US should explain its harsh rights report on Thailand, govt says

[connda]

Miami Bob just posted the truth- and along with myself- realise that it is almost hopeless for anyone other than the chosen elite to be elected in the United States. In the unlikely event that a person with integrity and not beholden to the wealthy did receive a forum and was able to get their message across- they would be eliminated. America is the land of greed. As much as Thailand operates on the same system- America is the master of it all. Everything is about money. Obama trumpets his health care reform as though it really is reform- absolute nonsense. He caved into every wealthy business person associated with healthcare and created a monstrosity in which the tax man now monitors whether you paid your health care premium and added 10,000 more revenue agents to do it. Guess who pays their salaries. The American people, of course. Ever wonder why a person's' illness should be a way for someone to make money. Healthcare is an inalienable right. Most of Europe has basic healthcare for its citizens. The American government ignored those systems that actually work and are fair and chose a system that rewards insurance companies. This is only one example of the chicanery that the US government hoists on its populace. Again, I am not anti American but to fix a problem , one has to admit it exists. And there are plenty more.

It's been downhill since Kennedy.

[NovaBlue05]

There is no doubt that America has done great things for the World in its past history and has used its influence and wealth to assist others. This is in the past . I remember growing up in the United States where I was proud that my country had helped make the World a safer place and stemmed the advance of Nazism and totalitarianism during the Second World War. My father was proud to serve with the British, Australians, New Zealander's and many others in a righteous quest for peace and tranquillity. The administration of Franklin Roosevelt and Sir Winston Churchill knew that our very survival depended upon mobilizing our populations. Where did it all go wrong. We all became prosperous, however we forgot one thing- we forgot that we are all in this World together. People become greedy and the greed became infectious. We started to lose our ethical compass and forget the things our parents taught us like compassion, be a good neighbour and being humble. We also forgot the golden rule. Now it's every person for themselves and the US government once the envy of the World has become the scourge of the World. Yes, America lost almost 3,000 people during the 9-11 attack but we lost a lot more since- our moral compass and the good part of those ideals that make a great people. We can't fix this until we admit it.

Ironic that the greatest generation grew up through hardship and sacrifice living through the Great Depression and WWII before coming home and building the nation. In their noble desire that their children never face the hardships they faced, they produced the baby boomers. The rest is history

[fred Kubasa]

Yeah , right ! The US owes you an explanation about their actions/authority, like Eli Wallach, in a very old western film who said " we don't need no ----ing badges " !

[Rhys]

Well the USA is at it again.. the good, the bad, the Ugly.. and the so who cares..

[connda]

There is no doubt that America has done great things for the World in its past history and has used its influence and wealth to assist others. This is in the past . I remember growing up in the United States where I was proud that my country had helped make the World a safer place and stemmed the advance of Nazism and totalitarianism during the Second World War. My father was proud to serve with the British, Australians, New Zealander's and many others in a righteous quest for peace and tranquillity. The administration of Franklin Roosevelt and Sir Winston Churchill knew that our very survival depended upon mobilizing our populations. Where did it all go wrong. We all became prosperous, however we forgot one thing- we forgot that we are all in this World together. People become greedy and the greed became infectious. We started to lose our ethical compass and forget the things our parents taught us like compassion, be a good neighbour and being humble. We also forgot the golden rule. Now it's every person for themselves and the US government once the envy of the World has become the scourge of the World. Yes, America lost almost 3,000 people during the 9-11 attack but we lost a lot more since- our moral compass and the good part of those ideals that make a great people. We can't fix this until we admit it.

Ironic that the greatest generation grew up through hardship and sacrifice living through the Great Depression and WWII before coming home and building the nation. In their noble desire that their children never face the hardships they faced, they produced the baby boomers. The rest is history

Yeah agreed. And it's about time you Millennials move the hell out of the house and start a life of your own. And now ya'll are moving into 'leadership' positions. That should be a hoot!

[peterpop]

Unfortunately the Generals understanding of written English is as limited as his horizons. Oh Dear!

[tbthailand]

But lets forget to mention the Black Sites that the US allegedly have in Thailand, for enhanced torture.

Sorry, my mistake, Michael Morell says it isn't actually torture.

That's alright then, just blame those pesky Thais.

The "black sites" in Thailand were a secret arrangement between Thaksin and the US.

Thaksin?

yeah, I think not...

[Nick167]

I may not like Thaksin and the Pheu Thai for their corruption but really we have to "thank" Suthep and The Democrats, The Southerners, Singha Beer and The Thai Chinese from Bangkok for the state that Thailand is in today.And I hope that none of these people are complaining as they deserve it.

[NovaBlue05]

There is no doubt that America has done great things for the World in its past history and has used its influence and wealth to assist others. This is in the past . I remember growing up in the United States where I was proud that my country had helped make the World a safer place and stemmed the advance of Nazism and totalitarianism during the Second World War. My father was proud to serve with the British, Australians, New Zealander's and many others in a righteous quest for peace and tranquillity. The administration of Franklin Roosevelt and Sir Winston Churchill knew that our very survival depended upon mobilizing our populations. Where did it all go wrong. We all became prosperous, however we forgot one thing- we forgot that we are all in this World together. People become greedy and the greed became infectious. We started to lose our ethical compass and forget the things our parents taught us like compassion, be a good neighbour and being humble. We also forgot the golden rule. Now it's every person for themselves and the US government once the envy of the World has become the scourge of the World. Yes, America lost almost 3,000 people during the 9-11 attack but we lost a lot more since- our moral compass and the good part of those ideals that make a great people. We can't fix this until we admit it.

Ironic that the greatest generation grew up through hardship and sacrifice living through the Great Depression and WWII before coming home and building the nation. In their noble desire that their children never face the hardships they faced, they produced the baby boomers. The rest is history

Yeah agreed. And it's about time you Millennials move the hell out of the house and start a life of your own. And now ya'll are moving into 'leadership' positions. That should be a hoot!

Lol...I wish I were a Millennial. I was a young child when Eisenhower correctly warned of the direction the country was taking.

[jonesthebaker]

I was a veteran in the U.S. Marine Corps and proud of it. But to now what is going on in Thailand has to be done. Corruption, drugs, bad police just to name a few and the new PM has all the bad people looking over there shoulders and wondering if they will be next. In Thailand you do not see riot and whole cities destroyed while the police get a order to stand down. I believe progress has been made in Thailand and will get even better if they fire the bad police instead of transferring them to another district. Thansin still has a police rank so the police brotherhood must be stronger than the military!

did you kill any innocent woman or children or old people

Are you off your meds permanently or just until your handler finds out?

so in your tiny mind it is not a fact that so many american soldiers suffer from a life of post traumatic stress due to having killed innocent people? ok, get back on your meds.

Edited June 27, 2015 by jonesthebaker

[jesimps]

Here we go again.

I was kind of shocked to see that list and Thailand included in it.

posters here not surprised as you have always been an apologist,how is your bum

Red raw I would imagine going by his previous sychophantic comments.

[arend]

Fact: America imprisons more of it's citizens than any other country on the planet. i.e. 2.2 million people in America are in prison compared to 1.5 million in China. (you may wish to consider that China has more than 4 times the population).

America also holds the world record for death by police.

Just a couple of little factoids for those sitll living with the idea that America is a force for good

Oh, friend, I think you misunderstand. The high prison population is the Republican's innovative social welfare program . Inmates are no longer homeless and receive free food, shelter and medical care and it's increasingly privatized for corporate benefit so more can trickle down to needy families...

I checked Guinness for the "world record for death by police" but zip. I could only find statistics relating to the rates of death by violence. Hmmm...U.S. rates as 92nd out of 192 countries. Damn, America as average....how disappointing...

Anyway, keep those factoids coming....

You should have instead checked the "factoid" regarding "the high prison population" being a result of the "republicans" (for which I equally have little use for). It is simply not correct to suggest it is this narrow an issue; thats all. The first few pages of this link alone suggest the numbers for justices and their appointments. This reveals a very mixed picture.

https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R43426.pdf

The following link changes the complexity a bit and suggests a decidedly liberal tilt has taken place in the US (at the federal level). http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/10/27/obama-brief

The US prison population is hardly a result of 2nd Amendment or any other inherent qualia regarding the US. It is a direct result and corresponds with the social engineering began with the Great Society and secondary dependency programs. Add forced multiculturalism and social relativity on the population and the underlying American fabric is rent. The below graph says it all. All one has to then do is look at the history of liberal progressive social engineering in the US as an overlay and the causal connection is unavoidable. Countries like Thailand are delicately but resoundingly rejecting the obvious poison pill of western social engineering.

http://sentencingproject.org/doc/publications/inc_Trends_in_Corrections_Fact_sheet.pdf

Just satire....for a little fun...

Edited June 27, 2015 by arend

[jesimps]

Pot, Kettle, Black.

Two wrongs, don't make, a right.

Edited June 27, 2015 by jesimps

[jonesthebaker]

Fact: America imprisons more of it's citizens than any other country on the planet. i.e. 2.2 million people in America are in prison compared to 1.5 million in China. (you may wish to consider that China has more than 4 times the population).

America also holds the world record for death by police.

Just a couple of little factoids for those sitll living with the idea that America is a force for good

Oh, friend, I think you misunderstand. The high prison population is the Republican's innovative social welfare program . Inmates are no longer homeless and receive free food, shelter and medical care and it's increasingly privatized for corporate benefit so more can trickle down to needy families...

I checked Guinness for the "world record for death by police" but zip. I could only find statistics relating to the rates of death by violence. Hmmm...U.S. rates as 92nd out of 192 countries. Damn, America as average....how disappointing...

Anyway, keep those factoids coming....

You should have instead checked the "factoid" regarding "the high prison population" being a result of the "republicans" (for which I equally have little use for). It is simply not correct to suggest it is this narrow an issue; thats all. The first few pages of this link alone suggest the numbers for justices and their appointments. This reveals a very mixed picture.

https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R43426.pdf

The following link changes the complexity a bit and suggests a decidedly liberal tilt has taken place in the US (at the federal level). http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/10/27/obama-brief

The US prison population is hardly a result of 2nd Amendment or any other inherent qualia regarding the US. It is a direct result and corresponds with the social engineering began with the Great Society and secondary dependency programs. Add forced multiculturalism and social relativity on the population and the underlying American fabric is rent. The below graph says it all. All one has to then do is look at the history of liberal progressive social engineering in the US as an overlay and the causal connection is unavoidable. Countries like Thailand are delicately but resoundingly rejecting the obvious poison pill of western social engineering.

http://sentencingproject.org/doc/publications/inc_Trends_in_Corrections_Fact_sheet.pdf

Just satire....for a little fun...

what is satire about those facts??

[aeclubwoi]

thank you for the information. My country as you say. Violation humans are protected by the new government.

[jonesthebaker]

Yeah , right ! The US owes you an explanation about their actions/authority, like Eli Wallach, in a very old western film who said " we don't need no ----ing badges " !

typical moronic american attitude. i guess that is why americans vote for cowboy actors for president. america is fast becoming a third world cesspit!

[smotherb]

But this is coming from a country which also tramples on the rights of its own citizens, invades other countries on the flimsiest of excuses, detains citizens of other countries without trial and those persons only defenders are appointed by the the US military. Some of those people have been arrested in countries other than the USA and many of them have been awaiting trial for years.

It regularly sends drones to kill people in other countries and worries little if anything about "collateral damage" to that countries citizens.

Civilians in the USA are regularly killed by the police forces within the USA.

It supports freedom of speech but when it comes to Wikileaks it wants to prosecute to the nth degree those people that expose the truth.

It supports dictatorial regimes in some parts of the world.

When you live in a glass house it is not always a good idea to throw stones.

What's your point?

[jonesthebaker]

But this is coming from a country which also tramples on the rights of its own citizens, invades other countries on the flimsiest of excuses, detains citizens of other countries without trial and those persons only defenders are appointed by the the US military. Some of those people have been arrested in countries other than the USA and many of them have been awaiting trial for years.

It regularly sends drones to kill people in other countries and worries little if anything about "collateral damage" to that countries citizens.

Civilians in the USA are regularly killed by the police forces within the USA.

It supports freedom of speech but when it comes to Wikileaks it wants to prosecute to the nth degree those people that expose the truth.

It supports dictatorial regimes in some parts of the world.

When you live in a glass house it is not always a good idea to throw stones.

What's your point?

can't you read!

[tbthailand]

1. The US democratically elected government is a farce; it is manipulated both at the polls and the electors. Civil liberties in America are increasingly a farce both with the citizens and police/federal and journalists and federal government. Civil liberties in the US remain, but it is an empty container, aping its former glory.

2. Americans no longer have the ability to change government- 6 of one, 1/2 dozen of the other, always the lesser of two evils while America moves inexorably toward oligarchy and corporatocracy.

3. The Obama administration is oppressive to a free press and this results in America's freedom of speech rating to be increasingly lowered. Contrary to what one might imagine freedom of the press in the US is way down the list compared to many other countries.

4. The abuses of the US federal and local governments into outright assaults on the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 10th, and 14th Amendments. The US government is the most intrusive stasi like State in the history of planet earth. Under the stalking horse of "for the children" "stop the bad guys" and other Emmanuel Goldstein cliches, the US has become as oppressive as East Germany was. The only difference is the mechanics of going through the motions of same ole same ole. In other words, business as usual is only a shadow of its former self.

5. The US has passed indefinite detention laws suspending habeus corpus.

There is not really much more to say. If I were Thailand I would be equally aghast at the presumption of this stalking evil to pass judgement. So, why does it matter. Because while the US has lost even a fig leaf of credibility around the world it still wields a big stick and has repeatedly demonstrated it will attack allies and befriend enemies.

But this is coming from a country which also tramples on the rights of its own citizens, invades other countries on the flimsiest of excuses, detains citizens of other countries without trial and those persons only defenders are appointed by the the US military. Some of those people have been arrested in countries other than the USA and many of them have been awaiting trial for years.

It regularly sends drones to kill people in other countries and worries little if anything about "collateral damage" to that countries citizens.

Civilians in the USA are regularly killed by the police forces within the USA.

It supports freedom of speech but when it comes to Wikileaks it wants to prosecute to the nth degree those people that expose the truth.

It supports dictatorial regimes in some parts of the world.

When you live in a glass house it is not always a good idea to throw stones.

Ditto!

what a bunch of BS - go crawl back in your hole. If it weren't for America, your country would probably speak German/Italian/Japanese right now.

Your credibility is, presumably, because you are an American? Well, I am an American too. One could hardly dispute the points raised. One could hardly dispute that if it were not for America the world would be in so much darkness and suffering. It is overwhelmingly apparent that America has been through its short life a real force for good in the world. In its absence much of the world would still be cesspools of abuse and deprivation. I have always said that when the lights go out in America the rest of the world will become very dark. (The presumption that one must not be an American to note the facts above reveals much about the very arrogance that America is indicted for with regard to Thailand on this OP).

However, both of these observations are true, what you write and what is stated previously. They are not exclusive. America is the things you imply but also the things stated. It is the things stated to which the report on Thailand speaks and it is relevant because even a cursory glance at world affairs and feelings toward the US reveal America has lost great legitimacy. So, as I go crawl back in [my] hole, bloodied and disabled from serving my country for decades, I shall remember your brilliantly articulated notes on the obvious- America has done many great things for the world. Very true!

as an American, you are, like me, uniquely qualified to criticize our country. As you are clearly not a gratuitous American basher, I retract my "hole" comment and obviously, you may come from a family which spoke German/Italian/Japanese ... or still does.

Like you, I am well aware of the anti-democratic forces at work in our country and the power of money and influence - the discussion of which is far outside the scope of this topic. I disagree with many of your points while understanding that ours is not a perfect society.

But related to this thread, it is absurd to feel that a country with an open, free, democratic society like the USA has no place in calling out military regimes for suppressing human rights is - please allow me to repeat myself - a bunch of BS.

OK?

[smotherb]

Yeah , right ! The US owes you an explanation about their actions/authority, like Eli Wallach, in a very old western film who said " we don't need no ----ing badges " !

Actually, it was the 1948 Bogart movie, Treasure of Sierra Madre. The line was, "Badges, we don't need no stinking badges," and it was uttered by Alfonso Bedoya a Mexican actor who played the bandit leader.

https://www.google.co.th/search=cast+of+Treasure+of+Sierra+madre&oq=cast+of+Treasure+of+Sierra+madre&aqs=chrome..69i57.14505j0j7&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8

[50baht]

USA still angry about a message that was sent.....OLD SCHOOL.

>>>>>>http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/27/nicole-john-dead-teen-dau_n_696934.html

This after the American Ambassador strong armed the Thais to turn over Russian citizen Viktor Bout

[Thai at Heart]

Now peace has returned to the Kingdom and people can travel to any place in the country without fear, he said.

The clowns in government just don't understand. Yes, what he said might be true, but when they get where they are going these same people can't openly say what they think or gather in protest without fear.

So the so called insurgency in the south is over and done with?

[smotherb]

But this is coming from a country which also tramples on the rights of its own citizens, invades other countries on the flimsiest of excuses, detains citizens of other countries without trial and those persons only defenders are appointed by the the US military. Some of those people have been arrested in countries other than the USA and many of them have been awaiting trial for years.

It regularly sends drones to kill people in other countries and worries little if anything about "collateral damage" to that countries citizens.

Civilians in the USA are regularly killed by the police forces within the USA.

It supports freedom of speech but when it comes to Wikileaks it wants to prosecute to the nth degree those people that expose the truth.

It supports dictatorial regimes in some parts of the world.

When you live in a glass house it is not always a good idea to throw stones.

What's your point?

can't you read!

Whatever the US does, or is accused of doing, has absolutley no bearing on whether or not Thailand has made human rights violations.

Can't you think?

[jackanapes]

the problem with America is continual interference in other countries affairs it should look to its own affairs and stop sticking its nose in where its not wanted.

[jonesthebaker]

But this is coming from a country which also tramples on the rights of its own citizens, invades other countries on the flimsiest of excuses, detains citizens of other countries without trial and those persons only defenders are appointed by the the US military. Some of those people have been arrested in countries other than the USA and many of them have been awaiting trial for years.

It regularly sends drones to kill people in other countries and worries little if anything about "collateral damage" to that countries citizens.

Civilians in the USA are regularly killed by the police forces within the USA.

It supports freedom of speech but when it comes to Wikileaks it wants to prosecute to the nth degree those people that expose the truth.

It supports dictatorial regimes in some parts of the world.

When you live in a glass house it is not always a good idea to throw stones.

What's your point?

can't you read!

Whatever the US does, or is accused of doing, has absolutley no bearing on whether or not Thailand has made human rights violations.

Can't you think?

yes - i can think for myself. obviously you're more of a group think kind of person!

[wabothai]

if he does not understand how did he become a general?

[rijb]

Miami Bob just posted the truth- and along with myself- realise that it is almost hopeless for anyone other than the chosen elite to be elected in the United States. In the unlikely event that a person with integrity and not beholden to the wealthy did receive a forum and was able to get their message across- they would be eliminated. America is the land of greed. As much as Thailand operates on the same system- America is the master of it all. Everything is about money. Obama trumpets his health care reform as though it really is reform- absolute nonsense. He caved into every wealthy business person associated with healthcare and created a monstrosity in which the tax man now monitors whether you paid your health care premium and added 10,000 more revenue agents to do it. Guess who pays their salaries. The American people, of course. Ever wonder why a person's' illness should be a way for someone to make money. Healthcare is an inalienable right. Most of Europe has basic healthcare for its citizens. The American government ignored those systems that actually work and are fair and chose a system that rewards insurance companies. This is only one example of the chicanery that the US government hoists on its populace. Again, I am not anti American but to fix a problem , one has to admit it exists. And there are plenty more.

Were your welfare benefits cut off or are you just trying to suck up to your non-American friends?

[falangjim]

The truth hurts...that is unless you're Thai, then the truth can be manipulated with money. This was an outside report which has integrity, so it's no wonder the Thai junta don't understand it. How could they? And Commander Blop is the worst offender. When will this jerk understand his 15 minutes are over. Give the people back their country. If they destroy it again, let them destroy it on their terms. These lack of freedoms are BS.

[lostoday]

It's been downhill since Kennedy.

The Bay of Pigs. Almost WWIII (Cuban missile crisis). Start of Vietnam. Berlin wall built. I guess you didn't live in America.

[Sabaidee Mai]

But this is coming from a country which also tramples on the rights of its own citizens, invades other countries on the flimsiest of excuses, detains citizens of other countries without trial and those persons only defenders are appointed by the the US military. Some of those people have been arrested in countries other than the USA and many of them have been awaiting trial for years.

It regularly sends drones to kill people in other countries and worries little if anything about "collateral damage" to that countries citizens.

Civilians in the USA are regularly killed by the police forces within the USA.

It supports freedom of speech but when it comes to Wikileaks it wants to prosecute to the nth degree those people that expose the truth.

It supports dictatorial regimes in some parts of the world.

When you live in a glass house it is not always a good idea to throw stones.

Ignoring your knack of overstating things in a pretty ridiculous manner, what does any of that have to do with Thailands transgressions? Slavery still exists here. Refugees are sold into it. Camps are burned to "prevent them from being used again", or more likely to get rid of the evidence. Blocking voting booths, arresting people for speaking their mind, and overthrowing elected governments time and time again with military coups. Face it, Thailand deserves the rating it has received. It deserves to have its fishing industry boycotted. The US is far from perfect, but that doesn't invalidate what has been said.

I think you will find slavery exists in most countries reported often in the UK, and girls are trafficked here to work in the sex industry, some countries take the attention of themselves by accusing others