Police volunteers powers

[cobblers]

Can someone please help I would like to know the extent of a police volunteers powers in Pattaya.

The reason I am asking is today a police volunteer tried to stop me on my motor bike at the dolphin round about. I drove straight past him and stopped at the Thai policeman I spoke Thai to him and told him I had not stopped at the volunteer as he was not a proper police man.

I showed my licence and was told I could go.

The western police volunteer then approched me and asked why I had not stopped for him. I said I thought he had no right to step out in the road and stop me as he was not a proper police man.

We're apron he asked why I thought that as he had a uniform a badge an a number.

I said this was bull----- and the Thai police man asked him to move away and for me to leave which I did.

So the question is does this volunteer have the right to stop me?

I was under the impression that they are not police officers but if I am wrong please correct me.

Law abiding citizen.

Sent from my iPad

[Thai Chi]

Sounds like a load of old cobblers to me

[CharlieH]

As this is Pattaya specific,

MOVED to Pattaya forum

[Liquorice]

Historically most of the activities of the FTPA have been based in Walking Street, the heart of Pattaya’s night life, where staff assist the visiting public with general inquiries and work with Tourist Police duty officers to resolve incidents such as drunken behaviour or breaches of public disorder. However, our duties are now expanding to incorporate varied duties throughout the city and beyond, many in the day time as well as the evening.......................................

Read more here: http://www.ftpapattaya.org/expanding-duties-ftpa/

[Thongkorn]

there are Falang police , which are the same as Thai police they have guns to

[cobblers]

Faz

Thank you for the information.

However the volunteer was wearing a full Thai police uniform which your group appere on your web site not to be doing.

The question I would like answered is does a non Thai volunteer police man have the right to stop and ask for my documents.

I think the answer to this is No, however I would like to know your opinion!

Regards

Cobblers

[manarak]

As this is Pattaya specific,

MOVED to Pattaya forum

hmm... do police volunteers have different powers depending on where they work? I don't think so... happened in Pattaya, but the question isn't Pattaya specific.

[manarak]

Faz

Thank you for the information.

However the volunteer was wearing a full Thai police uniform which your group appere on your web site not to be doing.

The question I would like answered is does a non Thai volunteer police man have the right to stop and ask for my documents.

I think the answer to this is No, however I would like to know your opinion!

Regards

Cobblers

hmm...

Firstly, how do you know he isn't Thai? did you ask him for his nationality ?

Second - what are the powers of Thai police volunteers ?

Third - does a full uniform and a badge make a difference ?

Fourth - are there differences in powers of Thai and non-Thai police volunteers ?

[patrick1968]

they are volunteers to help the thai police with the falang arrest or other cases they are not full police , his got no power to act alone another thai police should be in present next to him , then again every time thing change ,,,,you never know in Thailand every thing is possible ...my app,,you did the right think I would do the same ,,

[cobblers]

Manarak

I can only answer your first question.

When I spoke to the Thai policeman in Thai, the "volunteer " did not appear to understand what I had said so that and his non Thai accent and lookIng a westerner makes me believe he was not Thai.

The other questions I would also like answered.

Thanks

Cobblers

[petercool]

There are foreign volunteers in a number of different police units - Highway, Traffic, Tourist, Thai volunteers and at police stations. The one you met could have been either Traffic or working with a Thai volunteers unit on some road block duty.

In practice, when in uniform and on duty and within a duty that also has Thai police or Thai volunteer along side, they are there to do what ever the specific duty leader asks and that can include restraint and assisting in arrests, checking papers or vehicles or whatever.

More normally they are used and expected to act only when a foreigner is involved as many Thai officers have little English or non-Thai language skills and in the OP's case that volunteer has every right to stop and ask for papers or whatever as he was working with Thai officers or Thai volunteers on a specific duty where just that expectation existed.

It is a fact that abuse of - or refusing to cooperate with - any valid officer on official duty - be he Thai or foreign - is an offence under Thai law and if ID is issued by a Police station or police unit then that has to be recognised regardless of what some might think of the validity of these volunteers.

[cobblers]

Petercool

If this is so perhaps in some of the foreign language publications here in Thailand can print some information to clear up any misconceptions myself and perhaps others have.

Also information can be posted in some of the many forums here in the land of smiles.

Regards

Cobblers

[Rimmer]

Two inflammatory posts have been removed, there is no need to get all bent out of shape about this topic, if you can not make a sensible contribution to it and discuss nicely then please move on to another one that interests you more, Thank you.

[rocketboybkk]

They THINK they have powers but in reality they are there to assist the Thai police and assist tourists. They can't arrest you (................). Therein lies the issue


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited May 4, 2015 by petercool
removed a slur

[petercool]

To continue with addressing the OP's questions, I can reiterate that these volunteers are there to assist the Thai police in whatever way the Thai police wish and that may or may not be to assist any foreigner.

That depends on the circumstances and, despite the post above, some duties can and do extend to restraint and detention if needed even if the actual arrest procedure is by a Thai policeman.

The authorisation for all this comes from the senior police Colonel of any police division or station after being sanctioned by national police chiefs and agreements were long ago reached between police and Immigration etc. that such volunteers do not need work permits.

[Satcommlee]

There was an interesting answer in the ask the lawyer section some time ago, which implied that the police can deputize anyone!

However, I would challenge them to speak thai and it all becomes null and void :-)

[johnnybgood]

Meet Dave..............

A Thai Police Volunteer.

please begin at 11:35 min

https://youtu.be/MZQ6Ihunlhk

Edited May 4, 2015 by johnnybgood

[onemorechang]

not a fan of these people at all.

Edited May 4, 2015 by onemorechang

[samran]

There are foreign volunteers in a number of different police units - Highway, Traffic, Tourist, Thai volunteers and at police stations. The one you met could have been either Traffic or working with a Thai volunteers unit on some road block duty.

In practice, when in uniform and on duty and within a duty that also has Thai police or Thai volunteer along side, they are there to do what ever the specific duty leader asks and that can include restraint and assisting in arrests, checking papers or vehicles or whatever.

More normally they are used and expected to act only when a foreigner is involved as many Thai officers have little English or non-Thai language skills and in the OP's case that volunteer has every right to stop and ask for papers or whatever as he was working with Thai officers or Thai volunteers on a specific duty where just that expectation existed.

It is a fact that abuse of - or refusing to cooperate with - any valid officer on official duty - be he Thai or foreign - is an offence under Thai law and if ID is issued by a Police station or police unit then that has to be recognised regardless of what some might think of the validity of these volunteers.

Having worked with the Thai civil service it is impossible for a non Thai citizen to take up any offical position in the civil service and the powers that come with those positions.

Plenty of advisors rummaging around mind you, but as non Thai citizens the arent civil servants and thus have no offical position. The most I've seen a foreigner do is represent an agency.

[Rimmer]

Troll posts and a post discussing moderation have been removed

[petercool]

There are foreign volunteers in a number of different police units - Highway, Traffic, Tourist, Thai volunteers and at police stations. The one you met could have been either Traffic or working with a Thai volunteers unit on some road block duty.

In practice, when in uniform and on duty and within a duty that also has Thai police or Thai volunteer along side, they are there to do what ever the specific duty leader asks and that can include restraint and assisting in arrests, checking papers or vehicles or whatever.

More normally they are used and expected to act only when a foreigner is involved as many Thai officers have little English or non-Thai language skills and in the OP's case that volunteer has every right to stop and ask for papers or whatever as he was working with Thai officers or Thai volunteers on a specific duty where just that expectation existed.

It is a fact that abuse of - or refusing to cooperate with - any valid officer on official duty - be he Thai or foreign - is an offence under Thai law and if ID is issued by a Police station or police unit then that has to be recognised regardless of what some might think of the validity of these volunteers.

Having worked with the Thai civil service it is impossible for a non Thai citizen to take up any offical position in the civil service and the powers that come with those positions.

Plenty of advisors rummaging around mind you, but as non Thai citizens the arent civil servants and thus have no offical position. The most I've seen a foreigner do is represent an agency.

I cannot comment on your experience but can say that the information I have given in this topic about these specific Pattaya volunteers is well supported and indeed factual.

[WitawatWatawit]

Peter, - " ... has every right to stop and ..."

That's law enforcement, not law assistance, and therefore highly illegal.

I believe a strong case can be made for refusing to stop for one of these Walter Mitty characters. By stepping out in front of you and ordering you to stop, they are taking the role of an authorised police officer, which they are not. They have, by law, absolutely no authority to order anyone to do anything. A uniform with lots of shiny bits denotes nothing except an inflated ego.

A police chief might be authorised to deputise a foreigner to assist a police officer, but surely as non-citizens, they have no right to take any action whatsoever, nor to initiate any action such as ordering a cyclist to pull over.

I think this person who tried to stop the OP is treading on very dangerous ground.

[petercool]

^^^^^

This can be debated until the cows come home but my reliable information is that if the duty officer asks or expects a volunteer to do something, then it becomes an official act and legal.

In some cases it is in fact against the law NOT to assist when asked to by a policemen - no matter who you are.

[Rimmer]

Troll post and a reply removed

[Pattaya46]

there are Falang police , which are the same as Thai police they have guns to

What are you talking about?

They are not Police, certainly not same as Thai Police,

they don't wear the same uniform and they can't wear guns... luckily!

[smedly]

To continue with addressing the OP's questions, I can reiterate that these volunteers are there to assist the Thai police in whatever way the Thai police wish and that may or may not be to assist any foreigner.

That depends on the circumstances and, despite the post above, some duties can and do extend to restraint and detention if needed even if the actual arrest procedure is by a Thai policeman.

The authorisation for all this comes from the senior police Colonel of any police division or station after being sanctioned by national police chiefs and agreements were long ago reached between police and Immigration etc. that such volunteers do not need work permits.

In reality this is little more than a civilian may do in the same situation, the actual proper answer is very easy, Volunteers are just exactly that - they have no official powers themselves and assist regular police who maintain any powers that are required for a given situation, does a volunteer have the power to stop anyone and or demand papers - the answer is basically No, they have nothing more than a good citizen would have in assisting regular police, it is actually black and white but some may see as a grey area TiT

It would be an interesting situation if while trying to stop someone on a motorbike they cause them to crash and have a fatal injury - there just might be some explaining to do

Edited May 10, 2015 by smedly

[petercool]

^^^

You may have that opinion but you are wrong.

[jackanapes]

in reply re volunteer police yes he has the right to stop you he also has the right to ask for your passport but unfortunately he has no powers of arrest .

[petercool]

Correct.

[Pattaya46]

in reply re volunteer police yes he has the right to stop you he also has the right to ask for your passport but unfortunately he has no powers of arrest .

Maybe they can, but the right question would be:

Do we gave the right to not stop for them or to not give them our passport?