AMEX - no more fee waivers

[MadMac]

Just tried today to get the usual waiver of the annual fee for my Thai AMEX credit card. Lady at the phone told me, that they do not offer waivers this year, but offered a discount.

As AMEX is virtually useless in Thailand as almost nobody accepts it for payment (the last I used was Shell, they reject AMEX since half a year too), I told her I'm going to cancel the card. Lady sounded happy, another silly customer gone, and did not even try to keep me onboard. Offered straight to transfer the points into Thai miles and that was it.

I believe AMEX has serious problems in Thailand as their cost structure is unattractive to dealers and thus the low acceptance. Now it seems the already paying customers should fill the gap. Not worth the 4280B for a useless piece of plastic.

[Halfaboy]

In general I pay cash and in cases my Amex is rejected I use another one. For me no problem.

Having no serious problems using it in Thailand.

[MadMac]

Well, given the difficulty to get a real CC in Thailand I kept and used it as long as it was for free. As the acceptance of AMEX gets lesser and lesser in the country, the same time they charge a fee now, that is no longer attractive. So I rather keep the money and have a nice dinner.

Funny thing, they kept calling me to promote the "real Platinum" card, for a small fee of course . Most ridiculous if the card is already Platinum.

Edited October 6, 2015 by MadMac

[Asiantravel]

As an international company they are most disorganised.I never seem to get my card replaced easily and effortlessly when it reaches the expiry date. I always seem to have to chase them up even though I've been with them for 34 years.

I emailed them to tell them I hadn't yet received the replacement for my gold card which expires at the end of this month. Firstly I received an email from an Indian lady on their "emailing team " telling me that looking at their records my card was not due to expire yet.

I wrote back and said sorry but you're wrong I've got the card in front of me and it shows the dates clearly ! Then the same Indian lady wrote back a few hours later and said oh yes you are right

So then the Indian lady gave me a number to call and I ended up talking with a chap in Phoenix Arizona! Mind you he was far better than the Indian lady who was quite frankly waste of time to deal with and promised to send it to me by messenger within 2 to 3 days.

[SheungWan]

Last time I checked AMEX was accepted in TOPS.

[Jackie66]

I have an Amex card and use it all the time in Tops, Tesco, Villa market, restaurants, pubs etc.. Sometimes they don't accept it but that rarely happens.

Why I like Amex so much is actually the customer service. But my card is not a Thai amex card but an EU country Platinum amex so maybe there is a difference. Few years ago my card was skimmed and over 10k Euros taken within a few hours and they just called me to ask me if I was in Japan (That's where the charge came from) and i said no and that was it. I got the 10k charge on my next bill but they said just pay the rest and they covered it all without me losing a single Euro.

Customer service has always been great even when I was unable to pay the bill of about 7000 Euros for 2 months past due because of some cash flow issues they were understanding and did not cancel my card. Another thing is on certain ATMs cash advances are only 50THB compared to the normal 180THB per transaction. They also sent me a replacement card free of charge to Bangkok with DHL. Arrived here 2 days after I requested it.

I still have a local Visa debit card and a Mastercard just in case but don't really feel safe paying with those as I know getting a refund would be a nightmare.

Edited October 7, 2015 by Jackie66

[technologybytes]

Amex has its uses, especially if you travel.

The consumer protection you get buying products with your amex is far superior to what you get when buying with your visa/mastercard.. thats the real reason Thai merchants don't like it.

Of course if you do not use it, then its a waste of money.

[Sydebolle]

"Lady sounded happy, another silly customer gone, and did not even try to keep me onboard."

​This statement is regretfully applicable to many other services in Thailand. As long as staff does not understand that salaries have to be earned first and are paid by customers and not the boss ...........

Amex has been a loser for the last 20 years and I never understood why they keep on purposely killing customers. Their service partners (i.e. vendors which could accept AMEX as payment tool) are frustrated over higher commissioning of effected sales which ensured a Foodland customer in front of me in the line to go ballistic once the cashier said, that Foodland would not accept AMEX. The card got instantly destroyed in the cashier lane ....... by the customer himself! What a fantastic statement of satisfaction

[kg1947]

Stick with VISA and MASTER CARD , can't go wrong .

my regular bank in Canada is adding 2 percent FEE for any cash withdrawal ,

so it's like this : at Thailand ATM each cash withdrawal cost THB 180.- max.

withdr. THB 20,000.- plus regular ( standard ) Bank Charge of CAD 5.00

posted to my Canadian account ( debit )......

and since Sept. 01/2015 additional 2 percent fee over the amount of cash

withdrawal . so: CAD 800.- or roughly THB 20,000.- you pay CAD 16.00

on top . So the bank are really raking it in , like it or not .......

my bank is : COAST CAPITAL SAVINGS & CREDIT UNION based in BC.

Any ideas about ALTERNATIVE CASH WITHDRAWAL methods ??

[Pib]

Amex has its uses, especially if you travel.

The consumer protection you get buying products with your amex is far superior to what you get when buying with your visa/mastercard.. thats the real reason Thai merchants don't like it.

Of course if you do not use it, then its a waste of money.

How is the consumer protection far superior?

[stbkk]

I have an Amex card and use it all the time in Tops, Tesco, Villa market, restaurants, pubs etc.. Sometimes they don't accept it but that rarely happens.

Why I like Amex so much is actually the customer service. But my card is not a Thai amex card but an EU country Platinum amex so maybe there is a difference. Few years ago my card was skimmed and over 10k Euros taken within a few hours and they just called me to ask me if I was in Japan (That's where the charge came from) and i said no and that was it. I got the 10k charge on my next bill but they said just pay the rest and they covered it all without me losing a single Euro.

Customer service has always been great even when I was unable to pay the bill of about 7000 Euros for 2 months past due because of some cash flow issues they were understanding and did not cancel my card. Another thing is on certain ATMs cash advances are only 50THB compared to the normal 180THB per transaction. They also sent me a replacement card free of charge to Bangkok with DHL. Arrived here 2 days after I requested it.

I still have a local Visa debit card and a Mastercard just in case but don't really feel safe paying with those as I know getting a refund would be a nightmare.

I agree. I have a UK based Amex and the service I have received is good. I keep it for use outside of Thailand generally, and use my Thai credit card locally for low-value transactions etc.

[thonglorjimmy]

I have an Amex card because as I'm a retiree the main stream banks will not issue me a Visa or MasterCard credit card without depositing an equal, or higher, amount on deposit as security.

I'm told that Amex isn't a real bank so the normal rules on issuing a credit card don't apply, I have to admit that I don't really understand that reasoning, but there again I don't need to.

Sometimes Amex isn't accepted but more than often it is, I've even used it in Foodland where incidentally they offer 3 x points, I have noticed that some outlets don't accept debit cards, where I thought they got their cash almost instantaneously. I've had a debit card refused in a hospital, my Amex was accepted and when we were in a new restaurant in Thonglor recently where my Amex was accepted, another diner had to go to an atm in the rain to withdraw cash as they wouldn't accept his Visa debit card.

As I say I don't really understand a lot of the reasoning with Thai cards, but the Amex card works for me, even with the yearly fee.

[AmericanSafety]

• I kept my AMEX from the States. Had the option to change it over and didn't. Glad I hadn't. All the bill paying is online, so the regional distinction isn't important & with the Gold Preferred Rewards there is no international transaction fee. A lot of places don't take the AMEX, but for the big purchases (i.e HomePro & HomeWorks) they have taken it without problem. For US members, there is a new promotional offer of 50,000 air miles transferrable to any airlines if you sign on and spend $1000 in the 1st 3 months. The money may sound like a bit much but if you use it in place of normally spending of bills and pay it off each month, you naturally accrue no interest and get the 50,000 for normal spending. 1st year card fee waived and $85 each additional year.

[khunano]

Last time I checked AMEX was accepted in TOPS.

and Tesco and Big-C and Villa and many more, though Bangkok has many more vendors accepting it than upcountry where I live now...

[smccolley]

I have noticed I get a 10% discount on medicines at BPH when I pay with AMEX. That is enough reason for me to keep it around.

[gandalf12]

I cancelled my AMEX as I was getting nothing but problems from them. They were billing me for features I never asked for. Took me 2 years to get it all sorted but eventually did. Wouldnt have AMEX again.

[Sharpasatack]

I used my AMEX to pay a bail bondsman over the phone. The bail was 25,000 USD which I was surprised AMEX accepted. I am pretty sure I would not have been able to do that with my visa card. My friend was walking the streets in a few hours even though it was the middle of the night when he was thrown in the clink.

I use the AMEX all the time in bkk although there are places that do not take it. My biggest charges are on the AMEX at places such as Tesco, Villa Market and reataurants.

I would say the customer service is better than my Visa and Master cards because for many years I have been able to dispute charges online. My visa card has started to allow that as well now, so they are getting more competitive, but it is still much more of a hassle than with the AMEX.

[topt]

I used my AMEX to pay a bail bondsman over the phone. The bail was 25,000 USD which I was surprised AMEX accepted. I am pretty sure I would not have been able to do that with my visa card. My friend was walking the streets in a few hours even though it was the middle of the night when he was thrown in the clink. I use the AMEX all the time in bkk although there are places that do not take it. My biggest charges are on the AMEX at places such as Tesco, Villa Market and reataurants. I would say the customer service is better than my Visa and Master cards because for many years I have been able to dispute charges online. My visa card has started to allow that as well now, so they are getting more competitive, but it is still much more of a hassle than with the AMEX.

You must spend a hell of a lot of money on your card every month or just have a very high limit for emergencies to be able to charge 25k plus whatever else was already on it...........?

[MadMac]

Last time I checked AMEX was accepted in TOPS.

and Tesco and Big-C and Villa and many more, though Bangkok has many more vendors accepting it than upcountry where I live now...

I don't pay with credit card for out of the pocket purchases like supermarkets. People hate you for that and I hate people for that.

There are not many vendors left that accept AMEX, some restaurants, but declining. As I wrote the eyeopener for me was Shell that refused AMEX since May or April.

Travel? Well, some airlines accept it. Not the budget ones. So AMEX is basically useless in Thailand and there is no legitimate reason to charge a 4000+B fee for it. I have still my SG AMEX and other cards, a SCB visa in TH. They all cost me nothing and I can actually use them.

The argument with the difficulty to get a real CC in TH I mentioned already. But if you have one, you can get another. So AMEX, it was nice as long as it lasted. Thanks for the bumpy ride .

[thonglorjimmy]

I don't pay with credit card for out of the pocket purchases like supermarkets. People hate you for that and I hate people for that.

Why would you hate somebody who pays for a supermarket purchase with any sort of payment card, in fact why would anybody hate people who pay with a card, how does it effect anyone else?

Travel? Well, some airlines accept it. Not the budget ones.

Air Asia accepts Amex.

[MadMac]

Why? Ever stood in a queue and someone with a card takes 5 mins to get the paperwork done, that would not take more than 1 minute with cash? This then likely for 500B peanuts. Good reason Makro accepts only cash payments (well, besides that Citibank stuff).

Payment with AMEX is also limited for AirAsia flights. These guys also charge you a different fee depending on how you pay, so they charge the channel fees through to the customer.

[theoldgit]

Payment with AMEX is also limited for AirAsia flights. These guys also charge you a different fee depending on how you pay, so they charge the channel fees through to the customer.

What do you mean payment with Amex is also limited for Air Asia flights, I've never encountered a problem with with Amex for any destination.

As far as I'm aware they charge the same service fee whatever debit or credit card you use, though I believe they charge slightly less if you use direct debit.

I have to admit that I don't share your hate of those paying by payment card for smaller purchases, life's too short to get that upset, it's never taken me five minutes to get a card swiped, I suspect it's often quicker than paying in cash when the cashier has to wait for the cash register to tell them how much change to give.

[MadMac]

For the supermarket, I don't know why people pull out a card for 500B. That just blocks the process and people wait in the queue. It's 10x slower than cash payment at least. But usually I go to Makro and can avoid this. If you are retired and are one of the guys that enjoy queuing at the immigration at 4 in the morning (as it is here in CNX), you may of course be hardened or even enjoy the queue .

Air Asia limits the applicability of AMEX and JCB as of here: http://www.airasia.com/ask/template.do?id=237. Note: you can not pay in Euro(!)

3. Can I pay with Visa, MasterCard or Amex for all currencies?
Yes, Visa and MasterCard are accepted for all currencies available on AirAsia.com. American Express can be accepted for MYR, THB, USD, AUD, SGD, BND and HKD while JCB can be accepted for JPY transaction only.

[BudRight]

Why? Ever stood in a queue and someone with a card takes 5 mins to get the paperwork done, that would not take more than 1 minute with cash? This then likely for 500B peanuts. Good reason Makro accepts only cash payments (well, besides that Citibank stuff).

Payment with AMEX is also limited for AirAsia flights. These guys also charge you a different fee depending on how you pay, so they charge the channel fees through to the customer.

Five minutes? I've used my Visa in Foodland and while it was slower than in the country of issue, it was still less than ten seconds.

I speculate that if Amex Thailand is inferior, it is because it is being run rather ineptly and Thais keep the card for prestige rather than for perks like in The West.

[fritzzz25]

Stick with VISA and MASTER CARD , can't go wrong .

my regular bank in Canada is adding 2 percent FEE for any cash withdrawal ,

so it's like this : at Thailand ATM each cash withdrawal cost THB 180.- max.

withdr. THB 20,000.- plus regular ( standard ) Bank Charge of CAD 5.00

posted to my Canadian account ( debit )......

and since Sept. 01/2015 additional 2 percent fee over the amount of cash

withdrawal . so: CAD 800.- or roughly THB 20,000.- you pay CAD 16.00

on top . So the bank are really raking it in , like it or not .......

my bank is : COAST CAPITAL SAVINGS & CREDIT UNION based in BC.

Any ideas about ALTERNATIVE CASH WITHDRAWAL methods ??

You might be better off using a forex company to send you money from your Coast Cap acct to your thai bank. That is how I do it.

[thonglorjimmy]

MadMac, on 07 Oct 2015 - 23:05, said:MadMac, on 07 Oct 2015 - 23:05, said:MadMac, on 07 Oct 2015 - 23:05, said:MadMac, on 07 Oct 2015 - 23:05, said:

For the supermarket, I don't know why people pull out a card for 500B. That just blocks the process and people wait in the queue. It's 10x slower than cash payment at least. But usually I go to Makro and can avoid this. If you are retired and are one of the guys that enjoy queuing at the immigration at 4 in the morning (as it is here in CNX), you may of course be hardened or even enjoy the queue .

Air Asia limits the applicability of AMEX and JCB as of here: http://www.airasia.com/ask/template.do?id=237. Note: you can not pay in Euro(!)

3. Can I pay with Visa, MasterCard or Amex for all currencies?

Yes, Visa and MasterCard are accepted for all currencies available on AirAsia.com. American Express can be accepted for MYR, THB, USD, AUD, SGD, BND and HKD while JCB can be accepted for JPY transaction only.

I wouldn't use a payment card for a 500 Baht transaction, unless I didn't have enough cash on me, but I wouldn't hate anybody that did, my experience is that cards are pretty quick and often cash payments are pretty slow, especially when the cashier needs to constantly check the screen to see how much change to give, but I suppose everyone's experiences are different.

I note that Air Asia don't accept Amex for every conceivable currency, but as this is a Thai forum and the thread is about Thai cards, the point is hardly relevant.

At the end of the day the OP wasn't happy with his card so has ditched it, others are and have kept theirs.

It certainly works for me, so I'll leave it there.

[Pib]

Why? Ever stood in a queue and someone with a card takes 5 mins to get the paperwork done, that would not take more than 1 minute with cash? This then likely for 500B peanuts. Good reason Makro accepts only cash payments (well, besides that Citibank stuff).

Payment with AMEX is also limited for AirAsia flights. These guys also charge you a different fee depending on how you pay, so they charge the channel fees through to the customer.

Five minutes? I've used my Visa in Foodland and while it was slower than in the country of issue, it was still less than ten seconds.

I speculate that if Amex Thailand is inferior, it is because it is being run rather ineptly and Thais keep the card for prestige rather than for perks like in The West.

Yea, I don't know why people keep saying use of a debit/credit card in Thailand is much slower than cash....I expect that statement is made on lack of use of a card in Thailand.

I use my credit cards in Thailand almost daily for as many purchases as I can because I earn 1.5% cash back on every purpose, greatly lessens the need to run to an ATM all the time and carry lots of cash around, and greatly reduces the amount of money I did to transfer to Thailand to keep my Thai bank accounts topped up.

Just like you I use Foodland to buy many of my groceries...you hand them your card....they insert the card into the POS machine and punch in the baht amount for the charge, and just a few seconds later a receipt for signature prints out...I sign it...done. Ditto when buying fuel for my vehicle fuel at a PTT fuel station. Even faster at places like Lotus were they don't even have to punch in the amount to the POS machine because it's fully interfaced with the cashier register...receipt for signature prints out in a few seconds...I sign it...done in around 5 to 10 seconds.

Now for the cash paying customers getting done in 5 -10 seconds is just a dream. The customer takes time to find the approx right amount of cash in their pocketbook and/or turns to their shopping partner to ask for some additional cash, the cashier then counts the cash given "at least" once, puts it in the cash register, makes change from the amount given, hands it back to the customer, the customer then counts change, etc.

Using a card is "definitely" faster than using cash at least in Thailand since they don't require you to punch in PIN...that's why most store checkouts in Thailand don't have the POS machine within easy access of the customer...it's usually next to/under the cash register and only the checkout clerk touches it. And even in those countries where a PIN must be punched in by the customer, really had to image it could take longer than the cash paying process like described above unless the person is very slow in punching in their PIN.

[MadMac]

Well, not sure in which Thailand you live. But I would rather see higher limits than 300B for CC usage. It is slower by a factor of 10 (subjective of course) compared to cash payment. I mean here people who buy 1...2 things only which happens often. If you have then 4 cashier open in a whole BigC like the do it in Chiang Mai, it makes you, perhaps not hate, but dislike these people.

Agree, when you pay for a weekly shopping trip, the time to scan all the stuff outweighs the payment by far. Then it becomes a non-issue.

[Sharpasatack]

I used my AMEX to pay a bail bondsman over the phone. The bail was 25,000 USD which I was surprised AMEX accepted. I am pretty sure I would not have been able to do that with my visa card. My friend was walking the streets in a few hours even though it was the middle of the night when he was thrown in the clink. I use the AMEX all the time in bkk although there are places that do not take it. My biggest charges are on the AMEX at places such as Tesco, Villa Market and reataurants. I would say the customer service is better than my Visa and Master cards because for many years I have been able to dispute charges online. My visa card has started to allow that as well now, so they are getting more competitive, but it is still much more of a hassle than with the AMEX.

You must spend a hell of a lot of money on your card every month or just have a very high limit for emergencies to be able to charge 25k plus whatever else was already on it...........?

[Pib]

Well, not sure in which Thailand you live. But I would rather see higher limits than 300B for CC usage. It is slower by a factor of 10 (subjective of course) compared to cash payment. I mean here people who buy 1...2 things only which happens often. If you have then 4 cashier open in a whole BigC like the do it in Chiang Mai, it makes you, perhaps not hate, but dislike these people.

Agree, when you pay for a weekly shopping trip, the time to scan all the stuff outweighs the payment by far. Then it becomes a non-issue.

I live in Bangkok and use my cards in Bangkok and the provinces around it...almost daily. You estimate of being higher by a factor of 10 is like 10 times too high.

Please, please give details/example of why it's 10 times slower using a card. Like after the person hands the clerk their card where the slow down is...where's the choke point, etc?

Don't understand your last sentence in relation to how scanning items interfaces with how that makes cash or card payment faster. The cashier always scans the items whether you are paying with cash, card, slice of a gold bar, etc. We are talking paying after all the items have been scanned to ring-up the total payment due.