hakuho Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Obama is such a hypocrite. Last week in his home town, Chicago, U.S.A., there were over one hundred shootings, 49 died from gunshot wounds. Yet, he never mentions this; it is a black-on-black crime issue; and as we have heard, "Black Lives Matter"---Bull****. The international elitists have been trying to get Ameros to relinquish their weapons for decades...they want US citizens to become like the wussy Eurotrash, where Sweden leads in rapes and Merkle and Cameron bend over, like Obama, for their Jihad masters...it's disgusting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgesAbitbol Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 When it is more difficult to have a driving licence than a gun licence you know which kind of country you're in. More people in the USA are killed by cars than by guns! RTA deaths 2012 = 36,000 Gun deaths 2012 = 30,000 So logically the US authorities have that right. Let's update your numbers to the most recent year available : 2013 RTA deaths : 32,719 Guns Death: 33,623 Damn it is bigger! So it is normal you have tougher regulation for car than for gun? When i said the country was f.ked up... with "logic" like yours, nothing can never evolve. Idiocracy, the only movie which started as a fiction and ends as a documentary..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lukasisgood Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 (edited) A vast majority of gun deaths are suicides. Then a sizable amount of the violent deaths are cops killing bad guys, then most of the rest is gang related who most of the time do not own their guns legally and would have them anyway. When you adjust for suicide and gang on gang, car accidents and pharmacuricles kill for more people. The people killing themselves which is a majority of gun deaths are going to kill themselves with or without guns and the gang members are the same. When you actually look at the statistics critically, you have more of a risk dieing while ridding your bike. The anti gun lobby is built in emotional sensationalism not critical thinking. America per capita actually ranks much lower than many other countries in violent crime. In fact if you actually look at the statistic and break it down by per capita per state you can easily see that most states actually are on par and in many cases much less violent than the rest of the developed world. There are a few problem states with very bad cities that bring the numbers up as a whole country. Quite obviously if one actually looks instead of falling victim to rhetoric, America has a socioeconomic problem in its cities. This is a result of migration into cities upon the end of the civil war and then subsequent segregation laws that condensed poor people into certain areas as well as the condensation of poor people that migrated here as migrant farm workers. Let's not even get started on our complely failed war on drugs. Just a hunch but I'd bet there is an extremely strong corolation between prohibition of anything and violance. Prohibition builds black markets which are breeding grounds for violence. Actually it's not a hunch, these are known economc realities/ No. We don't really have a gun problem. Mass shootings are indeed able to be perpetrated a little easier here because we live in a free society, but it's mostly a mental health issue. More people die rideing their bikes. It just dosn't make good news. Edited October 9, 2015 by Lukasisgood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCruncher Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 Be interesting to see what happens when only the bad guys have guns. I guess about the same as in the numerous other countries in the world where only the bad boys have guns. In short, there will be much less gun violence. Sorry mate but that's not correct! Crimes involving firearms have climbed in the UK and Australia, all involve illegal firearms! This arguement blaming the weapon for the crime doesn't hold water, admittingly mass killing or spur of the moment killing are made easier with a firearm but more to the point must be the mental health of the perpetrator! In Australia the mass shootings were carried out by men with serious mental health problems, nearly all were under medical care and usually on "Prosac"! Nobody ever questions the treatment or the drugs perscribed......that would be taboo! Yeah, gun violence has climbed in the UK, to 0.26 deaths per 100.000. In Australia it is 0.86 deaths per 100.000. In the US it is a stunning 10.64 deaths per 100.000, the highest figure among all civilized countries in the world. You want to say again I'm not correct? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneday Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 (edited) The numbing down of Thailand...5 more people killed in van accident today. Edited October 9, 2015 by oneday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitehawk42 Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 I am an American. The object is not to take away guns from citizens who legally own them. Making it more difficult to buy them is. Making it regulated to purchase a gun similar to buying and owning an automobile would help tremendously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuketandsee Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 (edited) There are 2 parts to this problem. The first, and in most people's view most significant, is the ridiculously easy access to weapons and the ability of people to own multiple deadly arms far in excess of their needs. This is not what was intended by the framers of the Constitution and several serious legal scholars have made the point that the whole Second Amendment argument is based on a false reading of the actual language. And don't forget, as Jim Jefferies so brilliantly points out, it's an amendment for God's sake so it can be changed. I defy anyone to watch this and not see the idiocy of the gun lobby's position. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63i1yCswEtI The other part of the problem is the underlying violence of American society and its glorification in the media. As H Rap Brown so memorably said "Violence is American as cherry pie." You only need to look at it's most popular sport (the NFL) to see that. Or a typical night's TV. Virtually every cop show ends in a shoot-out, and in the case of CSI it's by lab technicians for C****'s sake! We should remember this is a country founded on slavery and genocide so we shouldn't be too surprised. And it's a country that believes bombing is the solution to most foreign policy issues. And for all you stats fans: 1. The US has 4.4% of the world's population but almost half of the civilian-owned guns. 2. There have been at least 986 mass shootings (4+ victims) in the US since Sandy Hook in 2012. That’s nearly one every day. 3. The US states with more guns have more deaths. 4. The states with tighter regulations have fewer deaths. 5. Most gun deaths are suicides and the states with the most guns have the most suicides. Guns allow people to kill themselves more easily. 6. In states with more guns, more police officers are shot on duty. 7. A large majority of Americans favor stricter gun laws. http://www.vox.com/2015/8/24/9183525/gun-violence-statistics Edited October 9, 2015 by phuketandsee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMartinHandyman Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun" Mao Zedong, 1st Chairman of Communist China. Who has the guns there? I believe this is why many of us Americans stand by the right to own a firearm. "Give me liberty or give me death" Patrick Henry 1775 Shortly before declaring independence from our now good friends Britain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuketandsee Posted October 9, 2015 Share Posted October 9, 2015 "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun" Mao Zedong, 1st Chairman of Communist China. Who has the guns there? I believe this is why many of us Americans stand by the right to own a firearm. "Give me liberty or give me death" Patrick Henry 1775 Shortly before declaring independence from our now good friends Britain. So you believe political power should be determined by firepower rather than the ballot box? You must love the Thai way then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMartinHandyman Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Quite the opposite. The ballot box in America is protected by an armed citizenry. Plenty of Patrick Henry types here to insure the government remains by the people, of the people and for the people and not a rogue military takeover at the barrel of a gun against an unarmed population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuketandsee Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Quite the opposite. The ballot box in America is protected by an armed citizenry. Plenty of Patrick Henry types here to insure the government remains by the people, of the people and for the people and not a rogue military takeover at the barrel of a gun against an unarmed population. Are you for real? The second amendment was designed to preserve a "well regulated militia" not a bunch of gun-toting....ah, forget it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RabC Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 (edited) When it is more difficult to have a driving licence than a gun licence you know which kind of country you're in. More people in the USA are killed by cars than by guns! RTA deaths 2012 = 36,000 Gun deaths 2012 = 30,000 So logically the US authorities have that right. Edited October 10, 2015 by RabC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitrevie Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Quite the opposite. The ballot box in America is protected by an armed citizenry. Plenty of Patrick Henry types here to insure the government remains by the people, of the people and for the people and not a rogue military takeover at the barrel of a gun against an unarmed population. Are you for real? The second amendment was designed to preserve a "well regulated militia" not a bunch of gun-toting....ah, forget it. The 1st and 2nd amendments along with the bible, koran and the ten commandments are probably the most oft quoted documents and least read. Do you recall the idiot republican congressman who thought the ten commandments should be on judicial buildings being interviewed by Colbert and when asked to name them failed miserably. Who the hell bothers to read any of this stuff before they spout it on some forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuketandsee Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Quite the opposite. The ballot box in America is protected by an armed citizenry. Plenty of Patrick Henry types here to insure the government remains by the people, of the people and for the people and not a rogue military takeover at the barrel of a gun against an unarmed population. And how long would your overweight and untrained "Patrick Henry types" hold out against a modern military that would be using tanks, laser guided munitions, F16s and a lot of other weapons that are not generally available, even at unregulated gun shows? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danmarnj Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Obama is such a hypocrite. Last week in his home town, Chicago, U.S.A., there were over one hundred shootings, 49 died from gunshot wounds. Yet, he never mentions this; it is a black-on-black crime issue; and as we have heard, "Black Lives Matter"---Bull****. The international elitists have been trying to get Ameros to relinquish their weapons for decades...they want US citizens to become like the wussy Eurotrash, where Sweden leads in rapes and Merkle and Cameron bend over, like Obama, for their Jihad masters...it's disgusting. And Chicago has some of the toughest gun laws in the country Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuketandsee Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Obama is such a hypocrite. Last week in his home town, Chicago, U.S.A., there were over one hundred shootings, 49 died from gunshot wounds. Yet, he never mentions this; it is a black-on-black crime issue; and as we have heard, "Black Lives Matter"---Bull****. The international elitists have been trying to get Ameros to relinquish their weapons for decades...they want US citizens to become like the wussy Eurotrash, where Sweden leads in rapes and Merkle and Cameron bend over, like Obama, for their Jihad masters...it's disgusting. Pretty good example of the attitudes that result in so much violence in the US Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Geen Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 US citizens should be allowed to shoot each other as much as they want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johpa Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I'm American and carrying guns is my constitutional right And it is also your right to be, to a certain extent, bat guano crazy. And in a land where people well along the continuum of bat gaunoness are allowed to constitutionally own and carry guns it is perhaps time for those with a little bit more sanity to question that unfettered constitutional right bestowed upon the populace during a very different, not to mention distant era, when firearms only superficially resembled modern firearms. You need to stop living in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuketandsee Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I'm American and carrying guns is my constitutional right Actually it's not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1BADDAT Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 "More Americans have died from guns in the US since 1968 than on the battlefields of all the wars in American history, 33,000 dead a year!" "Outside of war zones and struggling nations, nobody comes close to the United States when it comes to gun violence and death by guns." Please do your research before you post such inane drivel, and false information.Civil war deaths: 618,222 WWI deaths - 116,516 WWI deaths - 405,399 Vietnam war - 58,177 Korean War - 36,568 And these are only American deaths. The amount of deaths inflicted on the enemy, with the obvious exception of the Civil war, was astoundingly higher. In Vietnam alone, well over 2 million. he said 33k x 47 years which works out to 1.5 million people. Which is more than the list you cane up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckd Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I'm American and carrying guns is my constitutional right Actually it's not. How about expanding on your comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rice555 Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I am an American. The object is not to take away guns from citizens who legally own them. Making it more difficult to buy them is. Making it regulated to purchase a gun similar to buying and owning an automobile would help tremendously. I paid cash for a new car and drove off with it as it was in the showroom and was after the service dept. was closed, picked up the car the next day. I paid cash for a handgun, many times in CA and had to wait 5 days before I could take delivery , what's your point???? Again, I'm only talking about CA! rice555 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuketandsee Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I'm American and carrying guns is my constitutional right Actually it's not. How about expanding on your comment. Carrying guns is not an unfettered constitutional right. You might want to read up on District of Columbia v Heller and especially the opinion of Justice Scalia (hardly a gun control advocate) where he states "the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pakboong Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 Imagine for a second those people were still on the street Lots of gang bangers and their ilk, No question there is collateral damage, there is always some collateral damage. I don't know any of the collateral damage personally and if I did, I would be upset about it but, the herd has to be thinned and this is one way to do it. We think of wars and their impact on the herd but, in wars you lose a lot of good soldiers, in daily gun violence, you can usually keep away from it if you use a bit of common sense. There are exceptions of course and those exceptions are indeed unfortunate. Even if you are forced to live in a tough neighborhood, you can reduce your expose by staying home in the wee hours of the morning. Again there will be exceptions. I know personally many soldiers who have been killed and wounded in war but I do not know one person who was killed in local gun violence. I am not a gun geek but have no problem with the line in the sand I believe the pro gun folks will draw on this particular issue. It will divide the nation in a way from which we may never recover and I simply believe that is a chance we cannot afford to take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxYakov Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 I'm American and carrying guns is my constitutional right Actually it's not. How about expanding on your comment. Carrying guns is not an unfettered constitutional right. You might want to read up on District of Columbia v Heller and especially the opinion of Justice Scalia (hardly a gun control advocate) where he states "the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose." I'd like to hear Justice Scalia's opinion on a notion of the "right of self-defense". The way I see it, anyone on the grounds of the Umpqua Community College had effectively ceded that right (or an notion of it) by adhering to the college's "gun-free" policy. The college should have added "Enter at your own risk" to the "Gun-free Zone" signs since they obviously failed miserably to provide adequate security for the students and staff yet had removed their effective capability of self-defense or deterrence. "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State and the right of individual self-defense, being necessary for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Where was that "well regulated Militia" when the staff and students were being gunned down? How many have an issue with "the right of individual self-defense"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toenail Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 Total gun homicides in Thailand are higher than US total (not per capita, but total). I don't accept Americans getting numb, which means they don't care and don't want change. Thailand is different: the people don't know, don't care, and have been powerless so long that "mai pen rai" is about as far as they go. Becoming numb assumes once had feelings, which is not the case here. The entry above is correct. (I had to look it up to make sure.) According to NationMaster that uses all kinds of statistics from countries around the world, Thailand has 67% more homicides than the USA. (Where would Thailand be if everyone had access to a gun such as they do in the United States?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCruncher Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 Total gun homicides in Thailand are higher than US total (not per capita, but total). I don't accept Americans getting numb, which means they don't care and don't want change. Thailand is different: the people don't know, don't care, and have been powerless so long that "mai pen rai" is about as far as they go. Becoming numb assumes once had feelings, which is not the case here. The entry above is correct. (I had to look it up to make sure.) According to NationMaster that uses all kinds of statistics from countries around the world, Thailand has 67% more homicides than the USA. (Where would Thailand be if everyone had access to a gun such as they do in the United States?) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate\ List of countries by intentional homicide rate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rice555 Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 I'm American and carrying guns is my constitutional right Actually it's not. How about expanding on your comment. Carrying guns is not an unfettered constitutional right. You might want to read up on District of Columbia v Heller and especially the opinion of Justice Scalia (hardly a gun control advocate) where he states "the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose." DC is not a State, States have the power to make their own gun laws, like in 38 states you can own fully automatic weapons, sawed off shotguns and silencers, but are taxed through the ATF. There is also open carry and concealed carry, what was the the case you quoted about? DC doesn't have full State's rights, it'a District. rice555 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckd Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 I'm American and carrying guns is my constitutional right Actually it's not. How about expanding on your comment. Carrying guns is not an unfettered constitutional right. You might want to read up on District of Columbia v Heller and especially the opinion of Justice Scalia (hardly a gun control advocate) where he states "the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose." I'm a little late to the party and rice555 has already answered. Carrying guns is a constitutional right, but not carrying any sort of gun one wishes. Automatic weapons are not permitted without specific approval involving rounds of bureaucratic red tape.. Hand gun carry is permitted in most states, either open carry or concealed. States' rights and all that. You said zackattack was wrong when he made the claim the Constitution gave him the right to carry guns. It was you who made the mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phuketandsee Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 Chuck, you have confirmed my statement - carrying guns is not an unfettered constitutional right and the SCOTUS decision confirms that restrictions are constitutional. And Rice, you have confirmed my point also. States have the power to control gun ownership. Most sane people around the world (and in the US) believe gun ownership in the US should be a great deal more controlled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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