Thai Transport Ministry suggests BMTA cancel orders of remaining NGV buses

[webfact]

Transport Ministry suggests BMTA cancel orders of remaining NGV buses

BANGKOK, 10 August 2015, (NNT) - The Ministry of Transport has strongly suggested that the Bangkok Mass Transit Authority (BMTA) consider cancelling its planned purchase of the 2nd batch of 2,694 buses running on natural gas (NGV).

The ministry's Permanent Secretary Soithip Traisut made the suggestion during a meeting with the BMTA, the Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning and the Department of Land Transport. The ministry made the recommendation after it had forwarded to the BMA last week the feasibility study of the viability of electric buses for public transportation. According to the study, natural gas is not suitable for public transportation purposes in the long run due to price and availability.

Yesterday's meeting concluded that BMTA should either purchase electric buses or maintain the existing 2,860 buses scheduled for decommission until further notice.

The meeting however agreed with the BMTA's plan to sell a batch of its 628 older buses, asking the agency to provide the ministry with the details of the plan to sell those buses as soon as possible.


-- NNT 2015-08-10

[Stradavarius37]

Load, shoot.....Aim......

[greenchair]

Oh god, those broken down old things.

Who would buy them? ??

[billd766]

One that doesn't run but is in fair condition would be great as a playhouse for the kids, one of the bendy ones perhaps.

[Bluespunk]

I assume following concerns have been looked at and forward planning has implemented strategies to solve them.

"The Major Problem of the Electric Bus - Range Anxiety

"Range anxiety", a term coined to describe the fear of being stranded as a major reason why all-electric cars have not sold better to this point, can also be applied to electric buses. Due to the much larger mass of a bus than a car, electric buses have an effective range much lower than an electric car has - as little as thirty miles.

Since most buses are out on the road for twelve hours and 150 miles or more per day ( on their way to 12 years and 250,000 or more miles ), it is clear that without some ability to recharge en route electric buses will not be able to be deployed in the nation's bus systems.

Recharging Stations Required, Potentially Causing Delays

Because the electric bus battery range is so low, buses will need to be charged periodically at a convenient place along the route, preferably at the layover location to avoid inconveniencing the passengers."

[webfact]

BMTA told to scrap plan to buy NGV-powered buses

BANGKOK: -- The plan of the Bangkok Mass Transit Authority (BMTA) to purchase 2,694 NGV-powered buses is likely to be aborted after the Transport Ministry proposed electric bus is a better choice.

The proposal was made by the ministry’s permanent secretary Mrs Soithip Traisut at a meeting last week.

BMTA plans to purchase 2,694 buses running on natural gas (NGV) on its second batch order.

The NNT reported that Mrs Soithip Traisut suggested during a meeting with the BMTA, the Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning and the Department of Land Transport, citing its feasibility study of the viability of electric buses for public transportation.

According to her, natural gas is not suitable for public transportation purposes in the long run due to price and availability.

The study concluded that BMTA should either purchase electric buses or maintain the existing 2,860 buses scheduled for decommission.

The meeting also agreed with the BMTA’s plan to sell 628 older buses, but with recommendation that it provides details of the plan to sell those buses as soon as possible.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/bmta-told-to-scrap-plan-to-buy-ngv-powered-buses


-- Thai PBS 2015-08-10

[billd766]

I assume following concerns have been looked at and forward planning has implemented strategies to solve them.

"The Major Problem of the Electric Bus - Range Anxiety

"Range anxiety", a term coined to describe the fear of being stranded as a major reason why all-electric cars have not sold better to this point, can also be applied to electric buses. Due to the much larger mass of a bus than a car, electric buses have an effective range much lower than an electric car has - as little as thirty miles.

Since most buses are out on the road for twelve hours and 150 miles or more per day ( on their way to 12 years and 250,000 or more miles ), it is clear that without some ability to recharge en route electric buses will not be able to be deployed in the nation's bus systems.

Recharging Stations Required, Potentially Causing Delays

Because the electric bus battery range is so low, buses will need to be charged periodically at a convenient place along the route, preferably at the layover location to avoid inconveniencing the passengers."

Somewhere in my travels I have seen electric buses where the batteries were in a trailer towed behind the bus. Sadly I cannot remember where but Germany sort of rings a bell.

That would be a good way to extend the range as periodically the bus can get to a recharging point and simply swap the battery trailers over in perhaps 5 minutes and be on its way again.

The flat battery trailer can then be recharged ready for another bus. Depending on the size of the trailers and batteries you can get a longer range. You can also have a smaller battery pack under the bus for use when the trailer pack is removed for change or the battery pack is flat in an emergency.

[tingtongfarang]

Oh god, those broken down old things.

Who would buy them? ??

Some of those buses are not so old...they just have regular accidents and get to look old and broken down in a very short time, one i see most days on the same route goes along with the front wheels in the left lane and the off side rear in the right hand lane.

I guess new electric buses would be in the same condition in a matter of weeks.

[NoBrains]

natural gas is not suitable for public transportation purposes in the long run due to price and availability.

<deleted>, a gasoline engine rebuild for natural gas can run on petrol, LPG, Propan and Butan gas.

When no natural gas isn't available anymore then (some) powerstations in Thailand switche off, electric isn't then eather available.

[laocowboy2]

Cancel the order, bin the old rust buckets and then blame the minister when services get cancelled. At that point I would imagine that someone in a green uniform might at last do something.

[asdecas]

Most of the BMTA red and cream buses needed putting out to pasture twenty years ago. Who would buy them after the speed-fuelled maniacs have mangled their gearboxes and shunted them through traffic, eighteen hours a day for decades? Perhaps the Burmese?

As for electric buses, Shanghai is using super-conductor buses on some routes, whereby the buses layover and recharge at designated points along the route, taking a couple of minutes each time. But the problem in Bangkok would be to make space for these points in already far over-congested streets. Then there is the question of maintenance....

[wvavin]

Every country in this region is developing and moving forward except Thailand.

[SOTIRIOS]

...doesn't say much for their decision-making process to begin with....

[bontang]

I assume following concerns have been looked at and forward planning has implemented strategies to solve them.

"The Major Problem of the Electric Bus - Range Anxiety

"Range anxiety", a term coined to describe the fear of being stranded as a major reason why all-electric cars have not sold better to this point, can also be applied to electric buses. Due to the much larger mass of a bus than a car, electric buses have an effective range much lower than an electric car has - as little as thirty miles.

Since most buses are out on the road for twelve hours and 150 miles or more per day ( on their way to 12 years and 250,000 or more miles ), it is clear that without some ability to recharge en route electric buses will not be able to be deployed in the nation's bus systems.

Recharging Stations Required, Potentially Causing Delays

Because the electric bus battery range is so low, buses will need to be charged periodically at a convenient place along the route, preferably at the layover location to avoid inconveniencing the passengers."

Re Electric Bus range distance should not be an Issue as Most Battery Powered Vehicles have their own Charging system, We have charging systems on Power Supply Cat Gererators for years it the Generator is on Standby the Battery is fully charged I'm sure the Bus will have similar system,

[mrfill]

"maintain the existing 2,860 buses scheduled for decommission until further notice."

[darren84310]

I assume following concerns have been looked at and forward planning has implemented strategies to solve them.

"The Major Problem of the Electric Bus - Range Anxiety

"Range anxiety", a term coined to describe the fear of being stranded as a major reason why all-electric cars have not sold better to this point, can also be applied to electric buses. Due to the much larger mass of a bus than a car, electric buses have an effective range much lower than an electric car has - as little as thirty miles.

Since most buses are out on the road for twelve hours and 150 miles or more per day ( on their way to 12 years and 250,000 or more miles ), it is clear that without some ability to recharge en route electric buses will not be able to be deployed in the nation's bus systems.

Recharging Stations Required, Potentially Causing Delays

Because the electric bus battery range is so low, buses will need to be charged periodically at a convenient place along the route, preferably at the layover location to avoid inconveniencing the passengers."

[Srikcir]

Cancelling its planned purchase of the 2nd batch of 2,694 buses running on natural gas is the right call.

Current electric bus technology can charge a bus in 1.6 hours to provide almost 250 km range using 200kW connection or 5 hours using 60 kW connection. The Chinese BYD Co. is the world’s largest producer of electric buses and has sold more than 5,000 of them globally, including the USA and Canada. The company is part-owned by Warren Buffett’s Berkshire Hathaway Inc.

[mikiea]

Oh god, those broken down old things.

Who would buy them? ??

south and Latin america , a donkey with a cart is called a hatch-back ..............

[sawati]

The chinese offered a bigger kickback...nothing new.Next one!

[Ulic]

Time to cancel the second bus order. The kick backs have long since been spent and it

is now necessary to re-grease the wheels. BTW Just wondering if there are any penalties

to cancelling the second order?

[balo]

It would be a dream come true if all buses and cars in Bangkok would be replaced with electric ones.

Then you can start breathing in the fresh air that will give you a pleasant smell of sewer combined with chilli . Can't wait.

[jacko45k]

Oh god, those broken down old things.

Who would buy them? ??

Coming to a place near you soon!

[monkey4u]

Oh god, those broken down old things.

Who would buy them? ??

Someone looking for a hen house

Or accommodation for the inlaws

[jerojero]

Now they decide to reverse course on this? Someone just woke up to alternatives? Buffoons...'nuff said.

[sammygood]

somebody is going to be majorly pissed

they will have to pay a large fine, right ?

so let's not change anything and keep those black smoking oldies running for another 10 - 20 years ?

[Anon999]

By electric in all probability they mean diesel electric hybrids. London has just added another 51 to its fleet.

[DrTuner]

They might actually be right. Given that a bus stands still hours every day while stuck in the horrid traffic jams, an engine that does not consume energy while idling could work. Or they could construct a working subway system... nah, too easy and kickbacks aren't that good.

[DrTuner]

Somewhere in my travels I have seen electric buses where the batteries were in a trailer towed behind the bus. Sadly I cannot remember where but Germany sort of rings a bell.

That would be a good way to extend the range as periodically the bus can get to a recharging point and simply swap the battery trailers over in perhaps 5 minutes and be on its way again.

The flat battery trailer can then be recharged ready for another bus. Depending on the size of the trailers and batteries you can get a longer range. You can also have a smaller battery pack under the bus for use when the trailer pack is removed for change or the battery pack is flat in an emergency.

I can already see the the menu of the day having "roasted scooter drivers" on it. If there's a 10cm crack between the trailer and the bus, they'll cram in there and given the level of maintenance in Thailand, get fried when touching the wires hanging out. Thailaaaan is a special case.