Westerners waiing to Thais.Why would you?

[ardokano]

The numbers in the chart are seriously flawed, some of them assume the entire population shakes hands as its preferred method of greeting!

Indonesia for example is 86% Muslim where their religion forbids contact between men and unrelated women hence handshake is not the norm., ditto the 1.6 billion Muslims globally.

And India represents 1.4 billion people out of a global population of circa 7.6 billion, the handshake is not the dominant form of greeting in India.

China, population 1.5 billion, huge numbers of rural Chinese have never seen a Westerner let alone shook hands before.

Middle East, population 250 million, the handshake is not the norm.

Japan, population ....

Enough already, 72% my Aunt Fanny!

1.you probably have not been to China. Chines get from westermer communism.. so for a lot of Chinese normal handshake.

2. For muslim its normal too( we not talking about women or not) many muslim not eat with woman so now you can say for muslim people not normal eat?

[howerde]

Many considerations, the social status/age and many other aspects decide the 'WAI', just as the height of your hands, how firmly grasped of just loose, kind of just like a limp handshake, most non Thais are clueless they just think a 'wai' is a handshake,

I find a nod and a wink does it.

Edited May 30, 2016 by howerde

[chiang mai]

The numbers in the chart are seriously flawed, some of them assume the entire population shakes hands as its preferred method of greeting!

Indonesia for example is 86% Muslim where their religion forbids contact between men and unrelated women hence handshake is not the norm., ditto the 1.6 billion Muslims globally.

And India represents 1.4 billion people out of a global population of circa 7.6 billion, the handshake is not the dominant form of greeting in India.

China, population 1.5 billion, huge numbers of rural Chinese have never seen a Westerner let alone shook hands before.

Middle East, population 250 million, the handshake is not the norm.

Japan, population ....

Enough already, 72% my Aunt Fanny!

1.you probably have not been to China. Chines get from westermer communism.. so for a lot of Chinese normal handshake.

2. For muslim its normal too( we not talking about women or not) many muslim not eat with woman so now you can say for muslim people not normal eat?

I lived in China for two years, In Beijing and later three months each in Dalian, Shenyang, Nanjing then Guangdong Province.

The subject is the handshake not eating, Muslim men do not shake hands with unrelated women.

[hawker9000]

^^^ except that a police officer does not have a higher social status, (to me) nor does a doctor, an Imm. officer or a business associate.... so no wais for them, unless they wai me first.

Dude, if you want to overlay your own egalitarian culture and beliefs, that's fine. (Well, it's amusing anyway.) But then don't prattle or pretend about respecting Thai culture. You can't have it both ways.

Yo Bro, allow me to "prattle" I do not respect culture, I live it. I have egalitarian beliefs when it comes to mutual respect but the statement you quote is not about that. Quite the opposite, due to my achievments, age and wealth I am not "inferior" to a cop, a beurocrat or an MD. (examples used in the post I was replying to) so I will not behave in a way that implies I am.

My egaltarian culture does not demand that those of lesser age, achienments or wealth grovel to me. On topic, My wai is reserved for friends, mutual and simultanious, or returning it to those that wai me. Hope this clears your confusion.

Oh I'm sure.

[garryjohns]

It's sometimes funny to watch when newbies and tourists wai the bell boy, the girl in the 7/11 twenty something year old taxi driver.

It is funny indeed,but its not funny when you make insinuations against me that are simply lies !

Show me where i said that 70 million people are stupid .

You cant, can you and you are not man enough to admit it,

Oh, OK then:

"shaking hands would be "normal" behaviour, not a stupid local custom".

Ahhhhhmmmm rather deceitful, despicable and desperate attempt to discredit me don't you think?

The words that you post here and attribute to me are YOUR own words .

I had simply quoted YOUR words in reply to your rave.Yes?

Yes, i get the irony part of your post, but no need to go twisting my reply to suit your own agenda.

Posted 2016-05-28 20:07:16

chiang mai, on 28 May 2016 - 18:27, said:

A Thai poster writes, " Dear Agony Aunt, I now live in the UK and everyone here wants to shake my hand when we meet and I think this is stupid, why would I bow to some stupid local custom, what do you advise".

Readers can construct their own replies as they see fit.

Edited May 31, 2016 by garryjohns

[ardokano]

The numbers in the chart are seriously flawed, some of them assume the entire population shakes hands as its preferred method of greeting!

Indonesia for example is 86% Muslim where their religion forbids contact between men and unrelated women hence handshake is not the norm., ditto the 1.6 billion Muslims globally.

And India represents 1.4 billion people out of a global population of circa 7.6 billion, the handshake is not the dominant form of greeting in India.

China, population 1.5 billion, huge numbers of rural Chinese have never seen a Westerner let alone shook hands before.

Middle East, population 250 million, the handshake is not the norm.

Japan, population ....

Enough already, 72% my Aunt Fanny!

1.you probably have not been to China. Chines get from westermer communism.. so for a lot of Chinese normal handshake.

2. For muslim its normal too( we not talking about women or not) many muslim not eat with woman so now you can say for muslim people not normal eat?

I lived in China for two years, In Beijing and later three months each in Dalian, Shenyang, Nanjing then Guangdong Province.

The subject is the handshake not eating, Muslim men do not shake hands with unrelated women.

I know many people live in China but "not go in China" , just home-office and few bar-restaraunt for foreigners .

Again in China is normal handshaking, proposition HOT water, tea, and cigarettes..

(I lived in China near 6 year)

Yes subject is handshake, but its be us example. if muslim not it with wimen its not mean they not eating.

if they not handshaking with women its not mean they not handshaking.. Handshaking for muslim its normal and often it be buy two hand

and then necking.

[chiang mai]

Ahhhhhmmmm rather deceitful, despicable and desperate attempt to discredit me don't you think?

The words that you post here and attribute to me are YOUR own words .

I had simply quoted YOUR words in reply to your rave.Yes?

Yes, i get the irony part of your post, but no need to go twisting my reply to suit your own agenda.

Posted 2016-05-28 20:07:16

chiang mai, on 28 May 2016 - 18:27, said:

A Thai poster writes, " Dear Agony Aunt, I now live in the UK and everyone here wants to shake my hand when we meet and I think this is stupid, why would I bow to some stupid local custom, what do you advise".

Readers can construct their own replies as they see fit.

Well, no, actually: I quoted an imaginary Thai poster who had written to an agony Aunt, I did so in order to make a point that people from other countries where a handshake is not the norm., probably feel the same way about the handshake when they visit an overseas country as many here, including you, feel about the wai greeting here.

You, replied to that post without quoting anything hence I believed/believe you think the wai is stupid.

And I'm not trying to score points or twist anything, I'm simply responding to the posts I read.

Looking at the broader picture there is no reason why the wai cannot be seen and respected as the national (not local) greeting that it is, used by almost 70 million people in a sovereign country it deserves more than to be dismissed as silly, stupid, belittling et al. It's as much a part and parcel of the landscape here as the bow is in Japan, namaste in India, salame in Malaysia, pseudo wai's in Sri Lanka and Korea, kisses on each cheek in France, hongi in New Zealand, sticking out your tongue in Tibet and at least a hundred other ways in as many different countries. To suggest the handshake is the preferred or majority way of greeting in the world is I think short sighted and insular and indicates a lack of respect for different cultures.

Edited May 31, 2016 by chiang mai

[chiang mai]

The numbers in the chart are seriously flawed, some of them assume the entire population shakes hands as its preferred method of greeting!

Indonesia for example is 86% Muslim where their religion forbids contact between men and unrelated women hence handshake is not the norm., ditto the 1.6 billion Muslims globally.

And India represents 1.4 billion people out of a global population of circa 7.6 billion, the handshake is not the dominant form of greeting in India.

China, population 1.5 billion, huge numbers of rural Chinese have never seen a Westerner let alone shook hands before.

Middle East, population 250 million, the handshake is not the norm.

Japan, population ....

Enough already, 72% my Aunt Fanny!

1.you probably have not been to China. Chines get from westermer communism.. so for a lot of Chinese normal handshake.

2. For muslim its normal too( we not talking about women or not) many muslim not eat with woman so now you can say for muslim people not normal eat?

I lived in China for two years, In Beijing and later three months each in Dalian, Shenyang, Nanjing then Guangdong Province.

The subject is the handshake not eating, Muslim men do not shake hands with unrelated women.

I know many people live in China but "not go in China" , just home-office and few bar-restaraunt for foreigners .

Again in China is normal handshaking, proposition HOT water, tea, and cigarettes..

(I lived in China near 6 year)

Yes subject is handshake, but its be us example. if muslim not it with wimen its not mean they not eating.

if they not handshaking with women its not mean they not handshaking.. Handshaking for muslim its normal and often it be buy two hand

and then necking.

On Saturday mornings in Beijing during 1996 and 1997 we'd go down to Tianamen and watch people fly kites, the location is a must see pilgrimage for first time visiting nationals from the west of the country - huge numbers of them would stop and stare at us because they'd never seen a white westerner before let alone ever shaken hands!

[connda]

The Japanese have NO expectations that westerners will have any idea 'how to bow correctly.' But they do appreciate the fact that they try.

I have a feeling that the Thais feel the same way. When we farang speak Thai and use the wrong tones, the Thais don't laugh at us. They don't expect us to know the correct tones and give us a bit more leeway in our speech. They most certainly DO appreciate the fact that we try to speak to them in their own language.

IMHO it's basically impossible for a falang to speak Thai with correct tones, unless they have been brought up with Thai from infancy. Just as Thais trip over our combined consonants in English.

My Thai GF was trying to explain the tone difference between Ngoo ( mouse ) and Ngoo ( snake ). While I could hear the difference in tone, my vocal chords could not reproduce it.

It gets even worse in her village, where many seem to speak in grunts.

My teerak will hug and kiss me in private. In public is a big no-no. Her family wais me, and I wai back.

I can say Ngoo ( mouse ) and Ngoo ( snake ) correctly, especially if it's written. I also know how to wai correctly.

However, I'll never be proficient at the Thai language (simply started too late in life), and just like walking to left side of the car to open the drivers door or turning on the wind shield wipers when signalling left, I will occasionally screw up waiing too (I may know how to wai, but sometimes the hand-brain synapses don't fire in the correct order - rack it up to age). As ME Smith noted, a smile and a nod from a farang = 1 wai. You can't go wrong.

[ardokano]

On Saturday mornings in Beijing during 1996 and 1997 we'd go down to Tianamen and watch people fly kites, the location is a must see pilgrimage for first time visiting nationals from the west of the country - huge numbers of them would stop and stare at us because they'd never seen a white westerner before let alone ever shaken hands!

As i say : " I know many people live in China but "not go in China""

So how i see from your remarks its about you.

"because they'd never seen a white westerner before" ©

But they seen they liders of communist and NOT western white .

WOSHOU- handshake NOW normal in China as HUISHOU,BAISHOU,ZHAOSHOU- differetn type greeting waving hand/s or JUGONG,HAYAO- different type depths bow.

And starts it even in 70s...

And Now( last 20-30years) add was the transfer of a business card with two hands ..

no offense ..

[JaseTheBass]

I have a confession to make...

I waid my doctor the other day.

Actually, my office is a wai- free zone. I make a concious effort to nurture an atmosphere of equality and mutual respect due to quality work done by all my staff.

All of them buy into it an all love working with us (especially this weekend as I have treated them all to a weekend away at a Thai mansion).

[amexpat]

I can say Ngoo ( mouse ) and Ngoo ( snake ) correctly, especially if it's written. ...........

I hope that was just a typo.

[PBR STREETGANG]

When in doubt, I execute a a proper curtsy.

That gets some looks.

[ardokano]

To be honest, the name of a Thai greeting I did not know before reading this topic.

But I do it sometimes, it's depend of my mood..

[JaseTheBass]

I have a confession to make...

I waid my doctor the other day.

Actually, my office is a wai- free zone. I make a concious effort to nurture an atmosphere of equality and mutual respect due to quality work done by all my staff.

All of them buy into it an all love working with us (especially this weekend as I have treated them all to a weekend away at a Thai mansion).

When we were leaving our weekend getaway this afternoon, my staff all lined up and waiied me. Bugger!

[FruitPudding]

My favourite is the one-handed wai.  I do it even when there is nothing in my other hand.

 

 

[Mekong Thunder]

On 05/06/2016 at 4:48 PM, JaseTheBass said:

On 03/06/2016 at 3:35 PM, JaseTheBass said:

I have a confession to make...

I waid my doctor the other day.

Actually, my office is a wai- free zone. I make a concious effort to nurture an atmosphere of equality and mutual respect due to quality work done by all my staff.

All of them buy into it an all love working with us (especially this weekend as I have treated them all to a weekend away at a Thai mansion).

When we were leaving our weekend getaway this afternoon, my staff all lined up and waiied me. Bugger!

"All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others" ~ George Orwell,Animal Farm.

[richard_smith237]

There's nothing wrong with being mutually respectful... 

 

Some Westerners trip over themselves trying too hard and in the process make buffoons of themselves. 

Others try so hard to prove there is no need to make any alteration to their Westernised behaviour and in their stubbornness alienate themselves. 

 

Somewhere in-between lives the levels of appropriate behaviour many of us has become comfortable. 

 

----------

 

Others have commented on the 'one handed wai'... Its something I find myself doing a lot when my hands are full...  In the majority of cases it is the simple effort that is respected and noted. 

Edited October 15, 2016 by richard_smith237

[Rhys]

A smile sometimes may work..

[JaseTheBass]

A saucy wink often does the trick

Sent from my R2D2 using my C3P0 manservant

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎25‎.‎05‎.‎2016 at 8:39 PM, MadMac said:

Nothing wrong with it, just a different form of greeting. You can use one hand or just nod if your hands are full. Imagine they would do that nose thing as the Kiwis or kiss you like the communists

Why accuse Kiwis of the nose thing? Most Kiwis are not Maoris and don't do it, any more than they wear flax skirts.

 

I don't wai and never have except twice, once when I mistakenly wai'd a child, and once when I was asked to do so by my fiancé to her mother, but she taught me the correct way to do so in that situation.

We don't know how to do it and the Thais don't expect us to anyway.

Insulting someone by wai'ing the wrong way is worse that not wai'ing at all, IMO.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎29‎.‎05‎.‎2016 at 7:05 PM, chiang mai said:

The numbers in the chart are seriously flawed, some of them assume the entire population shakes hands as its preferred method of greeting!

Indonesia for example is 86% Muslim where their religion forbids contact between men and unrelated women hence handshake is not the norm., ditto the 1.6 billion Muslims globally.

And India represents 1.4 billion people out of a global population of circa 7.6 billion, the handshake is not the dominant form of greeting in India.

China, population 1.5 billion, huge numbers of rural Chinese have never seen a Westerner let alone shook hands before.

Middle East, population 250 million, the handshake is not the norm.

Japan, population ....

Enough already, 72% my Aunt Fanny!

When I grew up it wasn't good manners to shake a female's hand, but now it is. Times change and nothing is set in stone. Wai or not, who gives a toss? Just do whatever you are comfortable with.

[SaintLouisBlues]

Worst of all, Westerners who wai other Westerners

[e2x10]

To be respectful and polite..

Don't strain yourself.

[Support]

Inappropriate comment removed

[BaldPlumber]

Worst of all, Westerners who wai other Westerners

Also westerners who talk ridiculous thaiglish to other westerners.

Same same but different - just stop it.

[Teak]

On 2016-05-25 at 8:17 AM, Johpa said:

Oh please, in casual situations there is no right or wrong way to wai. Sure when greeting a higher ranking monk, or greeting a respected elderly person at a wedding or funeral, or attempting to curry favor and kiss the derriere of some corrupt local official you might be more focused upon where you place your hands. But when you are joining your neighbors for food or drink, and this is for the minority of us here on TV who interact with our Thai neighbors on a daily basis and do not consider a housing estate to be a muubaan, few Thais pay much attention to the details of how you, as a non-Thai, wai.

 

On 2016-05-25 at 9:59 AM, HampiK said:

 

 

[Teak]

Johpa...when a mid/lower, level bureaucrat enters the village and intentionally proffers a mid/lower level Wai to the White Guy; to display their status to the local Thais. This becomes interesting regarding how we respond. In my mind there is a 6 inch  acceptable reply variable, above or below . I tend to exactly match the height offered and not an inch higher or lower. It is noticed by the Thais around.

Of course, if I intend to ingratiate myself I offer 6 inches higher and 'potentially' either embarrass the individual for their low wai and show my most respect to the rural potentate ...or,  if  I am not pleased with the bureaucrat I drop the wai 12 inches to show my disrespect...and make a potential enemy.   Between acknowledged friends and neighbours, of course, the position is irrelevant, just get on with it and pass the 'lao cao'  , ...Ken

[jak2002003]

On ‎16‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 4:37 AM, SaintLouisBlues said:

Worst of all, Westerners who wai other Westerners

Ha!. I found myself doing that by accident a couple of times.  Its just a reflex action now.. as I usually am around Thai people.  If you live here a long time and usually mix in Thai circles, its an easy 'mistake' to make.  I have been back to the UK only once for a week in all my years here.. and its hard to stop saying 'thank you' in Thai language for the first day or 2.

 

Also I sometimes caught myself speaking a little pigeon English with another farang subconsciously (particularly if the farang is not a native English speaker).  This is because I speak Thai day to day more than English.. and when my lazy brain translates back to English I find myself speaking the English words, but in the same sentence structure as the Thai sentence.  I even forget a few English words now and again and have to ask my Thai friend (who speaks very good English) what the English word is for something.