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Should Corbyn Quit or Be Pushed, as Leader of the UK Labour Party ?

Ricardo

By Ricardo
in Home Country Forum

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Ricardo Star Member

Ricardo

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Over the past week-end several of the Opposition's shadow-cabinet have quit, following the performance of their leader during the run-up to the Brexit vote, and David Cameron's example of resigning as PM.

One reason given for their rebellion is simply that, having nominally campaigned for Remaining, he then ran a fairly lack-lustre campaign which calls into doubt his campaigning abilities, and they say that they want someone better as leader.

Another reason is that traditional Labour-voters/areas were clearly largely pro-Brexit, and that his party failed to reflect that stance, so they need (like the Conservatives) to pick a new pro-Brexit leader in order to reflect their supporters' views.

In contrast the Lib-Dems, a small third-force who were in coallition with the Conservatives in the previous administration, have said that they remain pro-EU and will campaign on that platform in the next general-election, whenever that may be.

Is Corbyn right to insist on remaining party-leader, or should he follow Cameron's example & fall-on-his-sword, to make way for a new party-leader who is more in touch with traditional Labour-supporters' views ?

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Suradit69 Diamond Member

Suradit69

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Posted

The poor Brits. What a bunch of hopeless people.

Yes it does seem to indicate a headlong rush into third world status.

The ratings agencies have already downgraded their credit worthiness with warnings of worse to come. Property prices fall and bank shares drop so far & fast that trading has been halted.

There was even a Brexit from UEFA Euro 2016.

Worrying about whether some politicians do this or that is really a case of arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

UK financial markets remain volatile in the wake of the Brexit vote, with sterling plunging to a 31-year low against the dollar, and some share trading temporarily halted.

Yields on 10-year government bonds sank below 1% for the first time as investors bet on an interest rate cut.

Shares in airlines, housebuilders and banks were worst hit, with sharp falls causing a momentary halt in trading.

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Shiver Advanced Member

Shiver

Posted
Posted

The turnout % to vote suggests people feel that this was more important than national politics, whatever their stance either Nationally or Internationally.

I'm just waiting to see if any EU countries that use the Euro choose to hold a referendum too. The implications of that would be far greater (should it turn out to be an exit vote I mean). Just think what subprime in USA (one market segment in one country) did to the whole planet. We've got far more interesting stuff to look forward to than little Britain (I'm northern England working class by origin fwiw).

If that should come to pass, then cryptos hold onto your hats...

Oh, and since the petition for having a re-referendum managed to get 36,000+ supporters from the Vatican (population 800), I think the next vote should be done on a decentralised blockchain too. There will be any number of people willing to work for free to ensure integrity of the numbers, all open source for anyone interested to see.

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MissAndry Apprentice Member

MissAndry

Posted
Posted

How Corbyn ever got elected to leader of the Labour party is beyond belief.

He is a total communist waste of space.

Spineless useless bigot.

Before he became leader, he appeared to be a good bet, with a bit of integrity.

Then he did a u-turn and became another Obama.

If he'd stuck to his original LEAVER stance, he would have been next prime minister.

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Ricardo Star Member

Ricardo

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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/28/labour-crisis-vote-jeremy-corbyn-leadership-david-cameron-brexit/

" Jeremy Corbyn has lost two thirds of his Cabinet and seen more than 40 of his MPs revolt against his leadership over the last 48 hours. Today up to 150 MPs are expected to join together in an effort to oust the embattled party leader.

The rebels have criticised his performance in the EU referendum and called for him to stand down as leader but Mr Corbyn has promised to fight on. "

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IAMHERE Platinum Member

IAMHERE

Posted
Posted

The poor Brits. What a bunch of hopeless people.

It was only a 'referendum', the UK isn't ruled by referendum; the UK is a country ruled by law made in Parliament. BREXIT isn't law, hasn't been voted on by Parliament, nor will it be. Parliament has enough people that are from Scotland and London proper that there will never be a BREXIT bill passed in our lifetime. The end of UK being in the EU is greatly exaggerated.

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jeab1980 Gold Member

jeab1980

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Posted

The poor Brits. What a bunch of hopeless people.

It was only a 'referendum', the UK isn't ruled by referendum; the UK is a country ruled by law made in Parliament. BREXIT isn't law, hasn't been voted on by Parliament, nor will it be. Parliament has enough people that are from Scotland and London proper that there will never be a BREXIT bill passed in our lifetime. The end of UK being in the EU is greatly exaggerated.

Ihave no idea where you get this from yes a rreferendum is not legallybinding only the mp's can down it and that is never going to happen. There are not enough scotland mps to defeat it and I guarantee there will be a three line whip on both sides of the house when it comes to ratifiction of the Referendum . We will leave the EU and decide our own destiny as we have done for thousands of years .

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lungbing Gold Member

lungbing

Posted
Posted

Corbyn was elected as leader of the Labour party because the unions and activists thought the party should lurch to the left. That being despite the electorate punishing them at the last general election for being too far to the left already with Milliband. They could now go the whole hog and get somebody from the Socialist Workers Party as leader, or be more sensible and ignore their activists and get somebody closer to the middle.

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peterb17 Silver Member

peterb17

Posted
Posted

The poor Brits. What a bunch of hopeless people.

And you are from....?

With the hat , carefully sculptured beard, smirk - probably from the land of the free.

It's always strange that the guys who expect to stir up a rage of posts - never reply - actually quite like the hat- is it plastic?

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Ricardo Star Member

Ricardo

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Should Corbyn Quit or Be Pushed Out, as Leader of the UK Labour Party ?

Is this a rhetorical question?

Yes it is, but it's also another interesting story, arising out of the Referendum-result.

And that latest today (see previous post quoting from the Beeb) is that his fellow Labour MPs have indeed now voted 172 - 40 against his leadership, and called upon him to quit.

Amazing times. blink.png

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nellyp Silver Member

nellyp

Posted
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probably not the best leader for this, but definitely a guy I would have trusted do help my mam cross the road. the problem is, that he never publicly backed his beliefs, and that is why labour has taken thge opportunity to rebel against him. he has nbever had the backing of MPs, but now they feel they can rebel. I think that as we are going to go down this wild road, lets take a new leader. The trouble is that we will end up with the same <deleted>

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GuestHouse Diamond Member

GuestHouse

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Posted

I think the problems Labour and Corbyn are facing are the same as the problems the Tories are facing and are the real underlying problem that has brought about the Brexit vote.

Not what is wrong with Europe, but what is wrong with British Politics.

Corbyn won the leadership because he gained the support and built more support amongst grass roots Labour and left wing voters (plus as others have said he had the support of the unions). Corbyn offers something that the Labour party was founded on, representation of ordinary people by ordinary people selected from their own communities. Up until the time of Blair that is how Labour selected candidates, from each of the local constituencies and its why Labour MPs spoke with regional accents, why Labour MPs were such a mixed and (as Blair had noted) uncontrollably bunch of people.

Uncontrollable because they were selected by their local Labour Party, they came from and represented their local constituency and they owed their position, not to the leader of the Labour Party but to the local constituency.

Its as close to real democratic representation that any political party in the UK has ever come. But Blair knew he could not control that Labour Party so he changed the selection process where he and central office selected candidates, replacing local candidates with their local knowledge, local allegiances and local accents with 'Blair's Babes' and his hand picked professional politicians.

It is at precisely this point Labour stopped representing working people and at this point forward that the resentment started to grow in the political vacuum that Labour left wide open for the extreme right to step into.

The battle Corbyn now faces is with the remnants of Blair's Labour Party, the hand picked central office cadres who know full well that if Corbyn reverses selection and hands it back to the constituencies, they will be out of work.

Corbyn has refused to step down and he will now go back to his base support in the Labour Party membership.

You don't have to be a Labour Party supporter to see how important this battle is - It is exactly the battle for the UK to have members of parliament who come from, are selected by and represent ordinary people.

This is the fix UK politics needs to address the very reasonable complaint many Brexit supporters have made that they, ordinary people, are not being represented.

There are of course exceptions, tragically Jo Cox was one such exception. Though selected by central office, she was a local woman, she came from a working class family, won her place at the UK's best university purely on merit and then returned to represent the people she grew up with. We need more people like her

We need more ordinary people representing ordinary people in parliament and that is exactly the fight that is going on right now.

I don't think Corbyn is a great leader but what he is fighting for is the best hope we have for fixing our politics.

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eastendanto Senior Member

eastendanto

Posted
Posted

The poor Brits. What a bunch of hopeless people.

It was only a 'referendum', the UK isn't ruled by referendum; the UK is a country ruled by law made in Parliament. BREXIT isn't law, hasn't been voted on by Parliament, nor will it be. Parliament has enough people that are from Scotland and London proper that there will never be a BREXIT bill passed in our lifetime. The end of UK being in the EU is greatly exaggerated.

and if our elected MPs decided to ignore the wishes of the democratically held referendum and vote to stay in EEC gonna be one heck of a party over here..... 4th July will be a damp squid by comparison for fireworks!! I Think old Guy Fawkes might make a come back lol

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eastendanto Senior Member

eastendanto

Posted
Posted

I think the problems Labour and Corbyn are facing are the same as the problems the Tories are facing and are the real underlying problem that has brought about the Brexit vote.

Not what is wrong with Europe, but what is wrong with British Politics.

Corbyn won the leadership because he gained the support and built more support amongst grass roots Labour and left wing voters (plus as others have said he had the support of the unions). Corbyn offers something that the Labour party was founded on, representation of ordinary people by ordinary people selected from their own communities. Up until the time of Blair that is how Labour selected candidates, from each of the local constituencies and its why Labour MPs spoke with regional accents, why Labour MPs were such a mixed and (as Blair had noted) uncontrollably bunch of people.

Uncontrollable because they were selected by their local Labour Party, they came from and represented their local constituency and they owed their position, not to the leader of the Labour Party but to the local constituency.

Its as close to real democratic representation that any political party in the UK has ever come. But Blair knew he could not control that Labour Party so he changed the selection process where he and central office selected candidates, replacing local candidates with their local knowledge, local allegiances and local accents with 'Blair's Babes' and his hand picked professional politicians.

It is at precisely this point Labour stopped representing working people and at this point forward that the resentment started to grow in the political vacuum that Labour left wide open for the extreme right to step into.

The battle Corbyn now faces is with the remnants of Blair's Labour Party, the hand picked central office cadres who know full well that if Corbyn reverses selection and hands it back to the constituencies, they will be out of work.

Corbyn has refused to step down and he will now go back to his base support in the Labour Party membership.

You don't have to be a Labour Party supporter to see how important this battle is - It is exactly the battle for the UK to have members of parliament who come from, are selected by and represent ordinary people.

This is the fix UK politics needs to address the very reasonable complaint many Brexit supporters have made that they, ordinary people, are not being represented.

There are of course exceptions, tragically Jo Cox was one such exception. Though selected by central office, she was a local woman, she came from a working class family, won her place at the UK's best university purely on merit and then returned to represent the people she grew up with. We need more people like her

We need more ordinary people representing ordinary people in parliament and that is exactly the fight that is going on right now.

I don't think Corbyn is a great leader but what he is fighting for is the best hope we have for fixing our politics.

Very eloquently put .. however Corbyn is a <deleted> and the end of his tenure as Labour leader can't be far away whether he is pushed or resigns. Would you really want that man to lead your country in a crisis whether it be financial, economic, war etc........ I'd rather have Roy Hodgson in charge and thats saying something!!!

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GuestHouse Diamond Member

GuestHouse

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Posted

Very eloquently put .. however Corbyn is a <deleted> and the end of his tenure as Labour leader can't be far away whether he is pushed or resigns. Would you really want that man to lead your country in a crisis whether it be financial, economic, war etc........ I'd rather have Roy Hodgson in charge and thats saying something!!!

You completely missed the point of my post.

As I stated in my last sentence. I don't think Corbyn is a great leader but what he is fighting for is the best hope we have for fixing our politics.

The battle going on is not over Corbyn, its over who within the Labour Party gets to control power and representation. It is a debate that is at the heart of everything that is wrong with British Politics right now and for the past 25 years.

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Ricardo Star Member

Ricardo

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Very eloquently put .. however Corbyn is a <deleted> and the end of his tenure as Labour leader can't be far away whether he is pushed or resigns. Would you really want that man to lead your country in a crisis whether it be financial, economic, war etc........ I'd rather have Roy Hodgson in charge and thats saying something!!!

You completely missed the point of my post.

As I stated in my last sentence. I don't think Corbyn is a great leader but what he is fighting for is the best hope we have for fixing our politics.

The battle going on is not over Corbyn, its over who within the Labour Party gets to control power and representation. It is a debate that is at the heart of everything that is wrong with British Politics right now and for the past 25 years.

Absolutely ... he is leader because the rank-and-file voted for him.

But the Labour MPs don't have any confidence in him, many think he ran (deliberately as a Eurosceptic or through incompetence ?) a crap Remain-campaign and can't possibly lead them to election-victory, and therefore want him gone.

So which POV is going to win ?

IMO this mirrors the tussle between the people who voted in the referendum, who showed a split down-the-middle but leaning slightly towards Brexit, versus all the MPs in Parliament who have the power to reject their views and not actually endorse a vote to leave.

In that sense then Call-me-Dave is dodging a bullet by quitting when he has.

Interesting, isn't it ? rolleyes.gif

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jeab1980 Gold Member

jeab1980

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Posted

The problem with labour is the unions they rule the party. They were the ones who put Corbyn as leader with the block votes. And unfortunately when a new leadership contest is triggered (the no confidence vote is not binding) the same unions with the same block vote will if the traitor decides to stand again back him again. Then it's good bye Labour party for 10 to 20 years.

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superal Gold Member

superal

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Posted

Has to quit as has Cameron and cronies . How can he perform his duties when he does not believe in what he is doing ? He does not represent the working man as he is an advocate of immigration which is at the expense of the working man . Communist in disguise , me thinks .

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