Taxation question capital gains and education visa

[cerox]

Hello together,

I'm planning my move to Thailand and I have a question about taxation.

I trade financial markets (currencies). My broker / banks are not in Thailand, I don't trade stocks or any financial instruments in Thailand, nor in my home country. I will soon have no residence or other connections in my home country, so I'll not be required to pay taxes in my home country anymore.

So I have done some research about how to pay capital gain taxes in Thailand. This is what I found:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_gains_tax

There is no separate capital gains tax in Thailand. If capital gains arise outside of Thailand it is not taxable. All earned income in Thailand from capital gains is taxed the same as regular income. However, if individual earns capital gain from security in the Stock Exchange of Thailand, it is exempted from personal income tax.

There are many countries which have no capital gain tax. Dubai is another example and the UK/Ireland is another paradies for traders with 0% taxation if things are done the right way.

My questions are:

- is there really no tax for that in Thailand or is it considered as income and subject to income tax? Some countries do it this way

- maybe independent of question 1, I plan to use an education visa / language course

As far as I understand it I'm not permitted to work with that type of visa. Technically I do not work, neither in Thailand, nor in any other country. Some people call it "gambling" other call it trading, call it as you like What I mean is it is not a type of typical work, e.g. being an employee or blogging online and having a business in another country.

So the second question would be is there something wrong with my visa or what other choices (apart from tourist visa) would I have? I don't want to work for a Thai company, so I won't get the work visa / work permit. I'm still young and a retirement visa is out of range. That's the reason why I figured the education visa would be the best option for me.

As it seems to be at the moment, I'm not required to pay any taxes in Thailand, because capital gains are not taxable. I have no income in Thailand, I have no job, I'm not even allowed to work.

So what would you do if you were in my situation ? Or maybe here is somebody who knows about a similar case. Another example: If you have property in another country and you rent it out, it would be similar - capital gains, but you might pay taxes somewhere else depending on your home country and relations to that country.

I hope somebody can help me

Please note, that I'm not planning to evade taxes. I just don't see a way how to pay taxes for the reasons exlained above.

One more thing so we don't get wrong impressions: I'm not the typical farang going to Thailand without knowing anything. I know the country well, the culture and I speak intermediate Thai, can read and write Thai as well. Just wanna avoid people thinking there's another guy going to Thailand, who does mistakes.

Edited August 10, 2015 by cerox

[paz]

Hello together,

...

Please note, that I'm not planning to evade taxes. I just don't see a way how to pay taxes for the reasons exlained above.

Unfortunately nobody here can help you. You will have people telling you that you will need a work permit, business visa and form a (fake) Thai company jst to trade stocks online. Of course that is just their unfounded opinion, but they will try everything possible to scaremonger you because of their envy and boredom.

Another variation is people will come up and tell you that you will need to pay taxes if you stay in Thailand for more than 183 days a year, which technically is true, but is impossible to do unless you have all the stuff above, that clearly do not apply to an individual trader.

You cannot just voluntarily pay taxes in Thailand. And even if you do, you will not gain any status or right by doing that. That means nothing: no medical care, no residency, no right to apply for a 5yr driver license, nothing.

So the simple facts are: there is no clear legal framework for who does online trading and any other online work in Thailand. Just a lot of interested opinions.

My personal advice: first try to make money in the market, which is difficult enough. And then figure out the rest, keep an eye on the tax situation of your country of birth or current legal residence. And more than anything else, keep whatever you do for yourself only, including anonymous forums.

By the way, ED visa or extension of stay are not a good way as they as they were in the past. It has become expensive and hassling. If you don't have any other qualification the easiest and cheapest is repeated tourist visa, or if you are willing to pay USD 14,200, Thai elite visa for 5 years.

Edited August 10, 2015 by paz

[cerox]

Thank you for your reply.

I already noticed what you're saying. Although it's my first thread and post here, I've been reading a lot here, so I know what you mean. I tried to ask the same question in another forum, but I only go stupid answers and people telling me I would have to pay taxes in Thailand although they don't even know the laws...

So I thought let's go to a forum with people who know about Thailand

You're right there is no legal framework. That's what I actually already found out And that's the reason why I can't pay taxes in my opinion

I know about the new limitations of language / ed visas, but it seemed I have no choice.

Thanks for the advise about the elite visa. I'll do research on that. 14.200 USD is expensive fore 5 years, is that an investment visa in Thailand (so I get the money back after that time?) or is the money completely lost and paid for the visa?

You say keep it to yourself - that's what I found out about online work as well. What about bank accounts in Thailand? Better not use them? Credit cards and prepaid cards are expensive in the long run.

Edited August 10, 2015 by cerox

[paz]

I know about the new limitations of language / ed visas, but it seemed I have no choice.

Thanks for the advise about the elite visa. I'll do research on that. 14.200 USD is expensive fore 5 years, is that an investment visa in Thailand (so I get the money back after that time?) or is the money completely lost and paid for the visa?

You say keep it to yourself - that's what I found out about online work as well. What about bank accounts in Thailand? Better not use them? Credit cards and prepaid cards are expensive in the long run.

If you are from a Western country, you always have the choice of getting repeated double entry tourist visa in Laos, or even your country when you got home. That is easier and cheaper that ED visa, about Bt 15,000 a year (depending where you stay) compared to Bt 25,000- 300,00 a year for ED visa and extension, although these would included Thai classes it is still cheaper to use torusit visa and pay classes at your pace independently.

If you pay for Thai elite, the money paid is never seen again.

You can have a basic bank account In Thailand, most likely Kasikorn opened in a tourism location. You can do all what is practically needed with it, incuding having proof that your receive money from overseas, for more info check the banking forum.

Edited August 10, 2015 by paz

[cerox]

What I mean is if I transfer money from overseas to a Thai bank account, will I get trouble after a certain time? Or what I assume, they don't care anyway?

I don't mind paying for an education visa, but there a two reasons I don't like it. Many teachers don't meet my expectations and I'm better off learning Thai myself like I've been doing for the last 1.5 years. And the second reason is inflexibility. I love a lifestyle where I can decide when I learn and which is not determined in advance so "I have to go to school now".

I read the Thai instituations are cracking down on foreigners who permantently use tourist visas, is that not the case? Otherwise a solution could be to spend several month in another country.

[paz]

What I mean is if I transfer money from overseas to a Thai bank account, will I get trouble after a certain time? Or what I assume, they don't care anyway?

There is no issue. If you receive event USD 5,000 or even 50,000 a month nobody really cares. Thailand is happy that money comes in and and you spend it.

I read the Thai instituations are cracking down on foreigners who permantently use tourist visas, is that not the case? Otherwise a solution could be to spend several month in another country.

There is no crackdown whatsoever. People continue to use tourist visa as ever before.

[gk10002000]

Just because you don't have a residence, that does not mean you are not liable for taxes. If you are an American citizen of the good old US of A, the IRS wants you no matter where you live or don't live. And that is just the federal level. Depending on what State you are from or last filed taxes in, they may want to talk to you also, especially if you are maintaining any ID from that state.

[ubonjoe]

Info on Thai personal income tax is here: http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

[Soutpeel]

Thank you for your reply.

I already noticed what you're saying. Although it's my first thread and post here, I've been reading a lot here, so I know what you mean. I tried to ask the same question in another forum, but I only go stupid answers and people telling me I would have to pay taxes in Thailand although they don't even know the laws...

So I thought let's go to a forum with people who know about Thailand

You're right there is no legal framework. That's what I actually already found out And that's the reason why I can't pay taxes in my opinion

I know about the new limitations of language / ed visas, but it seemed I have no choice.

Thanks for the advise about the elite visa. I'll do research on that. 14.200 USD is expensive fore 5 years, is that an investment visa in Thailand (so I get the money back after that time?) or is the money completely lost and paid for the visa?

You say keep it to yourself - that's what I found out about online work as well. What about bank accounts in Thailand? Better not use them? Credit cards and prepaid cards are expensive in the long run.

In legal terms regarding Thailand the basic premise of the law is thus....if you are in the country for more than 180 days pa you are resident for tax purposes so your reasearch is flawed as regards stating there is no legal frame work yes there is, how its implemented in practice is a different question

Further the TE visa is not expensive, less than Thai minimum wage per day buts lets no open that debate again

Invesyment visa equals Thb 10 million which you do get back and this is indicated by the name of the visa " investment"

Why not use Thai banks ? And cc are not expensive if they are used properly

[Soutpeel]

Hello together,

...

Please note, that I'm not planning to evade taxes. I just don't see a way how to pay taxes for the reasons exlained above.

Unfortunately nobody here can help you. You will have people telling you that you will need a work permit, business visa and form a (fake) Thai company jst to trade stocks online. Of course that is just their unfounded opinion, but they will try everything possible to scaremonger you because of their envy and boredom.

Another variation is people will come up and tell you that you will need to pay taxes if you stay in Thailand for more than 183 days a year, which technically is true, but is impossible to do unless you have all the stuff above, that clearly do not apply to an individual trader.

You cannot just voluntarily pay taxes in Thailand. And even if you do, you will not gain any status or right by doing that. That means nothing: no medical care, no residency, no right to apply for a 5yr driver license, nothing.

So the simple facts are: there is no clear legal framework for who does online trading and any other online work in Thailand. Just a lot of interested opinions.

My personal advice: first try to make money in the market, which is difficult enough. And then figure out the rest, keep an eye on the tax situation of your country of birth or current legal residence. And more than anything else, keep whatever you do for yourself only, including anonymous forums.

By the way, ED visa or extension of stay are not a good way as they as they were in the past. It has become expensive and hassling. If you don't have any other qualification the easiest and cheapest is repeated tourist visa, or if you are willing to pay USD 14,200, Thai elite visa for 5 years.

Anothet factually incorrect and bitter post

[Pattaya46]

Info on Thai personal income tax is here: http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

Thanks for that UbonJoe

I would appreciate if anyone could explain the §2.3 though ??

2.3 Tax Credit for dividends:

Any taxpayer who domiciles in Thailand and receives dividends from a juristic company or partnership incorporated in Thailand is entitled to a tax credit of 3/7 of the amount of dividends received. In computing assessable income, taxpayer shall gross up his dividends by the amount of the tax credit received. The amount of tax credit is creditable against his tax liability

3/7 ??

About taxes on trading incomes, I am studying documentation to start trading the Thai SET, and what I have been told by Bualuang office is that they apply by default a 10% tax rate, and if you exceed 500'000 THB you must go to the "governmental taxes office" that will calculate the exact taxes amount. Kind of coherent with the table in §3.1.

Edited August 11, 2015 by Pattaya46

[ubonjoe]

The 3/7 is three sevenths of 1 or 42.85714285714286 %..

You should post your questions about taxes on the Jobs, economy, banking, business, investments forum.

[mngmn]

My humble opinion which I am sure will get shot down by wiser men...

One of the mistakes people from western cultures make when they want to understand Thailand is to read the laws, rules etc. A good example is provided by the existence of this forum. Thai immigration law is clearly defined in legislation and regulations but it is rarely applied as defined. So the posters on this forum do exactly what Thais do. They ask a network of contacts and friends what the current rules are and most important what you can get away with. Maybe one of the reasons Thais cultivate such huge networks of contacts.

My suggestion would be to ask if there is anyone on this forum who does NOT have a work permit and yet DOES pay tax in Thailand on their overseas earnings, pension etc. I suspect not. No matter what the rules say. Even in advanced economies it has been historically difficult to tax people who operate completely outside of the taxation system. This of course is changing with better information sharing betweem government departments and banks. But this is something that I don't see happening in Thailand.

[cerox]

Thanks for all your replies.

mngmn:

That's one of the best answers and I totally agree with you. If I got a proper visa for Thailand (meaning re-entry the country as often as I want, have rights to stay etc etc.) I'd be happy to pay taxes. But there is no visa for my purpose. Founding a company might be possible, but I won't do that because it's totally oversized in terms of management effort for an individual to just puts on some trades.

paz:

Thanks for the info about the bank account in Thailand. That's what I read as well, and I would not expect a country like Thailand to do research on my money transfers, if I'm there for a tourist visa. Maybe they would do it after years, but for now, I have never permantently lived in Thailand, and who knows how long I'll be there. I'm trying to solve one problem at a time - so I expect it will be fine for at least the first year when I transfer money.

Pattaya46

Thanks for your reply, if you buy/sell securities at the Thai stock exchange, of course you have to pay taxes as in many other countries where you do that. But that does not apply for me. I don't own any shares, ownerships of companies etc. I just buy and sell currencies. I give you an example. If you changed 10.000 THB into USD and you wait a few months, after that you change it back to THB, you'd have a profit if the USD appreciates in value. Maybe not in this case, cause 10k THB is a low amount and you'd need to pay currency exchange fees two times But I just wanted to give a simple example to everyone can understand the difference to stocks of a company, bonds etc.

Soutpeel,

I understand you, but you also said it's difficult to implement in practice. So what would you do? Please share your opinion.

10 million baht for investments visa is pretty much; I don't have so much money and if I had I would not put it in government bonds, no matter of the country. So that's not an option

Thanks for all your help.

[Soutpeel]

My humble opinion which I am sure will get shot down by wiser men...

One of the mistakes people from western cultures make when they want to understand Thailand is to read the laws, rules etc. A good example is provided by the existence of this forum. Thai immigration law is clearly defined in legislation and regulations but it is rarely applied as defined. So the posters on this forum do exactly what Thais do. They ask a network of contacts and friends what the current rules are and most important what you can get away with. Maybe one of the reasons Thais cultivate such huge networks of contacts.

My suggestion would be to ask if there is anyone on this forum who does NOT have a work permit and yet DOES pay tax in Thailand on their overseas earnings, pension etc. I suspect not. No matter what the rules say. Even in advanced economies it has been historically difficult to tax people who operate completely outside of the taxation system. This of course is changing with better information sharing betweem government departments and banks. But this is something that I don't see happening in Thailand.

The rules are in place but the enforecement is not in Thailand but there could come a day in Thailand where in to get a long term visa or extension for Thailand and the person resides in Thailand for more than 180 days pa one must prove to them your tax affairs are in order ie

1. Your paying tax / submitting a tax return in your own country and are except from Thai tax under a double taxation agreement

2. you need to register and pay tax in Thailand if you cant prove the above

If the reports are true even HM revenue service in the UK are starting to look at the likes of paypal etc to start chasing UK citizens operating on line business' and dodging income tax and apparantly they are trying to force the likes of paypal etc to hand over details of British citizens using these services

[Time Traveller]

Info on Thai personal income tax is here: http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

Thanks for that UbonJoe

I would appreciate if anyone could explain the §2.3 though ??

2.3 Tax Credit for dividends:

Any taxpayer who domiciles in Thailand and receives dividends from a juristic company or partnership incorporated in Thailand is entitled to a tax credit of 3/7 of the amount of dividends received. In computing assessable income, taxpayer shall gross up his dividends by the amount of the tax credit received. The amount of tax credit is creditable against his tax liability

3/7 ??

About taxes on trading incomes, I am studying documentation to start trading the Thai SET, and what I have been told by Bualuang office is that they apply by default a 10% tax rate, and if you exceed 500'000 THB you must go to the "governmental taxes office" that will calculate the exact taxes amount. Kind of coherent with the table in §3.1.

I don't know what bualuang told you, but if you own dividend paying Thai shares, then you usually end up with tax credits from the corporate taxes companies have already paid. You can claim these back on you individual tax return.

If you don't claim them back then you get taxed at another 10% on top. The withholding tax.

If you own NVDRs, then you don't get any tax credits and then you get taxed the extra 10%.

The 3/7th refers to the corporate tax rate a few years ago of 30%. So for example, if Bangkok Bank paid out 7 baht in dividends for one year. You would get 6.3 baht after the 10% withholding tax on dividends.

However, if it's paying tax at 30%, then the 7 baht dividend would come with a 3 Baht tax credit. (Another way to think of it is 10 baht profit, pays 30% - or 3 baht - in corporate tax, wihich is in turn credited to the shareholder in form of tax credits)

So the individual tax payer would have 3.7 baht in tax credits (corporate tax + 10%withholding).

If they were in the 0% tax bracket, then they would get the full 3.7 baht in their tax refund.

Higher tax brackets will get slightly less in return.

Edited August 11, 2015 by Time Traveller

[glamont002]

Income earned offshore --for both a Thai citizen and a foreigner resident in Thailand-- is only taxable in Thailand if the income is brought into Thailand in the year earned. Quite a loop hole. So if you have a pension paid into an offshore account, capital gains, interest, dividends earned in an offshore account they are not taxable here if not remitted into Thailand in the year earned. It is a totally stupid rule (TIT) because money is fungible so how do you prove (more importantly how would the Revenue Department prove) what income is brought in and from what year. Uninforcable and they do not even try. Wealthy Thais exploit this rule and use investment accounts in tax havens like Hong Kong to avoid paying tax anywhere. BTW-- I am a tax partner here with an international accounting firm and not one of the arm chair idiots who comment on thigs they know nothing about......

[cerox]

glamont002

Thanks for your help. I don't bring money into the country which is earned in the same year. It's easy not to do that - proving is difficult and sometimes not even possible like you say. So we end up not paying taxes in Thailand.

My question to you is, let's assume I brought my money in straight away and I wanted to pay taxes. How can I do it with a tourist visa - does not make sense to me. If you know something about that, I'd be glad if you have some time to explain that.

[blackcab]

Hello together,

...

Please note, that I'm not planning to evade taxes. I just don't see a way how to pay taxes for the reasons exlained above.

Unfortunately nobody here can help you. You will have people telling you that you will need a work permit, business visa and form a (fake) Thai company jst to trade stocks online. Of course that is just their unfounded opinion, but they will try everything possible to scaremonger you because of their envy and boredom.

Another variation is people will come up and tell you that you will need to pay taxes if you stay in Thailand for more than 183 days a year, which technically is true, but is impossible to do unless you have all the stuff above, that clearly do not apply to an individual trader.

You cannot just voluntarily pay taxes in Thailand. And even if you do, you will not gain any status or right by doing that. That means nothing: no medical care, no residency, no right to apply for a 5yr driver license, nothing.

So the simple facts are: there is no clear legal framework for who does online trading and any other online work in Thailand. Just a lot of interested opinions.

My personal advice: first try to make money in the market, which is difficult enough. And then figure out the rest, keep an eye on the tax situation of your country of birth or current legal residence. And more than anything else, keep whatever you do for yourself only, including anonymous forums.

By the way, ED visa or extension of stay are not a good way as they as they were in the past. It has become expensive and hassling. If you don't have any other qualification the easiest and cheapest is repeated tourist visa, or if you are willing to pay USD 14,200, Thai elite visa for 5 years.

Anothet factually incorrect and bitter post

I don't know if you can pay your taxes voluntarily - but to get my tax ID number I had to give the tax office a copy of my work permit. Can you get a tax number without a work permit?

On one hand I can't see a government saying no to money, but on the other hand government offices here do love copies of everything.

[Soutpeel]

Income earned offshore --for both a Thai citizen and a foreigner resident in Thailand-- is only taxable in Thailand if the income is brought into Thailand in the year earned. Quite a loop hole. So if you have a pension paid into an offshore account, capital gains, interest, dividends earned in an offshore account they are not taxable here if not remitted into Thailand in the year earned. It is a totally stupid rule (TIT) because money is fungible so how do you prove (more importantly how would the Revenue Department prove) what income is brought in and from what year. Uninforcable and they do not even try. Wealthy Thais exploit this rule and use investment accounts in tax havens like Hong Kong to avoid paying tax anywhere. BTW-- I am a tax partner here with an international accounting firm and not one of the arm chair idiots who comment on thigs they know nothing about......

Well your not stating anything new but yet you call everyone else idiots and then claim to be a tax partner without knowing anyone elses background, further i know a few real deal CA 's and financial guys and they would never write in the manner you have written, but you do write in the manner of those shady shady people working for those " financial" companies selling dodgy investments

[Soutpeel]

Hello together,

...

Please note, that I'm not planning to evade taxes. I just don't see a way how to pay taxes for the reasons exlained above.

Unfortunately nobody here can help you. You will have people telling you that you will need a work permit, business visa and form a (fake) Thai company jst to trade stocks online. Of course that is just their unfounded opinion, but they will try everything possible to scaremonger you because of their envy and boredom.

Another variation is people will come up and tell you that you will need to pay taxes if you stay in Thailand for more than 183 days a year, which technically is true, but is impossible to do unless you have all the stuff above, that clearly do not apply to an individual trader.

You cannot just voluntarily pay taxes in Thailand. And even if you do, you will not gain any status or right by doing that. That means nothing: no medical care, no residency, no right to apply for a 5yr driver license, nothing.

So the simple facts are: there is no clear legal framework for who does online trading and any other online work in Thailand. Just a lot of interested opinions.

My personal advice: first try to make money in the market, which is difficult enough. And then figure out the rest, keep an eye on the tax situation of your country of birth or current legal residence. And more than anything else, keep whatever you do for yourself only, including anonymous forums.

By the way, ED visa or extension of stay are not a good way as they as they were in the past. It has become expensive and hassling. If you don't have any other qualification the easiest and cheapest is repeated tourist visa, or if you are willing to pay USD 14,200, Thai elite visa for 5 years.

Anothet factually incorrect and bitter post

I don't know if you can pay your taxes voluntarily - but to get my tax ID number I had to give the tax office a copy of my work permit. Can you get a tax number without a work permit?

On one hand I can't see a government saying no to money, but on the other hand government offices here do love copies of everything.

Yes you can get a tax number wirhout a WP people who live here and have Thai investments and even pay tax on interest on their bank accounts can get one

[Soutpeel]

glamont002

Thanks for your help. I don't bring money into the country which is earned in the same year. It's easy not to do that - proving is difficult and sometimes not even possible like you say. So we end up not paying taxes in Thailand.

My question to you is, let's assume I brought my money in straight away and I wanted to pay taxes. How can I do it with a tourist visa - does not make sense to me. If you know something about that, I'd be glad if you have some time to explain that.

Why would you want to pay taxes in Thailand from offshore investments unless you think you can avoid taxation in your own country or think you will be paying a lower rate; tax rates in Thailand above 125k pa USD attract a 35% tax rate Edited August 11, 2015 by Soutpeel

[khunPer]

OP, if you cannot maintain an ED-visa, and is not old enough for retirement (50 years), an option may be Thai Elite Card, which gives you 5 year for 500,000 baht – i.e. 100,000 baht a year, to be compared with expenses for visa-runs or expenses on whatever other way your stay in Thailand is arranged – however there is at the moment plans about multi entry tourist visa for 6 month or 1 year.

If you stay more than 180 days in Thailand, I think you in principle are taxable in Thailand (please someone correct me, if I’m wrong); however with no work-income from Thailand – no Work Permit – only foreign income and Thai interest can be in question. To my knowledge foreign income is taxable in Thailand only, if you bring the money into Thailand, and only if it’s the same year as you earned the money; if you wait till the following year, the money are savings that can be transferred into Thailand without taxation.

So live of you “savings”, while having your residence in Thailand.

Private trading on stock market is not considered as work.

Inside Thailand there are some withholding taxes of interest from bank accounts, 1 percent on normal accounts (presently omitted) and 15 percent on high interest rates, like 6 or 12-month fixed accounts. You can claim the withheld interest tax back, if you have no other income and the amount is under the minimum limit for paying tax at all; think gross income before paying income tax is around 180,000 baht, but I have no experience, since I never bothered to claim withheld interest tax back myself. Some have posted about it in other threads.

[cerox]

KhunPer

Thanks very much, that's very useful. It's good to know private trading is not considered as work, because I would not consider it as work either. Living of savings is possible and thereby one does not have to pay taxes as I thought. Getting a tax number is fine, but with a tourist visa that sounds a bit funny.

I don't bother about claming back interest. I'll only make monthly payments on a Thai bank account, in order to spend the money. So the accumulating interest will be very small and does not justify the effort of claiming it back.

The strange thing is that I also have no tax obligation in my own country. I already spoke to the tax authorities in my country, and they told me I have no tax obligation after having no residence here and there is no income arising in my country. So effectively there would be no taxes at all, but it sounds too good to be true

[BritTim]

Thank you for your reply.

I already noticed what you're saying. Although it's my first thread and post here, I've been reading a lot here, so I know what you mean. I tried to ask the same question in another forum, but I only go stupid answers and people telling me I would have to pay taxes in Thailand although they don't even know the laws...

So I thought let's go to a forum with people who know about Thailand

You're right there is no legal framework. That's what I actually already found out And that's the reason why I can't pay taxes in my opinion

I know about the new limitations of language / ed visas, but it seemed I have no choice.

Thanks for the advise about the elite visa. I'll do research on that. 14.200 USD is expensive fore 5 years, is that an investment visa in Thailand (so I get the money back after that time?) or is the money completely lost and paid for the visa?

You say keep it to yourself - that's what I found out about online work as well. What about bank accounts in Thailand? Better not use them? Credit cards and prepaid cards are expensive in the long run.

What about bank accounts in Thailand?

Savings accounts and ATM cards should be fine, assuming you just want to transfer money in and use them for living expenses.

[cerox]

Yes only for living expenses, thanks for your reply.

[khunPer]

KhunPer

Thanks very much, that's very useful. It's good to know private trading is not considered as work, because I would not consider it as work either. Living of savings is possible and thereby one does not have to pay taxes as I thought. Getting a tax number is fine, but with a tourist visa that sounds a bit funny.

I don't bother about claming back interest. I'll only make monthly payments on a Thai bank account, in order to spend the money. So the accumulating interest will be very small and does not justify the effort of claiming it back.

The strange thing is that I also have no tax obligation in my own country. I already spoke to the tax authorities in my country, and they told me I have no tax obligation after having no residence here and there is no income arising in my country. So effectively there would be no taxes at all, but it sounds too good to be true

You don't need to a tax-number in Thailand, when you don't pay tax, I always hear that only about 5 percent of Thais pays personal income tax.

Good and true, some (of us) are very lucky...

[cerox]

Thanks for your help khunPer.

[paz]

paz:

Thanks for the info about the bank account in Thailand. That's what I read as well, and I would not expect a country like Thailand to do research on my money transfers, if I'm there for a tourist visa. Maybe they would do it after years, but for now, I have never permantently lived in Thailand, and who knows how long I'll be there. I'm trying to solve one problem at a time - so I expect it will be fine for at least the first year when I transfer money.

To be more exact: when you transfer money to Thailand it doesn't matter if you have a tourist visa, no visa, or permanent residency. There is no limit and no obligations to declare any money that you move to Thailand, not even if you do that monthly for 40 years. Thai banks and Gov.t don't care.

[Jai Dee]

One flame post has been removed from this thread.