What do you love (and hate) about being a landlord in Thailand?

[Hal65]

As we are mostly ex-pats I'm expecting answers from mostly condo landlords.

Would do you see as the positives and negatives of being a landlord in Thailand?

[beachproperty]

Love the money.......Hate the effort (careless, dead-beat, and dirty tenants)

[asdecas]

Love not having a foreign landlord m'self.

[elgordo38]

As a renter I would prefer a foreign landlord which I had on my first condo rental. She was a German lady. When problems arose she was there immediately to fix things. When I moved she was fair with the deposit. I have moved 2 times in the same building and love the building. On the flipside I know of foreigners who have rented all inclusive from Thai landlords and have found their cable, internet or electric disconnected because the landlord "forgot" to pay the bill. I would only move into a unit where I am in charge of all utilities. On the last two moves I dealt with the office desk downstairs in all matters and in the second case I wanted to move early before the lease ended. My landlord(Chinese) at the time did state he did not want to extend the lease and as I was able to find another unit in the building that was empty at the time he agreed to let me terminate the lease early by about 4 months so he could do some cosmetic remodeling and jack up the rent fair enough. I was able to sign a 3 year lease on my present unit. I will approach the landlord early next summer to extend the lease. This building fits the location, location location premises to a T which I wanted after some trial and error renting. Trial and error are the key words. I make it a point to pay the rent always on the due date and to respect the landlords unit. I respect other peoples privacy and expect the same. Unfortunately we are getting more families with children who have parents that do not seem to understand living in a community style way. At 40 square metres on average these units are not designed for families with kids. They let the children run up and down the hallways as a play area and well kids do get noisy (screaming) and the modern day parent does not seem to grasp that this is a problem that should be dealt with before it becomes habitual. Welcome to the 21 century.

Edited August 1, 2015 by elgordo38

[Jimlove]

Love not having a foreign landlord m'self.

because ... ??? My Thaiwife refuse to rent from a thaiman - she dont trust them ...

[Mr Wonderful]

I only rent units deadbeats and dirty families can't afford.

And two or three months deposit works out to 200 or 300k so they do want most of that back.

[Hal65]

As a renter I would prefer a foreign landlord which I had on my first condo rental. She was a German lady. When problems arose she was there immediately to fix things. When I moved she was fair with the deposit. I have moved 2 times in the same building and love the building. On the flipside I know of foreigners who have rented all inclusive from Thai landlords and have found their cable, internet or electric disconnected because the landlord "forgot" to pay the bill. I would only move into a unit where I am in charge of all utilities. On the last two moves I dealt with the office desk downstairs in all matters and in the second case I wanted to move early before the lease ended. My landlord(Chinese) at the time did state he did not want to extend the lease and as I was able to find another unit in the building that was empty at the time he agreed to let me terminate the lease early by about 4 months so he could do some cosmetic remodeling and jack up the rent fair enough. I was able to sign a 3 year lease on my present unit. I will approach the landlord early next summer to extend the lease. This building fits the location, location location premises to a T which I wanted after some trial and error renting. Trial and error are the key words. I make it a point to pay the rent always on the due date and to respect the landlords unit. I respect other peoples privacy and expect the same. Unfortunately we are getting more families with children who have parents that do not seem to understand living in a community style way. At 40 square metres on average these units are not designed for families with kids. They let the children run up and down the hallways as a play area and well kids do get noisy (screaming) and the modern day parent does not seem to grasp that this is a problem that should be dealt with before it becomes habitual. Welcome to the 21 century.

I appreciate your input but I do hope we can keep this thread on track. The topic is for only for landlords to share their perspective.

[robertson468]

Love the extra income, love meeting new people and helping them with their problems, dislike those who do not respect my properties or the fact that I am renting a house and not a hotel room with room service!

[Mudcrab]

As a renter I would prefer a foreign landlord which I had on my first condo rental. She was a German lady. When problems arose she was there immediately to fix things. When I moved she was fair with the deposit. I have moved 2 times in the same building and love the building. On the flipside I know of foreigners who have rented all inclusive from Thai landlords and have found their cable, internet or electric disconnected because the landlord "forgot" to pay the bill. I would only move into a unit where I am in charge of all utilities. On the last two moves I dealt with the office desk downstairs in all matters and in the second case I wanted to move early before the lease ended. My landlord(Chinese) at the time did state he did not want to extend the lease and as I was able to find another unit in the building that was empty at the time he agreed to let me terminate the lease early by about 4 months so he could do some cosmetic remodeling and jack up the rent fair enough. I was able to sign a 3 year lease on my present unit. I will approach the landlord early next summer to extend the lease. This building fits the location, location location premises to a T which I wanted after some trial and error renting. Trial and error are the key words. I make it a point to pay the rent always on the due date and to respect the landlords unit. I respect other peoples privacy and expect the same. Unfortunately we are getting more families with children who have parents that do not seem to understand living in a community style way. At 40 square metres on average these units are not designed for families with kids. They let the children run up and down the hallways as a play area and well kids do get noisy (screaming) and the modern day parent does not seem to grasp that this is a problem that should be dealt with before it becomes habitual. Welcome to the 21 century.

Did you actually read the OP?

[smotherb]

I rent only to Thai university co-eds. They seem always ready to settle their rent.

[worgeordie]

Not racist,purely a business decision,we will never rent to Thais

again,we did rent 2 times to Thais,on the surface seemed like

nice people,in reality,never,ever paid the rent on time,one left,

taking 3 teak doors,all the curtains,lost remotes for A/Cs,the

auto gate, double sided tape all over the walls,holes drilled

everywhere,I must have removed 100+ rawl plugs and refilled

them.Its a good job the house was let unfurnished as we could

have lost the lot.

We have had many good Farang tenants,who have stayed long

term 3-5-even 8 years,always pay the rent on time and take care

of the house and garden,if any Thais want to rent now we tell them

need 6 months security deposit,just to put them off.

regards worgeordie

[mjakob007]

I found older tenants look after the property than younger ones.

I have never had a thai tenant, so cant comment on that aspect.

After 12 months of lease, i have had tenants who handed over the unit back in same condition, where i repaid 100% of the deposit.

initial years, i was averse to short term tenants, but now realise its not bad as that gives an opportunity to check and fix minor flaws.

[trogers]

Good job for a foreign retiree. Work is not taxing when your property has been refurbished with quality fixtures.

The taxing part is to be selective in taking on tenants.

[fang37]

I have been a landlord since my early 20s. When I came to Thailand, I did similar.

The low ROI combined even with very few problems make it a no-go.

I have a condo for sale - really too large to rent.

Built a house.

Pitiful bank interest & 15% tax is far more relaxing.

At 67yo, no thank you!

[trogers]

I have been a landlord since my early 20s. When I came to Thailand, I did similar.

The low ROI combined even with very few problems make it a no-go.

I have a condo for sale - really too large to rent.

Built a house.

Pitiful bank interest & 15% tax is far more relaxing.

At 67yo, no thank you!

Low ROI? Would depend on the point of the property cycle an investment is made.

[elliottm]

Hate - work permit for property renting business, income tax (thai and home country), immigration notifications for foreign residents.

Edited August 2, 2015 by elliottm

[fang37]

I have been a landlord since my early 20s. When I came to Thailand, I did similar.

The low ROI combined even with very few problems make it a no-go.

I have a condo for sale - really too large to rent.

Built a house.

Pitiful bank interest & 15% tax is far more relaxing.

At 67yo, no thank you!

Low ROI? Would depend on the point of the property cycle an investment is made.

I was referring to net rental return only. Capital accretion has been my sole purpose in acquiring property.

[trogers]

I have been a landlord since my early 20s. When I came to Thailand, I did similar.

The low ROI combined even with very few problems make it a no-go.

I have a condo for sale - really too large to rent.

Built a house.

Pitiful bank interest & 15% tax is far more relaxing.

At 67yo, no thank you!

Low ROI? Would depend on the point of the property cycle an investment is made.

I was referring to net rental return only. Capital accretion has been my sole purpose in acquiring property.

If capital appreciation is your main objective, buy near the bottom of cycles in any major city worldwide...

[fang37]

Picking the bottom of the market? If I knew that with certainty, I would be dining with Bill Gates & Warren Buffett et al.

Sometimes, when it looks to have bottomed, it is in fact about to dip again.

The property market is not as smooth as stocks etc - volume.

However, in general terms, I agree with your hypothesis.

[trogers]

Picking the bottom of the market? If I knew that with certainty, I would be dining with Bill Gates & Warren Buffett et al.

Sometimes, when it looks to have bottomed, it is in fact about to dip again.

The property market is not as smooth as stocks etc - volume.

However, in general terms, I agree with your hypothesis.

My observation is that a cycle bottoms out when some developer kick starts a new development.

We can only try buying near the bottom, and not at the lowest point.

[Linzz]

I have been a landlord since my early 20s. When I came to Thailand, I did similar.

The low ROI combined even with very few problems make it a no-go.

I have a condo for sale - really too large to rent.

Built a house.

Pitiful bank interest & 15% tax is far more relaxing.

At 67yo, no thank you!

Low ROI? Would depend on the point of the property cycle an investment is made.

I was referring to net rental return only. Capital accretion has been my sole purpose in acquiring property.

If capital appreciation is your main objective, buy near the bottom of cycles in any major city worldwide...

Or buy high, sell higher...e,g. Auckland, Sydney, no one has a crystal ball

[MatteoBassini]

I own rental store/place that is part of condo in Jomtien, Pattaya.

I don't like the fact that people come in and start up a business that obviously won't be profitable or barely profitable to justify opening up such business. Currently, it's a massage parlor, unless they start hiring Russian models as masseuse, this place won't be scoring any high cash flows. So as a result, they can't even afford the rent sometimes let alone not pay on time. And because it is really difficult to find a tenant, I have to bite the bullet and deal with being given 5,000 baht less than standard rental price.

[blackcab]

I work for a Thai company that owns apartment blocks where we rent out individual rooms. These are cheap rooms rented almost exclusively by Thai low income earners (although the rooms are available to anyone of any nationality).

From a commercial point of view it's a nice steady business that brings 5-6% net ROI, and that is doing it the legit way where all income is declared and all taxes are paid, including VAT.

Expenses are low and we do precisely zero advertising.

From a management point of view we have to have really good building managers to keep on top of some tenant's anti social tendencies.

Each building has a maintenance guy, so as soon as the (basic) rooms become empty they quickly redecorate and fix everything for the next tenant. Everything is standardised. The same paint, the same fixtures, the same furniture.

The business strategy is clearly working - the apartments run 100% full most months (with a waiting list).

[trogers]

I work for a Thai company that owns apartment blocks where we rent out individual rooms. These are cheap rooms rented almost exclusively by Thai low income earners (although the rooms are available to anyone of any nationality).

From a commercial point of view it's a nice steady business that brings 5-6% net ROI, and that is doing it the legit way where all income is declared and all taxes are paid, including VAT.

Expenses are low and we do precisely zero advertising.

From a management point of view we have to have really good building managers to keep on top of some tenant's anti social tendencies.

Each building has a maintenance guy, so as soon as the (basic) rooms become empty they quickly redecorate and fix everything for the next tenant. Everything is standardised. The same paint, the same fixtures, the same furniture.

The business strategy is clearly working - the apartments run 100% full most months (with a waiting list).

Five to six percent per annum ROI is a poor return unless there is capital appreciation on the land.

[blackcab]

I work for a Thai company that owns apartment blocks where we rent out individual rooms. These are cheap rooms rented almost exclusively by Thai low income earners (although the rooms are available to anyone of any nationality).

From a commercial point of view it's a nice steady business that brings 5-6% net ROI, and that is doing it the legit way where all income is declared and all taxes are paid, including VAT.

Expenses are low and we do precisely zero advertising.

From a management point of view we have to have really good building managers to keep on top of some tenant's anti social tendencies.

Each building has a maintenance guy, so as soon as the (basic) rooms become empty they quickly redecorate and fix everything for the next tenant. Everything is standardised. The same paint, the same fixtures, the same furniture.

The business strategy is clearly working - the apartments run 100% full most months (with a waiting list).

Five to six percent per annum ROI is a poor return unless there is capital appreciation on the land.

Agreed. Capital appreciation is the real money maker. A real (and fairly normal) situation is the company paid 51 million for a property and then made about 14 million worth of improvements. The property was sold for 95 million a year and a half later, after bringing in about 6 million profit.

[Hal65]

The wisdom in my old real estate circle was that if you were consistently running at 100% occupancy then you were pricing too low. an occupancy factor of about 94% (across many years) was standard. This was in the US though.

Edited July 6, 2016 by Hal65

[blackcab]

It's a very fine line though. One building the company I work for owns runs at 99-100% occupancy.

About 50 meters away there is a similar building owned by a competitor. Their rooms are newer, larger and furnished to a higher standard. They charge 500 baht more per month and they are at about 70% occupancy.

Personally if I managed that building I would be more competitive with pricing, but I think it's partly a loss of face thing to reduce rents.

[trogers]

It's a very fine line though. One building the company I work for owns runs at 99-100% occupancy.

About 50 meters away there is a similar building owned by a competitor. Their rooms are newer, larger and furnished to a higher standard. They charge 500 baht more per month and they are at about 70% occupancy.

Personally if I managed that building I would be more competitive with pricing, but I think it's partly a loss of face thing to reduce rents.

With such a high price elasticity, I would venture to guess that the tenant sector is primarily households that live from pay packet to pay packet...

[DLang]

On Thai property (condo) : the high RoI, and knowing that myself in my life, and my child in their life, will always have a nice condo to live in should we need/choose.

Western property: the income.

[blackcab]

It's a very fine line though. One building the company I work for owns runs at 99-100% occupancy.

About 50 meters away there is a similar building owned by a competitor. Their rooms are newer, larger and furnished to a higher standard. They charge 500 baht more per month and they are at about 70% occupancy.

Personally if I managed that building I would be more competitive with pricing, but I think it's partly a loss of face thing to reduce rents.

With such a high price elasticity, I would venture to guess that the tenant sector is primarily households that live from pay packet to pay packet...

Absolutely correct. 7-Eleven workers, factory workers, street food sellers, taxi drivers. Some office workers and nursing assistants too.

There is a Thai massage parlour very close to that building. My manager tells me the girls have units in the new condo down the road!

Edited July 7, 2016 by blackcab