Greedy ATMs - And a New Card

[D3030]

Well, I normally use Krungsri Banks ATMs for the option of withdrawing 30000 baht per withdrawal..

Secondary option.. Send $$ via New York to my Bangkok Bank Account..

But since I like to get my cash fast and the most per withdrawal.. I use my debt card at a Krungsri ATM..

Well.... A couple of problems occurred back to back after years of no problems..

On my exit from Thailand, I used my debt card at a Krungsri ATM.. No baht disbursed, but the $$ was deducted from my account..

Took 2 days to get a temporary deposite from my bank, but took 8 weeks before I was informed the problem was resolved, and wouldn't get screwed over to pay it back..

So, on my return to Thailand, with my new debt card, and it's new and improved smart chip... Krungsri and Bangkok Banks, ATMs didn't work..

Other banks ATM did, but only disbursed 20000 bahts per withdrawal...

I also notice a new option, I never seen before....

The option was to accept an exchange rate less than the current rate.. It was at a Krungsri ATM... It was a 34 vice 35 baht per U.S. dollar rate.. I accepted, but got an error message to call my bank..

Called my bank, was informed it was the cards new chip or the card is worn out..

So, I just stopped at any ATM I saw.. And attempted a withdrawal.. That same message of accepting a less than the current rate came up again...

This time it said, 31 baht per U.S. Dollar exchange rate, do I accept! I pressed "NO!"... 20000 baht was dispersed..

I checked my online account, the exchange rate was very close to the current rate, not the shitty rate given if I accepted that option..

Just sharing my new pet peeve, and wonder if others have had recent ATM problems?

[pgrahmm]

Go to a Bangkok Bank that has a currency exchange desk...Take your ATM card & passport.....

Ask for a cash advance - they should give you a slip to sign & you can take out up to 60,000 per day....

[stevenl]

Well, I normally use Krungsri Banks ATMs for the option of withdrawing 30000 baht per withdrawal..

Secondary option.. Send $$ via New York to my Bangkok Bank Account..

But since I like to get my cash fast and the most per withdrawal.. I use my debt card at a Krungsri ATM..

Well.... A couple of problems occurred back to back after years of no problems..

On my exit from Thailand, I used my debt card at a Krungsri ATM.. No baht disbursed, but the $$ was deducted from my account..

Took 2 days to get a temporary deposite from my bank, but took 8 weeks before I was informed the problem was resolved, and wouldn't get screwed over to pay it back..

So, on my return to Thailand, with my new debt card, and it's new and improved smart chip... Krungsri and Bangkok Banks, ATMs didn't work..

Other banks ATM did, but only disbursed 20000 bahts per withdrawal...

I also notice a new option, I never seen before....

The option was to accept an exchange rate less than the current rate.. It was at a Krungsri ATM... It was a 34 vice 35 baht per U.S. dollar rate.. I accepted, but got an error message to call my bank..

Called my bank, was informed it was the cards new chip or the card is worn out..

So, I just stopped at any ATM I saw.. And attempted a withdrawal.. That same message of accepting a less than the current rate came up again...

This time it said, 31 baht per U.S. Dollar exchange rate, do I accept! I pressed "NO!"... 20000 baht was dispersed..

I checked my online account, the exchange rate was very close to the current rate, not the shitty rate given if I accepted that option..

Just sharing my new pet peeve, and wonder if others have had recent ATM problems?

That is called dynamic currency conversion, often offered on withdrawals and Cc payments. Always really expensive, I never accept that option. Edited April 3, 2016 by stevenl

[fey]

point of the post is he can withdraw a lot of baht

[D3030]

Go to a Bangkok Bank that has a currency exchange desk...Take your ATM card & passport.....

Ask for a cash advance - they should give you a slip to sign & you can take out up to 60,000 per day....

Sounds good! Thanks for the info...

[Pib]

The daily/per transaction limit for a cash advance (a.k.a., counter withdrawal) will depend on the limit set my your "card-issuing bank"; not the local Thai bank although the local Thai bank may have some high, high limit. Limits vary from card to to card. For example the U.S. Schwab Bank debit card often mentioned on ThaiVisa has a daily/transaction cash limit of either $500 (approx Bt17.5K) or $1000 (approx Bt35K) depending on whether you have their standard card or Platinum debit card...I have and use such a Platinum card. I have another card from another bank I use which has a $2,000 daily limit (approx Bt70K limit). Have used both cards in Bangkok and Krungsri banks for counter withdrawals. Sometimes I use both cards at the same time to get over Bt100K.

Yes, limits set by the card-issuing bank can vary greatly from maybe around $300/day to thousands of U.S. dollars (or equivalent)....depends on the card-issuing bank.

Also, some Thai bank branches will not accept a debit card for a counter withdrawal (more commonly known to Thais as cash advances as you mentioned)....instead they just point you to their ATM, but they will gladly accept a credit card almost always for a cash advance. But keep in mind almost all credit cards whack you hard for cash advances like an upfront 3% fee plus probably another 3% foreign transaction fee....fortunately I have such a credit card that charges neither....one of the few out there.

And if the card is rejected during a counter-withdrawal even if you know you are below the card's daily limit, it may be because the card-issuing bank has blocked cash withdrawals for certain countries/areas such as Thailand...don't blame the Thai bank for that. Happened to me once when I first used that card which has the $2,000/Bt70K limit...the bank clerk showed me the error which said "Over Limit" on the POS machine...I then said please try again for Bt65K (a shot in the dark as I was guessing I had exceeded the card's daily limit)...the transaction was approved. Later that night I called my bank to find out about the $2,000 daily limit and I now always stay below that limit when doing cash advances.

And always beware of a cash transaction where Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) rate is offered although it probably will not be called that...instead the bank/ATM will have a warn & fuzzy name for it like Bank Rate, Home Rate, etc. This rate will be around 4% lower than the card-network rate. Do not accept a DCC transaction....decline that selection to continue on to get the full card-network (Visa/Mastercard rate) rate minus in foreign transaction fee your card-issuing bank may apply. Don't blame the Thai bank for any foreign transaction fee that effectively lowers your exchange rate; blame that on your home country card-issuing bank who is profiting off your transaction.

[4evermaat]

My newer BoA atm card with chip and strip no longer seems to work @ the AEON atms in chumphon. There is a newer one in tesco i'll check.

Sometimes you can call and request a temporary limit increase on either debit or cash advance limits. For permanent limit increases, you may have to fax or request written permission. But i wouldnt expect boa to budge too much. You could consider 2 or more accounts and shift funds around and max out for each acct.

Edit: TMB also has 30k withdraw limit. Try it.

Also try a couple of different machines. Maybe 1 machine works and another one doesnt. This is especially true for ADM/CDM deposits. But it is a risk as the worst case scenario is machine "eating" your card. That is rare though.

Edited April 5, 2016 by 4evermaat

[D3030]

The daily/per transaction limit for a cash advance (a.k.a., counter withdrawal) will depend on the limit set my your "card-issuing bank"; not the local Thai bank although the local Thai bank may have some high, high limit. Limits vary from card to to card. For example the U.S. Schwab Bank debit card often mentioned on ThaiVisa has a daily/transaction cash limit of either $500 (approx Bt17.5K) or $1000 (approx Bt35K) depending on whether you have their standard card or Platinum debit card...I have and use such a Platinum card. I have another card from another bank I use which has a $2,000 daily limit (approx Bt70K limit). Have used both cards in Bangkok and Krungsri banks for counter withdrawals. Sometimes I use both cards at the same time to get over Bt100K.

Yes, limits set by the card-issuing bank can vary greatly from maybe around $300/day to thousands of U.S. dollars (or equivalent)....depends on the card-issuing bank.

Also, some Thai bank branches will not accept a debit card for a counter withdrawal (more commonly known to Thais as cash advances as you mentioned)....instead they just point you to their ATM, but they will gladly accept a credit card almost always for a cash advance. But keep in mind almost all credit cards whack you hard for cash advances like an upfront 3% fee plus probably another 3% foreign transaction fee....fortunately I have such a credit card that charges neither....one of the few out there.

And if the card is rejected during a counter-withdrawal even if you know you are below the card's daily limit, it may be because the card-issuing bank has blocked cash withdrawals for certain countries/areas such as Thailand...don't blame the Thai bank for that. Happened to me once when I first used that card which has the $2,000/Bt70K limit...the bank clerk showed me the error which said "Over Limit" on the POS machine...I then said please try again for Bt65K (a shot in the dark as I was guessing I had exceeded the card's daily limit)...the transaction was approved. Later that night I called my bank to find out about the $2,000 daily limit and I now always stay below that limit when doing cash advances.

And always beware of a cash transaction where Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) rate is offered although it probably will not be called that...instead the bank/ATM will have a warn & fuzzy name for it like Bank Rate, Home Rate, etc. This rate will be around 4% lower than the card-network rate. Do not accept a DCC transaction....decline that selection to continue on to get the full card-network (Visa/Mastercard rate) rate minus in foreign transaction fee your card-issuing bank may apply. Don't blame the Thai bank for any foreign transaction fee that effectively lowers your exchange rate; blame that on your home country card-issuing bank who is profiting off your transaction.

Where to start?

I don't get charged by my bank on any foreign transaction I make with my ATM debt card.

I have been using Krungsri ATMs for the option of the 30000 baht per withdrawal and get charged 200 baht fee for using their bank.. No problem with that..

My new card just happened not to work that night at the banks I normally use.. So it was not a limit issue or anything my bank did, as they suggested I try other ATMs or go into a bank and make a cash advance that way..

The ATM that did work, I ended up making 2 withdrawals because their limit was 20000 baht per transaction.. So got charged 400 baht vice 200, hence the greedy ATM comment I made.

Peace out...

The other nonsense of a lower exchange rate option or DCC transaction you mentioned, never seen or noticed it being an option before. So for sure, I will not accept that option.

[D3030]

The daily/per transaction limit for a cash advance (a.k.a., counter withdrawal) will depend on the limit set my your "card-issuing bank"; not the local Thai bank although the local Thai bank may have some high, high limit. Limits vary from card to to card. For example the U.S. Schwab Bank debit card often mentioned on ThaiVisa has a daily/transaction cash limit of either $500 (approx Bt17.5K) or $1000 (approx Bt35K) depending on whether you have their standard card or Platinum debit card...I have and use such a Platinum card. I have another card from another bank I use which has a $2,000 daily limit (approx Bt70K limit). Have used both cards in Bangkok and Krungsri banks for counter withdrawals. Sometimes I use both cards at the same time to get over Bt100K.

Yes, limits set by the card-issuing bank can vary greatly from maybe around $300/day to thousands of U.S. dollars (or equivalent)....depends on the card-issuing bank.

Also, some Thai bank branches will not accept a debit card for a counter withdrawal (more commonly known to Thais as cash advances as you mentioned)....instead they just point you to their ATM, but they will gladly accept a credit card almost always for a cash advance. But keep in mind almost all credit cards whack you hard for cash advances like an upfront 3% fee plus probably another 3% foreign transaction fee....fortunately I have such a credit card that charges neither....one of the few out there.

And if the card is rejected during a counter-withdrawal even if you know you are below the card's daily limit, it may be because the card-issuing bank has blocked cash withdrawals for certain countries/areas such as Thailand...don't blame the Thai bank for that. Happened to me once when I first used that card which has the $2,000/Bt70K limit...the bank clerk showed me the error which said "Over Limit" on the POS machine...I then said please try again for Bt65K (a shot in the dark as I was guessing I had exceeded the card's daily limit)...the transaction was approved. Later that night I called my bank to find out about the $2,000 daily limit and I now always stay below that limit when doing cash advances.

And always beware of a cash transaction where Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) rate is offered although it probably will not be called that...instead the bank/ATM will have a warn & fuzzy name for it like Bank Rate, Home Rate, etc. This rate will be around 4% lower than the card-network rate. Do not accept a DCC transaction....decline that selection to continue on to get the full card-network (Visa/Mastercard rate) rate minus in foreign transaction fee your card-issuing bank may apply. Don't blame the Thai bank for any foreign transaction fee that effectively lowers your exchange rate; blame that on your home country card-issuing bank who is profiting off your transaction.

Where to start?

I don't get charged by my bank on any foreign transaction I make with my ATM debt card.

I have been using Krungsri ATMs for the option of the 30000 baht per withdrawal and get charged 200 baht fee for using their bank.. No problem with that..

My new card just happened not to work that night at the banks I normally use.. So it was not a limit issue or anything my bank did, as they suggested I try other ATMs or go into a bank and make a cash advance that way..

The ATM that did work, I ended up making 2 withdrawals because their limit was 20000 baht per transaction.. So got charged 400 baht vice 200, hence the greedy ATM comment I made.

The other nonsense of a lower exchange rate option or DCC transaction you mentioned, never seen or noticed it being an option before. So for sure, I will not accept that option.

Peace....

[Pib]

Cam depend on your card if you get offered a DCC transaction or not at an ATM. May not be purely the ATM bank. I've never been offered DCC at a Thai ATM with my U.S. "Visa" cards. But based on many posts I've read Mastercard card seems to be offered DCC frequently.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Pib

[islandguy]

My wife paid a yearly fee that lets her do unlimited withdrawals at any bank in any province with no additional fees for 'out of province' or 'more than allowed free withdrawals'. This is with Krungsi and not accounting for foreign sourced funds, but it is a good value for her. Something to consider.

[Colabamumbai]

I can never seem to get more than 20,000 Baht from an A.T.M., using a foreign or Thai bank card here, it does not matter how much I have on deposit.

[bazza40]

I use a Visa debit card from Australia. That way, if anything fraudulent happens, I have redress through my Australian finance provider. Good luck with trying for compensation if you are scammed using a Thai bank card.

Dynamic Currency Conversion is the worldwide banking euphemism for legalised theft.

[MyFriend You]

My bank in the US just reimbursed me he equivalent of 8,000 baht for what it called 'illegal bank ATN charges' since September 2015. I was happy to get the money, but no further info was provided. Called the bank and was told my normal bank SCB was overcharging me for ATM withdrawals..........when I get back to Thailand I'll ask ...<deleted>...?? I always accept the ATM charge and its always only 150 baht - where did the 8,000 charges come from. been a member of SCB almost 20 years.

[MyFriend You]

Cam depend on your card if you get offered a DCC transaction or not at an ATM. May not be purely the ATM bank. I've never been offered DCC at a Thai ATM with my U.S. "Visa" cards. But based on many posts I've read Mastercard card seems to be offered DCC frequently.

Sorry, I am drawing a blank here - What is a DCC?

[dotpoom]

https://youtu.be/akrU70NFklo?t=26 ( start it from beginning )

Edited April 5, 2016 by dotpoom

[Pib]

Cam depend on your card if you get offered a DCC transaction or not at an ATM. May not be purely the ATM bank. I've never been offered DCC at a Thai ATM with my U.S. "Visa" cards. But based on many posts I've read Mastercard card seems to be offered DCC frequently.

Sorry, I am drawing a blank here - What is a DCC?

Review post number 6 above.

But basically Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC) is where the local bank/vendor accomplishes the conversion at their rate which will be lower than the Visa/Mastercard exchange rate. Both Visa and Mastercard really don't like this, but it's illegal...done all over the world. Visa/Mastercard usually get blamed for the lower rate since people don't understand the vendor/local bank did the exchange instead of Visa/Mastercard.

[Langsuan Man]

My bank in the US just reimbursed me he equivalent of 8,000 baht for what it called 'illegal bank ATN charges' since September 2015. I was happy to get the money, but no further info was provided. Called the bank and was told my normal bank SCB was overcharging me for ATM withdrawals..........when I get back to Thailand I'll ask ...<deleted>...?? I always accept the ATM charge and its always only 150 baht - where did the 8,000 charges come from. been a member of SCB almost 20 years.

I think you have been in the tunnel too long

SCB was one of the first to jump on the 150 THB foreign card fee, and gladly joined the rest when it was upped to 180 THB and then gleefully allied again when it was raised to 200 THB

SCB is my main bank but I don't use their machines due to their 20,000 THB per pull limit even if I am being reimbursed for the fee from all of my US bank accounts and I manage what banks I use so the pain is spread around equally

TMB and Krungsri allow 30,000 THB per pull so they are who I use, both for the savings to my US banks and the saving of my time and energy

[hugh2121]

Bangkok Bank. You can use internet banking to increase the daily amount via ATM. I increased mine to THB 200,000.

[55Jay]

The dreaded DCC monster.

I used a Thai ATM once at Swampy to get some USD as I was flying to the US. Sure, if there's a problem with the ATM not dispensing money, and you are about to board a flight, that would be a major PITA as it sounds like it was for you, thanks for mentioning that.

I skipped the ATM on our last 2 trips, and used an ATM in 7-11 after landing in the US. Then kick myself because unlike where we live in Thailand, virtually everywhere accepts credit/debit cards. Can buy a 6 pack of beer and use the credit card, not much need for cash, and the Cash Back Rewards pile up nicely too.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Bangkok Bank. You can use internet banking to increase the daily amount via ATM. I increased mine to THB 200,000.

There are two different limits that come into play on the Thai end when withdrawing from Thai ATMs:

1. is how much you can withdraw per single ATM withdrawal. For most Thai banks, that's 20-25K per ATM withdrawal, although Krungsri/Ayudhya and TMB allow 30K per pull. Those are limits that the customer has no ability to change.

2. is how much your Thai bank allows you to withdrawal via ATM PER DAY, regardless of the number of individual transactions involved. That's the limit where, at least with BKK Bank, you can have them adjust your daily limit to various amounts. But you still won't be able to pull anymore PER WITHDRAWAL than the PER WITHDRAWAL limit set by the bank for its ATMs.

Separately, as far as DCC (Dynamic Currency Conversion) is concerned, it's very easy and NOT complicated to tell when the Thai bank is trying to con you into accepting that lower rate. Here's how:

Anytime the Thai bank ATM screen is showing you your withdrawal amount in your home country currency instead of or in addition to a Thai baht amount, that means they're offering you a DCC rate -- which you want to avoid.

Edited April 6, 2016 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Pib]

Bangkok Bank. You can use internet banking to increase the daily amount via ATM. I increased mine to THB 200,000.

There are two different limits that come into play on the Thai end when withdrawing from Thai ATMs:

1. is how much you can withdraw per single ATM withdrawal. For most Thai banks, that's 20-25K per ATM withdrawal, although Krungsri/Ayudhya and TMB allow 30K per pull. Those are limits that the customer has no ability to change.

2. is how much your Thai bank allows you to withdrawal via ATM PER DAY, regardless of the number of individual transactions involved. That's the limit where, at least with BKK Bank, you can have them adjust your daily limit to various amounts. But you still won't be able to pull anymore PER WITHDRAWAL than the PER WITHDRAWAL limit set by the bank for its ATMs.

Separately, as far as DCC (Dynamic Currency Conversion) is concerned, it's very easy and NOT complicated to tell when the Thai bank is trying to con you into accepting that lower rate. Here's how:

Anytime the Thai bank ATM screen is showing you your withdrawal amount in your home country currency instead of or in addition to a Thai baht amount, that means they're offering you a DCC rate -- which you want to avoid.

On my Bangkok Bank ibanking I "can not" change the ATM card limit; I can only change the 3rd party transfer limit...all the way up to Bt500K if desired. I keep it set to zero except when needing to do a 3rd party transfer like pay for something such as my annual vehicle insurance, buy an item online and pay via funds transfers, etc...I change the limit to some amount...complete the transfer...then set the limit back to zero for added banking safety. There is no setting allowing me to change my ATM card limit....if there is I've never been able to find it...the Bangkok Bank website says you can call their 1333 number to make a change in your ATM limit up to Bt150K/day.

Now the account I have an ATM card on is a joint account with my wife...we both have ATM cards. "Maybe" for a single account owner account Bangkok Bank ibanking offers changing the ATM limit....or maybe folks are confusing that with the 3rd party transfer limits which does not affect your ATM card limit. Rules/policies for joint and single accounts vary a little.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

...

Edited April 6, 2016 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I will say, regarding the conversion that's going on now in the U.S. with the move to chipped debit cards, there have been quite a few misc. reports here on TV surfacing with people reporting various problems using their new chipped U.S. cards with various Thai bank ATMs -- problems that weren't occurring before with the older magnetic strip only cards.

But thus far, they seem to be sporadic and I haven't been able to discern any clear or repeating pattern of problems occurring. Presumably, it's something about how the Thai ATMs and systems are configured, but who knows, could also be some issues on the U.S. end.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

On my Bangkok Bank ibanking I "can not" change the ATM card limit; I can only change the 3rd party transfer limit...all the way up to Bt500K if desired. I keep it set to zero except when needing to do a 3rd party transfer like pay for something such as my annual vehicle insurance, buy an item online and pay via funds transfers, etc...I change the limit to some amount...complete the transfer...then set the limit back to zero for added banking safety. There is no setting allowing me to change my ATM card limit....if there is I've never been able to find it...the Bangkok Bank website says you can call their 1333 number to make a change in your ATM limit up to Bt150K/day.

Yes, I didn't comment above on HOW you make those ATM card limit changes with BKK Bank. Hugh was talking about doing it via IBanking.

But you're correct. Contrary to what the prior poster said above, AFAIK, you cannot change the daily card ATM withdrawal limits via IBanking -- you have to call the bank and use their telephone banking system, and/or, I suppose, go into the branch and make the change with your home branch in person.

Edited April 6, 2016 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[55Jay]

^^ Yup. I keep larger amount of Baht in one ATM disabled account. Opened a second (joint) account so we both have our own cards, then simply IBanking transfer some money into it before we head out somewhere, hit the ATM on the way. If the ATM card is ever compromised, my exposure to loss is very low.

Edited April 6, 2016 by 55Jay

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I can never seem to get more than 20,000 Baht from an A.T.M., using a foreign or Thai bank card here, it does not matter how much I have on deposit.

There are a couple of issues here:

The first, is to determine what is the daily ATM withdrawal limit set by your card issuing bank, and make sure it's large enough to accommodate withdrawals of more than 20,000 baht. The daily ATM withdrawal limits set by Thai and foreign banks are unrelated to whatever balance you may have in those accounts.

Then, if your card's withdrawal limit is above 20,000 baht and you have sufficient funds in the account, you should try using Krungsri/Ayudhya yellow ATMs, or blue TMB (Thai Military Bank) ATMs. They both allow up to 30,000 baht per withdrawal. Both charge the now standard 200 baht per withdrawal fee on foreign cards.

[Pib]

Basically ditto for me...I have one Bangkok Bank account with no ATM card issued against it...didn't even want to incur the annual Bt200 to Bt300 fee....and I have another Bangkok Bank account with ATM. Actually these are joint accounts with the wife. We keep the bulk of our funds in the account with no ATM card and as required transfer x-amount to the account with ATM card using ibanking. Usually we don't keep no more than Bt50K to Bt60K in the account with ATM...and top it up again when it gets down to around Bt15K.

[55Jay]

Basically ditto for me...I have one Bangkok Bank account with no ATM card issued against it...didn't even want to incur the annual Bt200 to Bt300 fee....and I have another Bangkok Bank account with ATM. Actually these are joint accounts with the wife. We keep the bulk of our funds in the account with no ATM card and as required transfer x-amount to the account with ATM card using ibanking. Usually we don't keep no more than Bt50K to Bt60K in the account with ATM...and top it up again when it gets down to around Bt15K.

I was concerned about getting skimmed with the previous mag strip only ATM card on the single, larger balance BB account, which is why I locked it down and opened the second, low balance ATM access account.

Ironically, we were issued two of the newer chip cards for the new account, which I had resisted before due to their inflexibility, but it really hasn't posed a problem. We drive past 3 BB ATMs on our way into town, we just stop and get the cash out on the way.

Reckon the thieves will figure a way around the chips eventually, so having a reduced balance ATM account may still be a worthwhile effort.

Next up - retinal scanners and fingerprint verification at ATMs.

[Pib]

I'm still intentionally with the Bangkok Bank magnetic strip card as I want to be able to withdraw cash from any Thai ATM. I don't want to have to drive/go hunting for another Bangkok Bank ATM. With my current method of using two accounts...one with ATM card which I keep a fairly low balance in and top-up as necessary from my account without ATM card as described earlier....I feel safe enough. Once more Thai banks upgrade their ATMs so they can handle the Bangkok Bank Be1st Smart (chipped) card I will switch to the chipped card.