Filing of tax return

[Cpkt8]

Hi folks,

I have received tax form for 2015. However I do not have income to report. Do I ignore it or still have to send in the filing form?

Thank you.

[Rotweiler]

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

[Cpkt8]

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

Thank you! I worry I may get fined for not submitting.

[jjczap]

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

Thank you! I worry I may get fined for not submitting.

I hope you understand that the IRS classifies income as earned and unearned. I assume you live in Thai so how do you live without any income ? I can see you not having a w2 or self employed income etc. ( earned ) but no unearned like SS, Pension , interest on savings ( in Thai or the states ) , dividends etc. You have the booklet , I would suggest reading the easy to follow instructions on who has to file and what is considered income. I assume you are retired , so for example if your only income is SS you don't have to file. Again assuming you are retired here on a retirement visa using the 800k in the Thai bank method you may not have to file with the IRS but you must file the FBAR with the Treasury Dept. Why you may ask - it is the US law that requires all US citizens no matter where they live to report to the Treasury once a year if they have more than 10,000$ in total any where outside of the US -- severe penalties for not filling

[neilrob]

What sort of tax form is the OP asking about? I assumed it was a Thai tax form when I read the post, since this is Thailand. I received this form from the Thai tax office. Since I have income to report, I have submitted it. jjczap apparently assumes you are talking about a US tax form, but maybe it is a UK form or from wherever.... Better to specify the country if you want informed answers.

[Sheryl]

I believe Cpkt8 is referring to a Thai tax form.

[Rotweiler]

It appears you have USA on the brain. We are both speaking of the Thailand Income Tax forms which are delivered via post to all registered tax payers.

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

Thank you! I worry I may get fined for not submitting.

I hope you understand that the IRS classifies income as earned and unearned. I assume you live in Thai so how do you live without any income ? I can see you not having a w2 or self employed income etc. ( earned ) but no unearned like SS, Pension , interest on savings ( in Thai or the states ) , dividends etc. You have the booklet , I would suggest reading the easy to follow instructions on who has to file and what is considered income. I assume you are retired , so for example if your only income is SS you don't have to file. Again assuming you are retired here on a retirement visa using the 800k in the Thai bank method you may not have to file with the IRS but you must file the FBAR with the Treasury Dept. Why you may ask - it is the US law that requires all US citizens no matter where they live to report to the Treasury once a year if they have more than 10,000$ in total any where outside of the US -- severe penalties for not filling

[Cpkt8]

Sorry for not being clear enough. I'm referring to Thai tax form.

[SantiSuk]

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

To be precise that would be "no need to file the return if you have no income that is taxable in Thailand to report".

You might have income in a foreign country for 2015, but have not brought it into Thailand during 2015 (ie you lived from savings of income from prior years). That would not be taxable in Thailand.

[Rotweiler]

I should add something I forgot in my first response. If you have Thai income and have paid tax on it (such as income tax deducted by your bank on interest earned, you may file an income tax reture and get a refund of tax paid if that is your only source of Thai income.

[Gonsalviz]

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

To be precise that would be "no need to file the return if you have no income that is taxable in Thailand to report".

You might have income in a foreign country for 2015, but have not brought it into Thailand during 2015 (ie you lived from savings of income from prior years). That would not be taxable in Thailand.

If the income is from the US and already taxed there is no need to claim is it as there is a tax agreement between Thailand and the US.

[Rotweiler]

May be usefuil for you to review post 9 by Santisuk

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

To be precise that would be "no need to file the return if you have no income that is taxable in Thailand to report".

You might have income in a foreign country for 2015, but have not brought it into Thailand during 2015 (ie you lived from savings of income from prior years). That would not be taxable in Thailand.

If the income is from the US and already taxed there is no need to claim is it as there is a tax agreement between Thailand and the US.

[Oscar2]

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

Thank you! I worry I may get fined for not submitting.

I hope you understand that the IRS classifies income as earned and unearned. I assume you live in Thai so how do you live without any income ? I can see you not having a w2 or self employed income etc. ( earned ) but no unearned like SS, Pension , interest on savings ( in Thai or the states ) , dividends etc. You have the booklet , I would suggest reading the easy to follow instructions on who has to file and what is considered income. I assume you are retired , so for example if your only income is SS you don't have to file. Again assuming you are retired here on a retirement visa using the 800k in the Thai bank method you may not have to file with the IRS but you must file the FBAR with the Treasury Dept. Why you may ask - it is the US law that requires all US citizens no matter where they live to report to the Treasury once a year if they have more than 10,000$ in total any where outside of the US -- severe penalties for not filling

what are you on about???? IRS in Thailand?

[SantiSuk]

May be usefuil for you to review post 9 by Santisuk

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

To be precise that would be "no need to file the return if you have no income that is taxable in Thailand to report".

You might have income in a foreign country for 2015, but have not brought it into Thailand during 2015 (ie you lived from savings of income from prior years). That would not be taxable in Thailand.

If the income is from the US and already taxed there is no need to claim is it as there is a tax agreement between Thailand and the US.

I think he did read post #9 from me, as he was quoting it. I think what you might mean is "re-read it", because I agree his post doesn't quite make sense but I think it's just a confusion of terms.

"Claim", normally implies attempting to get a refund, whereas otherwise Gonsalviz is talking about whether his US income needs to be "declared" in a tax filing in Thailand when it has already suffered tax under US tax rules.

If that is the question then the answer is "I don't know"!

I have income arising in the UK (pension, interest and dividends) which is taxed in the UK even though I am no longer tax resident in the UK. Nothing unusual about that. Thai Revenue certainly asked me about that income when they "invited me" to their offices (Regional Investigation office no less) before paying out a 45,000 baht tax on interest refund here last year. They asked me how much income and what type in the UK. I told them and said that I had not used any of that 2014 income to bring into Thailand during 2014. They accepted my word having quizzed me about my assets and my former employment and positionSounds unusual for invetigation to end on just an oral representation? Yes - but I think it helped that the inspector knew about the professional firm I told him I worked in as my former firm (which advises heavily on inter-alia taxation) is present in Thailand and well-known to tax inspectors.

So I did not need to declare my UK income in any event. It was for that reason my position was accepted. Whether they would have formed the same view if I had told them "don't worry it was all taxed in the UK" I have no idea. I suspect they would have wanted me to tell them the gross amounts and the tax paid and maybe they would have been happy not to investigate further any income that was already taxed in the UK. I am not aware that Double Tax treaties (of which there is one between the UK and Thailand also) result in Thailand adopting the easy approach of "we don't need to know about that type of income" but it doesn't sound right somehow! I'm guessing that one is supposed to declare gross income and the tax already paid elsewhere and by declare I mean file a tax return. For the avoidance of doubt though, if it arose in the Us but was not shipped out here in the same tax year then it is clearly not assessable to Thai taxation and the Thai Revenue do not require anyone to include in a tax return income that is not assessable to tax here.

.... On the other hand it is not wholly inconceivable that even for income that has been imported in the same tax year, Thailand accepts that income arising and taxed abroad in a tax treaty country (even maybe in the hands of its own citizens) is never going to be assessed to tax in Thailand and so can be excluded from tax returns - and used as a basis for not filing a return if there is no other reason to do so.

Gonsalviz should not assume he can avoid filing, without more informed advice or without consulting his local Thai tax office (or without taking a risk!).

Edited March 19, 2016 by SantiSuk

[jjczap]

No need to file the return if you have no income to report, They will however send you another one next year (according to my experience).

To be precise that would be "no need to file the return if you have no income that is taxable in Thailand to report".

You might have income in a foreign country for 2015, but have not brought it into Thailand during 2015 (ie you lived from savings of income from prior years). That would not be taxable in Thailand.

If the income is from the US and already taxed there is no need to claim is it as there is a tax agreement between Thailand and the US.

thanks for the laugh - I did have my US brain on since I was doing my US tax - sorry I was confused - tks for stating it is Thai tax -- but for the US souls that don't report their accounts here or the Thais that have accounts in the US and not reporting -- Well --- Thailand, US sign agreement to share tax information - http://bangkok.coconuts.co/2016/03/04/thailand-us-sign-agreement-share-tax-information

[Cpkt8]

I've got my answer. Thank you so much guys!

Good day to you all![emoji2]