Trail Braking ..do you do it? Do you understand it?

[andreandre]

It was pointed out that this topic was not for 'noobies" thread ; about riding manual bikes..agree with that and i think it is another important part of riding skills and roadcraft so here is my interpretation of it as asked by dave-boo and seedy on that thread...E braking ran its course so lets go here;

@ dave...trail braking can help reduce your time through a particular corner [if done right] so yes it can make you faster...... @seedy...not so much about the rear end,. not directly anyway.

I will try to explain as best i can..this is another skill that i have done for years and years and not known the ''tech expression "for it....[trail braking]

As you approach a corner and braking as hard as you need, instead of taking off front brake you start slightly only reducing pressure and as you lean more into it you slowly reduce more and more..until apex and as you release the brake fully you start to feed in power...smooth ,one motion and no time between....By doing this, because the bike is squatting down to front after initial braking before corner and you keep some pressure on the front end won't come up and you have these benefits ;...you have compressed the front tyre so keep the larger contact patch, you have also slightly reduced both rake and trail which gives reduced turning radius and so quicker steering and faster through the corner.

Not a skill for a 'noobie'' to learn IMO but one that a competent rider can gradually develope as his riding/ braking skills increase.[ its hard for a 'noobie'' to even dream of front braking in a corner]..once you have this skill, it becomes just another one that is executed automatically on track and on road...its critical all braking applications should be light and smooth but firm when needed.

[ktm jeff]

Thats explained well. Not a thing to try / practice on the way back from the test center. You can also drag the rear brake to help out , in a similar way , of reducing more speed without altering the front fork angle / trail. This cant be done on Hondas with their weird "combined" braking , as if you drag the rear brake md corner - the front brake will come on !.

[macknife]

But can you do it on a cold and wet night in Stoke?

[speedthrills]

just finiching night shift freesing cold stillagain brrrrr waited more for me new R3 till maybe april delivered late now ?? not care as for the cold too much for riding ice i thanks for you informing of trial breaking i thought was about the riding off of roads like on motorcross bike but i learn from you now an i can soon be practised this on me R3

[Gweiloman]

just finiching night shift freesing cold stillagain brrrrr waited more for me new R3 till maybe april delivered late now ?? not care as for the cold too much for riding ice i thanks for you informing of trial breaking i thought was about the riding off of roads like on motorcross bike but i learn from you now an i can soon be practised this on me R3

Are you drunk?

[ll2]

But can you do it on a cold and wet night in Stoke?

then you do other things to protect your a..s..s. every different situation needs a different solution.

if wet and cold, then brake slowly way before the corner, go through it slowly without leaning or leaning much.

[moose7117]

You can also keep your foot on the rear brake"lightly" as you exit a corner this will help stop the rear tyre from spinning under power.

Rob

[Gweiloman]

You can also keep your foot on the rear brake"lightly" as you exit a corner this will help stop the rear tyre from spinning under power.

Rob

I would have thought that most road bikes up to 650 cc is unlikely to spin the rear wheel when exiting a corner. Even if so, won't it be preferable to "drift" out rather than have the rear brake on?

[Shurup]

Mmm... Drift...

[andreandre]

You can also keep your foot on the rear brake"lightly" as you exit a corner this will help stop the rear tyre from spinning under power.

Rob

Nothing to do with trail braking as such but Yes, for sure you can.use rear brake to control wheelspin when you aggressively twist that throttle.......'lightly'' is definitely the key word though...

[andreandre]

just finiching night shift freesing cold stillagain brrrrr waited more for me new R3 till maybe april delivered late now ?? not care as for the cold too much for riding ice i thanks for you informing of trial breaking i thought was about the riding off of roads like on motorcross bike but i learn from you now an i can soon be practised this on me R3

Are you drunk?

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

[Gweiloman]

just finiching night shift freesing cold stillagain brrrrr waited more for me new R3 till maybe april delivered late now ?? not care as for the cold too much for riding ice i thanks for you informing of trial breaking i thought was about the riding off of roads like on motorcross bike but i learn from you now an i can soon be practised this on me R3

Are you drunk?

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

I had forgotten about that. My apologies speedthrills. I wasn't picking on your language skills. I will try to decipher again what you had written:

"Just finishing work, it's still freezing cold again. Have to wait till April before my new R3 will be delivered, if not later. Don't care too much as it's too cold to ride and besides, roads are still icy. Thanks for posting about trail braking. I initially thought it was about riding off roads like on a motorcross bike (trials, breaking trails?) but I see now that this is about road riding. I will soon be able to practice this on my R3."

I guess this is the gist of it.

Not sure of your skill level speedthrills but this is an advanced braking technique and should ideally be restricted to the track. There's no need for it during normal day to day road riding. Trail braking (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

[garryjohns]

just finiching night shift freesing cold stillagain brrrrr waited more for me new R3 till maybe april delivered late now ?? not care as for the cold too much for riding ice i thanks for you informing of trial breaking i thought was about the riding off of roads like on motorcross bike but i learn from you now an i can soon be practised this on me R3

Are you drunk?

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

I had forgotten about that. My apologies speedthrills. I wasn't picking on your language skills. I will try to decipher again what you had written:

"Just finishing work, it's still freezing cold again. Have to wait till April before my new R3 will be delivered, if not later. Don't care too much as it's too cold to ride and besides, roads are still icy. Thanks for posting about trail braking. I initially thought it was about riding off roads like on a motorcross bike (trials, breaking trails?) but I see now that this is about road riding. I will soon be able to practice this on my R3."

I guess this is the gist of it.

Not sure of your skill level speedthrills but this is an advanced braking technique and should ideally be restricted to the track. There's no need for it during normal day to day road riding. Trail braking (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

Interesting and informative thread for advanced riders.

Your gist of the post is about right, but really i think we all could see that anyway.

I agree that this is not for newbies but disagree with your assertion that trail braking is reserved for the track

OP does already stress not a skill for a 'noobie'' to learn

Im wondering why there is no response from any serious riders.

There seems to be more emphasis on less involved topics.

I realise from reading this forum only a smaller number would consider themselves advanced, but any input is to advantage of others.

Gweiloman , i'm surprised you have not gone against this trail braking issue

My impression is that Keith Code does not endorse this technique as you appear to be the master of his techniques, in theory anyway.

He is a great, one of the best teachers i have heard of but he can only advise, Its up to the student to do the work to gain from his expertise.

Edited February 21, 2015 by garryjohns

[ll2]

trail braking is good and necessary. a simple google search about it can bring you many valuable info and videos about it.

but it is not rocket science so if you ride for sometime, you can get it and best way to learn and practice it is a track.

and you can do trail braking everywhere.

Edited February 21, 2015 by ll2

[andreandre]

trail braking is good and necessary. a simple google search about it can bring you many valuable info and videos about it.

but it is not rocket science so if you ride for sometime, you can get it and best way to learn and practice it is a track.

and you can do trail braking everywhere.

Agree that it is not rocket science, but don't underestimate that it is way up in advanced riding techniques.. it is reasonably easy to learn for competent riders though as you say, but then again,not all competent riders use this technique ..yet another personal choice....Yes a track is good for practice, but so is real world conditions out on the roads....

i really can't remember when i myself and some mates started this use but was somewhere in the late '70's on my Laverda Jota..[76 model so that time is fitting ]that i realised that i was braking into corners just by nature of one of my favourite mountain roads..many blind corners and/or decreasing radius ones..so going in deep on front brake was just normal....wasn't called trail braking then...just "braking into corners.".. blind corners you can still be braking far into the corner to enable you to see more of it...looking for the apex...decreasing radius corners also trailbraking can be a life saver if you have come in way too hot initially..being competent trailbraking can save your arse big time.

[andreandre]

just finiching night shift freesing cold stillagain brrrrr waited more for me new R3 till maybe april delivered late now ?? not care as for the cold too much for riding ice i thanks for you informing of trial breaking i thought was about the riding off of roads like on motorcross bike but i learn from you now an i can soon be practised this on me R3

Are you drunk?

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

I had forgotten about that. My apologies speedthrills. I wasn't picking on your language skills. I will try to decipher again what you had written:

"Just finishing work, it's still freezing cold again. Have to wait till April before my new R3 will be delivered, if not later. Don't care too much as it's too cold to ride and besides, roads are still icy. Thanks for posting about trail braking. I initially thought it was about riding off roads like on a motorcross bike (trials, breaking trails?) but I see now that this is about road riding. I will soon be able to practice this on my R3."

I guess this is the gist of it.

Not sure of your skill level speedthrills but this is an advanced braking technique and should ideally be restricted to the track. There's no need for it during normal day to day road riding. Trail braking (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

There is not one reason at all why this should be restricted to the track...see LL2 post also my reply....A highside from bad trail braking?? very very unlikely ...lowside? yes near everytime if you get it wrong.

[Gweiloman]

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

I had forgotten about that. My apologies speedthrills. I wasn't picking on your language skills. I will try to decipher again what you had written:

"Just finishing work, it's still freezing cold again. Have to wait till April before my new R3 will be delivered, if not later. Don't care too much as it's too cold to ride and besides, roads are still icy. Thanks for posting about trail braking. I initially thought it was about riding off roads like on a motorcross bike (trials, breaking trails?) but I see now that this is about road riding. I will soon be able to practice this on my R3."

I guess this is the gist of it.

Not sure of your skill level speedthrills but this is an advanced braking technique and should ideally be restricted to the track. There's no need for it during normal day to day road riding. Trail braking (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

Interesting and informative thread for advanced riders.

Your gist of the post is about right, but really i think we all could see that anyway.

I agree that this is not for newbies but disagree with your assertion that trail braking is reserved for the track

OP does already stress not a skill for a 'noobie'' to learn

Im wondering why there is no response from any serious riders.

There seems to be more emphasis on less involved topics.

I realise from reading this forum only a smaller number would consider themselves advanced, but any input is to advantage of others.

Gweiloman , i'm surprised you have not gone against this trail braking issue

My impression is that Keith Code does not endorse this technique as you appear to be the master of his techniques, in theory anyway.

He is a great, one of the best teachers i have heard of but he can only advise, Its up to the student to do the work to gain from his expertise.

I do not know if Keith Code endorses this technique or not - if you want to know, send him an email. I am also definitely not a master of his techniques for if I am, I would not be wasting my time on this forum.

One thing I know for sure is that over the last 20-30 years, riding styles have changed substantially.

[Gweiloman]

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

I had forgotten about that. My apologies speedthrills. I wasn't picking on your language skills. I will try to decipher again what you had written:

"Just finishing work, it's still freezing cold again. Have to wait till April before my new R3 will be delivered, if not later. Don't care too much as it's too cold to ride and besides, roads are still icy. Thanks for posting about trail braking. I initially thought it was about riding off roads like on a motorcross bike (trials, breaking trails?) but I see now that this is about road riding. I will soon be able to practice this on my R3."

I guess this is the gist of it.

Not sure of your skill level speedthrills but this is an advanced braking technique and should ideally be restricted to the track. There's no need for it during normal day to day road riding. Trail braking (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

There is not one reason at all why this should be restricted to the track...see LL2 post also my reply....A highside from bad trail braking?? very very unlikely ...lowside? yes near everytime if you get it wrong.

Trail braking is used to shave tenth's of seconds of a lap time. It increases the risk of losing traction. This risk increases even more on the roads due to surface and traffic condition.

When I'm riding on the road, my primary objective is to arrive to my destination safely. Secondary objective is to have fun. Speed / timing is almost always never a consideration. Therefore, I prefer to do my braking in a straight line and release my brakes before my turn in to corners unless situations (such as decreasing radius corners) dictate otherwise.

Ultimately, it depends on the individual rider. There is nothing to stop anyone from trail braking on the roads. Same as there is no reason to stop anyone from doing wheelies or stoppies. It's all a matter of one's perception of what is safe riding.

speedthrills was not familiar with the concept of trail braking. I gathered from this that he's a relative beginner. That's why I suggested to him to keep it to the track and not bring it out onto the roads for the moment. Like you said, everytime it goes wrong, a lowside is very likely.

[moose7117]

hang on i am lost here ! are you supposed to brake before the corner and then turn in with no brakes, either coasting or under power .

or are you supposed to keep the brakes on? front only ? rear only? or both ? and after turning in you slowly release the brake and then wind on power ?

preeas exprain !

i have watched G.P. coverage and seems the lord ROSSI keep breaking well into the corner as it seems immediately as he comes of the break he has the power wound on .

help !

[Gweiloman]

hang on i am lost here ! are you supposed to brake before the corner and then turn in with no brakes, either coasting or under power .

or are you supposed to keep the brakes on? front only ? rear only? or both ? and after turning in you slowly release the brake and then wind on power ?

preeas exprain !

i have watched G.P. coverage and seems the lord ROSSI keep breaking well into the corner as it seems immediately as he comes of the break he has the power wound on .

help !

Depends a lot on what it is that you are trying to achieve. One thing you should never do on a track is to coast. The bike is least stable under such a circumstance.

In simple terms, trail braking means that you continue to have light pressure on the brakes (usually front) even after the turning point. The reason is because this allows you to carry more speed into the corner. Once your turn is completed, meaning bike is pointed in the direction that you want to go, you then release the brakes and roll on the throttle to exit the corner. This is almost always before the apex of the corner.

However, this is an advanced technique and the main reason is to go faster round the track.

Relative newbies are taught to first of all brake in a straight line and to finish your braking before you turn in. As you turn in, you should feather your throttle (throttle control). The reason is this transfers the weight of the bike onto the rear wheel. As the rear wheel is larger than the front, this increases the contact patch with the ground giving more grip. As with trail braking, once your turn is completed, you start to roll on the throttle to exit the corner.

You can see how trail braking can therefore shave tenth's of seconds of your lap time.

[seedy]

In normal riding I try and brake while the bike is upright and going in a straight line. Lean the bike into the corner accelerate the smallest amount if the corner speed was OK or brake if it is a decreasing radius corner.

If the corner looks maybe a little dicey, I will apply just a little rear brake - just to stabilize the bike.

Fast Freddie Spencer pioneered the technique of braking well into the corner, tossing the bike around, and immediately getting on the throttle - called 'Squaring the Corner' to obtain quicker acceleration out of the corner.

Maybe that is what you see Rossi doing.

Not recommended if you are not Freddie Spencer, Rossi, or a rider of that caliber !

[andreandre]

hang on i am lost here ! are you supposed to brake before the corner and then turn in with no brakes, either coasting or under power .

or are you supposed to keep the brakes on? front only ? rear only? or both ? and after turning in you slowly release the brake and then wind on power ?

preeas exprain !

i have watched G.P. coverage and seems the lord ROSSI keep breaking well into the corner as it seems immediately as he comes of the break he has the power wound on .

help !

As i said in OP..here again to save you looking..

As you approach a corner and braking as hard as you need, instead of taking off front brake you start slightly only reducing pressure and as you lean more into it you slowly reduce more and more..until apex and as you release the brake fully you start to feed in power...smooth ,one motion and no time between....By doing this, because the bike is squatting down to front after initial braking before corner and you keep some pressure on the front end won't come up and you have these benefits ;...you have compressed the front tyre so keep the larger contact patch, you have also slightly reduced both rake and trail which gives reduced turning radius and so quicker steering and faster through the corner.

Not a skill for a 'noobie'' to learn IMO but one that a competent rider can gradually develope as his riding/ braking skills increase.[ its hard for a 'noobie'' to even dream of front braking in a corner]..once you have this skill, it becomes just another one that is executed automatically on track and on road...its critical all braking applications should be light and smooth but firm when needed.

[andreandre]

hang on i am lost here ! are you supposed to brake before the corner and then turn in with no brakes, either coasting or under power .

or are you supposed to keep the brakes on? front only ? rear only? or both ? and after turning in you slowly release the brake and then wind on power ?

preeas exprain !

i have watched G.P. coverage and seems the lord ROSSI keep breaking well into the corner as it seems immediately as he comes of the break he has the power wound on .

help !

Depends a lot on what it is that you are trying to achieve. One thing you should never do on a track is to coast. The bike is least stable under such a circumstance.

In simple terms, trail braking means that you continue to have light pressure on the brakes (usually front) even after the turning point. The reason is because this allows you to carry more speed into the corner. Once your turn is completed, meaning bike is pointed in the direction that you want to go, you then release the brakes and roll on the throttle to exit the corner. This is almost always before the apex of the corner.

However, this is an advanced technique and the main reason is to go faster round the track.

Relative newbies are taught to first of all brake in a straight line and to finish your braking before you turn in. As you turn in, you should feather your throttle (throttle control). The reason is this transfers the weight of the bike onto the rear wheel. As the rear wheel is larger than the front, this increases the contact patch with the ground giving more grip. As with trail braking, once your turn is completed, you start to roll on the throttle to exit the corner.

You can see how trail braking can therefore shave tenth's of seconds of your lap time.

To use your words as to speedthrills..Are you drunk?

On another post you said that bad trail braking will cause a highside...i responded and said you will more likely lowside and you agreed. Which one is it in your experience?

A number of things you have said in this post are totally incorrect.

[speedthrills]

just finiching night shift freesing cold stillagain brrrrr waited more for me new R3 till maybe april delivered late now ?? not care as for the cold too much for riding ice i thanks for you informing of trial breaking i thought was about the riding off of roads like on motorcross bike but i learn from you now an i can soon be practised this on me R3

Are you drunk?

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

I had forgotten about that. My apologies speedthrills. I wasn't picking on your language skills. I will try to decipher again what you had written:

"Just finishing work, it's still freezing cold again. Have to wait till April before my new R3 will be delivered, if not later. Don't care too much as it's too cold to ride and besides, roads are still icy. Thanks for posting about trail braking. I initially thought it was about riding off roads like on a motorcross bike (trials, breaking trails?) but I see now that this is about road riding. I will soon be able to practice this on my R3."

I guess this is the gist of it.

Not sure of your skill level speedthrills but this is an advanced braking technique and should ideally be restricted to the track. There's no need for it during normal day to day road riding. Trail braking (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

i am rider of other bike fore 5 year now all together not drunk never yes R3 is too came late now

[garryjohns]

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

I had forgotten about that. My apologies speedthrills. I wasn't picking on your language skills. I will try to decipher again what you had written:

"Just finishing work, it's still freezing cold again. Have to wait till April before my new R3 will be delivered, if not later. Don't care too much as it's too cold to ride and besides, roads are still icy. Thanks for posting about trail braking. I initially thought it was about riding off roads like on a motorcross bike (trials, breaking trails?) but I see now that this is about road riding. I will soon be able to practice this on my R3."

I guess this is the gist of it.

Not sure of your skill level speedthrills but this is an advanced braking technique and should ideally be restricted to the track. There's no need for it during normal day to day road riding. Trail braking (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

Interesting and informative thread for advanced riders.

Your gist of the post is about right, but really i think we all could see that anyway.

I agree that this is not for newbies but disagree with your assertion that trail braking is reserved for the track

OP does already stress not a skill for a 'noobie'' to learn

Im wondering why there is no response from any serious riders.

There seems to be more emphasis on less involved topics.

I realise from reading this forum only a smaller number would consider themselves advanced, but any input is to advantage of others.

Gweiloman , i'm surprised you have not gone against this trail braking issue

My impression is that Keith Code does not endorse this technique as you appear to be the master of his techniques, in theory anyway.

He is a great, one of the best teachers i have heard of but he can only advise, Its up to the student to do the work to gain from his expertise.

I do not know if Keith Code endorses this technique or not - if you want to know, send him an email. I am also definitely not a master of his techniques for if I am, I would not be wasting my time on this forum.

One thing I know for sure is that over the last 20-30 years, riding styles have changed substantially.

mdvsmm.png

You often refer to Code and other video releases for your replies

This is expected of course when one has very little actual riding experience to call on.

One thing I know for sure is that over the last 20-30 years, riding styles have changed substantially.

That is an outstanding observation, Show me anything much else that hasn't also changed substantially in last 20-30 years.

So, what point are you trying to make about the change of riding styles?

Edited February 22, 2015 by seedy

[seedy]

Troll / Flaming post removed.

Gentlemen - Please

Let's keep it civil. A posters experience - or lack thereof - if no grounds for such an attack.

Post in a courteous manner please.

[seedy]

Multiple Trolling / Flaming post removed

[andreandre]

Give the kid a break....you busted his arse before not not using spell checker..it's clear english is not his native tongue...

I had forgotten about that. My apologies speedthrills. I wasn't picking on your language skills. I will try to decipher again what you had written:

"Just finishing work, it's still freezing cold again. Have to wait till April before my new R3 will be delivered, if not later. Don't care too much as it's too cold to ride and besides, roads are still icy. Thanks for posting about trail braking. I initially thought it was about riding off roads like on a motorcross bike (trials, breaking trails?) but I see now that this is about road riding. I will soon be able to practice this on my R3."

I guess this is the gist of it.

Not sure of your skill level speedthrills but this is an advanced braking technique and should ideally be restricted to the track. There's no need for it during normal day to day road riding. Trail braking (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

Interesting and informative thread for advanced riders.

Your gist of the post is about right, but really i think we all could see that anyway.

I agree that this is not for newbies but disagree with your assertion that trail braking is reserved for the track

OP does already stress not a skill for a 'noobie'' to learn

Im wondering why there is no response from any serious riders.

There seems to be more emphasis on less involved topics.

I realise from reading this forum only a smaller number would consider themselves advanced, but any input is to advantage of others.

Gweiloman , i'm surprised you have not gone against this trail braking issue

My impression is that Keith Code does not endorse this technique as you appear to be the master of his techniques, in theory anyway.

He is a great, one of the best teachers i have heard of but he can only advise, Its up to the student to do the work to gain from his expertise.

I do not know if Keith Code endorses this technique or not - if you want to know, send him an email. I am also definitely not a master of his techniques for if I am, I would not be wasting my time on this forum.

One thing I know for sure is that over the last 20-30 years, riding styles have changed substantially.

mdvsmm.png

Actually, he does teach trail braking...is there any relationship between KC and your determination that riding styles have changed substantially?..would you expand on this thought with real info. to show what you mean....

[andreandre]

hang on i am lost here ! are you supposed to brake before the corner and then turn in with no brakes, either coasting or under power .

or are you supposed to keep the brakes on? front only ? rear only? or both ? and after turning in you slowly release the brake and then wind on power ?

preeas exprain !

i have watched G.P. coverage and seems the lord ROSSI keep breaking well into the corner as it seems immediately as he comes of the break he has the power wound on .

help !

Depends a lot on what it is that you are trying to achieve. One thing you should never do on a track is to coast. The bike is least stable under such a circumstance.

In simple terms, trail braking means that you continue to have light pressure on the brakes (usually front) even after the turning point. The reason is because this allows you to carry more speed into the corner. Once your turn is completed, meaning bike is pointed in the direction that you want to go, you then release the brakes and roll on the throttle to exit the corner. This is almost always before the apex of the corner.

However, this is an advanced technique and the main reason is to go faster round the track.

Relative newbies are taught to first of all brake in a straight line and to finish your braking before you turn in. As you turn in, you should feather your throttle (throttle control). The reason is this transfers the weight of the bike onto the rear wheel. As the rear wheel is larger than the front, this increases the contact patch with the ground giving more grip. As with trail braking, once your turn is completed, you start to roll on the throttle to exit the corner.

You can see how trail braking can therefore shave tenth's of seconds of your lap time.

To use your words as to speedthrills..Are you drunk?

On another post you said that bad trail braking will cause a highside...i responded and said you will more likely lowside and you agreed. Which one is it in your experience?

A number of things you have said in this post are totally incorrect.

I'm interested to hear your response..do you not have one?

[Gweiloman]

ng (when done wrongly) sometimes starts a chain reaction that ends up with a high side.

Interesting and informative thread for advanced riders.

Your gist of the post is about right, but really i think we all could see that anyway.

I agree that this is not for newbies but disagree with your assertion that trail braking is reserved for the track

OP does already stress not a skill for a 'noobie'' to learn

Im wondering why there is no response from any serious riders.

There seems to be more emphasis on less involved topics.

I realise from reading this forum only a smaller number would consider themselves advanced, but any input is to advantage of others.

Gweiloman , i'm surprised you have not gone against this trail braking issue

My impression is that Keith Code does not endorse this technique as you appear to be the master of his techniques, in theory anyway.

He is a great, one of the best teachers i have heard of but he can only advise, Its up to the student to do the work to gain from his expertise.

I do not know if Keith Code endorses this technique or not - if you want to know, send him an email. I am also definitely not a master of his techniques for if I am, I would not be wasting my time on this forum.

One thing I know for sure is that over the last 20-30 years, riding styles have changed substantially.

mdvsmm.png

Actually, he does teach trail braking...is there any relationship between KC and your determination that riding styles have changed substantially?..would you expand on this thought with real info. to show what you mean....

It's your "good" buddy (incidentally, the only poster who ever "likes" your posts) who brought KC into the discussion. You should check with him, not me. I have no idea what KC has to say about trail braking.

Edited February 22, 2015 by Gweiloman