A Palestinian village braces for Israeli demolition

[Jingthing]

Ah bless, if some Romanian pikeys constructed a corrugated iron shanty town across the street from some of our esteemed members I bet they would have called the police, fire brigade and national guard before having a seizure.

The houses were unlicensed and possibly even dangerous, though had they been left to stand and came down on their occupants heads it would still be Israel's fault.

But I almost forgot the Palestinians are nothing more than ammunition to fire at Israel, the total silence over the 2900 of them murdered in Syria amply demonstrates this.

The houses were unlicensed and possibly even dangerous,

You are blaming the victims for their problems, rather than putting the blame on Israel for not giving them building permits. It is THEIR land, unlike the ILLEGAL settler structures built on occupied land.

Israel keeps giving the world a reason to hate them.

I used to support Israel, but now.....................( can't say what I really think ).

Israel isn't perfect. Nobody said they were. Is your country perfect? Is China perfect? Is Russia perfect? Is the USA perfect? Is Brazil perfect? Unless you have a specific Israel demonizing obsession, I reckon you can't say what you really think about the majority of nations in the world. No? Hmm.

[thaibeachlovers]

by the time the jews have finished building Palestine will be no more than a memory they are a greedy nation greedy for land which is not theirs to take more and more and the world just watches and does nothing they are a blight on the face of the planet .

The one thing about anti semites is that they really can't disguise their hate.

Like Hitler said,

“If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed.”

It is possible to dislike, even hate, Israel for what they do to the Palestinians and still like Jewish people.

[Ulysses G.]

Yeah sure and some of your best friends are Jewish.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[Jingthing]

by the time the jews have finished building Palestine will be no more than a memory they are a greedy nation greedy for land which is not theirs to take more and more and the world just watches and does nothing they are a blight on the face of the planet .

The one thing about anti semites is that they really can't disguise their hate.

Like Hitler said,

“If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed.”

It is possible to dislike, even hate, Israel for what they do to the Palestinians and still like Jewish people.

Perhaps so, but it sounds like you are defending the vile Jew hating rhetoric of jackanapes when non-racist people would be condemning it. One thing I find odd about these Israel threads is so many posting anti-Israel obsessively making loud noises that it has nothing to do with Jew hatred, and yet you pretty much never see them going after the blatant out of the closet Jew hating posts that we do see here regularly. So it makes it really, really hard to believe their sincerity.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Jingthing

[thaibeachlovers]

Ah bless, if some Romanian pikeys constructed a corrugated iron shanty town across the street from some of our esteemed members I bet they would have called the police, fire brigade and national guard before having a seizure.

The houses were unlicensed and possibly even dangerous, though had they been left to stand and came down on their occupants heads it would still be Israel's fault.

But I almost forgot the Palestinians are nothing more than ammunition to fire at Israel, the total silence over the 2900 of them murdered in Syria amply demonstrates this.

The houses were unlicensed and possibly even dangerous,

You are blaming the victims for their problems, rather than putting the blame on Israel for not giving them building permits. It is THEIR land, unlike the ILLEGAL settler structures built on occupied land.

Israel keeps giving the world a reason to hate them.

I used to support Israel, but now.....................( can't say what I really think ).

Israel isn't perfect. Nobody said they were. Is your country perfect? Is China perfect? Is Russia perfect? Is the USA perfect? Is Brazil perfect? Unless you have a specific Israel demonizing obsession, I reckon you can't say what you really think about the majority of nations in the world. No? Hmm.

My country isn't perfect, but they haven't been oppressing the lawful owners of the land since before 1948.

As long as Israel occupies Palestine things ain't gonna change, and lots of people won't like Israel.

The difference between some other countries and Israel is that one expects them to behave badly. A Jewish nation should be better considering what happened to them.

Edited July 25, 2015 by thaibeachlovers

[stevenl]

Ah bless, if some Romanian pikeys constructed a corrugated iron shanty town across the street from some of our esteemed members I bet they would have called the police, fire brigade and national guard before having a seizure.

The houses were unlicensed and possibly even dangerous, though had they been left to stand and came down on their occupants heads it would still be Israel's fault.

But I almost forgot the Palestinians are nothing more than ammunition to fire at Israel, the total silence over the 2900 of them murdered in Syria amply demonstrates this.

The houses were unlicensed and possibly even dangerous,

You are blaming the victims for their problems, rather than putting the blame on Israel for not giving them building permits. It is THEIR land, unlike the ILLEGAL settler structures built on occupied land.

Israel keeps giving the world a reason to hate them.

I used to support Israel, but now.....................( can't say what I really think ).

That's what I said in another thread as well. Worldwide Israel has been supported by many for a long time, but that support has been evaporating significantly over the years and also at the moment the support for Israel is getting less and less.

And that has nothing to do with growing anti Semitism, but with more and more people disagreeing with Israels policies, especially the continuing occupation of Palestinian land and the growing number of settlements there.

[Ulysses G.]

If the Palestinians want peace, all they have to do is recognize Israel and sign a peace treaty. They have refused for almost 70 years.

“If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel' ”.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[thaibeachlovers]

Yeah sure and some of your best friends are Jewish.

Indeed yes. In Antarctica I was good friends with a Jewish guy that worked on an American base there. Top guy, in fact one of the nicest men I ever met. Lost touch after we went home to different countries.

Probably the only reason I don't have more Jewish friends is that they are not many in my country ( only met one, at school ), didn't meet any in Saudi, or where I worked in London. Where I live now in LOS there aren't any farangs of any ethnicity to meet.

[Ulysses G.]

Your best friend is a Jewish guy in Antarctica. That sounds about right.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[thaibeachlovers]

If the Palestinians want peace, all they have to do is recognize Israel and sign a peace treaty. They have refused for almost 70 years.

“If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel' ”.

The Palestinians will never sign a peace treaty with Israel as long as they occupy the west bank and build illegal settlements. Would you if you were Palestinian?

So, let's reverse what you said. If the Israelis want peace, all they have to do is leave the west bank and return to the legal borders of Israel. They have NO intention of doing so.

Occupation hasn't produced peace in 51 years, so perhaps it's time to try something different.

[thaibeachlovers]

Your best friend is a Jewish guy in Antarctica. That sounds about right.

I wasn't aware that a Jew is different if he lives in Antarctica than if he lives somewhere else.

[thaibeachlovers]

I think Israel have learned enough lessons the hard way with suicide bombs and terrorists. I doubt they care what people who have no idea what that is like think.

The unanswered question is whether these people have settled there deliberately to defy Israel and cry foul when they get moved out as they knew they would.

The article reads like it is very biased to someone who would like to know the full facts and is yet another piece of journalism-with-an-agenda.

Why of course. The EU actually funds illegal Palestinian settlements and has a hissy fit when they are correctly dismantled.

http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Report-EU-building-hundreds-of-illegal-structures-for-Palestinians-in-Area-C-of-West-Bank-390184

Which is quite ironic as they are building walls to stop and squabbling like children to avoid the flood of third world culture enrichers swamping their borders.

How the frack can a Palestinian settlement be illegal in PALESTINE??????????

The Israelis are the ILLEGAL occupiers and have no right to be dictating where Palestinians should live.

[Ulysses G.]

There is no "Palestine". The Arabs have not negotiated any borders as they have committed to. They are illegally building on the parts of the West Bank that is under full Israeli control, according to the Oslo Accords that they agreed to.

Edited July 25, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[thaibeachlovers]

Spare us the pseudo history and deflections.

The bottom line for all Palestinian delegitimizers is this: even if you think there was was never a country called Palestine, well think again...because there is one now...recognized by 70% of the world's countries with more to follow. And just like Israelis they are not going away. So get over it, and start thinking towards the future rather than wallowing in a spurious past that convinces no-one except Zionists.

If Israelis don't get serious soon about discussing a just peace in a 2 state solution (giving back land they are attempting futilely to swallow up in the OP), they will find themselves in a one state solution, having to absorb 4.5 Palestinians, and losing any hope of a state with a predominantly Jewish character.

Here's the thing that you and other Jew haters can't get through your head (or don't want to as it will interfere with your anti-Jew views) and that's the fact - yes FACT - that the only people preventing peace is Hamas and the Gazans. Their charter calls for the absolute destruction of Israel - fact. The history lesson I gave you is nothing 'pseudo'. It's fact. When Britain signed the charter in 1947 returning Israel to the Jews, according to the British Mandate the population was 1.9 million of which 68% were Arabs and 31% Jews (the discrepancy of 1% is allowing for Bedouins). Most of the so-called Palestinians came from Saudi and Syria to find work with the Jews. The region was dissected - it was called Transjordan one side of the river became Israel again and one became Jordan. The Palestinian population was split between Jordan and Israel. How come |I don't hear you calling for Jordan to give the land back to somebody? Oh I know the answer, because they're not Jews, right? There's 2.1 million registered Palestinians in Jordan and 370,000 in camps yet I don't hear you or your mates calling for help for them? People like you make me vomit, you know nothing of the region except you don't like Jews.

You are most welcome to call me a Zionist hater and a current right wing Israeli government hater...they are badges I wear proudly, but please don't call me an anti Semite. That is a reportable offense on this forum.There is not a racist/religionist bone in my body.

I am quite willing to debate your phony history of Israel/Palestine but I believe we may be drifting off topic. Another thread another time maybe.

Fair enough Dexterm. Perhaps you are an exception. Two serious questions I'd like to ask you.

I believe them foundational to any conversation re land appropriation.

1. Could you give some idea of what you think Zionism is and a source for your thinking? Personally the desire and even demand for a Jewish homeland leaves me wondering why someone would be a Zionist hater (and proudly so) if they were not otherwise antisemitic. I briefly looked for such a source but so far came up empty.

2. In these multitudes of word battles on this forum that began long before I arrived and will doubtless continue after I'm gone, have you ever noted what you might consider 'racist/religionist' bones in any of the posters' bodies?

Those questions have been answered many many times before, on many threads.

[losworld]

Time to cut U.S. funding to Israel (currently around 4 billion per year). Ridiculous.

[Ulysses G.]

Cutting funding to our closest ally in the Middle East would be a lot more ridiculous.

Most of the money that the USA gives Israel has been used to purchase goods and services from America, so that American aid money is recycled back into the American economy. Nearly 90% of US aid to Israel is military, and Israel spends about 75% of that purchasing U.S. goods. This aid is really an American subsidy to U.S. arms manufacturers.

Israel is a strong military ally. The security cooperation between Israel and the United States is huge, and Israel has consistently been a major security asset to the United States, an asset upon which America can rely, far more than other recipients of American funds.

Israel is the world's leading expert in collecting intelligence on terrorist groups and in counter-terrorism. It provides military intelligence and know-how to the U.S. worth far more than what we give them in Aid.

On top of intelligence, if there were no Israel, the US would have to deploy aircraft carriers to the area, along with tens of thousands of US soldiers, which would cost tens of billions of dollars annually. Gen. Alexander Haig called Israel "the largest US aircraft carrier, which does not require even one US soldier, cannot be sunk, is the most cost-effective and battle-tested, located in a region which is critical to vital US interests."

Edited July 25, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[wabothai]

It sounds like a threat of violence but I wanted confirmation from the horse's mouth.

you obviously haven't taken note of my former postings.

[Jingthing]

It sounds like a threat of violence but I wanted confirmation from the horse's mouth.

you obviously haven't taken note of my former postings.

I just did. The usual Israel demonization claptrap. Welcome to my ignore list.

[Jingthing]

Your best friend is a Jewish guy in Antarctica. That sounds about right.

I wasn't aware that a Jew is different if he lives in Antarctica than if he lives somewhere else.

Claims of having close Jewish friends, true or not, are irrelevant.

We are talking about political issues here. Not your personal life.

[samthefish]

Talmud?

No.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Zionism/zionism.html

The term “Zionism” was coined in 1890 by Nathan Birnbaum.

Its general definition means the national movement for the return of the Jewish people to their homeland and the resumption of Jewish sovereignty in the Land of Israel.

Since the establishment of the State of Israel in 1948, Zionism has come to include the movement for the development of the State of Israel and the protection of the Jewish nation in Israel through support for the Israel Defense Forces.

From inception, Zionism avocated tangible as well as spiritual aims. Jews of all persuasions - left, right, religious and secular - formed the Zionist movement and worked together toward its goals.

Disagreements in philosophy has led to rifts in the Zionist movement of the years and a number of separate forms have emerged, notably: Political Zionism; Religious Zionism; Socialist Zionism and Territorial Zionism.

So Talmud don't say Gentiles are just work force,slaves. Stealing from Gentiles isn't a crime. Jewish courts have to favor Jews over Gentiles...?

So silence after signature tantrum , hmmm,is that a yes?

[Jingthing]

Some more background on the actual topic of this thread:

How a Palestinian Hamlet of 340 Drew Global Attention

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/24/world/middleeast/palestinians-west-bank-susiya-israeli-demolition.html?_r=0

I hope there is a satisfactory resolution for all concerned, Jews and Arabs.

Like a lot of this seemingly endless conflict, it's messy.

[Linky]

P.s Wikipedia is not a source.

And this is why. From Thorgal's link:

"Last edited 4 hours ago by an anonymous user"

Oh the irony of you making this post, as an anonymous poster on here ?

[Jingthing]

I think Israel have learned enough lessons the hard way with suicide bombs and terrorists. I doubt they care what people who have no idea what that is like think.

The unanswered question is whether these people have settled there deliberately to defy Israel and cry foul when they get moved out as they knew they would.

The article reads like it is very biased to someone who would like to know the full facts and is yet another piece of journalism-with-an-agenda.

Why of course. The EU actually funds illegal Palestinian settlements and has a hissy fit when they are correctly dismantled.

http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Report-EU-building-hundreds-of-illegal-structures-for-Palestinians-in-Area-C-of-West-Bank-390184

Which is quite ironic as they are building walls to stop and squabbling like children to avoid the flood of third world culture enrichers swamping their borders.

How the frack can a Palestinian settlement be illegal in PALESTINE??????????

The Israelis are the ILLEGAL occupiers and have no right to be dictating where Palestinians should live.

How?

That's pretty obvious.

Sweden may recognize the fiction that a state of Palestine actually exists, but Israel doesn't.

Which is why the Palestinian leaderships should consider direct negotiations with Israel, the country that really MATTERS in the potential actuality of a Palestinian state.

So there is no current state of Palestine and there never was a nation state called Palestine.

The actual legal reality of land of this village:

Their land lies in what is known as Area C, a part of the West Bank directly overseen by Israeli agencies rather than by the Palestinian Authority.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/24/world/middleeast/palestinians-west-bank-susiya-israeli-demolition.html?_r=0

No I am not suggesting this situation is good. Of course it isn't. But that's your answer as to HOW?

Edited July 25, 2015 by Jingthing

[Scott]

Off-topic, troll, inflammatory and replies removed.

[Seastallion]

Some more background on the actual topic of this thread:

How a Palestinian Hamlet of 340 Drew Global Attention

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/24/world/middleeast/palestinians-west-bank-susiya-israeli-demolition.html?_r=0

I hope there is a satisfactory resolution for all concerned, Jews and Arabs.

Like a lot of this seemingly endless conflict, it's messy.

Not messy at all...it's very clear cut. The IDF are forcing these people off their land so that settlers can expand their holdings.

[Seastallion]

Why of course. The EU actually funds illegal Palestinian settlements and has a hissy fit when they are correctly dismantled.

http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Report-EU-building-hundreds-of-illegal-structures-for-Palestinians-in-Area-C-of-West-Bank-390184

Which is quite ironic as they are building walls to stop and squabbling like children to avoid the flood of third world culture enrichers swamping their borders.

How the frack can a Palestinian settlement be illegal in PALESTINE??????????

The Israelis are the ILLEGAL occupiers and have no right to be dictating where Palestinians should live.

How?

That's pretty obvious.

Sweden may recognize the fiction that a state of Palestine actually exists, but Israel doesn't.

Which is why the Palestinian leaderships should consider direct negotiations with Israel, the country that really MATTERS in the potential actuality of a Palestinian state.

So there is no current state of Palestine and there never was a nation state called Palestine.

The actual legal reality of land of this village:

Their land lies in what is known as Area C, a part of the West Bank directly overseen by Israeli agencies rather than by the Palestinian Authority.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/24/world/middleeast/palestinians-west-bank-susiya-israeli-demolition.html?_r=0

No I am not suggesting this situation is good. Of course it isn't. But that's your answer as to HOW?

Overseen. Not owned.

[sdanielmcev]

Palestine is an area, much like the steppes of Russia, or the Rocky Mountains in the US. Before the establishment of the state of Israel, anybody in that area was considered Palestinian. Including Jews. When Israel was forcibly carved out of Jordan, to get the troublesome Jews out of Europe, there was no idea that the newly transplanted Jews would practice the same holocaust on the indigenous peoples that Hitler did.

While later, Jews claimed an 'indigenous right' to the area, they killed and displaced any actual indigenous peoples already there. Close to 1 million, by last estimates. The Israelis in the name of their god now want the rest of the world to believe they have a right to this area, or any other area they willfully gave up some 2000 years ago, does not stand the test of truth. Except they can kill more.

Have a nice day.

[Lissos]

Europe's centuries old nemesis, the Ottoman Empire, was defeated by European powers who then carved up the remains into political / ethnic divisions as they (the victors) saw fit, just as the Muslim Arab Conquest took over a defeated 'Christian' Levant and North Africa (lest we forget, as many do) and did what they liked with the land and any peoples upon that same land.

The Arab world for the most part largely accepted this carve up into what are 'western created' nations, with comparatively little complaint even though there was plenty of upheaval, strife and different sections of a family even ended up in different nations afterwards as a result. Accepted with relatively little complaint, except for one miniscule area of course

Hmmm, I wonder why that was? Perhaps because it was to be home to Jews controlling their own destiny instead of being Dhimmi to Muslim overlords?

Middle Easterners complaining about a 'western imposition' in the case of Israel, need to look at the details surrounding their own nation's founding.

Get over it!

[Harveyg]

If the Palestinians want peace, all they have to do is recognize Israel and sign a peace treaty. They have refused for almost 70 years.

If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel' .

I can't express the bottom line any better than that. Put aside all this bickering over settlements and gaza and deal with those 2 statements. This is the Big Picture. The amount of truth you are able to give to these statements is roughly the amount of understanding you have for Israel's actions. Except of course those of you who already agree with the typical stereotypes - Jews "greedy", " blight on the world"

[Ulysses G.]

When Israel was forcibly carved out of Jordan, to get the troublesome Jews out of Europe, there was no idea that the newly transplanted Jews would practice the same holocaust on the indigenous peoples that Hitler did.

Anyone who thinks that "Israel was carved out of Jordan" does not have the slightest idea of what they are talking about. Jordan was taken from the British Mandate of Palestine - the land meant to be the homeland for the Jewish people. If anything, you have it backwards.

Edited July 26, 2015 by Ulysses G.