Survey: Should the Composition of the EU Change?

[Grouse]

To paraphrase Dennis Healy's first law of holes, when you're in one, stop digging!

[joshstiles]

yup i agree....and yet another stupid poll. i thought this website was thaivisa....about thailand....so now any flaming topic is poll material???

...and why are the choices always dictated to us...only four choices...why not 5 or 10 or 20...once again cheap ass choices created to yield a result so desired...how lame...but so typical.

[bangkapi]

There is a political union and a monetary union.

This poll misses the point.

One thing is for sure.. The ECB needs to be shut down as much as the fed and other central banks as they are leading the world to disaster.

[natway09]

Absolutely ridiculous poll.

95% of Thai Visa readers have not enough information or knowledge on the subject to offer anything worthwhile (including me)

[Surasak]

The EU is too rigid in its application of the rules. One size does not fit all and never will. A more flexible approach needs to be applied and util this happens those countries not in the euro will remain outside. Of the 28 nations within the EU only ten are in the euro zone. 5 of those nations are in deep financial trouble, Why? because as stated one size does not fit all. The one good thing George Brown did for the UK was to keep Britain out of the Euro. Had he not done so the UK finacial situation would now be in a verry sad state akin to Spain or Portugal. Prior to the UK being conned into the Common Maekt by the traitor Heath, the UK traded with the world and its commonwealth partners. The eu put a stop to that because it could not stand the competition. The eu is a joke and the quicker it falls the better.

[JockPieandBeans]

To paraphrase Dennis Healy's first law of holes, when you're in one, stop digging!

Just like the EU does ?

Auditors refuse to give EU accounts a clean bill of health for 19th year in a row as rate of unexplained spending rises 23%... with UK liable for £800m

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2487670/Auditors-refuse-EU-accounts-clean-health-19th-year-row.html

And yet you advocate being a part of this corrupt shower of sh!te !

Speaks volumes.

[maidee]

funny poll

on the other side

USA is in debt of 17 trillion dollars

and thai household dept is 85% of GDP

and we all are living here ...

[hawker9000]

The EU?

'Just another place where career politicians go to hang their hat and collect a nice salary with perks. Responsible, self-reliant nations will go on funding it; the socialist loser nations will go on draining it dry.

Reconstitute it; it'll make a nice website. And let it go at that...

[KarenBravo]

Seems like every one of them has a vested financial interest for staying in the EU.

So it is hardly rocket science that they would wish to remain part of the EU.

As long as the few benefit financially from EU membership, the rest of the UK does not matter.

A bit like Nero fiddling while Rome burned around him.

A "few" making money?

There are millions of jobs created by these companies.

These millions of people contribute tax to the government which funds things for people unconnected to these companies.

These millions spend their money and enrich people unconnected to these companies.

These millions if not employed would have to use government hand-outs.

Business and economics isn't quite as simplistic as your posts imply.

Since globalization, it's a vast web of interconnections.

Get rid of one bit and there can be unexpected ramifications elsewhere in the web.

[JockPieandBeans]

Seems like every one of them has a vested financial interest for staying in the EU.

So it is hardly rocket science that they would wish to remain part of the EU.

As long as the few benefit financially from EU membership, the rest of the UK does not matter.

A bit like Nero fiddling while Rome burned around him.

A "few" making money?

There are millions of jobs created by these companies.

These millions of people contribute tax to the government which funds things for people unconnected to these companies.

These millions spend their money and enrich people unconnected to these companies.

These millions if not employed would have to use government hand-outs.

Business and economics isn't quite as simplistic as your posts imply.

Since globalization, it's a vast web of interconnections.

Get rid of one bit and there can be unexpected ramifications elsewhere in the web.

Yes and they get away with not paying Billions in taxes due to creative accounting.

So please do not try and insult my intelligence by insinuating that they employ all these people for the benefit of the people.

Business and economics may not be as simplistic as my post may have implied. But the topic is not about Business and Economics. It is about the EU and should the EU be changed.

If various Governments had been truthful in the late 60's and early 70's the EU would never have gotten of the ground.

[Scott]

Off-topic post removed.

[Grouse]

The EU is too rigid in its application of the rules. One size does not fit all and never will. A more flexible approach needs to be applied and util this happens those countries not in the euro will remain outside. Of the 28 nations within the EU only ten are in the euro zone. 5 of those nations are in deep financial trouble, Why? because as stated one size does not fit all. The one good thing George Brown did for the UK was to keep Britain out of the Euro. Had he not done so the UK finacial situation would now be in a verry sad state akin to Spain or Portugal. Prior to the UK being conned into the Common Maekt by the traitor Heath, the UK traded with the world and its commonwealth partners. The eu put a stop to that because it could not stand the competition. The eu is a joke and the quicker it falls the better.

We're discussing the EU not the Euro. Please keep up

[Grouse]

To paraphrase Dennis Healy's first law of holes, when you're in one, stop digging!

Just like the EU does ?

Auditors refuse to give EU accounts a clean bill of health for 19th year in a row as rate of unexplained spending rises 23%... with UK liable for £800m

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2487670/Auditors-refuse-EU-accounts-clean-health-19th-year-row.html

And yet you advocate being a part of this corrupt shower of sh!te !

Speaks volumes.

Aha! The Black Knight returns!

I have already said, many aspects need sorting out including audited accounts

Not worth losing all the advantages though!

Would you like another list?

[Grouse]

The EU?

'Just another place where career politicians go to hang their hat and collect a nice salary with perks. Responsible, self-reliant nations will go on funding it; the socialist loser nations will go on draining it dry.

Reconstitute it; it'll make a nice website. And let it go at that...

May I recommend a subscription to The Economist?

If there are some words you don't understand just ask

[Grouse]

Seems like every one of them has a vested financial interest for staying in the EU.

So it is hardly rocket science that they would wish to remain part of the EU.

As long as the few benefit financially from EU membership, the rest of the UK does not matter.

A bit like Nero fiddling while Rome burned around him.

A "few" making money?

There are millions of jobs created by these companies.

These millions of people contribute tax to the government which funds things for people unconnected to these companies.

These millions spend their money and enrich people unconnected to these companies.

These millions if not employed would have to use government hand-outs.

Business and economics isn't quite as simplistic as your posts imply.

Since globalization, it's a vast web of interconnections.

Get rid of one bit and there can be unexpected ramifications elsewhere in the web.

Yes and they get away with not paying Billions in taxes due to creative accounting.

So please do not try and insult my intelligence by insinuating that they employ all these people for the benefit of the people.

Business and economics may not be as simplistic as my post may have implied. But the topic is not about Business and Economics. It is about the EU and should the EU be changed.

If various Governments had been truthful in the late 60's and early 70's the EU would never have gotten of the ground.

As an American (gotten?!!) you are going to lecture us on tax policy?

Yes, this is an issue which requires attention.

I also agree that economics is only one aspect

I shall return with many examples of other benefits derived from EU membership

[JockPieandBeans]

Aha! The Black Knight returns!

I have already said, many aspects need sorting out including audited accounts

Not worth losing all the advantages though!

Would you like another list?

I am quite capable of finding links to pro-EU websites. Feel free to produce away.

As someone who claims to have been in Thailand for 15 years, how about listing the advantages that pertain to you ?

Perhaps you would like to go back to the EU inception and explain why Governments LIED through their teeth.

Christopher Booker 1970

There are some in this country who fear that in going into Europe we shall in some way sacrifice independence and sovereignty. These fears, I need hardly say, are completely unjustified

Edward Heath 1973

Prime Minister Edward Heath, television broadcast on Britain's entry into the Common Market, January 1973

This country quite voluntarily surrendered the once seemingly immortal concept of the sovereignty of parliament and legislative freedom by membership of the European Union ... as a once sovereign power, we have said we want to be bound by Community law.

I am grateful to the Bruges Group for the chance to expand on a talk I gave to their 12th anniversary meeting in February 2001, and which I rather frivolously suggested might be entitled “Having Made Our Bed, Must We Continue To Lie In It?”.

The starting point for my talk was the release under the 30-year rule last January of documents relating to Britain’s application to join the Common Market in 1970. What these papers revealed more starkly than ever before was just how deliberately the Heath Government and the Foreign Office set out to conceal from the British people the Common Market’s true purpose. They were fully aware that it was intended to be merely the first step towards creating a politically united Europe, but they were determined to hide this away from view.

http://www.brugesgroup.com/eu/britain-and-europe-the-culture-of-deceit.htm?xp=paper

I used Rabbie Burns in another thread.

Pertinent to quote him again.

A Parcel O' Rogues written circa 1791.

Seems that nothing has changed in just over 200 years.

[teatree]

The EU is fundamentally undemocratic.

The executive arm is unelected.

I'll repeat that for the hard of thinking.

The executive arm is UNELECTED.

Countries such as the UK are going around the world invading 'rogue' nations to bring them into democracy, ostensibly at least. It would be nice if they started at home and left the EU.

As long as the UK, or any other country, is in the EU it is not democratic.

[mania]

Any country that gives up control of its own/ Has its own currency.... stands no chance in dictating its own future

Edited March 5, 2015 by mania

[CapeCobra]

I wish UK isolationists would rather concentrate on solving the abhorrent discrepancies in their society and get up to level with mainland europe.

According to figures of the WHO, average male HLE in Rwanda currently stands at 55 years, almost three years longer than in the poorest parts of England.

The estimate for boys in the most deprived parts of England is on a par with those for Botswana, Gambia, Guyana and Djibouti and only two years more than that for those born in Burkina Faso, one of the poorest countries in the world.

Duncan Exley, director of the Equality Trust think-tank, said: “The UK is one of the most unequal countries in the developed world."

Found in The Daily Telegraph today

Worse than Rwanda: life prospects in Britain’s poorest areas

[Anon999]

There are a number or issues involved.

1. The whole thing needs a massive rethink and the objectives rethought. Starting from scratch would be the best solution!

2. Allowing countries to join who did not meet the criteria, of which one of the original members, if I remember correctly France did not strictly meet the criteria either is crass.

3. There should be an exit clause that makes states that fail to meet the financial criteria, be ejected.

4. One of the two parliaments should be scrapped, Strasbourg to be precise.

5. Expensive trips to far away exotic places for scores of people who have no good reason to be there should be scrapped.

6. During the whole life of the 'institution', call it what you will, they have never produced a set of audited accounts and never will. They have blocked every attempt by auditors to have them comply. Therefore my view is scrap the whole unethical and totally corrupt 'organisation'. If it was a company you can well imagine exactly what would happen!

As long as there are 27 parliaments on top of all the central bureaucracy running the show it's an invitation to fail.

Bearing in mind that the populations of various countries have become disillusioned with the whole corrupt, inefficient and over controlling unelected bureaucrats is it any wonder the dire straights it is in. Furthermore the turmoil will continue to repeat itself.

Best separate the Euro issue from the EU issue.

Yes there are many issues that need fixing including making it more Democratic, forcing proper audited accounts and ditching Strasbourg.

But overall the benefits hugely outweigh the disadvantages. Pity there isn't a more assertive press - maybe the good news doesn't sell papers. The Economist is certainly pro for. What it's worth!

Did you know that Greek state pension is 111% of national average wage compared to 43% for UK?

I thought it was a moving target, upwards, as the average wage declines due to increasing unemployment and consequently a lack of wage increases.

[samran]

Any country that gives up control of its own/ Has its own currency.... stands no chance in dictating its own future

Only if there is no common fiscal policy for starters.

[hawker9000]

Any country that gives up control of its own/ Has its own currency.... stands no chance in dictating its own future

Only if there is no common fiscal policy for starters.

Sheer insanity - especially in light of current events (Greece, etc.) - any country surrendering control of its own sovereign fiscal policy! Yet, what does an "EU" even mean without a common fiscal policy? Ergo...

Edited March 6, 2015 by hawker9000

[JockPieandBeans]

Any country that gives up control of its own/ Has its own currency.... stands no chance in dictating its own future

Only if there is no common fiscal policy for starters.

Sheer insanity - especially in light of current events (Greece, etc.) - any country surrendering control of its own sovereign fiscal policy! Yet, what does an "EU" even mean without a common fiscal policy? Ergo...

Love him or loathe him.

The UK owes a great deal of thanks to Gordon Brown, the man who shoved 2 fingers up at the EU's common fiscal policy.

[samran]

Err, monetary policy...