What's so great about Chiang Mai?

[bangmai]

Taking into consideration increasing house prices, rents, medical fees, labour costs and noise levels, I think the same could be said for the whole of Thailand, only that Chiang Mai is no longer as good value for money as in other regions.

Number one, immigration has become a nightmare the worst in the whole country, the pollution in Chiang Mai is bad, early closing of bars and general lack of things that maybe taken for granted in other regions. I am becoming disillusioned with Chiang Mai and would not recommend settling here.

I used to live ther 2006/7 but now stay Hua Hin ,I go back now and again to visit friends , the place has a bit of charm around the river restuarants at night and has some nice parts.

However I now find it overun with chinese tourists that have recked the Sunday market , for me anyhow they just walk over people in droves.

The streets smell a bit of sewerage and my friend who owned a guest house off moon muang soi 9 said the party is over in Chiang Mai.

I found the bar area and restuarants around LOi krow empty of falangs and looking a bit sad , some are filthy.

As for the burgers in moon muang just up from spicy very good, the angus burger from Burger KINg is nearly 300 BHT $15.00 NZ rediculous.

I find it good for a visit but getting crowded and expensive.

Hua Hin is getting crowded and expensive as well ,New Year last night the traffic and amount of people in town was unbelievable.

But I don't cherish the thought of playing bingo in an RSA or Bowling club looking at old farts bored sheetless if decided to go back home.

An interesting review of Chiang Mai...of the most trashpacker area, all within 500 meters of Thapae Gate. Do you base your opinions of BKK on your tattoo experience at KSR? Sunday Market? been an overrun zoo before the Chinese came...farang families with baby strollers walking five wide down the sois, oblivious to the hundred people behind them, who simply want to get by....all of those items can be bought at more convenient venues. Burger King? Is the one in HH cheaper? Loi Kroh? A lot of its decline is due to skyrocketing property values. BTW, most of those girls are from Isaan, and most locals farang & expat don't patronize those places. MM Soi 9....800 hotels in CNX, which is about 400 too many. Poorly planned businesses fail frequently, elsewhere, too. The circus pants crowd has always had money problems; now they have visa problems...what a coincidence...fortunately, for those of us, who value being clean, the places welcoming "the funny hair" and "he not take shower" are becoming fewer. The upmarket nature of Hua Hin may lead to its own demise, as it seems to now be the base of a number of con artists and swindlers. The table cloth sales people on the beaches are way more annoying than a tuk-tuk pushing a soapy. 40 THB for an ear of corn? and that was 8 years ago. They would probably invite you to the police station for doing that here.

Edited January 1, 2016 by bangmai

[LawrenceN]

I'm a cyclist and I live in Sansai. Quiet rural roads are right outside my door. I can go all over the province without ever riding on a four-lane divided highway. For example, from my house to Sankamphaeng Hot Springs is a 60 km round trip on smooth, quiet roads. I rode 5,000 km last year, and 6,000 each of the two previous years. Why did I ride fewer km in 2015? Read on . . .

More golf. Golf here is cheap and abundant. I just joined (for the first time in my life) a country club. Annual fee was US$200 (7,000 baht), and $24 (800 baht) per 18 holes all year long. Nice fairways and greens, friendly caddies, nice restaurant at the end. My friends belong to various clubs, so we all sign in as each other's guests for reduced rates. My guests pay 1000 baht vs. the walk-in rate of 2800.

My wife of 28 years is a Northerner. We looked all over the country before we decided on CM. Bangkok, beaches, Ayuthaya, and other towns where we had lived or studied or have friends. We're happy we chose Chiang Mai. It's been a real homecoming for her especially, to re-connect with Northerners after 30 years away in the USA.

I first succumbed to CM's charms in 1978. I was living in Maha Sarakham at the time, and CM felt different. For one, no one was yelling at me for no good reason. No "Hey You!" No "Farang!" constantly, as if I'm a walking freak show. Just gentle smiling people who might have been trying to sell me useless crap, but gentle and smiling was good enough for me at the time (and still is). Since then, the Northern people have grown on me. You might guess from my history that I speak Thai pretty well by now. That's key. I go on bike rides and stop for directions and make friends. I stop for coffee or a bowl of noodles at places where I'm known and welcomed like a long-lost friend every time. I sit down and share jokes and pictures of my family with the proprietors of these coffee and noodle shops. Bangkok and other places are OK for friendly conversation, but nobody beats the warmth and genuineness of the Northerners.

OP, I hope that answers your question, in part.

Edited January 1, 2016 by LawrenceN

[arunsakda]

Found "Chiang Mai" people just love it and won't go anywhere else, others don't care for it and prefer Phuket , etc. Horses for courses. One dude I dragged up here left

after one night and went back to Sukhumvit road in BKK. Something there more to his liking..A kind of guy who comes to Thailand and eats a burger at Hard Rock.

I work outside Thailand on a tropical Island with year round heat and humidity. If I ever see another white sand beach I'll put my head through a coconut tree stump.

I like the valleys and mountains of the North, riding bicycles, the Lanna culture, even hot season not so humid and especially our short winters.

Really never seen a place in Thailand as beautiful and enticing.

Edited January 1, 2016 by arunsakda

[cardinalblue]

Chiang Mai is the best place in Thailand for a foreigner to live...

Traffic management is a huge problem in CM and getting worse...won't be resolved in our lifetime...

Air pollution is only a 1-3 month problem every year...easy for some to relocate but not for others...

Why do people live here? It's cheaper than where they are from....very few multi millionaires would choose CM or Thailand to live full time...too many third world issues still present...

[Branches]

I have lived in CM since June (so I haven't experienced the burning!!).

1) The food in CM is superb. Trip Advisor lists 1500 restaurants and virtually any place you go into is fabulous.

2) I rented a place for 19,000 a month and it was amazing. A younger friend found one for 10,000 in the same block, and has found a studio for 4000 now (quite tidy). There are LOADS of great places to stay + hotels are quite abundant and cheap.

3) The people are really friendly.

4) The farangs you meet in bars are chatty and friendly........ not generally sleaze merchants.

5) CM is very safe. I feel very comfortable walking around late. Plus I never see p*ssed up guys fighting.

6) The police seem very nice (although they do close the bars shortly after 12!)

It only seems to be CM in Thailand where bars are closing shortly after midnight????? Not that I want to drink into the wee hours every night..... but it does seem to be a silly rule. There are effectively no nightclubs (they also close at 12!!!!!) and things just shut down. If it continues, CM will just attract Chinese tourists who want to just eat and go home to their hotels.

[Dibbler]

Thai people are very friendly and have made us most welcome here especially in the community we live in

I have found my neighbors in the mooban -- a small one -- to be aloof and snobbish. They have been here forever and think that myself (and maybe the other two aliens in the area) are interlopers. I have never had anyone say, "Hi" to me. And before you jump to conclusions, I am quiet and unassuming and polite. If I dropped in the street of a heart attack, I doubt anyone would give a shit.

The Thai "friendliness" is a hoax. I was recently in the US for a month and the people there ... no, any high school student could give master classes on politeness.

One neighbor up the soi has a small ma and pa shop and they have put in a pipe along the outside of their wall that takes their kitchen and cutting waste and funnels it to the next house down from them. They toss rubbish in the (now) dirt gutter and have a nice colony of rats there. The woman who runs the place and lives there is a true earth pig. I have heard that their neighbors across the soi have complained to the tessaban and they come out and waggle their finger, she tidies up and then pollutes as usual.

My landlord, after owning this property for 29 years, decides that the mango trees are "too big" and severely pollards them. He wanted to cut them down at the base, but I dissuaded him. He cut down completely a large longan tree because he could.

On my soi and the next one there are six houses vacant and either for sale or rent. One is a "condo on the ground" with a small carpark; no soil only the house. She is firm on 8,000 baht a month, which is laughable. Probably why it's been for rent for years.

The "superhighway" is undergoing massive refurbishment and the Maejo road intersection is being converted to an underground throughway and that's supposed to take three years. Haha...

If you want to own your own house, not possible (that means the land too -- who the hell would spend the money to build a house on land they don't own? "My wife/girlfriend loves me! I trust her." Oh boy. ...)

Thais are if nothing else, largely selfish and don't care about you. If I had a nickel for every Thai who gave their word to me (time to meet, work to do, etc.) and then broke it, I'd be rich.

Thais have a litter mentality (not as bad as the Indians or the Egyptians) and my mooban is always gathering rubbish. Just last week someone dumped a bag of trash by the side of the road, by a house, and the solution? Pick it up? No. Set it on fire.

The list goes on.

I stay here because it happens to be where I am now; things are cheap; you can rent companionship for a song and then tell them to get the hell out and do another; there used to be a cool season but that's pretty much gone now; and you can break the rules in SE Asia and pretty much nothing happens.

I am thinking of an exit strategy even now. It's an interesting place and if you don't give a shit about your environment and the year after year of humidity and oppressive heat and a people who have an average IQ of about 85, then it's great. You can get a girlfriend who is massively out of your league and you can even marry them, but you will never know if it's true or you are just a "big customer." I've seen several "solid" years-long relationships dissolve because the woman just got bored, or sick of the guy or found a bigger fish. "I will stay with you because you 'take care' of me and I don't want to continue working in some pissant job making nothing or working in a bar. I love you!"

Most of the foreigners I see have women who can't speak English to save their life. Then the foreigner dumbs down so now he's speaking like a knuckle-dragging neanderthal. Loneliness is one thing, but having a person around you who can't discuss current events or even locate England on a map is mindboggling. But so many men don't recognize this as a downside. Sex soothes many evils. So that's a plus, I guess.

Chiang Mai is fine if you don't care about the downsides. I know some men have "gone native" and move to some shitkicker village and live with the extended family who don't speak English (and most foreigners can't seem to be bothered to learn it, let alone read and write) and have fun counting chickens and setting traps for catching frogs. Hoo ho! My retired life is so good!

Oh yeah, and there's Kad Suan Kaow, where you can have fried rice and a Chang in the food court. All that's missing is the pigeons to feed.

Cutting it fine for post of the year Love it

100% agreed. Post of the year in my book.

Disenchanted with mooban or local friends or baan nohk attitudes, perhaps unable to gain the language skills that enable one to emotionally connect with an intellectual equal, perhaps you should have caught the bus out of CM years ago. Why not leave now? VIP buses departing CM for BKK every hour. Much greater diversity of people especially educated folks in the big smoke. Been in BKK 19 years now and have never felt the level of despair you intimate in this post.

[Loaded]

The pollution problems aren't necessarily permanent. Look at the air in LA...much better than it used to be. Same with most rivers in the US. I think they are doing a lot better in BKK with the garbage than they used to. Some things may have to get worse before they get better, but there is still hope. Same goes with the dog problems....it might just take a rabies outbreak to finally get it taken care of; but, IMO, it will be worth it (assuming I'm not one, who gets it).

Are there actually nice places on this planet that welcome the penniless? I don't know of any. I grew up in Fairfax County, Virginia, which is internationally known for high incomes, and great public schools. I can assure you, it is one of the worst places to be if you aren't making at least 50,000 usd per year, and you would be losing 40% of your take home to housing expenses, and have hellish commutes. The dating scene is near horrific. A friend, who is actually loaded, has resorted to meeting a Korean lady at the local Panda Express and a short time comes with a 200 USD donation. Another friend, makes about 140K per year, and I think the only shag he's had in the last 10 years was with a Romanian hooker at Oktoberfest in Germany.

'friend' would be stretching it a bit far.

[Beng]

I have been listening to people say that Thailand isnt what it use to be for 40 years. For me it just keeps getting better.

One thing. Iced towels. Used to get them in every bar, and small business even in Bkk. Where did that charming gesture Go?

True.

[bangmai]

The pollution problems aren't necessarily permanent. Look at the air in LA...much better than it used to be. Same with most rivers in the US. I think they are doing a lot better in BKK with the garbage than they used to. Some things may have to get worse before they get better, but there is still hope. Same goes with the dog problems....it might just take a rabies outbreak to finally get it taken care of; but, IMO, it will be worth it (assuming I'm not one, who gets it).

Are there actually nice places on this planet that welcome the penniless? I don't know of any. I grew up in Fairfax County, Virginia, which is internationally known for high incomes, and great public schools. I can assure you, it is one of the worst places to be if you aren't making at least 50,000 usd per year, and you would be losing 40% of your take home to housing expenses, and have hellish commutes. The dating scene is near horrific. A friend, who is actually loaded, has resorted to meeting a Korean lady at the local Panda Express and a short time comes with a 200 USD donation. Another friend, makes about 140K per year, and I think the only shag he's had in the last 10 years was with a Romanian hooker at Oktoberfest in Germany.

'friend' would be stretching it a bit far.

"loaded;" not "Loaded." I'm sure Loaded would be required to make an even larger donation.

[mesquite]

The pollution problems aren't necessarily permanent. Look at the air in LA...much better than it used to be. Same with most rivers in the US. I think they are doing a lot better in BKK with the garbage than they used to. Some things may have to get worse before they get better, but there is still hope. Same goes with the dog problems....it might just take a rabies outbreak to finally get it taken care of; but, IMO, it will be worth it (assuming I'm not one, who gets it).

Are there actually nice places on this planet that welcome the penniless? I don't know of any. I grew up in Fairfax County, Virginia, which is internationally known for high incomes, and great public schools. I can assure you, it is one of the worst places to be if you aren't making at least 50,000 usd per year, and you would be losing 40% of your take home to housing expenses, and have hellish commutes. The dating scene is near horrific. A friend, who is actually loaded, has resorted to meeting a Korean lady at the local Panda Express and a short time comes with a 200 USD donation. Another friend, makes about 140K per year, and I think the only shag he's had in the last 10 years was with a Romanian hooker at Oktoberfest in Germany.

I lived in NOVA for a long time and agree. $50k is more like poverty there and that was the case 15 years ago.

Tons of good looking women, but many seem to act like men. Lots of lady lawyers, similar to the one George Clooney married. You meet one for dinner and she brings her briefcase and is wearing a tie. A dime a dozen. Very career oriented. Ever get into an argument with a Georgetown-educated woman lawyer? I have and I'm lucky I still have my nuts. Forgetaboutit..., The women I dated wanted either nothing or the whole shebang. I did get laid, but I was young and it was a lot of work. I finally went into the Asian community so to speak and was able to do what your friend did. It was great, but not near as good as Thailand. Too many self-important people in NOVA. Yeah, Washington DC women...think Hillary Clinton, except good looking and not a lesbian.

Edited January 1, 2016 by mesquite

[TheAppletons]

The pollution problems aren't necessarily permanent. Look at the air in LA...much better than it used to be. Same with most rivers in the US. I think they are doing a lot better in BKK with the garbage than they used to. Some things may have to get worse before they get better, but there is still hope. Same goes with the dog problems....it might just take a rabies outbreak to finally get it taken care of; but, IMO, it will be worth it (assuming I'm not one, who gets it).

Are there actually nice places on this planet that welcome the penniless? I don't know of any. I grew up in Fairfax County, Virginia, which is internationally known for high incomes, and great public schools. I can assure you, it is one of the worst places to be if you aren't making at least 50,000 usd per year, and you would be losing 40% of your take home to housing expenses, and have hellish commutes. The dating scene is near horrific. A friend, who is actually loaded, has resorted to meeting a Korean lady at the local Panda Express and a short time comes with a 200 USD donation. Another friend, makes about 140K per year, and I think the only shag he's had in the last 10 years was with a Romanian hooker at Oktoberfest in Germany.

I lived in NOVA for a long time and agree. $50k is more like poverty there and that was the case 15 years ago.

Tons of good looking women, but many seem to act like men. Lots of lady lawyers, similar to the one George Clooney married. You meet one for dinner and she brings her briefcase and is wearing a tie. A dime a dozen. Very career oriented. Ever get into an argument with a Georgetown-educated woman lawyer? I have and I'm lucky I still have my nuts. Forgetaboutit..., The women I dated wanted either nothing or the whole shebang. I did get laid, but I was young and it was a lot of work. I finally went into the Asian community so to speak and was able to do what your friend did. It was great, but not near as good as Thailand. Too many self-important people in NOVA. Yeah, Washington DC women...think Hillary Clinton, except good looking and not a lesbian.

Do you think it was the same Romanian hooker?

[bangmai]

In Seattle they dress like lumber jacks or steel workers, but yeah, many stay in their work clothes long after work. There is a whole culture of people whose idea of success is to be in mid-level government management at the Department of Bullcrap.....they want the same for their offspring, as well. I've had to remind a number of them that their knowledge would earn them 18,000 per year in Phoenix. Some great doctors out of Georgetown, but yeah, lawyers in DC....dime per dozen. I even knew one that was an usher at the Kennedy Center in the evenings, along with countless working in restaurants/bars.

[mesquite]

Do you think it was the same Romanian hooker?

Yes.

[Trujillo]

Quote

I live in a house, in a field, in a valley with a view ...

I could never live in a place with a view but no trees on the property. For me, that's beautiful slumming. But maybe you've got some Thai blood in you since Thais HATE trees. (I have never seen a people with such disdain for trees, particularly large ones that provide shade, coolness, are home to songbirds and squirrels, and provide natural beauty. "That tree is TOO BIG; let's cut it completely down!" A very sad state of affairs.)

The pond looks nice as does the rice, but in the non-growing seasons, it must look bleak...and hot as the hobs of hell out there.

Quote

One thing. Iced towels. Used to get them in every bar, and small business even in Bkk. Where did that charming gesture Go?

You'd be amazed at how many eye infections I saw in my year living in Ho Chi Minh City. The eye hospital doctors said those cold towels at restaurants were a prime source of infection. Never touch them.

Quote

Trujillo, I noticed you didn't say anything about you learning Thai.

What is it you would like to know? I studied at a local uni and can read (although to be fair, some words baffle me) and understand maybe to a grade school level. My speaking is not very flash and I stopped studying after a personal incident derailed me a few years ago.

Some people I know can speak, read and write well, but from my observations over the last 10 years, not very many, and most who can cobble together a conversation, can't read anything. It seems to be the norm. Just look at all the Latinos living in America for 20 years who still can't speak English.

Quote

I can't understand someone who is so negative about a place, but continue to live there.

The fact is, everyone likes to complain. That doesn't mean that the place you live in is hopeless.

Quote

And yes, I have a Thai girlfriend who looks after me very well.

And one assumes you "look after her" very well in return?

[JaseTheBass]

The best thing about Chiang Mai is that almost anyplace is only about 5 minutes away from being in the country or even wilderness. There aren't many cities that can make that claim.

What do you drive? A helicopter?

[northernjohn]

It just barely passes for an ok place to live. Nothing exceptional there. Surrounding areas are nice to visit. I have since moved out, and the only thing I miss is Rimpings. Overall, I would say that Chiang Mai, like Thailand, is short of Amazing. I figure on moving back to the homeland within two years.

Interesting. Care to tell us where you moved to. Why wait two years if it is not doing it here for you? I mean you intend to do it and have the reason why stay?

That is the kind of information that it would be nice to see posted.

[northernjohn]

Thai people are very friendly and have made us most welcome here especially in the community we live in

I have found my neighbors in the mooban -- a small one -- to be aloof and snobbish. They have been here forever and think that myself (and maybe the other two aliens in the area) are interlopers. I have never had anyone say, "Hi" to me. And before you jump to conclusions, I am quiet and unassuming and polite. If I dropped in the street of a heart attack, I doubt anyone would give a shit.

The Thai "friendliness" is a hoax. I was recently in the US for a month and the people there ... no, any high school student could give master classes on politeness.

One neighbor up the soi has a small ma and pa shop and they have put in a pipe along the outside of their wall that takes their kitchen and cutting waste and funnels it to the next house down from them. They toss rubbish in the (now) dirt gutter and have a nice colony of rats there. The woman who runs the place and lives there is a true earth pig. I have heard that their neighbors across the soi have complained to the tessaban and they come out and waggle their finger, she tidies up and then pollutes as usual.

My landlord, after owning this property for 29 years, decides that the mango trees are "too big" and severely pollards them. He wanted to cut them down at the base, but I dissuaded him. He cut down completely a large longan tree because he could.

On my soi and the next one there are six houses vacant and either for sale or rent. One is a "condo on the ground" with a small carpark; no soil only the house. She is firm on 8,000 baht a month, which is laughable. Probably why it's been for rent for years.

The "superhighway" is undergoing massive refurbishment and the Maejo road intersection is being converted to an underground throughway and that's supposed to take three years. Haha...

If you want to own your own house, not possible (that means the land too -- who the hell would spend the money to build a house on land they don't own? "My wife/girlfriend loves me! I trust her." Oh boy. ...)

Thais are if nothing else, largely selfish and don't care about you. If I had a nickel for every Thai who gave their word to me (time to meet, work to do, etc.) and then broke it, I'd be rich.

Thais have a litter mentality (not as bad as the Indians or the Egyptians) and my mooban is always gathering rubbish. Just last week someone dumped a bag of trash by the side of the road, by a house, and the solution? Pick it up? No. Set it on fire.

The list goes on.

I stay here because it happens to be where I am now; things are cheap; you can rent companionship for a song and then tell them to get the hell out and do another; there used to be a cool season but that's pretty much gone now; and you can break the rules in SE Asia and pretty much nothing happens.

I am thinking of an exit strategy even now. It's an interesting place and if you don't give a shit about your environment and the year after year of humidity and oppressive heat and a people who have an average IQ of about 85, then it's great. You can get a girlfriend who is massively out of your league and you can even marry them, but you will never know if it's true or you are just a "big customer." I've seen several "solid" years-long relationships dissolve because the woman just got bored, or sick of the guy or found a bigger fish. "I will stay with you because you 'take care' of me and I don't want to continue working in some pissant job making nothing or working in a bar. I love you!"

Most of the foreigners I see have women who can't speak English to save their life. Then the foreigner dumbs down so now he's speaking like a knuckle-dragging neanderthal. Loneliness is one thing, but having a person around you who can't discuss current events or even locate England on a map is mindboggling. But so many men don't recognize this as a downside. Sex soothes many evils. So that's a plus, I guess.

Chiang Mai is fine if you don't care about the downsides. I know some men have "gone native" and move to some shitkicker village and live with the extended family who don't speak English (and most foreigners can't seem to be bothered to learn it, let alone read and write) and have fun counting chickens and setting traps for catching frogs. Hoo ho! My retired life is so good!

Oh yeah, and there's Kad Suan Kaow, where you can have fried rice and a Chang in the food court. All that's missing is the pigeons to feed.

So you made a bad choice of where to rent. any thing else?

[northernjohn]

Sad to be me?

I did not say I was unhappy. Just pointing out the obvious, to me anyway. I am sure there are plenty of other places in SE Asia that are better than CM. It's been an interesting run. But often things are what you make of them; however that silk purse is not easy to make of a sow's ear.

Post of the year? Haha...And just 2 hours under the gun

edit//

Look around you dude and compare with what you have in CM with what it's like back home, then stop spouting off about Thailand!

Are you talking to me? Am I the "Dude" now? Cool!

You assume that I am some newbie and I have a "back home." I have not lived in my home country for just over 30 years now. Closing in on 10 of those in Thailand. But really; are you postulating that CM is better than any "back home" in the world? Uh, ok. Sorry your "back home" is so awful.

this is going no where. You have completely baffled me. You claim to have 30 years away from your home country with close to 10 of them here in Thailand.

How with all that experience did you wind up in living conditions like those you have expounded on?

[Robert24]

Thai people are very friendly and have made us most welcome here especially in the community we live in

I have found my neighbors in the mooban -- a small one -- to be aloof and snobbish. They have been here forever and think that myself (and maybe the other two aliens in the area) are interlopers. I have never had anyone say, "Hi" to me. And before you jump to conclusions, I am quiet and unassuming and polite. If I dropped in the street of a heart attack, I doubt anyone would give a shit.

The Thai "friendliness" is a hoax. I was recently in the US for a month and the people there ... no, any high school student could give master classes on politeness.

One neighbor up the soi has a small ma and pa shop and they have put in a pipe along the outside of their wall that takes their kitchen and cutting waste and funnels it to the next house down from them. They toss rubbish in the (now) dirt gutter and have a nice colony of rats there. The woman who runs the place and lives there is a true earth pig. I have heard that their neighbors across the soi have complained to the tessaban and they come out and waggle their finger, she tidies up and then pollutes as usual.

My landlord, after owning this property for 29 years, decides that the mango trees are "too big" and severely pollards them. He wanted to cut them down at the base, but I dissuaded him. He cut down completely a large longan tree because he could.

On my soi and the next one there are six houses vacant and either for sale or rent. One is a "condo on the ground" with a small carpark; no soil only the house. She is firm on 8,000 baht a month, which is laughable. Probably why it's been for rent for years.

The "superhighway" is undergoing massive refurbishment and the Maejo road intersection is being converted to an underground throughway and that's supposed to take three years. Haha...

If you want to own your own house, not possible (that means the land too -- who the hell would spend the money to build a house on land they don't own? "My wife/girlfriend loves me! I trust her." Oh boy. ...)

Thais are if nothing else, largely selfish and don't care about you. If I had a nickel for every Thai who gave their word to me (time to meet, work to do, etc.) and then broke it, I'd be rich.

Thais have a litter mentality (not as bad as the Indians or the Egyptians) and my mooban is always gathering rubbish. Just last week someone dumped a bag of trash by the side of the road, by a house, and the solution? Pick it up? No. Set it on fire.

The list goes on.

I stay here because it happens to be where I am now; things are cheap; you can rent companionship for a song and then tell them to get the hell out and do another; there used to be a cool season but that's pretty much gone now; and you can break the rules in SE Asia and pretty much nothing happens.

I am thinking of an exit strategy even now. It's an interesting place and if you don't give a shit about your environment and the year after year of humidity and oppressive heat and a people who have an average IQ of about 85, then it's great. You can get a girlfriend who is massively out of your league and you can even marry them, but you will never know if it's true or you are just a "big customer." I've seen several "solid" years-long relationships dissolve because the woman just got bored, or sick of the guy or found a bigger fish. "I will stay with you because you 'take care' of me and I don't want to continue working in some pissant job making nothing or working in a bar. I love you!"

Most of the foreigners I see have women who can't speak English to save their life. Then the foreigner dumbs down so now he's speaking like a knuckle-dragging neanderthal. Loneliness is one thing, but having a person around you who can't discuss current events or even locate England on a map is mindboggling. But so many men don't recognize this as a downside. Sex soothes many evils. So that's a plus, I guess.

Chiang Mai is fine if you don't care about the downsides. I know some men have "gone native" and move to some shitkicker village and live with the extended family who don't speak English (and most foreigners can't seem to be bothered to learn it, let alone read and write) and have fun counting chickens and setting traps for catching frogs. Hoo ho! My retired life is so good!

Oh yeah, and there's Kad Suan Kaow, where you can have fried rice and a Chang in the food court. All that's missing is the pigeons to feed.

So you made a bad choice of where to rent. any thing else?

sounds like you are having a bad day. Hope tomorrow is better, if not you better move on to where you think life is better. By the way, traveling helps a lot. The more you travel and see places, the more you know whether to appreciate to call TH/CM your home or not. Just a thought. All the best though.

[bazza40]

Quote

And yes, I have a Thai girlfriend who looks after me very well.

And one assumes you "look after her" very well in return?

Yes I do - and your point is?

[WinnieTheKhwai]

The best thing about Chiang Mai is that almost anyplace is only about 5 minutes away from being in the country or even wilderness. There aren't many cities that can make that claim.

What do you drive? A helicopter?

Not so much what he drives but where he lives: Likely in Not-Nimman.

[FolkGuitar]

When I worked in Japan, it would take me almost 90 minutes of motorcycle lane-splitting riding to get out of town and into the countryside. I couldn't move as my university supplied my apartment. Living here in Chiang Mai, I can be on country roads/mountain roads in less then 15 minutes when I feel the need. I have the choice of buying my foods at any of 5-6 different modern supermarkets or a dozen different old-style 'fresh' markets. When I feel the desire for some restaurant food, I have a choice of 8-10 different Ethnic restaurants, depending upon my mood, so not limited to just Thai food, though that is one of my favorites. Shopping in local street markets such as Warrarote-Kad Luang or ultra modern shopping malls. Private medical clinics or large hospitals. Western medicine, Chinese medicine, or Ayurvedic medicine. Going to quiet parks or sitting in the middle of noisy crowds. Waterfalls or museums. Participating in sports or just watching them....

... The point is, here in Chiang Mai we have choices. Almost unlimited choices. And all at relatively low cost. Please tell me where else on earth we can find similar.

[villagefarang]

Quote

I live in a house, in a field, in a valley with a view ...

I could never live in a place with a view but no trees on the property. For me, that's beautiful slumming. But maybe you've got some Thai blood in you since Thais HATE trees. (I have never seen a people with such disdain for trees, particularly large ones that provide shade, coolness, are home to songbirds and squirrels, and provide natural beauty. "That tree is TOO BIG; let's cut it completely down!" A very sad state of affairs.)

The pond looks nice as does the rice, but in the non-growing seasons, it must look bleak...and hot as the hobs of hell out there.

We do have trees and lots of different birds but I made it clear from the beginning, that particular slice of view was to remain unimpeded. You can no longer see the house when coming down the driveway because of the trees. Unfortunately we lost our biggest tree to a windstorm but those things happen. Fortunately it fell at just the right angle and missed the house.

[mesquite]

The women, the women, the women, the women, the food, the moat, Thapae Gate, the festivals, THE FOOD, the temples, the people, Northern Thailand, the climate,the 700 year old architecture, Doi Suthep temple and the women.

The women? Obviously you have never been to Vietnam.

But now I must correct myself. I assumed themerg was an old retiree. I looked at his profile and he is a young English teacher so he probably is getting all the hot young women in CM! Still, Vietnam would be better.

Edited January 2, 2016 by mesquite

[LannaGuy]

The best thing about Chiang Mai is the burgers.

is the water still free?

Big C and Dukes it is.

At Big C Superhighway, one has the choice of gourmet KFC Zinger burgers or McDonald's Fillet of Fish cuisine. Walk past Dairy Queen on the way out and pick up a 10 baht ice-cream cone . All come with free water. Personally, my fav is the beer garden - 1 litre of Chang for a smidgen over 100 baht plus lots of free up-skirt and down-tops perving. No free water, but the ice cubes dropped into your beer by a smiling beer girl is gratis.

Which Beer Garden? Serious question. Thanks.

I think he's talking about the beer area in Big C nothing like soi 7 BKK believe me! give it a miss

[LannaGuy]

Thai people are very friendly and have made us most welcome here especially in the community we live in

I have found my neighbors in the mooban -- a small one -- to be aloof and snobbish. They have been here forever and think that myself (and maybe the other two aliens in the area) are interlopers. I have never had anyone say, "Hi" to me. And before you jump to conclusions, I am quiet and unassuming and polite. If I dropped in the street of a heart attack, I doubt anyone would give a shit.

The Thai "friendliness" is a hoax. I was recently in the US for a month and the people there ... no, any high school student could give master classes on politeness.

One neighbor up the soi has a small ma and pa shop and they have put in a pipe along the outside of their wall that takes their kitchen and cutting waste and funnels it to the next house down from them. They toss rubbish in the (now) dirt gutter and have a nice colony of rats there. The woman who runs the place and lives there is a true earth pig. I have heard that their neighbors across the soi have complained to the tessaban and they come out and waggle their finger, she tidies up and then pollutes as usual.

My landlord, after owning this property for 29 years, decides that the mango trees are "too big" and severely pollards them. He wanted to cut them down at the base, but I dissuaded him. He cut down completely a large longan tree because he could.

On my soi and the next one there are six houses vacant and either for sale or rent. One is a "condo on the ground" with a small carpark; no soil only the house. She is firm on 8,000 baht a month, which is laughable. Probably why it's been for rent for years.

The "superhighway" is undergoing massive refurbishment and the Maejo road intersection is being converted to an underground throughway and that's supposed to take three years. Haha...

If you want to own your own house, not possible (that means the land too -- who the hell would spend the money to build a house on land they don't own? "My wife/girlfriend loves me! I trust her." Oh boy. ...)

Thais are if nothing else, largely selfish and don't care about you. If I had a nickel for every Thai who gave their word to me (time to meet, work to do, etc.) and then broke it, I'd be rich.

Thais have a litter mentality (not as bad as the Indians or the Egyptians) and my mooban is always gathering rubbish. Just last week someone dumped a bag of trash by the side of the road, by a house, and the solution? Pick it up? No. Set it on fire.

The list goes on.

I stay here because it happens to be where I am now; things are cheap; you can rent companionship for a song and then tell them to get the hell out and do another; there used to be a cool season but that's pretty much gone now; and you can break the rules in SE Asia and pretty much nothing happens.

I am thinking of an exit strategy even now. It's an interesting place and if you don't give a shit about your environment and the year after year of humidity and oppressive heat and a people who have an average IQ of about 85, then it's great. You can get a girlfriend who is massively out of your league and you can even marry them, but you will never know if it's true or you are just a "big customer." I've seen several "solid" years-long relationships dissolve because the woman just got bored, or sick of the guy or found a bigger fish. "I will stay with you because you 'take care' of me and I don't want to continue working in some pissant job making nothing or working in a bar. I love you!"

Most of the foreigners I see have women who can't speak English to save their life. Then the foreigner dumbs down so now he's speaking like a knuckle-dragging neanderthal. Loneliness is one thing, but having a person around you who can't discuss current events or even locate England on a map is mindboggling. But so many men don't recognize this as a downside. Sex soothes many evils. So that's a plus, I guess.

Chiang Mai is fine if you don't care about the downsides. I know some men have "gone native" and move to some shitkicker village and live with the extended family who don't speak English (and most foreigners can't seem to be bothered to learn it, let alone read and write) and have fun counting chickens and setting traps for catching frogs. Hoo ho! My retired life is so good!

Oh yeah, and there's Kad Suan Kaow, where you can have fried rice and a Chang in the food court. All that's missing is the pigeons to feed.

Made me laugh, you picked a bad area, but much of what you say is true about Thais. You just have to accept thais are pretty selfish, generally, but it doesn't make chiang mai a bad place to live and it's the best part of Thailand IMHO.

Let's be honest many of us are here for the weather, women, food and more women. If you get tired of that live here and hop over to Vietnam, Philippines and Bali for even MORE women but poorer infrastructure (which is why most of us choose here to live). As an aside I find Philippine people are more polite and less selfish than Thais but that's another story and won't stop me basing myself here.

[villagefarang]

Quote

I live in a house, in a field, in a valley with a view ...

I could never live in a place with a view but no trees on the property. For me, that's beautiful slumming. But maybe you've got some Thai blood in you since Thais HATE trees. (I have never seen a people with such disdain for trees, particularly large ones that provide shade, coolness, are home to songbirds and squirrels, and provide natural beauty. "That tree is TOO BIG; let's cut it completely down!" A very sad state of affairs.)

The pond looks nice as does the rice, but in the non-growing seasons, it must look bleak...and hot as the hobs of hell out there.

We do have trees and lots of different birds but I made it clear from the beginning, that particular slice of view was to remain unimpeded. You can no longer see the house when coming down the driveway because of the trees. Unfortunately we lost our biggest tree to a windstorm but those things happen. Fortunately it fell at just the right angle and missed the house.

The trees on the south and east side of the house get a little bigger every year but as I said we lost our shade tree between the sala and the house which helped block the setting sun during the summer months. Fortunately we still have that one shower tree but it isn't as big yet.

Edited January 2, 2016 by villagefarang

[LannaGuy]

Quote

I live in a house, in a field, in a valley with a view ...

I could never live in a place with a view but no trees on the property. For me, that's beautiful slumming. But maybe you've got some Thai blood in you since Thais HATE trees. (I have never seen a people with such disdain for trees, particularly large ones that provide shade, coolness, are home to songbirds and squirrels, and provide natural beauty. "That tree is TOO BIG; let's cut it completely down!" A very sad state of affairs.)

The pond looks nice as does the rice, but in the non-growing seasons, it must look bleak...and hot as the hobs of hell out there.

We do have trees and lots of different birds but I made it clear from the beginning, that particular slice of view was to remain unimpeded. You can no longer see the house when coming down the driveway because of the trees. Unfortunately we lost our biggest tree to a windstorm but those things happen. Fortunately it fell at just the right angle and missed the house.

The trees on the south and east side of the house get a little bigger every year but as I said we lost our shade tree between the sala and the house which helped block the setting sun during the summer months. Fortunately we still have that one shower tree but it isn't as big yet.

gorgeous property sorry about the trees

[alfieconn]

general lack of things that maybe taken for granted in other regions.

Would be interested in what they are ?

Can`t answer that for you because it depends on what each person likes doing and availability of what some people enjoy. My main concerns are the present immigration situation and worsening pollution each year. Over the last 3 years my girlfriend and me have suffered from permanent coughs, wake up every morning choking my lungs up. A lot of what I used to enjoy has gone into decline in Chiang Mai. Different strokes for different folks.


Well in your opinion what are they ?

I`m not going to be cornered into this one. This is Thai Visa and whatever I say you are going to knock me down for it and say it`s me that is the problem.

I will say that for me Chiang Mai is now lacking in certain things that I used to enjoy in the past, a lot has changed. You can interpret that anyways you like.


You have already said that or are you know going to tell us what they are ?

Edited January 2, 2016 by alfieconn

[FolkGuitar]

When I worked in Japan, it would take me almost 90 minutes of motorcycle lane-splitting riding to get out of town and into the countryside. I couldn't move as my university supplied my apartment. Living here in Chiang Mai, I can be on country roads/mountain roads in less then 15 minutes when I feel the need. I have the choice of buying my foods at any of 5-6 different modern supermarkets or a dozen different old-style 'fresh' markets. When I feel the desire for some restaurant food, I have a choice of 8-10 different Ethnic restaurants, depending upon my mood, so not limited to just Thai food, though that is one of my favorites. Shopping in local street markets such as Warrarote-Kad Luang or ultra modern shopping malls. Private medical clinics or large hospitals. Western medicine, Chinese medicine, or Ayurvedic medicine. Going to quiet parks or sitting in the middle of noisy crowds. Waterfalls or museums. Participating in sports or just watching them....

... The point is, here in Chiang Mai we have choices. Almost unlimited choices. And all at relatively low cost. Please tell me where else on earth we can find similar.

Sorry... That should have been written as "8-10 different ethnicities with dozens of restaurants of each to choose from."