urgent advice needed about when to hand over cash for land

[irlguy1]

Hi all

I am not sure what section to put this so please feel free to move it.

Here is the situation. I am buying a small farm with a house but I am not in Thailand at the moment.

The deposit has been paid but as it is in my wifes home village her dad is sorting the deal.

He has just called to say that the seller has decided that she wont sign over the house papers or book

until after the cash has been lodged to her account but my father in law is adamant that this is not the

way and that the seller should sign over everything before the money is paid.

We are now at an impase as she will not agree to even take half upfront as she says what if we refuse to pay the

balance after the papers are signed over and like wise my dad is saying what if he pays in full and she then doesnt sign over.

My question is this,

How does it usually work? Has anyone here bought land or a home in the village and had this situation?

Its urgent we make a decision in 24 hours or we will lose the place to another buyer. If we back out we will lose 20000 Baht deposit.

But better that loss than her doing a runner with all the money.

Any advice on this please help.

[d2g]

You have a cashier check made for the balance due.

You give a copy of the check to the seller so they can validate the check.

When all the title transfer paperwork has been signed at the land office you give the cashier check to the seller.

This is the standard transfer process in Thailand.

What the seller is demanding is totally wrong and some sort of scam.

Don't do it.

[irlguy1]

You have a cashier check made for the balance due.

You give a copy of the check to the seller so they can validate the check.

When all the title transfer paperwork has been signed at the land office you give the cashier check to the seller.

This is the standard transfer process in Thailand.

What the seller is demanding is totally wrong and some sort of scam.

Don't do it.

Thats what I kinda thought.

Thanks mate for answering so quickly.

[GuestHouse]

You have a cashier check made for the balance due.

You give a copy of the check to the seller so they can validate the check.

When all the title transfer paperwork has been signed at the land office you give the cashier check to the seller.

This is the standard transfer process in Thailand.

What the seller is demanding is totally wrong and some sort of scam.

Don't do it.

On a couple of occasions I have handed cash over to the seller in the land office during the sign over.

The exchange of payment is exactly at the point of signature - anything else is unacceptable.

I also advise you personally should be in Thailand to see this deal through if you personally are paying for the land.

Get a message to the seller that you will make payment at the land office on the day of signature.

You don't say how much the deal is in total, but if its not a huge amount suggest cash - your seller will be hard pushed to refuse the sweet smell of cash in hand.

And make sure you have the documentation to show that you transferred the money into Thailand for this purchase - and/or evidence of where the money came from.

Edited August 30, 2015 by GuestHouse

[TommyUK1960]

All my girlfriend did was go to the Land office with cashiers cheque.

Land office made sure loans or other things were not on Chanute then land office told them to go and exchange money.

Chanute would be signed over to GF.

GF never paid deposit as she trust no one.

[chiang mai]

Make the exchange at the Land Office, at the same time the Chanotte is transferred, any other arrangement is totally unacceptable and open to serious fraud.

And cashiers cheques are useful for this purpose, if the seller will not accept one you should consider why and perhaps not proceed.

[irlguy1]

Make the exchange at the Land Office, at the same time the Chanotte is transferred, any other arrangement is totally unacceptable and open to serious fraud.

And cashiers cheques are useful for this purpose, if the seller will not accept one you should consider why and perhaps not proceed.

Thanks to all for the fast replies.

Any idea if the bank charge for the cashiers cheque?

[CharlieH]

We had a similar issue, old lady, old ways, didnt trust or believe anyone, and certainly wouldnt even know what a "cashiers cheque" was.

Met at the Land Office, she signed, we paid cash, it was all video'd etc.

[irlguy1]

We had a similar issue, old lady, old ways, didnt trust or believe anyone, and certainly wouldnt even know what a "cashiers cheque" was.

Met at the Land Office, she signed, we paid cash, it was all video'd etc.

You not worry carrying cash around ?

[chiang mai]

Make the exchange at the Land Office, at the same time the Chanotte is transferred, any other arrangement is totally unacceptable and open to serious fraud.

And cashiers cheques are useful for this purpose, if the seller will not accept one you should consider why and perhaps not proceed.

Thanks to all for the fast replies.

Any idea if the bank charge for the cashiers cheque?

Of course but it's a very small charge, under 500 baht last time I paid for one.

[CharlieH]

We had a similar issue, old lady, old ways, didnt trust or believe anyone, and certainly wouldnt even know what a "cashiers cheque" was.

Met at the Land Office, she signed, we paid cash, it was all video'd etc.

You not worry carrying cash around ?

Not at all, rural place, modestly hidden, no one could see it, not like it was "millions" where cash would become impractical and other ways would have to be explored.

You havnt said what sort of amount is involved, so I can only relay my experience of a land purchase.

[opalred]

100%right dont give money till you are at land office and sign papers in front of them and witness

[lovelomsak]

When we bought ours , the woman selling had a bank loan on it, The bank held the chanote.. We had to go to the bank with the owner, and we paid out the loan in cash. The bank gave us the chanote not the seller. We then went to land office and did the registering changes. When that was finished we paid the woman the remainder of the purchase price in cash. We brought a lawyer to witness the payments. Cheque would be far better,but cash is safe no one knows you are caring money. Donot pay in full till chanote is in your name.

Edited August 30, 2015 by lovelomsak

[irlguy1]

Its a million Baht.

I am just getting a bad feeling about her so think I may have to lose the deposit and take the hit.

She offered to sell us all the contents for 20k the same as the deposit.

Anyone hold out any hope that we could still claim the contents to cover the 20k?

[CharlieH]

Go with your gut, if it dont feel right and she wont compromise to achieve the same goal, then something is wrong. Like you said, 20k is better than 1 mil.

Personally, there is no way I would allow anyone to "handle" that for me, I would have to be there myself, but that's just my opinion.

[MaeJoMTB]

When we bought ours , the woman selling had a bank loan on it, The bank held the chanote.. We had to go to the bank with the owner, and we paid out the loan in cash. The bank gave us the chanote not the seller. We then went to land office and did the registering changes. When that was finished we paid the woman the remainder of the purchase price in cash. We brought a lawyer to witness the payments. Cheque would be far better,but cash is safe no one knows you are caring money. Donot pay in full till chanote is in your name.

That isn't normal,

Most banks send their guy along to the land office with the chanote, where the exchange takes place.

Last time I was at the land office (MaeJo), it was people with big bags of cash for cash sales, or bank representatives if a home loan was involved.

Millions and millions being counted out on the tables in front of everyone.

[petejjj]

....we recently purchased in a rural area. Had 2x chanotes. One for land only and other with 2 ngan and house.

Seller had a bank loan against one chanote so we went with seller and paid that off using our cash 1st. This was done at their bank and we kept the receipt for payment.That was THB100,000. it took 2 days for bank to obtain the chanote and release it. On the day the bank released the chanote, we meet at bank and jointly collected the chanote. We used one car and all stayed together. From there we went to the land department and transferred the 2 chanotes across to my wife (thai). I had to sign land department form to say funds are not mine, and also had to provide copy of my passport and our marriage certificate.

At all times we were present with the seller.

At the completion of transferring the chanotes we paid the balance to the seller in cash. The transfer at land department and final payment was all done within the day.

Good luck with your purchase

-p

[irlguy1]

Go with your gut, if it dont feel right and she wont compromise to achieve the same goal, then something is wrong. Like you said, 20k is better than 1 mil.

Personally, there is no way I would allow anyone to "handle" that for me, I would have to be there myself, but that's just my opinion.

Thanks for that mate, I can see why you would have that opinion but her dad is a good guy I trust him completly so

not worried that he hasnt got his daughter and my best interests at heart.

So I am not concerned about not being there. Even if I was there this woman would be exactly the same as she is now.

Her dad was the one that thought the sellers attitude smelt funny.

Wife is really upset as it was a dream home in her dream area. Something she has always wanted but if something smells like shit feels like shit and looks like shit

chances are its shit.

She values her dads and my opinion so I guess this is dead in the water

[petejjj]

Go with your gut, if it dont feel right and she wont compromise to achieve the same goal, then something is wrong. Like you said, 20k is better than 1 mil.

Personally, there is no way I would allow anyone to "handle" that for me, I would have to be there myself, but that's just my opinion.

...agree with you Charlie.....my terms were:

1/ had to be chanote

2/ had to be within certain distance from family

3/ not on main road

4/ I had to be present at all times for sake of transparency. If everything is transparent then there should be no problems [emoji3]

[irlguy1]

Go with your gut, if it dont feel right and she wont compromise to achieve the same goal, then something is wrong. Like you said, 20k is better than 1 mil.

Personally, there is no way I would allow anyone to "handle" that for me, I would have to be there myself, but that's just my opinion.

...agree with you Charlie.....my terms were:

1/ had to be chanote

2/ had to be within certain distance from family

3/ not on main road

4/ I had to be present at all times for sake of transparency. If everything is transparent then there should be no problems [emoji3]

Check

Check

And check.

Number 4 is not possible but I trust her dad so not an issue. He has always been upfront and even just offered to sell some of his own land to pay us back deposit we will lose.

[swissie]

So, if you don't act, another buyer will snap up the property within 24 hours?

"Dad" will have to sell land to raise 20.000 Bht to cover the loss of the deposit? You are clearly not surrounded by an affluent Thai-Family. "Dad" has probably set his eyes on a 10 % commission if the deal ever comes thru. 10 % of 1 million is how much ?

Alarm bells are ringing, and everybody can hear them. Can you?

Cheers.

[irlguy1]

So, if you don't act, another buyer will snap up the property within 24 hours?

"Dad" will have to sell land to raise 20.000 Bht to cover the loss of the deposit? You are clearly not surrounded by an affluent Thai-Family. "Dad" has probably set his eyes on a 10 % commission if the deal ever comes thru. 10 % of 1 million is how much ?

Alarm bells are ringing, and everybody can hear them. Can you?

Cheers.

Not gonna even waste my time with a detailed response to you.

Go back to the I hate Thais threads.

[swissie]

So, if you don't act, another buyer will snap up the property within 24 hours?

"Dad" will have to sell land to raise 20.000 Bht to cover the loss of the deposit? You are clearly not surrounded by an affluent Thai-Family. "Dad" has probably set his eyes on a 10 % commission if the deal ever comes thru. 10 % of 1 million is how much ?

Alarm bells are ringing, and everybody can hear them. Can you?

Cheers.

Not gonna even waste my time with a detailed response to you.

Go back to the I hate Thais threads.

How could you give a detailed response if not even yourself knows whats going on?

My condolences.

[rocketboybkk]

You lodge the funds with the legal party of the seller

If they act for themselves then once transfer is done at land office you pay immediately

You fil is right

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[PattayaClub]

Many folks in Thailand won't have anything to do with a check. Nothing wrong with that. I have always met the seller at the land office. I have a big bag of cash and seller has chanote. No cash or no chanote, no deal. But there has never been a problem.

You should get copy of the chanote and check everything out before doing the deal. Does the chanote cover the land you think you are buying? Do the neighbors agree with the stated boundary (VERY important)? Has there been a survey?

Finally, do not make the mistake of putting an "interim title" in another family member's name. If your wife is not here to put the land in her name, DON'T do the deal!!! I personally know a (Thai) guy who is a police officer, who temporarily put land in his own brother's name. The brother just stole it --refused to give it back. You can hear many such stories on this forum. Thinking that YOUR situation is different is one of the worst mistakes you can make here.

But even if your trust is well placed, there is a big land transfer tax on any land that changes hands in less than five years. So if the land goes into you father-in-law's name, there will be a tax. Then if you want to transfer to your wife in less than five years, expect to pay a big tax. If you leave it in his name until he dies and the land devolves to her the tax is waived. But if he dies with it in his name with no will and she has two brothers, then they will own two-thirds of it.

Food for thought.

[jacko45k]

I did the same (cashiers cheque handed over at time of signature and exchange of paperwork), in a lawyers office with lawyers present.

[LukKrueng]

Not every Thai seller is trying to scam you. Some might be worried you try to scam them too...

I bought a few properties over the years - in BKK and rural area too. In BKK it was through an estate agent who made the contract and handled the cash deposit required by the sellers. The balance was paid by cashier chqs (20 THB charged by the banks / chq) at the land office upon signing the papers and getting the chanot.

In the rural place it was a direct deal with the seller. The agreement was majority of the money at the land office and the balance outside - after the deal done. I paid by cashier chq at the land office. Got the chanot signed and all other documents. As the seller didn't trust the cashier chq, the lady at the land office suggested the owner holds the chanot while we all go together to the bank (we went separate cars...) and once the bank approves the chq she gives me the chanot - and that's how it was done. At that point I handed over the balance of the cash.

[scorecard]

Go with your gut, if it dont feel right and she wont compromise to achieve the same goal, then something is wrong. Like you said, 20k is better than 1 mil.

Personally, there is no way I would allow anyone to "handle" that for me, I would have to be there myself, but that's just my opinion.

Thanks for that mate, I can see why you would have that opinion but her dad is a good guy I trust him completly so

not worried that he hasnt got his daughter and my best interests at heart.

So I am not concerned about not being there. Even if I was there this woman would be exactly the same as she is now.

Her dad was the one that thought the sellers attitude smelt funny.

Wife is really upset as it was a dream home in her dream area. Something she has always wanted but if something smells like shit feels like shit and looks like shit

chances are its shit.

She values her dads and my opinion so I guess this is dead in the water

My Thai family before purchasing land / land&house always ask for a copy of the chanut and then take it to the land office and ask for a check that it's real and it's totally up to date in terms of any encumbrances etc.

[whatproblem]

Not forget do usafruct at same time or girlfriend will be moving Thai boyfriend in

[SOTIRIOS]

...she took you for the deposit....I guess she wants to see how far she can go....

...and hopefully nobody else is in on it.....