UK warns 500,000 migrants could try Mediterranean crossing

[boomerangutang]

Why are so many Muslims headed for the UK. It can't be just for the spotted dick, can it?

[sirineou]

And most of then are Muslims... good luck to you Europe countries, whom have embraced open doors,

willy nilly policies to Muslims to just come in and completely de-interreges and de-assimilate\with the local population it's culture and customs..... No good deed goes un-punished....

Their devotion to their deity has blessed their lands, now they want to bring that devotion to our lands, and if we can be taught to behave the same, and express same devotion , we too can enjoy the same blessings .

[GoodThaiGirl]

Why are so many Muslims headed for the UK. It can't be just for the spotted dick, can it?

all the freebies ..but mainly its the pub culture and bacon sandwiches hahahahahaha

[NeverSure]

Someone should write a novel about what could will become of Europe in 20 years. Call it something like 2034.

[ataloss]

Actually, there is a British guy driving around solo in the Algerian desert. He's taking photos of rock formations and other natural phenomena, as a hobbyist. So, in a sense, it is a two-way avenue. I once got in trouble for playing music at a couple of clubs in Mexico. The Mexican authorities said I was working there illegally. They were right. You could have called me a 'wetback' - but going south instead of north. We had a good chuckle, and I drove 2000 miles back to my home in California.

RE 'You could have called me a 'wetback' - but going south instead of north.'

Because you were going south, the Mexicans refer to you as a 'setback'.

[Ulic]

Of course. With smugglers filling boats with migrants, pointing them in the direction of

Italy and telling them they just have to get to international waters, call the Italian navy for

pick up and you are home free. Very little danger contrary to reports. 2000 deaths vs,

200,000 successful migrants. With most of the deaths coming from 1 terrible accident.

The zodiac type inflatable boats are perfect in the calm summer weather. No smugglers

needed to crew the boat. Slash the inflatable pontoon to ensure pick-up. Next year I

would think 2-3 million will be crossing as the word is out. The difficult part is getting

to Libya, not the Mediterranean crossing.

[moobie]

Someone should write a novel about what could will become of Europe in 20 years. Call it something like 2034.

Kinda like this one you mean : - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30694811

[dabhand]

Well UK and France were in there wanting the oil and helping to drive Gaddafi out so they should be prepared to accept the consequences.

Perhaps you haven't noticed but it's not so much Libyans wanting to cross the Med, but people from other countries transitting through Libya.

Not having a functioning government in Libya (Gaddafi or whoever) has meant that the migrants have been able to enter and exit Libya with the absolute minimum of border controls. Indeed it would be surprising if the various factions are not encouraging the people smuggling trade in order to gain a high financial return from this very lucrative business.

I recall that, just prior to Gaddafi's overthrow, he had made an offer to the EU that, for a few $billion, he would ensure that no migrants would be allowed to make their way to southern Europe from Libya. Given the current state of affairs, that would likely to have been the bargain of the century!!

[moobie]

Naturally, you do realise that the more migrants who make it over, the more the EU countries may ramp up the difficulties for those legally trying to get into the EU with their partners, etc? (From Thailand, etc?)

The Netherlands, France, Scandi's and the English seem to be heading towards a more right wing attitude as the "liberal nations" ideals and tolerance seem to attract those who actually seem to despise those very things. Very interesting times and potentially some bloody ones ahead.

(PS. Didn't John Donne write the following, whilst the experiences of the English Civil War were still keen in his mind - "Beware the fury of a patient man." ?)

[Asheron]

Naturally, you do realise that the more migrants who make it over, the more the EU countries may ramp up the difficulties for those legally trying to get into the EU with their partners, etc? (From Thailand, etc?)

The Netherlands, France, Scandi's and the English seem to be heading towards a more right wing attitude as the "liberal nations" ideals and tolerance seem to attract those who actually seem to despise those very things. Very interesting times and potentially some bloody ones ahead.

(PS. Didn't John Donne write the following, whilst the experiences of the English Civil War were still keen in his mind - "Beware the fury of a patient man." ?)

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

As i don't know about legislation in other EU member states i'll talk about Sweden again...

In Sweden it is a crime to stay in Sweden when your visa runs out (doh) and as such it's illegal to be in Sweden as illegal immigrant. If the police find you you'll eventually be deport (well, that's the idea but rarely happens). But for some reason it is perfectly legal for person X to hide illegal immigrant Z without any kind of consequence (in my eyes 5 years in prison would be nice punishment). People in Sweden are getting more tired by the day about the immigration to Sweden. It's not really rocket science that so called "right wing parties" are gaining lots and lots of votes in Europe.

Just a few days ago (day before swedish national day) a Middle Eastern immigrant who now works at the largest "news paper" in Sweden (Aftonbladet, a socialist tabloid) whined and cried that Sweden should apologize to her because she had to wait a while to get her asylum approved when she "fled" to Sweden. She was literally puked on by many and even the former immigration minister of Sweden and current deputy speaker of parliament (Tobias Billström) said in a diplomatic wait "<deleted> b*tch".

People don't seem to realize that "news" travel faster than light. And the "news" has for a long time been "if you are from a muslim country just say you are gay and afraid of your life and you get asylum in Sweden"... and that is true.

[thaibeachlovers]

Naturally, you do realise that the more migrants who make it over, the more the EU countries may ramp up the difficulties for those legally trying to get into the EU with their partners, etc? (From Thailand, etc?)

The Netherlands, France, Scandi's and the English seem to be heading towards a more right wing attitude as the "liberal nations" ideals and tolerance seem to attract those who actually seem to despise those very things. Very interesting times and potentially some bloody ones ahead.

(PS. Didn't John Donne write the following, whilst the experiences of the English Civil War were still keen in his mind - "Beware the fury of a patient man." ?)

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

As i don't know about legislation in other EU member states i'll talk about Sweden again...

In Sweden it is a crime to stay in Sweden when your visa runs out (doh) and as such it's illegal to be in Sweden as illegal immigrant. If the police find you you'll eventually be deport (well, that's the idea but rarely happens). But for some reason it is perfectly legal for person X to hide illegal immigrant Z without any kind of consequence (in my eyes 5 years in prison would be nice punishment). People in Sweden are getting more tired by the day about the immigration to Sweden. It's not really rocket science that so called "right wing parties" are gaining lots and lots of votes in Europe.

Just a few days ago (day before swedish national day) a Middle Eastern immigrant who now works at the largest "news paper" in Sweden (Aftonbladet, a socialist tabloid) whined and cried that Sweden should apologize to her because she had to wait a while to get her asylum approved when she "fled" to Sweden. She was literally puked on by many and even the former immigration minister of Sweden and current deputy speaker of parliament (Tobias Billström) said in a diplomatic wait "<deleted> b*tch".

People don't seem to realize that "news" travel faster than light. And the "news" has for a long time been "if you are from a muslim country just say you are gay and afraid of your life and you get asylum in Sweden"... and that is true.

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

Perhaps English is not your first language, but he is obviously saying if too many illegal economic migrants are admitted, it could make governments cut back on legal immigration.

[Asheron]

Naturally, you do realise that the more migrants who make it over, the more the EU countries may ramp up the difficulties for those legally trying to get into the EU with their partners, etc? (From Thailand, etc?)

The Netherlands, France, Scandi's and the English seem to be heading towards a more right wing attitude as the "liberal nations" ideals and tolerance seem to attract those who actually seem to despise those very things. Very interesting times and potentially some bloody ones ahead.

(PS. Didn't John Donne write the following, whilst the experiences of the English Civil War were still keen in his mind - "Beware the fury of a patient man." ?)

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

As i don't know about legislation in other EU member states i'll talk about Sweden again...

In Sweden it is a crime to stay in Sweden when your visa runs out (doh) and as such it's illegal to be in Sweden as illegal immigrant. If the police find you you'll eventually be deport (well, that's the idea but rarely happens). But for some reason it is perfectly legal for person X to hide illegal immigrant Z without any kind of consequence (in my eyes 5 years in prison would be nice punishment). People in Sweden are getting more tired by the day about the immigration to Sweden. It's not really rocket science that so called "right wing parties" are gaining lots and lots of votes in Europe.

Just a few days ago (day before swedish national day) a Middle Eastern immigrant who now works at the largest "news paper" in Sweden (Aftonbladet, a socialist tabloid) whined and cried that Sweden should apologize to her because she had to wait a while to get her asylum approved when she "fled" to Sweden. She was literally puked on by many and even the former immigration minister of Sweden and current deputy speaker of parliament (Tobias Billström) said in a diplomatic wait "<deleted> b*tch".

People don't seem to realize that "news" travel faster than light. And the "news" has for a long time been "if you are from a muslim country just say you are gay and afraid of your life and you get asylum in Sweden"... and that is true.

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

Perhaps English is not your first language, but he is obviously saying if too many illegal economic migrants are admitted, it could make governments cut back on legal immigration.

I fully understood what he wrote but i'm still puzzled why "they" would make any changes to something that is actually working pretty well (such as visas granted in Thailand etc) if "they" first did something about the very big problem regarding Mediterranean.

[thaibeachlovers]

Naturally, you do realise that the more migrants who make it over, the more the EU countries may ramp up the difficulties for those legally trying to get into the EU with their partners, etc? (From Thailand, etc?)

The Netherlands, France, Scandi's and the English seem to be heading towards a more right wing attitude as the "liberal nations" ideals and tolerance seem to attract those who actually seem to despise those very things. Very interesting times and potentially some bloody ones ahead.

(PS. Didn't John Donne write the following, whilst the experiences of the English Civil War were still keen in his mind - "Beware the fury of a patient man." ?)

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

As i don't know about legislation in other EU member states i'll talk about Sweden again...

In Sweden it is a crime to stay in Sweden when your visa runs out (doh) and as such it's illegal to be in Sweden as illegal immigrant. If the police find you you'll eventually be deport (well, that's the idea but rarely happens). But for some reason it is perfectly legal for person X to hide illegal immigrant Z without any kind of consequence (in my eyes 5 years in prison would be nice punishment). People in Sweden are getting more tired by the day about the immigration to Sweden. It's not really rocket science that so called "right wing parties" are gaining lots and lots of votes in Europe.

Just a few days ago (day before swedish national day) a Middle Eastern immigrant who now works at the largest "news paper" in Sweden (Aftonbladet, a socialist tabloid) whined and cried that Sweden should apologize to her because she had to wait a while to get her asylum approved when she "fled" to Sweden. She was literally puked on by many and even the former immigration minister of Sweden and current deputy speaker of parliament (Tobias Billström) said in a diplomatic wait "<deleted> b*tch".

People don't seem to realize that "news" travel faster than light. And the "news" has for a long time been "if you are from a muslim country just say you are gay and afraid of your life and you get asylum in Sweden"... and that is true.

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

Perhaps English is not your first language, but he is obviously saying if too many illegal economic migrants are admitted, it could make governments cut back on legal immigration.

I fully understood what he wrote but i'm still puzzled why "they" would make any changes to something that is actually working pretty well (such as visas granted in Thailand etc) if "they" first did something about the very big problem regarding Mediterranean.

If you think the present bunch of losers running Europe are going to do ANYTHING about stopping the flood of illegals, you are delusional, IMO. Neville Chamberlain to a man ( and woman ).

[Asheron]

I fully understood what he wrote but i'm still puzzled why "they" would make any changes to something that is actually working pretty well (such as visas granted in Thailand etc) if "they" first did something about the very big problem regarding Mediterranean.

If you think the present bunch of losers running Europe are going to do ANYTHING about stopping the flood of illegals, you are delusional, IMO. Neville Chamberlain to a man ( and woman ).

I that that the chance of thailand turning into a republic and having democracy is about 1000 times more likely but that was still not my point.

[cookee68]

and here comes the start of the end, just shout racism and your in, don't forget racism, and your in, that's the first words they learn.

[cookee68]

Naturally, you do realise that the more migrants who make it over, the more the EU countries may ramp up the difficulties for those legally trying to get into the EU with their partners, etc? (From Thailand, etc?)

The Netherlands, France, Scandi's and the English seem to be heading towards a more right wing attitude as the "liberal nations" ideals and tolerance seem to attract those who actually seem to despise those very things. Very interesting times and potentially some bloody ones ahead.

(PS. Didn't John Donne write the following, whilst the experiences of the English Civil War were still keen in his mind - "Beware the fury of a patient man." ?)

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

As i don't know about legislation in other EU member states i'll talk about Sweden again...

In Sweden it is a crime to stay in Sweden when your visa runs out (doh) and as such it's illegal to be in Sweden as illegal immigrant. If the police find you you'll eventually be deport (well, that's the idea but rarely happens). But for some reason it is perfectly legal for person X to hide illegal immigrant Z without any kind of consequence (in my eyes 5 years in prison would be nice punishment). People in Sweden are getting more tired by the day about the immigration to Sweden. It's not really rocket science that so called "right wing parties" are gaining lots and lots of votes in Europe.

Just a few days ago (day before swedish national day) a Middle Eastern immigrant who now works at the largest "news paper" in Sweden (Aftonbladet, a socialist tabloid) whined and cried that Sweden should apologize to her because she had to wait a while to get her asylum approved when she "fled" to Sweden. She was literally puked on by many and even the former immigration minister of Sweden and current deputy speaker of parliament (Tobias Billström) said in a diplomatic wait "<deleted> b*tch".

People don't seem to realize that "news" travel faster than light. And the "news" has for a long time been "if you are from a muslim country just say you are gay and afraid of your life and you get asylum in Sweden"... and that is true.

and throw in the racist card and it is game set and match, and the wonder why they are slowly being hated, The way things are going on there will be countries with no people let in them.

[moobie]

Naturally, you do realise that the more migrants who make it over, the more the EU countries may ramp up the difficulties for those legally trying to get into the EU with their partners, etc? (From Thailand, etc?)

The Netherlands, France, Scandi's and the English seem to be heading towards a more right wing attitude as the "liberal nations" ideals and tolerance seem to attract those who actually seem to despise those very things. Very interesting times and potentially some bloody ones ahead.

(PS. Didn't John Donne write the following, whilst the experiences of the English Civil War were still keen in his mind - "Beware the fury of a patient man." ?)

Why are you comparing illegal immigration (from Libya etc) with legal immigration (Thailand etc)?

As i don't know about legislation in other EU member states i'll talk about Sweden again...

In Sweden it is a crime to stay in Sweden when your visa runs out (doh) and as such it's illegal to be in Sweden as illegal immigrant. If the police find you you'll eventually be deport (well, that's the idea but rarely happens). But for some reason it is perfectly legal for person X to hide illegal immigrant Z without any kind of consequence (in my eyes 5 years in prison would be nice punishment). People in Sweden are getting more tired by the day about the immigration to Sweden. It's not really rocket science that so called "right wing parties" are gaining lots and lots of votes in Europe.

Just a few days ago (day before swedish national day) a Middle Eastern immigrant who now works at the largest "news paper" in Sweden (Aftonbladet, a socialist tabloid) whined and cried that Sweden should apologize to her because she had to wait a while to get her asylum approved when she "fled" to Sweden. She was literally puked on by many and even the former immigration minister of Sweden and current deputy speaker of parliament (Tobias Billström) said in a diplomatic wait "<deleted> b*tch".

People don't seem to realize that "news" travel faster than light. And the "news" has for a long time been "if you are from a muslim country just say you are gay and afraid of your life and you get asylum in Sweden"... and that is true.

Asheron, apologies for my delay in replying, it's been a long day at work.

Anyhow immigration in the UK (as in other parts of the EU) is a big issue at this moment in time and and an immigrant is still an immigrant regardless if they are legal or illegal. Naturally for the powers that be who are supposed to control such affairs the easy target is actually those going through the legal route. (This has nothing to do with race but pure facts and figures.) The 'low hanging fruit' bear the best and easiest results on a spreadsheet/graph and few would be bothered about the tale behind the refusal unless it affected them. I agree that this is not right but when targets are set I will guarantee that, as often as not, the end justifies the means.

[NeverSure]

The Netherlands, France, Scandi's and the English seem to be heading towards a more right wing attitude as the "liberal nations" ideals and tolerance seem to attract those who actually seem to despise those very things. Very interesting times and potentially some bloody ones ahead.

The Muslims don't fit in with either the left or the right... Obviously the far right wants to get hard nosed but the far left won't tolerate their anti-women, anti-gay and other practices.

This is one hope that a western culture could wake up and not get overrun. Mostly it's been the left that has been PC about being "inclusive" but they will find out even if too late that Muslims are anything but inclusive. If Muslims get the lead all of the left's ideals they've worked for go out the window.

Just watch either a left or right wing person try to live his ideals openly in Saudi Arabia.

[simple1]

Well UK and France were in there wanting the oil and helping to drive Gaddafi out so they should be prepared to accept the consequences.

Perhaps you haven't noticed but it's not so much Libyans wanting to cross the Med, but people from other countries transitting through Libya.

There are reports of Libyan refugees crossing into Europe, but difficult to identify actual numbers.

There are nearly 60k IDPs Libyan nationals and estimations of up to one million Libyan refugees in neighbouring countries due to the civil war. Why do you believe they are not trying to get across the Mediterranean?

[JockPieandBeans]

Well UK and France were in there wanting the oil and helping to drive Gaddafi out so they should be prepared to accept the consequences.

Perhaps you haven't noticed but it's not so much Libyans wanting to cross the Med, but people from other countries transitting through Libya.

There are reports of Libyan refugees crossing into Europe, but difficult to identify actual numbers.

There are nearly 60k IDPs Libyan nationals and estimations of up to one million Libyan refugees in neighbouring countries due to the civil war. Why do you believe they are not trying to get across the Mediterranean?

If you check online refugee mapping. You will see that Real & Genuine refugees normally take refuge in the nearest safe place. Just like the up to 1 Million refugees from Libya who you report to be in neighbouring Countries.

Possibly, there are 2 reasons why they are not trying to get across the Med.

1. The do not have the money to pay the traffickers.

2. The traffickers do not have enough boats.

[NickJ]

How many Muslim countries are there in this world were most of the population does not want to flee from?.

[Scott]

I am not sure what you mean by 'Real Refugees'. Refugees can be found in all kinds of countries and circumstances. Whether they are in a neighboring country of heading to Europe, if they are a refugee, they are no less real. That said, the situation that Europe is facing is a huge crisis and I am guessing that a very large number would be economic migrants. Many of them face significant danger in their own country, but I don't know that it is persecution. It's hard for a gov't to persecute people if there really isn't a functioning gov't to begin with. Of course, that also means the gov't can't protect its citizens either.

[JockPieandBeans]

I am not sure what you mean by 'Real Refugees'. Refugees can be found in all kinds of countries and circumstances. Whether they are in a neighboring country of heading to Europe, if they are a refugee, they are no less real. That said, the situation that Europe is facing is a huge crisis and I am guessing that a very large number would be economic migrants. Many of them face significant danger in their own country, but I don't know that it is persecution. It's hard for a gov't to persecute people if there really isn't a functioning gov't to begin with. Of course, that also means the gov't can't protect its citizens either.

Scott,

We both know what genuine refugees are and what they do. What they do not do, in the vast majority of cases, is pay people traffickers vast sums of money to transport them somewhere else.

Have you watched any of the news footage of the 1200 picked up by HMS Bulwark ?

Most of them are men in their 20's.

Common theme. They are not Libyans, but were in Libya looking for work. Sure, what kind of unskilled nutjob goes to Libya looking for work ? So why didn't they go home when they couldn't find work ? They did not have the sense to say that they had to flee their own Country for fear of persecution.

They are nothing more than economic migrants.

[Scott]

I am not going to get into an argument but I worked with refugees for many, many years and still have affiliations in the area. You can rest assured that many real refugees, as in those screened by the UN and resettled in 3rd countries, paid huge amounts of money to get out of their home countries. Because people do or do not have money is not the defining issue of whether a person is a refugee.

However, I think we are straying off topic on this issue. Regardless of what they are, and as I have said, I would guess that a huge number are economic migrants. I wouldn't even venture to make a guess at the breakdown. The point is that Europe is not really in a position to absorb 500,000 migrants of any type at this particular point in time. The resources and will of most Europeans are simply not there for such a mass influx of people.

[JockPieandBeans]

I am not going to get into an argument but I worked with refugees for many, many years and still have affiliations in the area. You can rest assured that many real refugees, as in those screened by the UN and resettled in 3rd countries, paid huge amounts of money to get out of their home countries. Because people do or do not have money is not the defining issue of whether a person is a refugee.

However, I think we are straying off topic on this issue. Regardless of what they are, and as I have said, I would guess that a huge number are economic migrants. I wouldn't even venture to make a guess at the breakdown. The point is that Europe is not really in a position to absorb 500,000 migrants of any type at this particular point in time. The resources and will of most Europeans are simply not there for such a mass influx of people.

I will not comment on your 1st paragraph. Sometimes its better to keep quiet

There is no argument from me. I am open to discussion on the subject. Contrary to what others may think, I am concerned about the plight of these people. However, I never see many solutions being put forward.

Of course a huge number are economic migrants. Agreed, Europe does not have the resources or the will to accept this influx. Why should they ? How many will it lead to next year, and the year after ? When does it end ? When Europe is a barren wasteland ?

[simple1]

After a few minutes of online research I found that the issue of mass 'illegal migrants' / refugees has long been on the policy agenda of EU countries, in fact policy discussions commenced in ernest after 9/11. The debate evolved to Integrated Border Management (IBM) where border control should occur with three strategic lines of protection at external borders.

1) External borders of third countries e.g. Africa

2) External borders of EU

3) Common area of movement within the EU

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=nOuaQ7X352MC&pg=PA113&lpg=PA113&dq=europe+barren+wasteland&source=bl&ots=Xx1NSM8pHj&sig=jhHUWvNWSY1RE3xJk4lhLxjnzoA&hl=en&sa=X&ei=DWN2VdCUJMbX8gWUi4HwBQ&ved=0CFQQ6AEwCg#v=onepage&q=europe%20barren%20wasteland&f=false

Policy evolved to the funded Eurosur program, although Eurosur has experienced criticism.

"Eurosur is a surveillance system of the European Union that uses drones, reconnaissance aircraft, offshore sensors and satellite remote sensing, to track illegal immigration into the member states of the European Union. The program was put into effect by the European parliament on October 10th 2013. On December 2nd 2013, Eurosur was started in 18 EU member states and Norway.

As of October 2013, 244 million Euros have been secured from the EU budget for the installation and maintenance of the system until 2020. Critics expect the costs of the project to surpass one billion Euros - other sources however mention expected costs of around 340 million Euros"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurosur

Also of relevance is Frontex.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontex#Responsibilities

Those with knowledge on the progress of the funded initiatives / programs may like to discuss the above.

Edited June 9, 2015 by simple1

[istinspring]

In other words Europe have some demographic pressure. I.e. slow colonization in the same way Europe did in America. Would be interesting to see the UK Sultanate and Sweden Caliphate in next few decades.

Edited June 9, 2015 by istinspring

[JockPieandBeans]

After a few minutes of online research I found that the issue of mass 'illegal migrants' / refugees has long been on the policy agenda of EU countries, in fact policy discussions commenced in ernest after 9/11. The debate evolved to Integrated Border Management (IBM) where border control should occur with three strategic lines of protection at external borders.

1) External borders of third countries e.g. Africa

2) External borders of EU

3) Common area of movement within the EU

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=nOuaQ7X352MC&pg=PA113&lpg=PA113&dq=europe+barren+wasteland&source=bl&ots=Xx1NSM8pHj&sig=jhHUWvNWSY1RE3xJk4lhLxjnzoA&hl=en&sa=X&ei=DWN2VdCUJMbX8gWUi4HwBQ&ved=0CFQQ6AEwCg#v=onepage&q=europe%20barren%20wasteland&f=false

Policy evolved to the funded Eurosur program, although Eurosur has experienced criticism.

"Eurosur is a surveillance system of the European Union that uses drones, reconnaissance aircraft, offshore sensors and satellite remote sensing, to track illegal immigration into the member states of the European Union. The program was put into effect by the European parliament on October 10th 2013. On December 2nd 2013, Eurosur was started in 18 EU member states and Norway.

As of October 2013, 244 million Euros have been secured from the EU budget for the installation and maintenance of the system until 2020. Critics expect the costs of the project to surpass one billion Euros - other sources however mention expected costs of around 340 million Euros"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurosur

Also of relevance is Frontex.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontex#Responsibilities

Those with knowledge on the progress of the funded initiatives / programs may like to discuss the above.

OMG

Did you actually read the links you provided ?

Not only are they a complete waste of money.

From your own link.

According to European Council on Refugees and Exiles (ECRE) and British Refugee Council in written evidence submitted to the UK House of Lords inquiry, Frontex fails to demonstrate adequate consideration of international and European asylum and human rights law including the 1951 Convention relating to the Status of Refugees and EU law in respect of access to asylum and the prohibition of refoulement.^[25]

In addition ECRE and British Refugee Council have expressed a worry with the lack of clarity regarding Frontex accountability for ensuring compliance with international and EC legal obligations by Member States involved in Frontex coordinated operations. This is compounded by the lack of transparency, and the absence of independent monitoring and democratic accountability of the Agency.

Drastic fail

[simple1]

After a few minutes of online research I found that the issue of mass 'illegal migrants' / refugees has long been on the policy agenda of EU countries, in fact policy discussions commenced in ernest after 9/11. The debate evolved to Integrated Border Management (IBM) where border control should occur with three strategic lines of protection at external borders.

1) External borders of third countries e.g. Africa

2) External borders of EU

3) Common area of movement within the EU

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=nOuaQ7X352MC&pg=PA113&lpg=PA113&dq=europe+barren+wasteland&source=bl&ots=Xx1NSM8pHj&sig=jhHUWvNWSY1RE3xJk4lhLxjnzoA&hl=en&sa=X&ei=DWN2VdCUJMbX8gWUi4HwBQ&ved=0CFQQ6AEwCg#v=onepage&q=europe%20barren%20wasteland&f=false

Policy evolved to the funded Eurosur program, although Eurosur has experienced criticism.

"Eurosur is a surveillance system of the European Union that uses drones, reconnaissance aircraft, offshore sensors and satellite remote sensing, to track illegal immigration into the member states of the European Union. The program was put into effect by the European parliament on October 10th 2013. On December 2nd 2013, Eurosur was started in 18 EU member states and Norway.

As of October 2013, 244 million Euros have been secured from the EU budget for the installation and maintenance of the system until 2020. Critics expect the costs of the project to surpass one billion Euros - other sources however mention expected costs of around 340 million Euros"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurosur

Also of relevance is Frontex.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontex#Responsibilities

Those with knowledge on the progress of the funded initiatives / programs may like to discuss the above.

OMG

Did you actually read the links you provided ?

Not only are they a complete waste of money.

From your own link.

According to European Council on Refugees and Exiles (ECRE) and British Refugee Council in written evidence submitted to the UK House of Lords inquiry, Frontex fails to demonstrate adequate consideration of international and European asylum and human rights law including the 1951 Convention relating to the Status of Refugees and EU law in respect of access to asylum and the prohibition of refoulement.^[25]

In addition ECRE and British Refugee Council have expressed a worry with the lack of clarity regarding Frontex accountability for ensuring compliance with international and EC legal obligations by Member States involved in Frontex coordinated operations. This is compounded by the lack of transparency, and the absence of independent monitoring and democratic accountability of the Agency.

Drastic fail

As you constantly complain of governments being too lax on border control / refugee policy etc I would have thought you would be pleased that Frontex:

"fails to demonstrate adequate consideration of international and European asylum and human rights law including the 1951 Convention relating to the Status of Refugees and EU law in respect of access to asylum and the prohibition of refoulement"

As the Eurosur program is still in the process of being implemented, is it not too early to make a judgement of success or otherwise? Same with Frontex, are not the various programs under constant review / revision according to unfolding circumstances.

[JockPieandBeans]

After a few minutes of online research I found that the issue of mass 'illegal migrants' / refugees has long been on the policy agenda of EU countries, in fact policy discussions commenced in ernest after 9/11. The debate evolved to Integrated Border Management (IBM) where border control should occur with three strategic lines of protection at external borders.

1) External borders of third countries e.g. Africa

2) External borders of EU

3) Common area of movement within the EU

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=nOuaQ7X352MC&pg=PA113&lpg=PA113&dq=europe+barren+wasteland&source=bl&ots=Xx1NSM8pHj&sig=jhHUWvNWSY1RE3xJk4lhLxjnzoA&hl=en&sa=X&ei=DWN2VdCUJMbX8gWUi4HwBQ&ved=0CFQQ6AEwCg#v=onepage&q=europe%20barren%20wasteland&f=false

Policy evolved to the funded Eurosur program, although Eurosur has experienced criticism.

"Eurosur is a surveillance system of the European Union that uses drones, reconnaissance aircraft, offshore sensors and satellite remote sensing, to track illegal immigration into the member states of the European Union. The program was put into effect by the European parliament on October 10th 2013. On December 2nd 2013, Eurosur was started in 18 EU member states and Norway.

As of October 2013, 244 million Euros have been secured from the EU budget for the installation and maintenance of the system until 2020. Critics expect the costs of the project to surpass one billion Euros - other sources however mention expected costs of around 340 million Euros"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurosur

Also of relevance is Frontex.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontex#Responsibilities

Those with knowledge on the progress of the funded initiatives / programs may like to discuss the above.

OMG

Did you actually read the links you provided ?

Not only are they a complete waste of money.

From your own link.

According to European Council on Refugees and Exiles (ECRE) and British Refugee Council in written evidence submitted to the UK House of Lords inquiry, Frontex fails to demonstrate adequate consideration of international and European asylum and human rights law including the 1951 Convention relating to the Status of Refugees and EU law in respect of access to asylum and the prohibition of refoulement.^[25]

In addition ECRE and British Refugee Council have expressed a worry with the lack of clarity regarding Frontex accountability for ensuring compliance with international and EC legal obligations by Member States involved in Frontex coordinated operations. This is compounded by the lack of transparency, and the absence of independent monitoring and democratic accountability of the Agency.

Drastic fail

As you constantly complain of governments being too lax on border control / refugee policy etc I would have thought you would be pleased that Frontex:

"fails to demonstrate adequate consideration of international and European asylum and human rights law including the 1951 Convention relating to the Status of Refugees and EU law in respect of access to asylum and the prohibition of refoulement"

As the Eurosur program is still in the process of being implemented, is it not too early to make a judgement of success or otherwise? Same with Frontex, are not the various programs under constant review / revision according to unfolding circumstances.

I am a UK taxpayer. It is my right to complain. I have even more right to complain when border control measures are dictated by others.

Why would I be pleased that Frontex fails to demonstrate adequate consideration of Laws ? I am not pleased when anyone breaks Laws. As much as I find some of the laws in the UK to be a joke. They are there for a reason, I respect that reason and I live within the Law.

It is not me who is trying to circumvent border controls. That would be those in the OP breaking the Law.

Eurosur will not deter the people in the OP. It is therefore an expensive waste of time, effort and money. That could be used to much better effect.