn't get to compacted around the base of the rose and keep the weeds away

As others have noted, water in the mornings and remove old flowers. Roses also benefit from cutting back, after the plant is well-established. Like a grape vine, you can cut back more than you think. Any time you see yellowed leaves, dead branches, insect damage - cut it back. Watch for white mealy bugs, snails and aphids.

I would agree if what you have said but could i add that it is also good to look at what roses are looking good in the neighbourhood and see if you can find the variety. I always preferred the old favourites like time tested Peace , Queen Elizabeth and Mr Lincoln but i doubt these would be true to form even if they were found them in Thailand.

A lot of roses do not have scent as they are breed for size or colour of bloom. It seems like a lot of things in life is you can't have it all.

As for watering i always make sure i water the soil and try to keep the water off the plant itself unless i am squirting of aphids of the stems. Usually i never use a nozzle on a hose . Evenings or morning is the best time to irrigate. I have found a long deep water for roses every second or third day is better than a light water everyday. You can always mulch around the base but not up to the stem if it is drying out too much and to protect the soil against heavy tropical rain.

Do not be scared to prune your roses hard , especially every few years . a hard prune every few years is often called a renovation prune in that you can take it back to the minimum and re-shape the rose into a "V " shape to aid air circulation around the plant. This helps both in combating fungal and black spot disease. Also the flowering will improve.Get rid of the old canes and dead wood and let new stems grow. Lime sulphur sprayed onto the old wood will help with scale but be careful as it will burn foliage and it smells like rotten egg gas. Not too sure where you will find it to buy.

Deadheading is the practise of cutting off the spent blooms. This promotes further flowering as the plant is not supporting a non-productive /dead flower. The idea is to cut the rose as you would cut a long stem rose for the house with a stem at least 100 mm long. Prune back to an outward growing bud.

[BonnieandClyde]

#1 Choose healthy plants at the garden center - thick stems, well shaped form, no obvious disease or insects, good dark green color leaves.

#2 Plant a bit higher than level ground and make sure that you prepare the hole; if it is clay or fill, replace with the bagged type soil. Make sure you have some sand mixed in...around 10% is good. Roses don't like standing water and overwatering.

#3 When you plant, remove the rice husks in the plastic bags by knocking off and just plant a bare root rose into your prepared hole.

#4 Next time you have fresh shrimp shells - dig them into the soil around the rose. Initial planting - use a mild analysis fertilizer mixed into your soil mix.

#5 Check that the soil doesn't get to compacted around the base of the rose and keep the weeds away

As others have noted, water in the mornings and remove old flowers. Roses also benefit from cutting back, after the plant is well-established. Like a grape vine, you can cut back more than you think. Any time you see yellowed leaves, dead branches, insect damage - cut it back. Watch for white mealy bugs, snails and aphids.

I would agree if what you have said but could i add that it is also good to look at what roses are looking good in the neighbourhood and see if you can find the variety. I always preferred the old favourites like time tested Peace , Queen Elizabeth and Mr Lincoln but i doubt these would be true to form even if they were found them in Thailand.

A lot of roses do not have scent as they are breed for size or colour of bloom. It seems like a lot of things in life is you can't have it all.

As for watering i always make sure i water the soil and try to keep the water off the plant itself unless i am squirting of aphids of the stems. Usually i never use a nozzle on a hose . Evenings or morning is the best time to irrigate. I have found a long deep water for roses every second or third day is better than a light water everyday. You can always mulch around the base but not up to the stem if it is drying out too much and to protect the soil against heavy tropical rain.

Do not be scared to prune your roses hard , especially every few years . a hard prune every few years is often called a renovation prune in that you can take it back to the minimum and re-shape the rose into a "V " shape to aid air circulation around the plant. This helps both in combating fungal and black spot disease. Also the flowering will improve.Get rid of the old canes and dead wood and let new stems grow. Lime sulphur sprayed onto the old wood will help with scale but be careful as it will burn foliage and it smells like rotten egg gas. Not too sure where you will find it to buy.

Deadheading is the practise of cutting off the spent blooms. This promotes further flowering as the plant is not supporting a non-productive /dead flower. The idea is to cut the rose as you would cut a long stem rose for the house with a stem at least 100 mm long. Prune back to an outward growing bud.

Much helpful advice here, thank you.

As mentioned before, we want the plants to climb and spread out on a fence. It is about 2 metres high; concrete posts strung with barbed wire and faced with split bamboo pickets.

The posts and barbed wire are an eyesore, so one of the reasons for planting roses is to cover them, also as something of a deterrent to kamoys. Although we've never had a problem in the eight years we've lived in our Nong Hoi neighbourhood.

[sfokevin]

Given what you are trying to achieve (a wall of flowers to cover the barbwire fence) you might consider bougainvillea... Many place sell them at Kamtiem for 80 baht... They grow fast like a weed with little or no care and are not so susceptible to bugs and fungus...

[BonnieandClyde]

Given what you are trying to achieve (a wall of flowers to cover the barbwire fence) you might consider bougainvillea... Many place sell them at Kamtiem for 80 baht... They grow fast like a weed with little or no care and are not so susceptible to bugs and fungus...

Beautiful!

You've given us a good idea for the fence in the rear of the house.

[CMKiwi]

If you want roses for a fence then go for the climbing rose variety....yes there is such a thing. And here's a strange but true fact about Bougainvillea, if you dont prune a native plant it wont produce thorns. Once it has been pruned it triggers a reaction within the plant and thorns grow. Saw a program years ago hosted by the botanist David Bellamy. He ran through a big native unpruned bush and not even a scratch. But he said it would unwise to do the same with a bush that had been pruned...and yes the thorns are quite a decent size.

Good luck with whichever path you decide to take.

[BonnieandClyde]

If you want roses for a fence then go for the climbing rose variety....yes there is such a thing. And here's a strange but true fact about Bougainvillea, if you dont prune a native plant it wont produce thorns. Once it has been pruned it triggers a reaction within the plant and thorns grow. Saw a program years ago hosted by the botanist David Bellamy. He ran through a big native unpruned bush and not even a scratch. But he said it would unwise to do the same with a bush that had been pruned...and yes the thorns are quite a decent size.

Good luck with whichever path you decide to take.

Very interesting bit of information about unpruned Bougainvillea having no thorns... never heard that before.

[hthuonghuong]

Hi everyone, I am interested in learning how to grow rose properly. Can you let me know which rose farm is best in Chiangmai (or anywhere in Thailand) please?

Thank you <3 

[Brightly]

For rose-related info or advice from a local Farang, you might want to ask Nancy L.

 

In her previous life she and her husband were commercial rose growers in the US.

 

Just a thought (and hope that’s OK, Nancy!)...

[opalred]

go through maerim past the lights where the road goes to the tourist places on the left  

just past the steel place a dirt road leads to rose farms /all colors 4for 100b cheers 

[NancyL]

On 6/8/2020 at 3:39 PM, Brightly said:

For rose-related info or advice from a local Farang, you might want to ask Nancy L.

 

In her previous life she and her husband were commercial rose growers in the US.

 

Just a thought (and hope that’s OK, Nancy!)...

Yeah, but we specialized in garden roses suitable for cold climates.  I saw some great examples of the type of roses we sold during a visit to Korea.  Not so much here.  I've visited a few public rose gardens here and found many of the rose varieties mis-labeled.  And I wouldn't put much hope in a rose bush that costs 25 baht.  I've seen those at the market with the Flower Parade and the majority are virused. 

 

A few years ago there used to be a nice planting of Knockout roses at the intersection of the road by the Orchid Hotel/Huay Kaew Residence and Huay Kaew Road.  Nice quality roses, not virused and tended by someone who knew what they were doing.  Even those declined over several years and they finally were pulled out.  Roses need a period of dormancy that I don't think they get in this climate.  The location was ideal -- full sun and the care good.  Knockout is a tough variety.  If it can't succeed, I have doubts about other varieties.

 

I'd suggest sticking with bougainvillea if you want something shrubby or climbing that blooms throughout the year.  Back when we were growing roses in Michigan, I said I wanted to retire someplace where you can grown bouganvilliea.  

[hthuonghuong]

4 hours ago, NancyL said:

Yeah, but we specialized in garden roses suitable for cold climates.  I saw some great examples of the type of roses we sold during a visit to Korea.  Not so much here.  I've visited a few public rose gardens here and found many of the rose varieties mis-labeled.  And I wouldn't put much hope in a rose bush that costs 25 baht.  I've seen those at the market with the Flower Parade and the majority are virused. 

 

A few years ago there used to be a nice planting of Knockout roses at the intersection of the road by the Orchid Hotel/Huay Kaew Residence and Huay Kaew Road.  Nice quality roses, not virused and tended by someone who knew what they were doing.  Even those declined over several years and they finally were pulled out.  Roses need a period of dormancy that I don't think they get in this climate.  The location was ideal -- full sun and the care good.  Knockout is a tough variety.  If it can't succeed, I have doubts about other varieties.

 

I'd suggest sticking with bougainvillea if you want something shrubby or climbing that blooms throughout the year.  Back when we were growing roses in Michigan, I said I wanted to retire someplace where you can grown bouganvilliea.  

Thank you so much for great information. I am actually staying in Vietnam now (we have winter, usually from 7 to 20degrees C (and thats amazing for roses). Summer is very hot, same as Thailand (and I have heard that peope call the summer heat the "dormancy" as they will sleep above 40 degrees C (and that time usually last from end of May to end of July - 2 months).

I am growing about 6 roses, with 4 are David Austin (Poet, Kate, Abraham, And Jubilee celebration) and they are doing great in winter, struggling through that 2 months of summer (still bloom but small and not proper forms).

I cant find anywhere to grow proper David Austin roses in Vietnam. few source are from Thailand, Australia. So I am thinking of going to Thailand to study about rose - I am not sure if its a good and correct idea.

I think about Thailand because its very close and easy to travel from Vietnam.

It would be great if you know and can share any other nearby place for rose study if Thailand is not best option. Thank you again so much and have a nice evening

Huong.

[hthuonghuong]

On 6/8/2020 at 3:39 PM, Brightly said:

For rose-related info or advice from a local Farang, you might want to ask Nancy L.

 

In her previous life she and her husband were commercial rose growers in the US.

 

Just a thought (and hope that’s OK, Nancy!)...

Thank you so much! I have read her comment here 

[hthuonghuong]

5 hours ago, opalred said:

go through maerim past the lights where the road goes to the tourist places on the left  

just past the steel place a dirt road leads to rose farms /all colors 4for 100b cheers 

Thank you! I have noted it down. Is there anyway I can have the link to a website or something? (I am sorry for asking as I am still in Vietnam, not Thailand now). Thank you

[NancyL]

They grow roses as cut flowers here, at the higher elevations and in greenhouses with cooling systems.  For garden roses, I think finding them in Australia is going to be a better proposition.  And with their connection to England, I think you're going to find some good sources for David Austin roses.  

 

Before you plan a trip to Australia to buy rose bushes, you should check out the regulations on bringing plants into Vietnam.  Nurseries in Australia should be able to research the regulations for you.  We did when we had customers who wanted to ship or bring our plants out-of-state or out-of-the-country.  It could be done, but with the proper inspection and paperwork.

 

Don't think you can "hide" a few plants in your carry-on luggage.  They have dogs at airports that find that sort of thing. 

[mrtc77]

On 6/9/2020 at 10:27 PM, hthuonghuong said:

Thank you! I have noted it down. Is there anyway I can have the link to a website or something? (I am sorry for asking as I am still in Vietnam, not Thailand now). Thank you 

I thought that Dalat was a big rose producing area..

? Maybe not anymore? 

[hthuonghuong]

On 6/11/2020 at 10:59 PM, mrtc77 said:

I thought that Dalat was a big rose producing area..

? Maybe not anymore? 

Yes it is. They are planing DA roses as well but I meant a licensed farm from David Austin.

[hthuonghuong]

On 6/11/2020 at 5:46 PM, NancyL said:

They grow roses as cut flowers here, at the higher elevations and in greenhouses with cooling systems.  For garden roses, I think finding them in Australia is going to be a better proposition.  And with their connection to England, I think you're going to find some good sources for David Austin roses.  

 

Before you plan a trip to Australia to buy rose bushes, you should check out the regulations on bringing plants into Vietnam.  Nurseries in Australia should be able to research the regulations for you.  We did when we had customers who wanted to ship or bring our plants out-of-state or out-of-the-country.  It could be done, but with the proper inspection and paperwork.

 

Don't think you can "hide" a few plants in your carry-on luggage.  They have dogs at airports that find that sort of thing. 

Thank you for all information . I would give it a try. I just got the contact from a licensed garden of DA roses in Thailand (Rakmit Roses Garden, Pakchong, Sub-Muang , Chantuek,Nakornrajsrima 30130 , Thailand. Tel +66818157921). So I will check it out once the border is opened, then Australia ????