Gay couple wins custody battle against Thai surrogate mother

[SoiBiker]

How is the child going to handle it, never mind these guys? Goes to school and tells everyone at school this is my dad and this is my dad. How do they explain were the mother is? I would think it would potentially cause a lot of psychological issues for the child. What the adults go through I am not interested in but it is the child that will have the difficult time

...because of people like you, who minimize "family" to mom+dad+ child!

Society is not built on queers it is built on heterosexual relationships but maybe no one told you that

Society includes us all, not just the people you approve of.

[DM07]

The poor children, two men taking children and pretending they are legitimate parents is wrong, for all the courts know they could be part of a paedophile ring pretending to be a gay couple, even worse is they are taking advantage of poor women in third world counties. These kids will grow to hate what the men have done to them, deprive them of their mother.

Only, if they get under the influence of gay- hating ignorants like yourself!

[DM07]

How is the child going to handle it, never mind these guys? Goes to school and tells everyone at school this is my dad and this is my dad. How do they explain were the mother is? I would think it would potentially cause a lot of psychological issues for the child. What the adults go through I am not interested in but it is the child that will have the difficult time

...because of people like you, who minimize "family" to mom+dad+ child!

Society is not built on queers it is built on heterosexual relationships but maybe no one told you that

Society is built on a diversity of life-styles, opinions and orientations.

And it is -has to be- open to change!

Otherwise, how about going back to burning witches?

[SoiBiker]

...because of people like you, who minimize "family" to mom+dad+ child!

Society is not built on queers it is built on heterosexual relationships but maybe no one told you that

Society is built on a diversity of life-styles, opinions and orientations.

And it is -has to be- open to change!

Otherwise, how about going back to burning witches?

Humans have been on this planet many thousands of years, the "practice" in question can only be done via fairly recent medical advances, if wasn't for that we would not have this thread and the two guys would live out their life with their lifestyle.

Seems now the technology is there to clone a human but is taboo, and rightly so..

If this particular method was not available, they would probably have adopted instead. Which you would still have objected to, because you don't think gay people should be allowed to raise children.

Stop pretending this is about anything else but your feelings about gay people.

[Jingthing]

How is the child going to handle it, never mind these guys? Goes to school and tells everyone at school this is my dad and this is my dad. How do they explain were the mother is? I would think it would potentially cause a lot of psychological issues for the child. What the adults go through I am not interested in but it is the child that will have the difficult time

...because of people like you, who minimize "family" to mom+dad+ child!

Society is not built on queers it is built on heterosexual relationships but maybe no one told you that

Society is built on a diversity of life-styles, opinions and orientations.

And it is -has to be- open to change!

Otherwise, how about going back to burning witches?

Being gay is not a lifestyle. That is very dated, trivialities it, and implies it is s choice. A lifestyle is something like being into surfing.

[jak2002003]

Should never have been created..........

Why?

No mum......

I don't want to get too personal here.. but you sound like you have some issues about absent mothers.

I am sorry if you had a bad experience growing up without a mother, for whatever reason... but millions of children grow up with no mother.. even here in Thailand...

A child does not have to have a mother raise it in order for it to be happy... and this child of the 2 gay men will not be raised in isolation with only these 2 guys for company.

The men will have families too.. so the child will have grandmothers, female cousins, etc so the child will not lack female company.

[gandalf12]

How is the child going to handle it, never mind these guys? Goes to school and tells everyone at school this is my dad and this is my dad. How do they explain were the mother is? I would think it would potentially cause a lot of psychological issues for the child. What the adults go through I am not interested in but it is the child that will have the difficult time

...because of people like you, who minimize "family" to mom+dad+ child!

Society is not built on queers it is built on heterosexual relationships but maybe no one told you that

Society includes us all, not just the people you approve of.

Unfortunately that is true. However it isnt just me, maybe you have noticed there are a lot around the world with similar thoughts. I understand you all feel you are special but you are not

[SoiBiker]

Why?

No mum......

I don't want to get too personal here.. but you sound like you have some issues about absent mothers.

I am sorry if you had a bad experience growing up without a mother, for whatever reason... but millions of children grow up with no mother.. even here in Thailand...

A child does not have to have a mother raise it in order for it to be happy... and this child of the 2 gay men will not be raised in isolation with only these 2 guys for company.

The men will have families too.. so the child will have grandmothers, female cousins, etc so the child will not lack female company.

Sorry but you do not understand anything I have been saying....

I do not give a toss about the gay thing, but I do give a toss about a babe being created because a guy does not like women and a kid will not have it's mum, was bought.

Of course kids grow up without mums, but they probably knew who they were or dad talked about mum. Not in this case where a kid will be told you were created for a fistful of dollars..

This is a discussion where I write my thoughts, some folk here have agreed with my thoughts so for sure I am not alone with those thoughts..

PS. I had a mum who passed on at 85...

So if they adopted a child you'd be fine about them raising it together?

[SoiBiker]

Society is not built on queers it is built on heterosexual relationships but maybe no one told you that

Society includes us all, not just the people you approve of.

Unfortunately that is true. However it isnt just me, maybe you have noticed there are a lot around the world with similar thoughts. I understand you all feel you are special but you are not

So we should deny rights from gay people because a minority of you find them icky?

Edited April 28, 2016 by SoiBiker

[DM07]

Society is built on a diversity of life-styles, opinions and orientations.

And it is -has to be- open to change!

Otherwise, how about going back to burning witches?

Being gay is not a lifestyle. That is very dated, trivialities it, and implies it is s choice. A lifestyle is something like being into surfing.

I know...that's why I included "orientations"

I actually meant "lifestyle" not connected to "being gay", but more in terms of diversity.

Being gay is also not an opinion...

[Sheryl]

Posts with personal attacks on other members and replies to same have been removed.

[Jingthing]

Society is built on a diversity of life-styles, opinions and orientations.

And it is -has to be- open to change!

Otherwise, how about going back to burning witches?

Being gay is not a lifestyle. That is very dated, trivialities it, and implies it is s choice. A lifestyle is something like being into surfing.

I know...that's why I included "orientations"

I actually meant "lifestyle" not connected to "being gay", but more in terms of diversity.

Being gay is also not an opinion...

I see that ... and we agree. Perhaps it will be informative to others that referring to being gay as a "lifestyle choice" does not reflect reality.

[Johnniey]

I actually meant "lifestyle" not connected to "being gay", but more in terms of diversity.

Being gay is also not an opinion...

I see that ... and we agree. Perhaps it will be informative to others that referring to being gay as a "lifestyle choice" does not reflect reality.

Please keep on topic. May here couldn't care less about whether you being gay is a lifestyle or choice.

The gay husbands withheld their gayness and the Thai mother didn't like the idea as it goes against traditional Thai values.

I'm sure she loves gay people as many Thais do because they are "sanook", but not as a family unit.

[balo]

Maybe better to just close this thread ? One child is now going to grow up in the west , in a modern society where she will have a good life . And gay family or not , who cares.

[Jingthing]

Maybe better to just close this thread ? One child is now going to grow up in the west , in a modern society where she will have a good life . And gay family or not , who cares.

Well, yes, but until we get the news that their airplane has left Bangkok, it's not completely over.

I'm still wondering what the story is on any TIME LIMITS on the surrogate woman's right to appeal.

They can't leave until it's known she won't appeal.

[DM07]

I actually meant "lifestyle" not connected to "being gay", but more in terms of diversity.

Being gay is also not an opinion...

I see that ... and we agree. Perhaps it will be informative to others that referring to being gay as a "lifestyle choice" does not reflect reality.

Please keep on topic. May here couldn't care less about whether you being gay is a lifestyle or choice.

The gay husbands withheld their gayness and the Thai mother didn't like the idea as it goes against traditional Thai values.

I'm sure she loves gay people as many Thais do because they are "sanook", but not as a family unit.

...it goes against traditional Thai values?

Whereas taking money for her "services", probably not even being able to read the contract for all the $-signs in her eyes, much less understanding it...that is in total sync with the "values", right?!

Or was she beaten unconscious, abducted and had the egg implanted into her reproductive- system?

Why can't you just be honest: you don't care for the woman even less then for the child.

All you care for, is that to people full of "gayness" are now raising a child and that goes against YOUR values.

[Bluespunk]

Society is not built on queers it is built on heterosexual relationships but maybe no one told you that

Society is built on a diversity of life-styles, opinions and orientations.

And it is -has to be- open to change!

Otherwise, how about going back to burning witches?

Humans have been on this planet many thousands of years, the "practice" in question can only be done via fairly recent medical advances, if wasn't for that we would not have this thread and the two guys would live out their life with their lifestyle.

Seems now the technology is there to clone a human but is taboo, and rightly so..

This case has nothing to do with cloning.

[smotherb]

If you want to have children get into a relationship with the opposite sex. If you choose to be in a gay relationship then the natural consequence is that it should be childless. That is the choice you make being gay.

The choice they made being gay was to have children.

But they can't.....A blind man wants too see, but he can't..

The Thai court just awarded them custody, so they can.

"Bangkok's Juvenile and Family Court ruled that the legal guardian of the 15-month-old child, named Carmen, is her American biological father, Gordon Lake" http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/912893-gay-couple-wins-custody-battle-against-thai-surrogate-mother/?utm_source=newsletter-20160427-0706&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=news

Gordon is the biological father. Are you advocating the denial of a father the right to his child?

The way it was done...Yes....Baby to order cos the guy don't like ladies....It's shit..

So if they'd adopted, you wouldn't have a problem with it?

No, cos the guardians would tell the kid..."We came forward to take care of you cos you have no parents, your mum and dad are dead, your mum and dad don't want you, your mum and dad....."...

So basically, despite all your attempts to argue about the details, you just don't think gay people should be allowed to raise kids?

Wasn't that obvious?

[Johnniey]

I actually meant "lifestyle" not connected to "being gay", but more in terms of diversity.

Being gay is also not an opinion...

I see that ... and we agree. Perhaps it will be informative to others that referring to being gay as a "lifestyle choice" does not reflect reality.

Please keep on topic. May here couldn't care less about whether you being gay is a lifestyle or choice.

The gay husbands withheld their gayness and the Thai mother didn't like the idea as it goes against traditional Thai values.

I'm sure she loves gay people as many Thais do because they are "sanook", but not as a family unit.

...it goes against traditional Thai values?

Whereas taking money for her "services", probably not even being able to read the contract for all the $-signs in her eyes, much less understanding it...that is in total sync with the "values", right?!

Or was she beaten unconscious, abducted and had the egg implanted into her reproductive- system?

Why can't you just be honest: you don't care for the woman even less then for the child.

All you care for, is that to people full of "gayness" are now raising a child and that goes against YOUR values.

I care for the poor child.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/lauretta-brown/adults-raised-gay-couples-speak-out-against-gay-marriage-federal-court

[Bluespunk]

I actually meant "lifestyle" not connected to "being gay", but more in terms of diversity.

Being gay is also not an opinion...

I see that ... and we agree. Perhaps it will be informative to others that referring to being gay as a "lifestyle choice" does not reflect reality.

Please keep on topic. May here couldn't care less about whether you being gay is a lifestyle or choice.

The gay husbands withheld their gayness and the Thai mother didn't like the idea as it goes against traditional Thai values.

I'm sure she loves gay people as many Thais do because they are "sanook", but not as a family unit.

She wasn't and isn't and never will be the mother.

[Johnniey]

I actually meant "lifestyle" not connected to "being gay", but more in terms of diversity.

Being gay is also not an opinion...

I see that ... and we agree. Perhaps it will be informative to others that referring to being gay as a "lifestyle choice" does not reflect reality.

Please keep on topic. May here couldn't care less about whether you being gay is a lifestyle or choice.

The gay husbands withheld their gayness and the Thai mother didn't like the idea as it goes against traditional Thai values.

I'm sure she loves gay people as many Thais do because they are "sanook", but not as a family unit.

She wasn't and isn't and never will be the mother.

What does it say as the headline to this thread?

[Bluespunk]

Please keep on topic. May here couldn't care less about whether you being gay is a lifestyle or choice.

The gay husbands withheld their gayness and the Thai mother didn't like the idea as it goes against traditional Thai values.

I'm sure she loves gay people as many Thais do because they are "sanook", but not as a family unit.

She wasn't and isn't and never will be the mother.

What does it say as the headline to this thread?

Yeah cause headlines are always bang on accurate...

She is a surrogate who has no biological link to the child.

She is not her mother.

[Jingthing]

Do gays make BETTER parents?

It's a loaded question the same as if you asked if Canadians make better parents.

Obviously some people are better at parenting than others.

You can't generalize anything like that applying to all of a particular identity group.

But still of interest as a counter to the usual anti-gay propaganda:

The bottom line, Stacey said, is that people who say children need both a father and a mother in the home are misrepresenting the research, most of which compares children of single parents to children of married couples. Two good parents are better than one good parent, Stacey said, but one good parent is better than two bad parents. And gender seems to make no difference. While you do find broad differences between how men and women parent on average, she said, there is much more diversity within the genders than between them.

http://www.livescience.com/17913-advantages-gay-parents.html

[Bluespunk]

She wasn't and isn't and never will be the mother.

What does it say as the headline to this thread?

Yeah cause headlines are always bang on accurate...

She is a surrogate who has no biological link to the child.

She is not her mother.

The umbilical chord will disagree......

Makes no difference.

Once the embryo is implanted there is no transfer of DNA from the host to the embryo.

She has no biological link to the child.

[kannot]

I hope they didnt have to pay anyone......

The only reason they got this kid was because they have money. So immoral.

yeah soooooooooooo much better for young somchai to pork a village lass then do a runner leaving her "holding the baby" with none or little funding eh???

[Johnniey]

I hope they didnt have to pay anyone......

The only reason they got this kid was because they have money. So immoral.

yeah soooooooooooo much better for young somchai to pork a village lass then do a runner leaving her "holding the baby" with none or little funding eh???

Are you asking me?

I don't see the relevance of the question.

I can't figure your motive, unless you just don't like Thais.

[Jingthing]

Really not much more to say until there is an update on whether they are allowed to exit Thailand or not.

Hopefully they can get out of Dodge and this adorable international family can be private people carrying on with their lives as I'm sure was always their desire.

Edited April 28, 2016 by Jingthing

[BritManToo]

I can't figure your motive, unless you just don't like Thais.

They aren't really likable.

[JUDAS]

Really not much more to say until there is an update on whether they are allowed to exit Thailand or not.

Hopefully they can get out of Dodge and this adorable international family can be private people carrying on with their lives as I'm sure was always their desire.

I'm not sure how child custody case is classified but if it falls under "civil law" then it appears that any appeal must be lodged within one month.

http://www.bia.co.th/030.html

[Jingthing]

Hmm. Ouch.