Bangkok bank credit cards....

[speedtripler]

I myself have not found the fee schedule for my Thai-bank issued credit cards to be materially 'worse' than any of my other US-bank issued cards.

Dunno what kind of cards you're familiar with, but in my entire life, I've never had a U.S. credit card of any kind charge me either a 1] up front issuance fee, or a b] annual renewal/maintenance fee, and both of those are pretty common among a broad range of Thai bank credit cards -- and not just the high-end ones where the fee is obviously going to offset the cost of various perks the card may have.

They may be waived in Thailand in certain situations. But for my cards in the U.S., those fees simply don't exist at all and are never charged -- regardless of how much or little I use a given credit card.

BTW, I also don't hold or use U.S. credit cards that want to charge me 20% interest on any running balance as in the standard Thai rate. I don't typically run credit card balances, but regardless, I wouldn't hold a CC that had that as its stated interest rate.

So, overall, considering those differences, I'd say the typical Thai CC is materially worse.

to be honest ,i also think thai cards are inferior to cards from europe and uk

the cards i used to use most often was from a building society (not a "bank" but tomato /Tomato )

it wasnt a "high end " card by any means but the benefits it carried were pretty hard to beat compared to todays cards

for a start and these are only the things i can rememeber.........(there were probably more )

no fees on any purchase if paid within 45days

no transaction fee to use it .......ever .......for anything

no yearly fee ,no signup fee

no fee for lost /broken or replacement cards

no fee for foreign exchange

no atm fee worldwide

chargeback warranty on defective goods for 180 days/6 months from recieving said

i had a cheque book so i could write cheques from it free

cash advance was free if repaid in 45 days

also i never had to have any portion of my account or savings locked up to get it which i hear some thai cards are doing

if theyre hold your money to ransom against any spending on the card ,is it really a "credit" card since you are essentially funding it via your own deposits ?

shouldnt it really be a "glorified debit card" they are trying to con people into taking ? since the defination of credit is paying with the banks money but with some

of these "credit cards" they are asking you to guarantee the credit or repay by "debit" from your own money they have frozen away ?

also anyone know ,if there is any interest paid on the frozen money ?do you get the standard 1-3% interest or do you forefit that if they ask you to secure your money against

whatever you buy on the card ? (that would make these cards very expensive vs western cards if you dont get paid interest on the locked acct )

[new2here]

I myself have not found the fee schedule for my Thai-bank issued credit cards to be materially 'worse' than any of my other US-bank issued cards.

Dunno what kind of cards you're familiar with, but in my entire life, I've never had a U.S. credit card of any kind charge me either a 1] up front issuance fee, or a b] annual renewal/maintenance fee, and both of those are pretty common among a broad range of Thai bank credit cards -- and not just the high-end ones where the fee is obviously going to offset the cost of various perks the card may have.

They may be waived in Thailand in certain situations. But for my cards in the U.S., those fees simply don't exist at all and are never charged -- regardless of how much or little I use a given credit card.

BTW, I also don't hold or use U.S. credit cards that want to charge me 20% interest on any running balance as in the standard Thai rate. I don't typically run credit card balances, but regardless, I wouldn't hold a CC that had that as its stated interest rate.

So, overall, considering those differences, I'd say the typical Thai CC is materially worse.

to be honest ,i also think thai cards are inferior to cards from europe and uk

the cards i used to use most often was from a building society (not a "bank" but tomato /Tomato )

it wasnt a "high end " card by any means but the benefits it carried were pretty hard to beat compared to todays cards

for a start and these are only the things i can rememeber.........(there were probably more )

no fees on any purchase if paid within 45days

no transaction fee to use it .......ever .......for anything

no yearly fee ,no signup fee

no fee for lost /broken or replacement cards

no fee for foreign exchange

no atm fee worldwide

chargeback warranty on defective goods for 180 days/6 months from recieving said

i had a cheque book so i could write cheques from it free

cash advance was free if repaid in 45 days

also i never had to have any portion of my account or savings locked up to get it which i hear some thai cards are doing

if theyre hold your money to ransom against any spending on the card ,is it really a "credit" card since you are essentially funding it via your own deposits ?

shouldnt it really be a "glorified debit card" they are trying to con people into taking ? since the defination of credit is paying with the banks money but with some

of these "credit cards" they are asking you to guarantee the credit or repay by "debit" from your own money they have frozen away ?

also anyone know ,if there is any interest paid on the frozen money ?do you get the standard 1-3% interest or do you forefit that if they ask you to secure your money against

whatever you buy on the card ? (that would make these cards very expensive vs western cards if you dont get paid interest on the locked acct )

As I've heard, the banks in Thailand - those that do offer a securitized account - those funds do earn interest, but naturally the funds within it can't be accessed, pledged or otherwise, until the account is paid in full and closed. This is pretty much in line with how most secured cards in the US operate as well.

As to the notion that it's a debit card based on the position that "... since the defination of credit is paying with the banks money..." I'd say no only because IF that were the case; a) presumably you would not get a bill/statement showing a balance/payment due, and/or you'd see a corresponding deduction in the associated savings account offsetting the amount used on the card in that period. Since (in many cases) neither a or b occurs with Thai issued cards (again, to the point that I know them) I don't think "debit" is the accurate word for it.

Naturally there will be debate as to the most correct term to use, but I think that the best - most accurate term - really is secured credit card. Because in a debit-card scenario, you retain control over the funds and account, and in many cases, can pledge that account ( subject to bank policy) and any 'limit' is solely based on the funds you maintain at any point in time. By contrast a secured credit cards limit tends to be fixed and not as variable as a daily balance change as a savings account based debit card account may experience.

Also there can be some differences in terms of perks/benefits offered as I tend to find that overall credit cards offer more perks than a traditional debit card does. Also with a credit card (and I understand that this applies to collateralized accounts as well) that there is a payment history recorded (i.e. credit report) and IF managed properly, to me would be an asset. Debit cards don't have this functionality.

Edited April 24, 2016 by new2here

[speedtripler]

I myself have not found the fee schedule for my Thai-bank issued credit cards to be materially 'worse' than any of my other US-bank issued cards.

Dunno what kind of cards you're familiar with, but in my entire life, I've never had a U.S. credit card of any kind charge me either a 1] up front issuance fee, or a b] annual renewal/maintenance fee, and both of those are pretty common among a broad range of Thai bank credit cards -- and not just the high-end ones where the fee is obviously going to offset the cost of various perks the card may have.

They may be waived in Thailand in certain situations. But for my cards in the U.S., those fees simply don't exist at all and are never charged -- regardless of how much or little I use a given credit card.

BTW, I also don't hold or use U.S. credit cards that want to charge me 20% interest on any running balance as in the standard Thai rate. I don't typically run credit card balances, but regardless, I wouldn't hold a CC that had that as its stated interest rate.

So, overall, considering those differences, I'd say the typical Thai CC is materially worse.

What I think the problem here is in the comparatives. The overall credit card market in the US is much, much larger. As a result, issuers are more able to offer products that are customized to that market.

Examples might be for those that are deemed (by the issuer using their proprietary scoring model) as being lower risk/higher score, the bank may offer up cards that may, as you cite, offer no annual fees and APRs that are much lower.. By contrast, those the issuer deems (again, by using an in-house scoring model) are higher risks/lower score, may be offered cards that do come with an application fee, annual fee and/or APRs much higher.

Under a US model someone with perhaps a mid-range score may still be approved, but perhaps with a card that carries a higher APR and/or annual fee; by contrast, in Thailand, as there doesn't yet seem to be as many card options, the same mid-range applicant may just be denied.

The market as I see it in Thailand is much smaller -- therefore as I see their just isn't a whole lot of product diversification or individualization (yet, as I think as the market and product matures, this will change). So if one looks at all the cards on offer, there will be much more similarity than not.

I also think with that comes the use of a independent credit reporting entity, like the NCB. With this, in time, issuers will be better able to determine risk profiles - and with that I suspect will come cards with differing initial APRs, floating APRs (like MOL +X%)

Based on how I know the Thai credit card market, I DO see a few aspects that are more advantageous than say a US-based system. For one is the difference in how credit scores are used. Under the US model, most scoring models (like FICO, Vantage, etc) do include the number of formal credit inquiries you have in the computation of your score - fewer applications gets you a slightly higher score. Therefore, if you want to protect your score, an applicant is mindful of how often and to whom they apply, as each application means one new "hard pull" and that stays on record for 24 months... As I know the system here, that's not the case - meaning you really can 'flood the market' and apply to all the banks, say 8 to 10, and that really won't have a material impact on your score..

So, my position that Thai cards are not materials worse is tempered with the reality that the market here just doesn't yet have the size or diversification as the US does, and as such can't yet offer products that are more "credit-risk" based. However, I do see here that a fair number of banks do in fact offer card come with no application fee and/or annual fees.. Interest rate I do cede seems to be quite similar across the board unless you're talking about an upper-tiered card...

One part where I do think Thai card are much better than US cards is in the promotional/promotions area... While US cards tend to be internal program-oriented (like rewards/points/miles-based or cash-back) Thai cards tend to be more merchant-based; examples might be the advertising for X bank and the various restaurants that will offer some kind of discount if paid by that banks card.

However in the end, what is deemed to be a good card is going to be hugely subjective depending on what you need or want and what you a qualify for.

i agree with most of what you posted bar a couple of thoughts

the credit card market is still a fraction of the us but i think you will find if you look

that the market is close to saturation with credit cards

it would take to long to check them all but just for example Bangko Bsnk alone offer a whopping 16 different cards you can apply for

http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/PERSONALBANKING/DAILYBANKING/CREDITCARDS/CREDITCARDTYPE/Pages/Default.aspx

Kasikorn has 43 different cards you can apply for !!!

http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/PERSONALBANKING/DAILYBANKING/CREDITCARDS/CREDITCARDTYPE/Pages/Default.aspx

check their sites one by one for more info if you have time/interest

i think they dont target farangs with their advertising so thats why most people are unaware they exist unless you specifically go looking for the info

most thais i know have a wallet full of colourful cards and they can get a discount on almost anything by using the correct card but thats only good as long as you can

avoid that slippery slope of spending more than you can repay within 30/45 days etc and i think thats how many of them end up in a spiral of debt they cant get out of

CREDIT CARDS WILL BLEED YOU DRY IF YOURE NOT SMART ABOUT THEY WAY TO USE THEM so i would not recommend your teenage kids be allowed them and refer them to debit instead

to avoid becoming victim/debt slave to these greedy banks,but IF YOU ARE SMART ABOUT IT they will actually SAVE your money ,contrary to what some people may have you believe!

i dont ever use a card thats going to cost me more than buying something with cash,either by fee or face value

normally i only pay if there is an incentive like 10-15% off or some other benefit like free insurance ,purchase protection or rewards/benefits and i never pay them back late so they never get me on their 20% plan !

Edited April 24, 2016 by speedtripler

[new2here]

I myself have not found the fee schedule for my Thai-bank issued credit cards to be materially 'worse' than any of my other US-bank issued cards.

Dunno what kind of cards you're familiar with, but in my entire life, I've never had a U.S. credit card of any kind charge me either a 1] up front issuance fee, or a b] annual renewal/maintenance fee, and both of those are pretty common among a broad range of Thai bank credit cards -- and not just the high-end ones where the fee is obviously going to offset the cost of various perks the card may have.

They may be waived in Thailand in certain situations. But for my cards in the U.S., those fees simply don't exist at all and are never charged -- regardless of how much or little I use a given credit card.

BTW, I also don't hold or use U.S. credit cards that want to charge me 20% interest on any running balance as in the standard Thai rate. I don't typically run credit card balances, but regardless, I wouldn't hold a CC that had that as its stated interest rate.

So, overall, considering those differences, I'd say the typical Thai CC is materially worse.

What I think the problem here is in the comparatives. The overall credit card market in the US is much, much larger. As a result, issuers are more able to offer products that are customized to that market.

Examples might be for those that are deemed (by the issuer using their proprietary scoring model) as being lower risk/higher score, the bank may offer up cards that may, as you cite, offer no annual fees and APRs that are much lower.. By contrast, those the issuer deems (again, by using an in-house scoring model) are higher risks/lower score, may be offered cards that do come with an application fee, annual fee and/or APRs much higher.

Under a US model someone with perhaps a mid-range score may still be approved, but perhaps with a card that carries a higher APR and/or annual fee; by contrast, in Thailand, as there doesn't yet seem to be as many card options, the same mid-range applicant may just be denied.

The market as I see it in Thailand is much smaller -- therefore as I see their just isn't a whole lot of product diversification or individualization (yet, as I think as the market and product matures, this will change). So if one looks at all the cards on offer, there will be much more similarity than not.

I also think with that comes the use of a independent credit reporting entity, like the NCB. With this, in time, issuers will be better able to determine risk profiles - and with that I suspect will come cards with differing initial APRs, floating APRs (like MOL +X%)

Based on how I know the Thai credit card market, I DO see a few aspects that are more advantageous than say a US-based system. For one is the difference in how credit scores are used. Under the US model, most scoring models (like FICO, Vantage, etc) do include the number of formal credit inquiries you have in the computation of your score - fewer applications gets you a slightly higher score. Therefore, if you want to protect your score, an applicant is mindful of how often and to whom they apply, as each application means one new "hard pull" and that stays on record for 24 months... As I know the system here, that's not the case - meaning you really can 'flood the market' and apply to all the banks, say 8 to 10, and that really won't have a material impact on your score..

So, my position that Thai cards are not materials worse is tempered with the reality that the market here just doesn't yet have the size or diversification as the US does, and as such can't yet offer products that are more "credit-risk" based. However, I do see here that a fair number of banks do in fact offer card come with no application fee and/or annual fees.. Interest rate I do cede seems to be quite similar across the board unless you're talking about an upper-tiered card...

One part where I do think Thai card are much better than US cards is in the promotional/promotions area... While US cards tend to be internal program-oriented (like rewards/points/miles-based or cash-back) Thai cards tend to be more merchant-based; examples might be the advertising for X bank and the various restaurants that will offer some kind of discount if paid by that banks card.

However in the end, what is deemed to be a good card is going to be hugely subjective depending on what you need or want and what you a qualify for.

i agree with most of what you posted bar a couple of thoughts

the credit card market is still a fraction of the us but i think you will find if you look

that the market is close to saturation with credit cards

it would take to long to check them all but just for example Bangko Bsnk alone offer a whopping 16 different cards you can apply for

http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/PERSONALBANKING/DAILYBANKING/CREDITCARDS/CREDITCARDTYPE/Pages/Default.aspx

some banks have even more! check their sites one by one for more info

i think they dont target farangs with their advwertising so thats why most people are unaware they exist unless you specifically go looking for the info

most thais i know have a wallet full of colourful cards and they can get a discount on almost anything by using the correct card but thats only good as long as you can

avoid that slippery slope of spending more than you can repay within 30/45 days etc and i think thats how many of them end up in a spiral of debt they cant get out of

CREDIT CARDS WILL BLEED YOU DRY IF YOURE NOT SMART ABOUT THEY WAY TO USE THEM so i would not recommend your teenage kids be allowed them and refer them to debit instead

to avoid becoming victim/debt slave to these greedy banks,but IF YOU ARE SMART ABOUT IT they will actually SAVE your money ,contrary to what some people may have you believe!

i dont ever use a card thats going to cost me more than buying something with cash,either by fee or face value

normally i only pay if there is an incentive like 10-15% off or some other benefit like free insurance ,purchase protection or rewards/benefits and i never pay them back late so they never get me on their 20% plan !

I very much agree that from a saturation point, Thailand appears to be high... and I think some of that is due, in part, to the historical lack of a centralized credit reporting system that would allow one financial institution to see if you've properly managed other accounts as well getting a more comprehensive analysis of your risk profile.

I also agree that any card, high rate or low rate, will bleed you dry if used improperly or not fiscally prudently. That part I think falls the consumer and not the bank to manage. The bank is charged with monitoring the banks fiscal responsibility, you have yours.

I think banks don't broadly target the foreigners market (and here I use the word foreigner in the broadest context, but cede that there can be a lot of differed between any two foreigners and their status here (ie short term, work-permit base longer stay or retiree among other situations) because, at least up to now, there really hasn't been a huge need to do so.

I suspect banks have been able to hit their organic lending portfolio targets by using only nationals. I also think that there is some level of acknowledgement that lending to a non-national carries some added level of default risk in that (and again, no two non-national cases are identical) a Thai essentially is going to be traceable and therefore can be engaged in any legal or other default-originated processes. S/he may attempt to flee or go "under the radar", but given the use of a single national ID number, it's going to be hard to fully and permanently disappear.

By contrast a non-national does have more ability to flee in a default scenario... and while a bank can still start legal process, I suspect that there is a known realization that while processes can be initiated, that if a non-nation does flee, that the real-world odds of a fiscal recovery are slim. Yes, some non-nationals have fixed assets here (condos, houses, etc) that could come into play, and some non-nationals are here for decades and in official (meaning with work permitted work) employment capacities earning salaries that far exceed most lending metrics, but I think given that they've been able to meet growth organically and give the somewhat unique risks of foreigner lending, I think they've just not "gone there" just yet..

But i think that will change.

Edited April 24, 2016 by new2here

[jacko45k]

Where you said, "I am required to have a 3 month fixed term deposit account holding the limit..." sure sounds like a collateral account for a secured card.

Yes it probably is, but they call it a credit card and to me it behaves as one. Also it is as I use my UK Mastercard too, no collateral account, but it gets paid off in full each month. I do not need the credit, the interest rates are silly, and was brought up to fear debt.

(They would offer me 1% or less on any money I lend to them, but 25+% on any money they lend me....no brainer!)

Edited April 24, 2016 by jacko45k

[JWNY]

Anyone here using the Visa Infinite from Bangkok Bank? Would like some feedback on the concierge. 

 

Annual fees at THB30,000 seems quite steep too 

[wordsofwisdom]

Anyone here using the Visa Infinite from Bangkok Bank? Would like some feedback on the concierge. 
 
Annual fees at THB30,000 seems quite steep too 

You must have 10 million baht plus in your Bangkok Bank account. Using Kasikorn Bank Wisdom credit card without annual fee and lot's of benefits

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[oxo1947]

Do you want a credit card so you can lend money---or do you want a credit card to use for just convenience ?

I wanted the latter----so I could book airlines/Hotels/car rentals etc.....I don't use it for much else.....shopping etc is cash for me. So I got Master card & Visa card , they required I open a 2nd account and deposit 100K to cover both of them---at the usual rubbish interest rate----I was then asked how I would like to pay  it  back from that account---so much a month etc ?  I opted for 100% immediate payment from that account.

 

The cost has been nothing--- I have made many purchases but 2 large ones at different times at 2 different BKK hospitals 87,000 ---78K at Pattaya hospital..... payment went through, but they txt me immediately in English asking if everything was OK.

 

Oh BKK Bank.......I wish I had 10 mil in my savings....but sadly no.....

[wordsofwisdom]

Do you want a credit card so you can lend money---or do you want a credit card to use for just convenience ?
I wanted the latter----so I could book airlines/Hotels/car rentals etc.....I don't use it for much else.....shopping etc is cash for me. So I got Master card & Visa card , they required I open a 2nd account and deposit 100K to cover both of them---at the usual rubbish interest rate----I was then asked how I would like to pay  it  back from that account---so much a month etc ?  I opted for 100% immediate payment from that account.
 
The cost has been nothing--- I have made many purchases but 2 large ones at different times at 2 different BKK hospitals 87,000 ---78K at Pattaya hospital..... payment went through, but they txt me immediately in English asking if everything was OK.
 
Oh BKK Bank.......I wish I had 10 mil in my savings....but sadly no.....

Well there are many cheaper ways to get Thai credit card without depositing money and let bank hold it. Depends how much cash you have

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[oxo1947]

11 minutes ago, wordsofwisdom said:

Well there are many cheaper ways to get Thai credit card without depositing money and let bank hold it. Depends how much cash you have

I don't know how much cheaper you can get than Zero Words-Of Wisdom. The money was sitting there anyway. Yer its a rubbish interest rate I know---he (manager) does include the amount in immigration letter if requested...(I haven't) .

At my age (although insured) I like to have just a certain amount of money accessible....which usually means for that lump I take a shit rate.....but a bit more than UK or USA I think,,,,,not looked for a while.

.

Still got my gold....that some financial wizard advised me to buy--- if it goes up another 20K a baht....I'll get my money back after waiting a few years----- I'll let every one know when I am about to sell----the rate always seems to go through the roof 2 days after I sell or do a forigen  money exchange .

Edited April 17, 2017 by oxo1947