Why it's best not to stop at a Beach Rd pedestrian light!

[Keesters]

I never stop at the red lights in beach rd unless I see people crossing the road. Because I know how Thais drive . But I drive slowly so I can reduce the speed if I see someone thinking about crossing. Just use your eyes and pay attention.

Why would the light come on if nobody is crossing? Did they give up and go back where they came. Or did they see a break in the traffic so crossed anyway. I appreciate as a driver you wouldn't know the answer but some may have a clue if its a regular occurrence.

Oh, I know the answer as I've seen exactly what often happens. Passers-by press the button just for fun as they're walking along with no intention of crossing the street. That's one of the reasons drivers don't take the light too seriously: like as not, nobody's gonna be crossing. So balo is quite right: the reasonable thing to do, consistent with best Thai driving habits , is to slow down a bit and prepare to stop (watching your back) if the light is counting down or is red, look to see if it's "real" or not, and, if not, just go right on through. If you're a pedestrian, start moving out and waving during the countdown to let drivers know that somebody really does want to cross. Most drivers will then stop, except for the kamikazes. Of course, newbies don't realize this, so, yes, it's esp dangerous for them. But TIT, such is par for the course in most Third World countries. Try crossing streets in Hanoi or Ho Chi Minh if you want to appreciate Thai driving habits.

Oh dear another bit of education needed. Don't play with the crossing button. It's just amazing how far Asia especially Thailand is behind the west. I was taught don't play with the crossing button over 50 years ago.

[Wasa]

_{Thanks for all the replies, seems as though there is wide ranging opinion on this subject!.}

_{As a follow up on my original post, today I had to go back to Jomtien Immigration. Living in Naklua I go down through the Dolphin roundabout and take the Beach Rd route.}

_{With the replies to this thread still swirling around my head, entering Beach Road I was acutely aware of the traffic light issue and sure enough I copped another red light, further up the northern end. That’s twice in one week. Although today was different, with no traffic out in front of me. I was about 200m out from the lights when I saw a farang guy tap the button. He didn't wait for the lights to change, just went ahead and crossed anyway because he had clear road. The lights did change though, so as someone else said here, they must work on demand. Maybe he also tapped the button earlier before I saw him.}

_{I looked up and saw the board counting down from green at 6, then they turned amber and the board flashed what I can only describe as the quickest 1, 2 seconds I have ever seen in my life. Then they turned red. If you're not looking up at the lights there is very little chance you would see the amber light!}

_{Anyway, having more space today I began to brake. I was in the right hand lane and keeping a watchful eye in my rear view mirror on the guy in the silver van directly behind me. He was jabbing his brakes as he approached to within what seemed like 30cm of my rear end before peeling off around the left hand side. I breathed a sigh of relief as my girlfriend was riding pillion today and I always worry more about being rear ended when she’s with me.}

_{Eventually I stopped. The van guy didn't. Nobody did. The traffic just continued to flow as if the lights were not even there. My girlfriend asked me what am I doing?? I said it’s a red light!! She said mai phen rai! nobody crossing! bpai, bpai!}

_{So off I went, through the red light again. At least I stopped, but sorry, one feels very exposed and vulnerable sitting stationary on Beach Rd with the rest of the traffic whizzing around you.}

[Keesters]

_{Thanks for all the replies, seems as though there is wide ranging opinion on this subject!.}

_{As a follow up on my original post, today I had to go back to Jomtien Immigration. Living in Naklua I go down through the Dolphin roundabout and take the Beach Rd route.}

_{With the replies to this thread still swirling around my head, entering Beach Road I was acutely aware of the traffic light issue and sure enough I copped another red light, further up the northern end. That’s twice in one week. Although today was different, with no traffic out in front of me. I was about 200m out from the lights when I saw a farang guy tap the button. He didn't wait for the lights to change, just went ahead and crossed anyway because he had clear road. The lights did change though, so as someone else said here, they must work on demand. Maybe he also tapped the button earlier before I saw him.}

_{I looked up and saw the board counting down from green at 6, then they turned amber and the board flashed what I can only describe as the quickest 1, 2 seconds I have ever seen in my life. Then they turned red. If you're not looking up at the lights there is very little chance you would see the amber light!}

_{Anyway, having more space today I began to brake. I was in the right hand lane and keeping a watchful eye in my rear view mirror on the guy in the silver van directly behind me. He was jabbing his brakes as he approached to within what seemed like 30cm of my rear end before peeling off around the left hand side. I breathed a sigh of relief as my girlfriend was riding pillion today and I always worry more about being rear ended when she’s with me.}

_{Eventually I stopped. The van guy didn't. Nobody did. The traffic just continued to flow as if the lights were not even there. My girlfriend asked me what am I doing?? I said it’s a red light!! She said mai phen rai! nobody crossing! bpai, bpai!}

_{So off I went, through the red light again. At least I stopped, but sorry, one feels very exposed and vulnerable sitting stationary on Beach Rd with the rest of the traffic whizzing around you.}

Was it the one just off the roundabout before you get to the corner by Thai airways? If it was I know it. The layout of that one is weird. The crossing point seems way before the lights. They buy all this technology probably from abroad and then mess up the installation.

Tut tut jumped another red light. Please explain to your GF there is no mai bpen rai when it comes to driving and road safety.

Edited March 10, 2015 by Keesters

[Wasa]

No, it was one of the sets further around, maybe one or two past Gullivers.

And yes, I jumped another red light in the interests of self preservation. But as I said, at least I stopped.

And my girlfriend does know better, we just recently returned from seven weeks in Australia, where we drove from Brisbane to Sydney and back again. She was amazed at how everyone there stops at traffic lights and how orderly the traffic flow is in general.

[Dannyboy666]

I think it is slightly unfair to criticise the OP for not 'being aware of the traffic around him'. In fact it's a slightly smug remark.

Not having encountered the lights on beach road, I am unable to say whether there is, or is not, an amber warning light. Even if there is, it still poses the same dilemma for the OP and others. Does he ignore amber, which in the UK is 'prepare to stop', or does he ignore that, on the basis the vehicles behind him will not do the same.?

You have the same issue on the main lights on Suk/Nua and other places. When you see the flashing arrow what goes through most westerners mind?. To me it means caution - prepare to stop. To Thai's it means speed up and get across as quick as possible.

I realise that there has to be a certain amount of adaptation whilst driving here, but I still believe we shouldn't completely compromise our standards to the extent of jumping a pedestrian red light, especially when there are people preparing to cross.

I think the OP made a slip by saying 'he was minding his own business', thus implying he was unaware of the situation around him. I'm certainly not going to be the judge of that remark.

I would have stopped.

" Does he ignore amber, which in the UK is 'prepare to stop' "

Whenever I've driven a rental car in America I have always understood amber is the same there as red in that you must actually stop on that colour as well even before the red appears? That's how I've always driven there anyway.

Mind you the traffic is a lot more orderly than Thailand.

. Yellow means Speed Up in America, are you kiddin???

[Keesters]

No, it was one of the sets further around, maybe one or two past Gullivers.

And yes, I jumped another red light in the interests of self preservation. But as I said, at least I stopped.

And my girlfriend does know better, we just recently returned from seven weeks in Australia, where we drove from Brisbane to Sydney and back again. She was amazed at how everyone there stops at traffic lights and how orderly the traffic flow is in general.

I'll have to look out for that one. Seems there are a few more that work than I thought. You don't always know if they are working if you pass over them when they are always green.

Self preservation. But you were stopped. You think somebody is going to rear end you when you were stopped. If that was the case then there would be billions of rear end accidents per day in Pattaya alone. You proceeded off from a stopped position through a red light because your GF told you too. Whatever she had learnt in Australia was totally forgotten as soon as she returned here. I.e. she learnt nothing.

[Keesters]

I think it is slightly unfair to criticise the OP for not 'being aware of the traffic around him'. In fact it's a slightly smug remark.

Not having encountered the lights on beach road, I am unable to say whether there is, or is not, an amber warning light. Even if there is, it still poses the same dilemma for the OP and others. Does he ignore amber, which in the UK is 'prepare to stop', or does he ignore that, on the basis the vehicles behind him will not do the same.?

You have the same issue on the main lights on Suk/Nua and other places. When you see the flashing arrow what goes through most westerners mind?. To me it means caution - prepare to stop. To Thai's it means speed up and get across as quick as possible.

I realise that there has to be a certain amount of adaptation whilst driving here, but I still believe we shouldn't completely compromise our standards to the extent of jumping a pedestrian red light, especially when there are people preparing to cross.

I think the OP made a slip by saying 'he was minding his own business', thus implying he was unaware of the situation around him. I'm certainly not going to be the judge of that remark.

I would have stopped.

" Does he ignore amber, which in the UK is 'prepare to stop' "

Whenever I've driven a rental car in America I have always understood amber is the same there as red in that you must actually stop on that colour as well even before the red appears? That's how I've always driven there anyway.

Mind you the traffic is a lot more orderly than Thailand.

I consider amber as both red and green. It's is red if you can stop safely. It is green if you cannot. By safe I mean not likely to cause an accident. Not requiring emergency braking that might make you skid or loose control. I don't see the amber light here much in Thailand. Would probably be interpreted as green anyway just as the red light is for the first 10 seconds it come on.

[joesanunu]

Stopping at red lights, slowing or stopping to let someone go first will get you killed in Thailand. Never give someone a break....

Think, me me me and you will blend in...

[Keesters]

Stopping at red lights, slowing or stopping to let someone go first will get you killed in Thailand. Never give someone a break....

Think, me me me and you will blend in...

And the opposite will end up killing somebody.

You may think you are blending in but only with those that break the driving laws. A good part of the drivers in Thailand are careful and considerate. It's just that more than a few, but not the majority, are reckless causing multiple accidents which end up involving those that drive quite well. Is that the group of dangerous drivers that you want to blend in with? If so tell me your plate number so I can avoid you.

Edited March 11, 2015 by Keesters

[elgenon]

I think it is slightly unfair to criticise the OP for not 'being aware of the traffic around him'. In fact it's a slightly smug remark.

Not having encountered the lights on beach road, I am unable to say whether there is, or is not, an amber warning light. Even if there is, it still poses the same dilemma for the OP and others. Does he ignore amber, which in the UK is 'prepare to stop', or does he ignore that, on the basis the vehicles behind him will not do the same.?

You have the same issue on the main lights on Suk/Nua and other places. When you see the flashing arrow what goes through most westerners mind?. To me it means caution - prepare to stop. To Thai's it means speed up and get across as quick as possible.

I realise that there has to be a certain amount of adaptation whilst driving here, but I still believe we shouldn't completely compromise our standards to the extent of jumping a pedestrian red light, especially when there are people preparing to cross.

I think the OP made a slip by saying 'he was minding his own business', thus implying he was unaware of the situation around him. I'm certainly not going to be the judge of that remark.

I would have stopped.

" Does he ignore amber, which in the UK is 'prepare to stop' "

Whenever I've driven a rental car in America I have always understood amber is the same there as red in that you must actually stop on that colour as well even before the red appears? That's how I've always driven there anyway.

Mind you the traffic is a lot more orderly than Thailand.

You can even enter the intersection on an amber light. You can't on a red. Stopping on an amber invites a rear collision by me and most other safe and sane drivers. Just sayin. (Always wanted to say that. Don't know why 555)

[Dirk_brijs]

Not having encountered the lights on beach road,

I am unable to say whether there is, or is not, an amber warning light.

Not only there is a amber warning (~3 seconds)

but there is mainly a countdown board for each color.

There is no excuse to say you were surprised by the change to red light.

excellent footage. Now I myself always stop for a red light and don't understand all the comments here of the danger of stopping for a red light????????

If a light turns red the LAW tells you to stop so you stop. If it is dangerous for you to stop tells me you were most likely speeding yourself in the first place.

Though speed limits as per LAW inside the city lines are set ridiculously high (90 and 80 in Bkk) it is maybe up to the discretion of the driver to adjust his speed inside the city limits NO? do we always need a LAW to tell us what is wrong or right? So when driving on beach Road adjust your speed (and yes YOU dont look at others look at yourself FIRST) and it wont be dangerous at all to stop for a red light cause cars behind you will be forced to adjust their speed as well. And if you see other cars drive through the red light does NOT justify you breaking the LAW.

[Keesters]

Not having encountered the lights on beach road,

I am unable to say whether there is, or is not, an amber warning light.

Not only there is a amber warning (~3 seconds)

but there is mainly a countdown board for each color.

There is no excuse to say you were surprised by the change to red light.

excellent footage. Now I myself always stop for a red light and don't understand all the comments here of the danger of stopping for a red light????????

If a light turns red the LAW tells you to stop so you stop. If it is dangerous for you to stop tells me you were most likely speeding yourself in the first place.

Though speed limits as per LAW inside the city lines are set ridiculously high (90 and 80 in Bkk) it is maybe up to the discretion of the driver to adjust his speed inside the city limits NO? do we always need a LAW to tell us what is wrong or right? So when driving on beach Road adjust your speed (and yes YOU dont look at others look at yourself FIRST) and it wont be dangerous at all to stop for a red light cause cars behind you will be forced to adjust their speed as well. And if you see other cars drive through the red light does NOT justify you breaking the LAW.

I thought inner city was 50. It is down here in Pattaya. Not that many take notice of it. Expressways would of course be different. But surely your not telling me that you can drive down Silom Road at 80 and it's legal.

Rest of your post excellent. Glad to hear I'm not the only farang around that obeys traffic lights. 30 years and not been rear ended yet. Just an excuse I reckon to try and justify breaking the law.

Edited March 11, 2015 by Keesters

[Si Thea01]

Stopping at red lights, slowing or stopping to let someone go first will get you killed in Thailand. Never give someone a break....

Think, me me me and you will blend in...

And the opposite will end up killing somebody.

You may think you are blending in but only with those that break the driving laws. A good part of the drivers in Thailand are careful and considerate. It's just that more than a few, but not the majority, are reckless causing multiple accidents which end up involving those that drive quite well. Is that the group of dangerous drivers that you want to blend in with? If so tell me your plate number so I can avoid you.

Ah, the holier than though is still preaching. The forum policeman and the law abiding Pattaya citizen. The know all, knows nothing man. Do you even drive? If you do and can tell us that you have never broken a law, then I will tell you that you are not being truthful. Just haven't been caught would be more like it. What gives you the right to denigrate someone by calling them a criminal because they make a decision to prevent a crash and in doing so break a law by running a red light? You then have the gall to assume that this may have arisen because they were speeding or at worst, intoxicated.

You need to stop your unwarranted criticisms of those who have done so, without endangering anyone, or is it like you suggested, no matter what, one must stop, cause a crash, all because you say that no one should break the law, regardless of the situation, and because the person who shunted you from the rear would be at fault.. The law is not applied in this manner and it is evident, through this statement, you know nothing about the law or how it can be applied. Have you ever heard of negligent driving or dangerous driving causing injury or death. If one stopped suddenly, a crash occurred and and caused injury or death to someone, regardless of the situation, and they could have avoided doing so, then through their failure to take all necessary action to avoid a crash, they could and most likely would be charged with one or other of those offenses. But you in you blind wisdom cannot see that or don't want to, or just want to show everyone how bright you are. Not very.

So being a law abiding citizen, but clearly knowing nothing about physics, vehicle dynamics, human perception/reaction times, vehicle reaction time and vehicle braking capability plus at least twelve other factors, you are telling us that one must stop at the red light even if it means a tailgating vehicle crashing into the rear. Then, because that vehicle is travelling at the same speed as the one in front, the impact would be minor. Your views and opinions are very dangerous because you lack the knowledge and cannot proffer a valid argument, just the same tired old rhetoric and when unable to answer, revert to insults. I, for one, would certainly do everything to avoid a crash rather than cause one through negligence and possibly cause injury or even death to the driver following. I would do this even if it meant running a red, that is with the proviso I could do so without endangering others.

Now, by all means go on with you inane scenarios and views of death and destruction and continue to make yourself look a bigger fool than you are. As for people wanting to avoid people, you make it to first place in my bucket list of things to do before I pass. So let me know which bars you hangout in and I will avoid them the next time I'm in Pattaya.

[longstebe]

So the moral of this thread is

Damned if you do

Damned if you don't.

[Keesters]

Stopping at red lights, slowing or stopping to let someone go first will get you killed in Thailand. Never give someone a break....

Think, me me me and you will blend in...

And the opposite will end up killing somebody.

You may think you are blending in but only with those that break the driving laws. A good part of the drivers in Thailand are careful and considerate. It's just that more than a few, but not the majority, are reckless causing multiple accidents which end up involving those that drive quite well. Is that the group of dangerous drivers that you want to blend in with? If so tell me your plate number so I can avoid you.

Ah, the holier than though is still preaching. The forum policeman and the law abiding Pattaya citizen. The know all, knows nothing man. Do you even drive? If you do and can tell us that you have never broken a law, then I will tell you that you are not being truthful. Just haven't been caught would be more like it. What gives you the right to denigrate someone by calling them a criminal because they make a decision to prevent a crash and in doing so break a law by running a red light? You then have the gall to assume that this may have arisen because they were speeding or at worst, intoxicated.

You need to stop your unwarranted criticisms of those who have done so, without endangering anyone, or is it like you suggested, no matter what, one must stop, cause a crash, all because you say that no one should break the law, regardless of the situation, and because the person who shunted you from the rear would be at fault.. The law is not applied in this manner and it is evident, through this statement, you know nothing about the law or how it can be applied. Have you ever heard of negligent driving or dangerous driving causing injury or death. If one stopped suddenly, a crash occurred and and caused injury or death to someone, regardless of the situation, and they could have avoided doing so, then through their failure to take all necessary action to avoid a crash, they could and most likely would be charged with one or other of those offenses. But you in you blind wisdom cannot see that or don't want to, or just want to show everyone how bright you are. Not very.

So being a law abiding citizen, but clearly knowing nothing about physics, vehicle dynamics, human perception/reaction times, vehicle reaction time and vehicle braking capability plus at least twelve other factors, you are telling us that one must stop at the red light even if it means a tailgating vehicle crashing into the rear. Then, because that vehicle is travelling at the same speed as the one in front, the impact would be minor. Your views and opinions are very dangerous because you lack the knowledge and cannot proffer a valid argument, just the same tired old rhetoric and when unable to answer, revert to insults. I, for one, would certainly do everything to avoid a crash rather than cause one through negligence and possibly cause injury or even death to the driver following. I would do this even if it meant running a red, that is with the proviso I could do so without endangering others.

Now, by all means go on with you inane scenarios and views of death and destruction and continue to make yourself look a bigger fool than you are. As for people wanting to avoid people, you make it to first place in my bucket list of things to do before I pass. So let me know which bars you hangout in and I will avoid them the next time I'm in Pattaya.

And please go ahead and blatantly break the law. One day you may kill someone. I drive every day. Have been doing so in Thailand for 30 years. Have never run a red light and have never been rear ended. Probably done some stupid things and broke the law but not knowingly and not continually as you have admitted to. I have never accessed you of drink driving or speeding but asked if you did because you have shown a predisposition to breaking Thai driving laws.

All your attempts at trying to justify your running red lights are preposterous. It does not alter the fact that in doing so you have broken the law and come here not only admitting it but seem proud of it.

[Keesters]

Its interesting that those who seem to have a predisposition for running a red light justify it saying it is to avoid an accident most likely by being rear ended.

I have been driving here for 30 years since I arrived to work on the Rama IX suspension bridge. Being also an avid walker I have always taken particular care at red lights to allow pedestrians to cross safely never having run through one. In those 30 years I must have covered 300,000 km and past through or stopped at thousands of lights. Never have I been rear ended. Neither have any of my farang friends who whilst not having been here as long as I also stop correctly at red lights. We often go on trips sharing driving so it is first hand knowledge. No one is this thread has said they have been rear ended while stopping correctly at a red light. We have even had instances of being at stop and then proceeding through a red light. The whole idea of I run a red light to stop an accident happening seems preposterous to me as to my knowledge a rear ending at a red light has never happened. It is also my experience that people will stop anywhere not just at red lights. Stop because they missed their turning. Stop because they found the shop they wanted. Do these cause rear end collisions? With the way that some people stop without regard for other road users you would think so. But I've never seen or heard of one. Seen plenty of side swipes and been involved in one when people pull out at junctions without looking. Seen them when someone runs a red light and the vehicles legally coming from the 90 degree direction crashes. Seen cars go off the road. Seen all sorts if things but have never seen or heard of a rear ender at a red light. Is it a myth perpetuated as an excuse to run a red light. It may well be.

Edited March 11, 2015 by Keesters

[joesanunu]

Stopping at red lights, slowing or stopping to let someone go first will get you killed in Thailand. Never give someone a break....

Think, me me me and you will blend in...

And the opposite will end up killing somebody.

You may think you are blending in but only with those that break the driving laws. A good part of the drivers in Thailand are careful and considerate. It's just that more than a few, but not the majority, are reckless causing multiple accidents which end up involving those that drive quite well. Is that the group of dangerous drivers that you want to blend in with? If so tell me your plate number so I can avoid you.

deleted post

deleted post

Soon after the beach road stop signals were installed, there were numerous rear end crashes at these lights. That's why they decided to not use them.

Very few Thais were stopping and many ended up crashing into law abiding drivers that didn't use their rear view mirrors.

Only an idiot would stop at a signal when a bus or TukTuk is bearing down.

[petercool]

Some off topic posts removed

[Keesters]

Stopping at red lights, slowing or stopping to let someone go first will get you killed in Thailand. Never give someone a break....

Think, me me me and you will blend in...

And the opposite will end up killing somebody.

You may think you are blending in but only with those that break the driving laws. A good part of the drivers in Thailand are careful and considerate. It's just that more than a few, but not the majority, are reckless causing multiple accidents which end up involving those that drive quite well. Is that the group of dangerous drivers that you want to blend in with? If so tell me your plate number so I can avoid you.

deleted post

deleted post

Soon after the beach road stop signals were installed, there were numerous rear end crashes at these lights. That's why they decided to not use them.

Very few Thais were stopping and many ended up crashing into law abiding drivers that didn't use their rear view mirrors.

Only an idiot would stop at a signal when a bus or TukTuk is bearing down.

Then I must be an idiot as I do it all the time and have not been rear ended. Thank you for the insult.

Please provide some evidence of all the rear end crashes happening at the pedestrian crossings. I read the PM online and don't recall hearing of any. And if it is true isn't it a failure of the drivers not the light that in many places been shut down.

Talk about putting the cart before the horse and he worship of the motorcar and motorbike. All more important than assuring our tourist and locals can cross our roads in safety.

[Si Thea01]

Stopping at red lights, slowing or stopping to let someone go first will get you killed in Thailand. Never give someone a break....

Think, me me me and you will blend in...

And the opposite will end up killing somebody.

You may think you are blending in but only with those that break the driving laws. A good part of the drivers in Thailand are careful and considerate. It's just that more than a few, but not the majority, are reckless causing multiple accidents which end up involving those that drive quite well. Is that the group of dangerous drivers that you want to blend in with? If so tell me your plate number so I can avoid you.

Ah, the holier than though is still preaching. The forum policeman and the law abiding Pattaya citizen. The know all, knows nothing man. Do you even drive? If you do and can tell us that you have never broken a law, then I will tell you that you are not being truthful. Just haven't been caught would be more like it. What gives you the right to denigrate someone by calling them a criminal because they make a decision to prevent a crash and in doing so break a law by running a red light? You then have the gall to assume that this may have arisen because they were speeding or at worst, intoxicated.

You need to stop your unwarranted criticisms of those who have done so, without endangering anyone, or is it like you suggested, no matter what, one must stop, cause a crash, all because you say that no one should break the law, regardless of the situation, and because the person who shunted you from the rear would be at fault.. The law is not applied in this manner and it is evident, through this statement, you know nothing about the law or how it can be applied. Have you ever heard of negligent driving or dangerous driving causing injury or death. If one stopped suddenly, a crash occurred and and caused injury or death to someone, regardless of the situation, and they could have avoided doing so, then through their failure to take all necessary action to avoid a crash, they could and most likely would be charged with one or other of those offenses. But you in you blind wisdom cannot see that or don't want to, or just want to show everyone how bright you are. Not very.

So being a law abiding citizen, but clearly knowing nothing about physics, vehicle dynamics, human perception/reaction times, vehicle reaction time and vehicle braking capability plus at least twelve other factors, you are telling us that one must stop at the red light even if it means a tailgating vehicle crashing into the rear. Then, because that vehicle is travelling at the same speed as the one in front, the impact would be minor. Your views and opinions are very dangerous because you lack the knowledge and cannot proffer a valid argument, just the same tired old rhetoric and when unable to answer, revert to insults. I, for one, would certainly do everything to avoid a crash rather than cause one through negligence and possibly cause injury or even death to the driver following. I would do this even if it meant running a red, that is with the proviso I could do so without endangering others.

Now, by all means go on with you inane scenarios and views of death and destruction and continue to make yourself look a bigger fool than you are. As for people wanting to avoid people, you make it to first place in my bucket list of things to do before I pass. So let me know which bars you hangout in and I will avoid them the next time I'm in Pattaya.

And please go ahead and blatantly break the law. One day you may kill someone. I drive every day. Have been doing so in Thailand for 30 years. Have never run a red light and have never been rear ended. Probably done some stupid things and broke the law but not knowingly and not continually as you have admitted to. I have never accessed you of drink driving or speeding but asked if you did because you have shown a predisposition to breaking Thai driving laws.

All your attempts at trying to justify your running red lights are preposterous. It does not alter the fact that in doing so you have broken the law and come here not only admitting it but seem proud of it.

Wake up or pick yourself up of the floor. Here we go again, go ahead and blatantly break the law, I'll kill someone one day. What are you on about? At one time I thought you were sensible but this proves you are not. Just the same old rubbish rehashed in a complete nondescript response.

And now finally, the holier than though admits to, partial quote. "Probably done some stupid things and broke the law but not knowingly." So now you want to join the club, breaking the law, yet you want crucifying others for doing the same. Regardless of whether knowingly or not, you have broken the law, so you're in the same category that you elected to place me, in all your finite wisdom. Keesters, you don't you have a legitimate argument, which is highlighted by you never ending inane responses.. And I quoted you. You can't quote me because you made it up.

You are also showing that you are prepared to proffer an intentional untruth about someone in your childish responses. You cannot come up with any concrete facts to discredit what I have written, so you resort to what only you know best, to twist things, verbal someone, blatantly lie and sensationalise you responses. Why? To make you look good, don't think so, it only highlights the lengths that you are prepared to go in your poor attempts to discredit someone's argument, for which you have no answer

Please show me where, and quote it, that I admitted to continually breaking the law. You know you can't and I didn't, so that makes you a person who is prepared to use blatant untruths in their quest to seek a victory over someone that they cannot do so legitimately with concrete arguments.. Only fools or nonintellects would attempt to verbal someone when it can be readily proved that they have.

You go ahead and prove me wrong, show me where I admitted to continually breaking the law, and I will show you your own words, which clearly prove you to be an untruthful person.. Don't play on words, read what you wrote, and I quote, "Now that you have admitted this traffic violation do you have anymore you'd like to get of your chest. Speeding, drink driving perhaps." Now, in you own words, I have proven you to be untruthful and also intimating there was maybe something in the background that I am failing to disclose because of the actions I took.

When I went to school the word " this" is singular, not plural, The word to be used for the plural is "these." A little more education for you. So if you wish to continue with your grubby responses feel free to do so. But in doing so, grow up, present the facts and don't lie.

[petercool]

It is time for the bickering to stop.

Everyone has had their say and baiting one another serves no purpose and any more such posts will be removed and posters potentially warned via warning points or worse.

petercool - moderator team

[Dirk_brijs]

Not having encountered the lights on beach road,

I am unable to say whether there is, or is not, an amber warning light.

Not only there is a amber warning (~3 seconds)

but there is mainly a countdown board for each color.

There is no excuse to say you were surprised by the change to red light.

excellent footage. Now I myself always stop for a red light and don't understand all the comments here of the danger of stopping for a red light????????

If a light turns red the LAW tells you to stop so you stop. If it is dangerous for you to stop tells me you were most likely speeding yourself in the first place.

Though speed limits as per LAW inside the city lines are set ridiculously high (90 and 80 in Bkk) it is maybe up to the discretion of the driver to adjust his speed inside the city limits NO? do we always need a LAW to tell us what is wrong or right? So when driving on beach Road adjust your speed (and yes YOU dont look at others look at yourself FIRST) and it wont be dangerous at all to stop for a red light cause cars behind you will be forced to adjust their speed as well. And if you see other cars drive through the red light does NOT justify you breaking the LAW.

I thought inner city was 50. It is down here in Pattaya. Not that many take notice of it. Expressways would of course be different. But surely your not telling me that you can drive down Silom Road at 80 and it's legal.

Rest of your post excellent. Glad to hear I'm not the only farang around that obeys traffic lights. 30 years and not been rear ended yet. Just an excuse I reckon to try and justify breaking the law.

yes you can

see speed limits throughout the world

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_by_country

Thailand highest

[petermik]

Traffic lights don't turn red all of sudden, they have an amber light first, maybe the OP should pay more attention to traffic situations while riding his bike.

The amber light does not work ................hence green then red

[Keesters]

Unable to reply in full mod has requested such. But you know my feelings I know yours. End of story.

[Keesters]

Not having encountered the lights on beach road,

I am unable to say whether there is, or is not, an amber warning light.

Not only there is a amber warning (~3 seconds)

but there is mainly a countdown board for each color.

There is no excuse to say you were surprised by the change to red light.

excellent footage. Now I myself always stop for a red light and don't understand all the comments here of the danger of stopping for a red light????????

If a light turns red the LAW tells you to stop so you stop. If it is dangerous for you to stop tells me you were most likely speeding yourself in the first place.

Though speed limits as per LAW inside the city lines are set ridiculously high (90 and 80 in Bkk) it is maybe up to the discretion of the driver to adjust his speed inside the city limits NO? do we always need a LAW to tell us what is wrong or right? So when driving on beach Road adjust your speed (and yes YOU dont look at others look at yourself FIRST) and it wont be dangerous at all to stop for a red light cause cars behind you will be forced to adjust their speed as well. And if you see other cars drive through the red light does NOT justify you breaking the LAW.

I thought inner city was 50. It is down here in Pattaya. Not that many take notice of it. Expressways would of course be different. But surely your not telling me that you can drive down Silom Road at 80 and it's legal.

Rest of your post excellent. Glad to hear I'm not the only farang around that obeys traffic lights. 30 years and not been rear ended yet. Just an excuse I reckon to try and justify breaking the law.

yes you can

see speed limits throughout the world

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_by_country

Thailand highest

Can't get a page for Thailand speed limits. Map shows 100 but that is highest in country not highest worldwide. There are many places with higher limits and some with no limit.

If you're so sure about 80 inner city can you post a more specific link please.

[Keesters]

Traffic lights don't turn red all of sudden, they have an amber light first, maybe the OP should pay more attention to traffic situations while riding his bike.

The amber light does not work ................hence green then red

Yeah lots of places around Thailand with no amber. Latest trend round my way is to give a visual 10 second countdown to the light changing. Suppose you could call that Thai amber.

In reality I noticed when it gets to 5 seconds on red changing to green a lot of the traffic will start moving off. Dangerous. Is it normal to have an amber between red and green? Or is only between green and red.

[huangnon]

I hate those pedestrian crossings; they are outright lethal for people coming from places with traffic rules and expecting to cross when they have the green light.....

Agreed. Totally dangerous for anyone arriving from a country with a functioning rule of law, or enforced traffic rules.

Thailand should just stop trying to copy civilized countries' road systems, thinking it makes them look "sophisticated". Because it doesn't.

[Keesters]

I hate those pedestrian crossings; they are outright lethal for people coming from places with traffic rules and expecting to cross when they have the green light.....

Agreed. Totally dangerous for anyone arriving from a country with a functioning rule of law, or enforced traffic rules.

Thailand should just stop trying to copy civilized countries' road systems, thinking it makes them look "sophisticated". Because it doesn't.

Now that's sarcasm I can understand. Unless you want to tell me different.

[Wasa]

We have a similar situation to Pattaya's Beach Rd in Surfer's Paradise and the Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia. Where you have a resident population of 350,000+ and another 100,000+ at any one time tourists, all separated from very popular golden beaches by a very long asphalt esplanade running parallel to the beaches and first laid down back in the late 1800s.

Here the local council has worked very hard over the years to separate pedestrians and vehicular traffic, through installing various measures such as 40 & 50km/hour speed limits, tight roundabouts, ripple bars, slaloms, varied pavement surfaces, safety barriers in the form of architectural type road furniture and red light pedestrian crossings which are enforced with cameras and obeyed.

Another thing they did was to enhance traffic flow on an inland highway (just 500m or so in from the esplanade) and also built an expressway type ring road further inland again. Both of these encouraged traffic flow away from the esplanade.

Someone suggested earlier making 2nd road two way. Probably not a bad idea. Install numerous terminals along the way for on/offloading baht bus passengers with a major terminal at the southern end to service walking street foot traffic.

[ageless1]

You want to 'Australianise' Pattaya's roads? Impossible!