Can An Asian Woman Really Love A Man? Or Are Men Just Atms

[chinadarling]

Spurred on by the recent posts about White men are good husbands and the reasons listed are all about $$$. I am wondering does anyone in Asia every think about love? or is marriage in Asia just business?

I have asked a number of women in Asia what is important and I have noticed one trend, they say the man should love me, never they should love the man. I wonder if there is any love in Asia or is it all just business?

Of course the age of the women affects the answer. Over 25 seem to have more sense.

Please try to hold back the stupid comments and place some thoughtful posts. At least for the first 10

[udon]

[samran]

If this turns into a thai woman bashing thread, we will close it quick smart.

[TRIPxCORE]

I want to know why you are including all Asian women in this. This is a Thai forum and we discuss issues dealing with mostly Thailand in here, not Asia. So are you basing this on what you hear from us and what you hear in Thailand? You cannot count all of Asia from just one country within it.

[Gary A]

Thai women are as capable of loving a man as any woman of any nationality. Money problems probably cause more western divorces than any other reason. Security is VERY important to a woman and that makes it easier for her to relax and make a happy marriage.

[britmaveric]

What a silly question of course LOVE is a primary reason for those truely in love.

[Scott]

The OP is rather smart. The issue is certainly Thai, but is more an Asian cultural thing, not just Thai. It doesn't have to be about bashing anybody.

Throughout much of Asia, at least moreso than in Western countries, marriage is about managing the family affairs & business. That is why in a number of countries there are arranged marriages--to protect the fortunes of the family.

This doesn't imply that anyone is more or less capable of love--it has to do with culture and the culture dictates these sorts of arrangements. This is enhanced by the tendency of women to seek security over other things--this is a world-wide trait and probably has a strong genetic basis. (A woman with children needs a provider to pass on those genes successfully).

In most cultures, men work and buy things to impress the ladies. Ladies are impressed by men who can earn money. The difference here is that often families have a more significant role in the decision making and there is a closer look at financial security than other places.

[Rumourz]

This is a very interesting topic!

Is Asian woman not capable to love anyone? I guess it is not fair to generalize Asian Women... I could also say, men also are manipulative as women. I grew up in Asia half of my life, I've seen how Western men had come to this part of the world "cheating" their family back home and also "cheating" the innocent girls here. (I am not talking about Thailand here, I am talking about in Asia generally, in Malaysia and H.K.). I knew a couple of heart broken Asian women who were cheated by the men.

So, the answer is Asian woman is just like any woman anywhere. They also need love and attention.Nowadays, working class women are capable of buying their own pairs of Jimmy Choo's so, men are not an ATMs anymore (this is quite ancient saying in the 18th Century where men are the only source of economy of the family-be it in Asia or Europe!).

Well, it's all set at the back of your mind. It's all depends on what you are looking for. If a man likes to be ATMs then he will be ATMs then. A good woman (doesn't matter Asian, Caucasian, Hispanic etc..) will never feel good to keep taking money from the man (even he is happy to be an ATM-I doubt it!!). There's always give and take.

[Minburi]

A very jaded view.

[pantarei]

Spurred on by the recent posts about White men are good husbands and the reasons listed are all about $$$. I am wondering does anyone in Asia every think about love? or is marriage in Asia just business?

I have asked a number of women in Asia what is important and I have noticed one trend, they say the man should love me, never they should love the man. I wonder if there is any love in Asia or is it all just business?

Of course the age of the women affects the answer. Over 25 seem to have more sense.

Please try to hold back the stupid comments and place some thoughtful posts. At least for the first 10

“Spurred on by the recent posts about White men are good husbands and the reasons listed are all about $$$”. If White men are good husbands and are not all about $$$, marry one.

”I have asked a number of women in Asia what is important and I have noticed one trend, they say the man should love me, never they should love the man”. Asian’s women polite way of saying ‘get lost’. “I wonder if there is any love in Asia or is it all just business?” You already answered your question = all about $$$.

”Please try to hold back the stupid comments and place some thoughtful posts. At least for the first 10”. Excellent advice – put it into use.

[a2396]

I think this is a serious issue with most realationships that involve Farangs in Thailand and in other countries as well. I think all would agree that it is reasonable for a woman to expect a certain amount of security from a relationship, such as a marriage. I would hope that emotional security would also rank on equal terms with economic. However, I think that the balance between emotional (love) and economic is quite out of kilter, when it comes to Thais (and probably women from other poor countries) dealing with Farangs. In my two years of living in Thailand and in my own personal experience, I have never seen ANY relationship with a Thai woman that did not involve money. It is not handled in a subtle way either. It is clear from the beginning, how much is expected and if you don't meet the demands, they are history in a hurry. The women from my own knowledge and involvement are not bar girls. I also doubt that they would behave in such a manner to a Thai man and I would expect that their emotional interest in a Thai man would play a greater role than that with a Farang.

This is really my only major negative experience with Thailand. I enjoy the country and have a much better life here than I would have in my home country. Hopefully, in the future I will find the woman I am looking for.

In my opinion the overseers of Thai Visa need to face reality about this issue and stop crying woman bashing everytime these matters are discussed.

[LoveDaBlues]

One of the first things my TW asked me when we met face-to-face was, "will you take me shopping?". I almost dropped her right there but figured what's a few bucks. Well I gave her 8,000 baht and she went shopping while I drank coffee,etc. and watched the Thai stroll by. When she had finished shopping she handed me 5,000 baht. I looked at what she had bought and it was all 'basic' items of clothing and a few nicer things but all priced okay. Later when I visited her village I discovered she literally only had a few pieces of simple clothing. Also, I later found out she wanted to 'look nice' when we went out together; not unreasonable I think.

To this day the TW is frugal with my (our) money. She's wonderful in many other ways and yes she loves me and I her.

So what's my point? Simple. Many people would have viewed the "will you take me shopping" request as just another Thai girl after a farang and his money. This would become their perspective of Thai women. However, once the 'whole picture' comes to light it was just a request from someone asking someone else to provide some basics and a little happiness.

[soihok]

One of the first things my TW asked me when we met face-to-face was, "will you take me shopping?". I almost dropped her right there but figured what's a few bucks. Well I gave her 8,000 baht and she went shopping while I drank coffee,etc. and watched the Thai stroll by. When she had finished shopping she handed me 5,000 baht. I looked at what she had bought and it was all 'basic' items of clothing and a few nicer things but all priced okay. Later when I visited her village I discovered she literally only had a few pieces of simple clothing. Also, I later found out she wanted to 'look nice' when we went out together; not unreasonable I think.

To this day the TW is frugal with my (our) money. She's wonderful in many other ways and yes she loves me and I her.

So what's my point? Simple. Many people would have viewed the "will you take me shopping" request as just another Thai girl after a farang and his money. This would become their perspective of Thai women. However, once the 'whole picture' comes to light it was just a request from someone asking someone else to provide some basics and a little happiness.

Thats a cool reply....well said!!

Cheers

[jbowman1993]

Troll

[Heng]

It'd be interesting to hear from the few falangs on this board who have married Asians/Thais that were their economic equals or superiors.

IMO money is just another aspect of life. Take it out of the equation and you take out all/most of the problems/fights so many people have because of it.

Edited August 30, 2006 by Heng

[Swelters]

One might want to think of the potential "deceptive unfairness" of the Thai woman, much lamented, in another way, just turn it around as a thought excercise.

"Why this old man, he a little ugly, not have many friends at home, he come here, he be very charm to me. I give him my beautiful, I am young, I eat fat food in very cold pub and watch boring movie I not understand. After marry five years, he never give me flower or buy dress for me like before, sleep late in morning, not want to make love me, very bad mood. Not care about my family."

Gentlemen, I would say we'd best keep an eye on our own conduct too.

[pedro01]

the age of the women affects the answer. Over 25 seem to have more sense.

Please try to hold back the stupid comments and place some thoughtful posts. At least for the first 10

Seems to me that the first post breaks this requirement

People in Thailand do not have pensions, there aren't many retirement homes here, either. This is different from the west where we need to hoard a large percentage of our income for when we retire & then get locked up in some smelly old folks home waiting to die. Here, the young are expected to look after the old. When you take on a Thai wife - you take on some of that responsibilty. This goes doubly if you take on a Thai bargirl because she (obviously) will be giving up 100% her income to live with you.

There's a Thai name for the sharing of your possessions - it's called Naam Jai (or Nam Jai). Initially a Thai women would not understand the need to hoard any cash for the future as in the main, they don't do it here. I'm not talking about rich or middle class Thais here - I'm talking about people that live month-to-month on limited incomes. Of course as you go up the earnings ladder - it becomes difficult to spend what you have, so wealthier Thais do save. A farang coming to Thailand would no more understand Naam Jai than the Thais understand pensions.

So - you WILL be expected to share what you have BUT you need to put limits on it - which should be based on what you can afford & what you think fair.

To say that you are being married for money shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the culture in Thailand. Here, a good Thai lover/husband will want to show he cares by sharing his worldly posessions. That's all that is expected of you. If you hit hard times, expect the family to rally around to help you too.

Sure - there are unscrupulous women here and they seem to be matched by an unending supply of idiots who DO act as walking ATMs. Som nam naa, I say.

What you need to do in a Thai/farang relationship is establish a middle ground - take time to explain your culture and time to understand theirs, then set up the ground rules for how you will proceed. Sure, the family may mistakenly be under the impression that all farangs are millionaires and put pressure on your partner to up the ante. Just be firm, explain how it's going to be & you don't have to be a walking ATM/

Pedro

[the swagman]

Seems to me that the first post breaks this requirement

People in Thailand do not have pensions, there aren't many retirement homes here, either. This is different from the west where we need to hoard a large percentage of our income for when we retire & then get locked up in some smelly old folks home waiting to die. Here, the young are expected to look after the old. When you take on a Thai wife - you take on some of that responsibilty. This goes doubly if you take on a Thai bargirl because she (obviously) will be giving up 100% her income to live with you.

There's a Thai name for the sharing of your possessions - it's called Naam Jai (or Nam Jai). Initially a Thai women would not understand the need to hoard any cash for the future as in the main, they don't do it here. I'm not talking about rich or middle class Thais here - I'm talking about people that live month-to-month on limited incomes. Of course as you go up the earnings ladder - it becomes difficult to spend what you have, so wealthier Thais do save. A farang coming to Thailand would no more understand Naam Jai than the Thais understand pensions.

So - you WILL be expected to share what you have BUT you need to put limits on it - which should be based on what you can afford & what you think fair.

To say that you are being married for money shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the culture in Thailand. Here, a good Thai lover/husband will want to show he cares by sharing his worldly posessions. That's all that is expected of you. If you hit hard times, expect the family to rally around to help you too.

Sure - there are unscrupulous women here and they seem to be matched by an unending supply of idiots who DO act as walking ATMs. Som nam naa, I say.

What you need to do in a Thai/farang relationship is establish a middle ground - take time to explain your culture and time to understand theirs, then set up the ground rules for how you will proceed. Sure, the family may mistakenly be under the impression that all farangs are millionaires and put pressure on your partner to up the ante. Just be firm, explain how it's going to be & you don't have to be a walking ATM/

Pedro

A decent post Pedro.

'To say that you are being married for money shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the culture in Thailand.'

Absolutely. No understanding of the culture or the people.

Does the author of the original post mean to say that there are other women in other countries where they don't want money to buy food, clothes etc etc. If he does please tell me. I'm gone.

It has only been in the last century that we have actually been able to have the luxury of marrying for love. In the past poeple married for necessity and security.

[Plus]

I think the "arranged marriages" aspect should also be included. In Asia they know that people can learn to love each other, blinding passion is not a prerequisite. Families, in fact, are afraid of this passion, it leads to trouble more often than not.

Women in question might thinkg that they can learn to love this particular man if everything else is ok. Being a "good wife" concept requires many other things than just love, too.

I'd say they take a holistic approach to relationships, in which love is just one of the components. Very wise in the long term, IMO.

[the swagman]

One might want to think of the potential "deceptive unfairness" of the Thai woman, much lamented, in another way, just turn it around as a thought excercise.

"Why this old man, he a little ugly, not have many friends at home, he come here, he be very charm to me. I give him my beautiful, I am young, I eat fat food in very cold pub and watch boring movie I not understand. After marry five years, he never give me flower or buy dress for me like before, sleep late in morning, not want to make love me, very bad mood. Not care about my family."

Gentlemen, I would say we'd best keep an eye on our own conduct too.

Well said.

How do you spell 'touchee'?

[Mighty Mouse]

An ATM is only a machine with buttons. Push the right buttons and you get what you want.

This same principle applies to both sexes.

When couples have feelings for each other, you don't push the buttons, you caress them, and you you will always get more than what you expect.

When those feelings turn to love, the machine disappears...no need to push buttons ever again.

[kiakaha]

It'd be interesting to hear from the few falangs on this board who have married Asians/Thais that were their economic equals or superiors.

IMO money is just another aspect of life. Take it out of the equation and you take out all/most of the problems/fights so many people have because of it.

My wife(of asian ethnicity) makes more in a month than 10 falang english teachers.I guess that kinda shoots down the ENTIRE premise of the OP's position

Maybe the OP didn't mean "asian women", but rather "poor girls/uneducated girls/ farm girls/hookers" etc.. Belive it or not there are actually asian women out there who have professional jobs and income streams of their own.Hard to fathom isn't it. If you spend more time on Thanon Sathorn rather than Soi 4, you'll get my point.

[taxexile]

It'd be interesting to hear from the few falangs on this board who have married Asians/Thais that were their economic equals or superiors.

my wife who is economically equal to me , she comes from a middle class Thai Chinese background , everyone in the family works , there are no slackers or parasites.

when we are with the in laws , they usually take care of the bill , i have to force my mother in law to discretely accept our contributions to expensive family gatherings in restaurants. when they visit us they always contribute , and vice versa.

on one occasion , a brother was out of work for a while and the bank were after his house , the family had a whip round and we all contributed an equal amount to help him.

she is extremely frugal with money and spends wisely , we share bank accounts and credit cards and is better at money management than me , all our assets are in joint names and have been from the beginning , but then Thai Chinese are usually better at money management than Thais. Many incorrectly interpret this as stinginess , its just that the Thai Chinese understand the concept of the "rainy day" better than Thais.

i suppose i am lucky , in not having acquired the terrible cynicism that a lot of posters have about funding extended families , but i can understand where it comes from. if i was continually expected to pay i would probably eventually become resentful of the demands , its not so much the paying , as the expectation and assumption that i would pay. then again , it would depend on the personalities and character of her family.

i think if a foreigner marries into a much poorer family , then they have to accept that they will be expected to show some (possible a lot of ) generosity , at least towards the parents .

and for sure , extended family members will often jump on the gravy train. i would think that a "test" of a girls love would be how protective of her husband and his finances she is in the face of obviously unreasonable demands by the family.

generosity translates as good spirit here , but it is up to the falang to know where to and more importantly , know how to draw the line without causing offence and loss of face to his wife in front of the family or the village , if its a village background.

thais that i know continually express amazement at how foriegners will marry thais from such different economic and educational backgrounds and be completely unaware of the social and family dynamics that exist in this country , and how the falang is so easily and deftly relieved of his money here.

they are not being disparaging about those lower down the economic scale , but just saying that marriage is easier between people from a similar economic background.

we know of richer/poorer couples who have stayed together for years , and of economically equal couple who have split up , and vice versa.

we know of deceit by thai girls , and deceit by the falang husband.

considering the grinding poverty that exists in this country and the difficulty of escaping it , it is natural for thai women to look for some improvement in their situation. its the same everywhere.

why marry a motorcycle taxi driver when there are well off falangs available.

there will always be unscrupulous women in the world , and there has never been a shortage of men for them to prey on.

add into the mix an inability to communicate in thai and an incomplete understanding of the social dynamics here , and its easy to see that the hunting season is year round.

its the game of love.

[LoveDaBlues]

It'd be interesting to hear from the few falangs on this board who have married Asians/Thais that were their economic equals or superiors.

my wife who is economically equal to me , she comes from a middle class Thai Chinese background , everyone in the family works , there are no slackers or parasites.

when we are with the in laws , they usually take care of the bill , i have to force my mother in law to discretely accept our contributions to expensive family gatherings in restaurants. when they visit us they always contribute , and vice versa.

on one occasion , a brother was out of work for a while and the bank were after his house , the family had a whip round and we all contributed an equal amount to help him.

she is extremely frugal with money and spends wisely , we share bank accounts and credit cards and is better at money management than me , all our assets are in joint names and have been from the beginning , but then Thai Chinese are usually better at money management than Thais. Many incorrectly interpret this as stinginess , its just that the Thai Chinese understand the concept of the "rainy day" better than Thais.

i suppose i am lucky , in not having acquired the terrible cynicism that a lot of posters have about funding extended families , but i can understand where it comes from. if i was continually expected to pay i would probably eventually become resentful of the demands , its not so much the paying , as the expectation and assumption that i would pay. then again , it would depend on the personalities and character of her family.

i think if a foreigner marries into a much poorer family , then they have to accept that they will be expected to show some (possible a lot of ) generosity , at least towards the parents .

and for sure , extended family members will often jump on the gravy train. i would think that a "test" of a girls love would be how protective of her husband and his finances she is in the face of obviously unreasonable demands by the family.

generosity translates as good spirit here , but it is up to the falang to know where to and more importantly , know how to draw the line without causing offence and loss of face to his wife in front of the family or the village , if its a village background.

thais that i know continually express amazement at how foriegners will marry thais from such different economic and educational backgrounds and be completely unaware of the social and family dynamics that exist in this country , and how the falang is so easily and deftly relieved of his money here.

they are not being disparaging about those lower down the economic scale , but just saying that marriage is easier between people from a similar economic background.

we know of richer/poorer couples who have stayed together for years , and of economically equal couple who have split up , and vice versa.

we know of deceit by thai girls , and deceit by the falang husband.

considering the grinding poverty that exists in this country and the difficulty of escaping it , it is natural for thai women to look for some improvement in their situation. its the same everywhere.

why marry a motorcycle taxi driver when there are well off falangs available.

there will always be unscrupulous women in the world , and there has never been a shortage of men for them to prey on.

add into the mix an inability to communicate in thai and an incomplete understanding of the social dynamics here , and its easy to see that the hunting season is year round.

its the game of love.

One of the most logical and well-balanced post I've every read concerning relationships here. Well done.

[Queers for Fears]

It'd be interesting to hear from the few falangs on this board who have married Asians/Thais that were their economic equals or superiors.

IMO money is just another aspect of life. Take it out of the equation and you take out all/most of the problems/fights so many people have because of it.

That would probaby be 1% of the forum

[Plus]

Back to the OP - what does he mean by "really love"? Follow your man through sickeness and hel_l without any reciprocation? Wash his underware after he comes back from allnight party that included a bit more than drinking?

How many people deserve such unconditional love????

[totlanh]

My wife wife is Vietnamese(I know its about Thailand however the op did state asian women)and comes from an extremely poor backround,indeed she only went to school for 4 years such was her familys need for money.This fact however has made her extremely cautious about money and thus she is the perfect foil for my over exuberant spending at times.To state that Asian women are after money could be levelled at times and indeed i suspect could be the main factor why so many marriages break down,but i suspect its something of a generalisation to label all Asian ladies as such and again to reiterrate my wife brings stability to my finances.

[mittheimp]

My relationship with my wife was never about money, which is lucky as i have never had any! We live in the UK now and have jobs with a similar income, no money is sent back to Thailand. She is from a lower middle class family.

Now if a girl is from a poor family then money is going to be a much bigger concern, and culturally the way women of limited education raise their status is by marrying well! So no surprises there!That of course is not to say you can't love and be financially dependant at the same time!

Thai notions of love do exist, obviously!! Just watch a turgid Thai soap opera or experience the department stores on Valentines day!

But when two people have a relationship from very different economic positions then money is always going to be an issue! - Hence the amount of times it is discussed on this message board!

[WaiWai]

If you look at the changes in other countries, you can see that as women receive greater educational opportunities and financial independence, they are less likely to marry (and less likely to have children).

That is not to say that they're not having loving relationships; it is just that these relationships become freed of the entanglement with finance, for both partners.

[sbk]

If you look at the changes in other countries, you can see that as women receive greater educational opportunities and financial independence, they are less likely to marry (and less likely to have children).

That is not to say that they're not having loving relationships; it is just that these relationships become freed of the entanglement with finance, for both partners.

True, and the more some men seem to complain because there aren't any "traditional" roles anymore. Seems to me you can't have it both ways: ie a 'traditional" female role where she is dependent onher husband for her money and a woman who isn't interested in a man for his money.