Freedom of speech still exists, Wissanu insists

[Blackfalds]

For once I agree with what General Prayut said: Don't trust any politician.

(I might add: How do you know a politician lies? His lips are moving.)

A purist take on the anti-politician ideology.

Either knowingly, or unknowingly, contributing to those who wish to demonize Democracy, without appearing to do so....By attacking the results of Democratic practices - the Politicians.

Don't get me wrong...I am not defending a purist take on Thai Democracy either....It is obvious many warts are attached.

But comparing Thai Democracy to a perfectionist form of Democracy does not fly. Some form of Democracy is better than the alternative we are witnessing now. At least there is a chance it will mature.

By chiming into that anti-politician mantra is simply aiding and abetting those who prefer an appointive system unhinged from an electorate they despise.

Or create many so-called Independent groups of their own ilk that supersede the electorate, they achieve the same result.

Edited August 29, 2015 by Blackfalds

[GeorgesAbitbol]

Les Majeste aside:

It's quite simple : you can say what you want as long as you are not writing stuff to promote division.

What this means, red-shirts, is stop egging each other on to go and commit more terrorism. We have seen enough of your 'democracy' now with your intimidation mobs outside courtrooms, death threats to judges or attacks on non-red shirt politicians if they dare venture into a red-shirt province. Thailand does not need more cowards firing grenades into women and children for a couple of thousand baht.

I have seen several of the low-end posters here sputtering about a peoples uprising and some sort of 'communist revolution' (which they seem to confuse with 'democracy') which is coming very soon. I reckon that's the sort of thing they are talking about.

It's quite simple - but obviously not simple enough. What you fail to realise is how you are free to post all this whining on a public forum. If it was anything like you pretend, why aren't you in jail with all the others you try to imply have been arrested ?.

While of course Suthep and Goons ® are the good samaritans.....who didn t hijacked an international airport and recently was not in the street begging for money (where this money go...probably Suthep pockets) and who is seen as too corrupted even by his Goons...So stop putting everuthing in red light each time this becomes the only argument they pro Junta have nowdays...

We can see how the army is handling the bombing, the south problem, the economy falling....

This forum is in english with 90% of non thai readers....but just try to call the dear Generalissimo a dictat. or speak about the guy at the top and see if you are free to speak..

The politic by itself and democracy is about division and the ability to express your opinion and that's how politics work.

You can go in North Korea if you want to avoid division speech

[Muhendis]

Lese majeste?

Defamation?

[Blackfalds]

For once I agree with what General Prayut said: Don't trust any politician.

(I might add: How do you know a politician lies? His lips are moving.)

A purist take on the anti-politician ideology.

Either knowingly, or unknowingly, contributing to those who wish to demonize Democracy, without appearing to do so....By attacking the results of Democratic practices - the Politicians.

Don't get me wrong...I am not defending a purist take on Thai Democracy either....It is obvious many warts are attached.

But comparing Thai Democracy to a perfectionist form of Democracy does not fly. Some form of Democracy is better than the alternative we are witnessing now. At least there is a chance it will mature.

By chiming into that anti-politician mantra is simply aiding and abetting those who prefer an appointive system unhinged from an electorate they despise.

Or create many so-called Independent groups of their own ilk that supersede the electorate, they achieve the same result.

On second thought....The appointive system I discuss above, and the many so-called Independent Agencies unhinged from the electorate yet superseding them, is basically the same things isn't it. They are both based on an appointive system, and not an electoral one. .....Voila.......Governance via appointment and not elections.

Certainly takes care of those annoying elections which include a large segment of society who are not qualified to vote anyway. Comparing their lowly position to the lofty Bangkok-centric elite just shows how ridiculous it is to have their vote count the same.....Best circumvent them and appoint from among the enlightened classes.

[sawadee1947]

I agree.....there is indeed freedom of speech! In your own room and only if nobody can listen. So please shut windows and doors first....

[thaiguzzi]

Les Majeste aside:

It's quite simple : you can say what you want as long as you are not writing stuff to promote division.

What this means, red-shirts, is stop egging each other on to go and commit more terrorism. We have seen enough of your 'democracy' now with your intimidation mobs outside courtrooms, death threats to judges or attacks on non-red shirt politicians if they dare venture into a red-shirt province. Thailand does not need more cowards firing grenades into women and children for a couple of thousand baht.

I have seen several of the low-end posters here sputtering about a peoples uprising and some sort of 'communist revolution' (which they seem to confuse with 'democracy') which is coming very soon. I reckon that's the sort of thing they are talking about.

It's quite simple - but obviously not simple enough. What you fail to realise is how you are free to post all this whining on a public forum. If it was anything like you pretend, why aren't you in jail with all the others you try to imply have been arrested ?.

Good grief! The view from the Yellow Planet...

[bamnutsak]

Good grief! The view from the Yellow Planet...

It's Yellow Fever, once caught - assuming survival - you are immune, from all logic.

It is amazing that the Junta fan-tards here still occasionally chime in with some idiotic nonsense, like "well, it could be worse"?

[cmsally]

Les Majeste aside:

It's quite simple : you can say what you want as long as you are not writing stuff to promote division.

What this means, red-shirts, is stop egging each other on to go and commit more terrorism. We have seen enough of your 'democracy' now with your intimidation mobs outside courtrooms, death threats to judges or attacks on non-red shirt politicians if they dare venture into a red-shirt province. Thailand does not need more cowards firing grenades into women and children for a couple of thousand baht.

I have seen several of the low-end posters here sputtering about a peoples uprising and some sort of 'communist revolution' (which they seem to confuse with 'democracy') which is coming very soon. I reckon that's the sort of thing they are talking about.

It's quite simple - but obviously not simple enough. What you fail to realise is how you are free to post all this whining on a public forum. If it was anything like you pretend, why aren't you in jail with all the others you try to imply have been arrested ?.

Good grief! The view from the Yellow Planet...

aka the "Wotsits" If you don't know what I'm on about do a search for image of a Wotsit.

[bamnutsak]

Freedom of speech doesn't exit in Thailand, but it doesn't exist in Germany, USA, Australia as well.

All the political correct freedom of speech friends want the freedom only for their opinions.....

Speak in Germany or Austria about the good things from Hitler (no matter if there are good one or not, freedom means that you can also express opinions which are wrong)

And you'll be faster in jail than you blink.

Speak in USA that you don't like gays or black people and you'll be in troubles.

Here you go full of nonsense again. You can say what you like about Obama and you know it and that's the reference point not Hitler who killed millions of Jews. Minorities like gays and blacks have the RIGHT not to be bullied or harrassed and laws are there to protect them.

This is NOTHING to do with the Les Majeste law nor the no opposition laws to your hero Junta. Your views are utterly distasteful and frankly nasty.

So you just confirm what I told....freedom of speech as long as it is your opinion...and you set the reference point....

No the reference point is set by the person who speak....and again it doesn't matter if it is right or wrong.

Examples which are NOT my opinion, just examples:

Say in USA: You don't want want Obama as President because he is a N....

You can't do that....where is the freedom of expression?

Say in Germany Hitler didn't kill 6 Million Jews he killed only 3 Million --> And in jail you go....

Freedom of speech include nasty, distasteful and rascist things. Freedom of speech but we are all political correct and don't hurt any minorities, don't bully people with other opinions is NOT freedom of speech.

Freedom of speech can't exist, because we don't want a society where someone can openly call to murder someone.

So the discussion is not freedom of speech it is which country is more restrictive and which less. Thailand is more restrictive.

You live in a very strange world. Do you ever go outside?

Nothing in this statement is correct.

That said, you do realize we are talking primarily about freedom of speech, in a political context, and not hate=speech?

[MrJohnson]

Les Majeste aside:

It's quite simple : you can say what you want as long as you are not writing stuff to promote division.

What this means, red-shirts, is stop egging each other on to go and commit more terrorism. We have seen enough of your 'democracy' now with your intimidation mobs outside courtrooms, death threats to judges or attacks on non-red shirt politicians if they dare venture into a red-shirt province. Thailand does not need more cowards firing grenades into women and children for a couple of thousand baht.

I have seen several of the low-end posters here sputtering about a peoples uprising and some sort of 'communist revolution' (which they seem to confuse with 'democracy') which is coming very soon. I reckon that's the sort of thing they are talking about.

It's quite simple - but obviously not simple enough. What you fail to realise is how you are free to post all this whining on a public forum. If it was anything like you pretend, why aren't you in jail with all the others you try to imply have been arrested ?.

I'm surprised it took 24 posts before this old chestnut came out. Dig a little deeper and dee the carefully planned and executed program to systematically shut down dissenting voices. Community radio and television stations across the country are gone. A few foreigners ranting away on a site like this don't worry the boys in green and is certainly not a yardstick for freedome of speech. I'll stop thereor this post will never seethe light of day.

[Kannikapor88]

They have no idea what "Freedom of Speech" mean ... Its like watching a baboon act like a dentist ...

[Srikcir]

Freedom of speech doesn't exit in Thailand, but it doesn't exist in Germany, USA, Australia as well.

All the political correct freedom of speech friends want the freedom only for their opinions.....

Speak in Germany or Austria about the good things from Hitler (no matter if there are good one or not, freedom means that you can also express opinions which are wrong)

And you'll be faster in jail than you blink.

Speak in USA that you don't like gays or black people and you'll be in troubles.

"Freedom of speech doesn't exit in Thailand"

You make a very provocative, anti-government statement that borders on violation of Article 44.

Can you expand on your belief why that such a civil liberty currently does not exist in Thailand despite the assurances of the NCPO's Interim Charter in Section 4 that "recognizes human dignity, rights, liberties and equality of all Thais?"

You seem to suggest that the Prayut government disregards the NCPO's Interim Charter in Section 3 that provides that "Sovereign power belongs to all Thais." If you are correct that that the NCPO and the Prayut government by extension holds itself above the law of the Thai people, then you must also believe that the Prayut regime is then a lawless body.

And I couldn't agree more.

[cmsally]

To allow free speech is to allow the invocation of symbols by language. Symbols have far more power in Thai political culture than do the elaborate structure and reasoning of speech. Thai culture does not have a culture of discussion, debate and oratory, even in the educated section of the populace.

You have to understand the nature and history of Thai language to have even a small understanding of the problem. The old uses and views of language are not going to fit into the 21st century. What is happening now is that a round peg is being bashed into a square hole. Lots of buzz words and headlines which fit into the old use of symbolism, but not really working in this day and age.

[Baerboxer]

It's freedom of speech ala French: "you can say what you want as long as you don't talk about the forbidden stuff". I'm exaggerating, Thai has more freedom of speech than France.

Sorry but what you say is utterly crap

Interesting, and a little off topic. But what is the situation in France? If you make anti-semitic comments you can be in big trouble with the law. Does this apply to any religion the same - anti-Catholic, anti-Protestant, anti-Islamic, anti-Hindu? As long as a law is applied evenly fair enough; but not if want group gets special treatment based on religion, ethnicity or sexual preference.

In the UK laws had to be introduced to restrict hate speech. That's fine providing the laws are not then manipulated to restrict genuine comments or questions of the government of the day.

Some Thai politicians and political "leaders", have shown in the past that they have intolerance to protesters, demonstrators, journalists, media that dare criticize or comment about something they don't like. Yet, without the freedom to do that, an important part of the checks and balances is lost.

I doubt if their is any definition of hate speech in Thai law. Anyone who comments, writes an article or even draws an article can be in big trouble if someone with the right wealth to pursue a law case doesn't like it; and now if the incumbent government don't to.

[MZurf]

For once I agree with what General Prayut said: Don't trust any politician.

(I might add: How do you know a politician lies? His lips are moving.)

Two points;

1) A certain PM said he would not instigate a coup and he would not seek to be PM. Lo and behold; both things happened!

2) If Prayuth is retired from the army and currently the PM exactly what is he if not a politician???

[retarius]

No freedom of speech, a ruined economy, corruption still rife....what exactly has this excuse of a government produced except laws limiting freedom of expression, tokenism against corruption and tokenism against slavery which was exposed by a journalist facing criminal charges.

[Benmart]

Doublespeak is language that deliberately disguises, distorts, or reverses the meaning of words. Doublespeak may take the form of euphemisms (e.g., "downsizing" for layoff^]), in which case it is primarily meant to make the truth sound more palatable. It may also refer to intentional ambiguity in language or to actual inversions of meaning (for example, naming a state of war "peace"). In such cases, doublespeak disguises the nature of the truth. Doublespeak is most closely associated with political language

[TheAppletons]

There just as much freedom of speech here in Thailand as there is in the USA. For example, in the USA, you can go to the Washington Monument and scream "Obama sucks!" and nothing bad will happen to you. In Thailand, you can go to Victory Monument and scream "Obama sucks!" and nothing bad will happen to you.

[ginjag]

Of course freedom of speech still exists.. Just not in Thailand unless you are doing it secretly or not talking bad about the current admin or police.

How do you still talk like this when you lot are here on TVF to just do it. Everyday, if it was not right then how do you agenda guys manage it ??? you think it's lenient mods ??

[ginjag]

PEOPLE still have the freedom to express their political opinions as long as they don't violate the law, Deputy Prime Minister Wissanu Krea-ngam insisted.

yes, and "the law" violates their rights including the people's right to freedom of expression...

Morons...

Why havent they taken you off TVF if it as you say. Your daily slagging then is tolerated---BUT wait --it could be monitored---be careful.

[Lukecan]

Freedom of speech doesn't exit in Thailand, but it doesn't exist in Germany, USA, Australia as well.

All the political correct freedom of speech friends want the freedom only for their opinions.....

Speak in Germany or Austria about the good things from Hitler (no matter if there are good one or not, freedom means that you can also express opinions which are wrong)

And you'll be faster in jail than you blink.

Speak in USA that you don't like gays or black people and you'll be in troubles.

You are 100% right.

If I were to go to Germany and say that hitler is a great leader and thanks to him germany was born from their ashes after WW1, I'd probably get arrested on the spot. If Germany had won the 2nd world war then the opposite would of been true, anyone critisizing Hitler would be sent to jail.

There is no freedom of expression in the EU its all HORSE SHİT

I seriously think there is greater freedom of speech in Thailand, atleast I could probably pay my way out of trouble here

Edited August 29, 2015 by Lukecan

[ginjag]

The absurdity of this statement defies belief. There is not even a slight resemblance to actual freedom of speech in Thailand. I sometimes wonder if what comes out of these official's mouths actually registers in their own brains?

Why does it need to when they can simply sling your ass in jail for saying anything that displeases them?

Way OTT who are they---unless you can give example. because at the last vote only 36% voted PTP more --much more than that are reasonably pleased with the way forward----YES problems---but they were here already.

Nasty aggressive OTT propaganda as with some of TVF posters expect trouble as in most countries---there are limits you can go to.

[ginjag]

Freedom of speech doesn't exit in Thailand, but it doesn't exist in Germany, USA, Australia as well.

All the political correct freedom of speech friends want the freedom only for their opinions.....

Speak in Germany or Austria about the good things from Hitler (no matter if there are good one or not, freedom means that you can also express opinions which are wrong)

And you'll be faster in jail than you blink.

Speak in USA that you don't like gays or black people and you'll be in troubles.

You are 100% right.

If I were to go to Germany and say that hitler is a great leader and thanks to him germany was born from their ashes after WW1, I'd probably get arrested on the spot. If Germany had won the 2nd world war then the opposite would of been true, anyone critisizing Hitler would be sent to jail.

There is no freedom of expression in the EU its all HORSE SHİT

I seriously think there is greater freedom of speech in Thailand, atleast I could probably pay my way out of trouble here

Good stuff my friend, minority PM bashers here do not want to hear what you say--it goes against their agenda------SURE

Edited August 29, 2015 by ginjag

[ginjag]

please TVF posters!!!

we can discuss ANYTHING even censored and censored and we can be open about His censored the censored and even talk about why censored got divorced and why censored family really was censored

I know this freedom exists because I submitted the above comments for 'comment adjustment' before posting.

Typical L G, propaganda post full of OTT rubbish. otherwise he would not be able to post on this site

[anon4546543]

Lots of subjects that are unlawful to talk about in Thailand. Lots of subjects that are frowned upon. In public that is. In my village, most people in private will talk about anything as anyone, anywhere does. But in general, politics, religion and royalty is off topic except in positive terms. I am happy with that.

Edited August 29, 2015 by metisdead
Bold font removed.

[GeorgesAbitbol]

It's freedom of speech ala French: "you can say what you want as long as you don't talk about the forbidden stuff". I'm exaggerating, Thai has more freedom of speech than France.

Sorry but what you say is utterly crap

Interesting, and a little off topic. But what is the situation in France? If you make anti-semitic comments you can be in big trouble with the law. Does this apply to any religion the same - anti-Catholic, anti-Protestant, anti-Islamic, anti-Hindu? As long as a law is applied evenly fair enough; but not if want group gets special treatment based on religion, ethnicity or sexual preference.

In the UK laws had to be introduced to restrict hate speech. That's fine providing the laws are not then manipulated to restrict genuine comments or questions of the government of the day.

Some Thai politicians and political "leaders", have shown in the past that they have intolerance to protesters, demonstrators, journalists, media that dare criticize or comment about something they don't like. Yet, without the freedom to do that, an important part of the checks and balances is lost.

I doubt if their is any definition of hate speech in Thai law. Anyone who comments, writes an article or even draws an article can be in big trouble if someone with the right wealth to pursue a law case doesn't like it; and now if the incumbent government don't to.

Well in France you can say the President is a moron and an incapable, public figures are open to critics, caricatures, let's take the exemple of "les guignols de l info" where you see presidents, politicians, public figures being compared to complete morons...

The defamation is not something which may land you in jail

There is no Lese majeste law for obvious reason

yes you can't say openly that the Nazi should have "finish the work or other crap like this" as it is assimilated to hate speech. Hate speech is for every religion or ethnicity. The only restriction about the Deportation is you can't argue against that, which is more and more criticized in France and you cannot wear a t shirt with a swastika.

Now let speak about thailand : you can t criticize anybody without facing defamation or lese majesty. You cannot say the elections are rigged, you cannot criticize the government, you do not have politic opposition nowdays, you not have the choice in Thailand....

Just look at the low style magazine like Voici which make a lot of money about private life of public figure, just try to find that in Thailand.

So comparing France and Thailand is yes, sorry to say that, a crappy statement and if you ever been to france or are french you know what you said is a nonsense

[ginjag]

Lots of subjects that are unlawful to talk about in Thailand. Lots of subjects that are frowned upon. In public that is. In my village, most people in private will talk about anything as anyone, anywhere does. But in general, politics, religion and royalty is off topic except in positive terms. I am happy with that.

Go along with that, there may be occasions to voice constructive criticism, if religion goes overboard-----or as in the amnesty bill--rice scam, just saying I would think then it IS ok.

[anon4546543]

to ginjag, yes, I go along with what you say except that my wife would say that there are many bad people, but in our village most people are good. She would have a big smile on her face as she said this.

[anon4546543]

Thais are much smarter than the average op. For instance, has your western freedom of speech ever stopped corruption in politics, or stopped corruption period. Has it ever stopped child abuse or abuse of power. Has it ever stopped hate speech or lead to a better life for the poorer people. Has it ever stopped the waves from reaching the shore.

[mikemac]

Les Majeste aside:

It's quite simple : you can say what you want as long as you are not writing stuff to promote division.

What this means, red-shirts, is stop egging each other on to go and commit more terrorism. We have seen enough of your 'democracy' now with your intimidation mobs outside courtrooms, death threats to judges or attacks on non-red shirt politicians if they dare venture into a red-shirt province. Thailand does not need more cowards firing grenades into women and children for a couple of thousand baht.

I have seen several of the low-end posters here sputtering about a peoples uprising and some sort of 'communist revolution' (which they seem to confuse with 'democracy') which is coming very soon. I reckon that's the sort of thing they are talking about.

It's quite simple - but obviously not simple enough. What you fail to realise is how you are free to post all this whining on a public forum. If it was anything like you pretend, why aren't you in jail with all the others you try to imply have been arrested ?.

Good grief! The view from the Yellow Planet...

This is pure gold ! This topic is about Free Speech, do we all agree ?

99 % of the comments so far have been denigrating the current government because of their stand on free speech, ie, they are not really "into it".

Things were going along swimmingly until out of the blue a member dared to post a comment from the "yellow" side and he was shot down in flames (literally) for doing so.

Apparently you are not entitled to an opinion unless you are a junta basher.

Hilarious !

Carry on, I am enjoying your amazing comments !