Wine for the "Uneducated Palate"

[Rimmer]

Spelling police posts that tried to hijack the topic have been removed

[Berty100]

I noticed at Makro on Nua that they have an Australian boxed wine 13°, in white and red, named Brookford at 690 Baht for 5 liter.

There is no fill or expiry date on the boxes, reason why i gave it a miss, but in case anyone has tried it please share your opinion.

[craigt3365]

I noticed at Makro on Nua that they have an Australian boxed wine 13°, in white and red, named Brookford at 690 Baht for 5 liter.

There is no fill or expiry date on the boxes, reason why i gave it a miss, but in case anyone has tried it please share your opinion.

Beat me to it! Brookford is OK! The neighbors brought over a box this week for our party. Very drinkable!

[Berty100]

I noticed at Makro on Nua that they have an Australian boxed wine 13°, in white and red, named Brookford at 690 Baht for 5 liter.

There is no fill or expiry date on the boxes, reason why i gave it a miss, but in case anyone has tried it please share your opinion.

Beat me to it! Brookford is OK! The neighbors brought over a box this week for our party. Very drinkable!

Please delete my post then, because I see the Pattaya forum storming Makro now, before I can get there.

[xylophone]

I noticed at Makro on Nua that they have an Australian boxed wine 13°, in white and red, named Brookford at 690 Baht for 5 liter.

There is no fill or expiry date on the boxes, reason why i gave it a miss, but in case anyone has tried it please share your opinion.

Beat me to it! Brookford is OK! The neighbors brought over a box this week for our party. Very drinkable!

Brookfords is an Australian wine with fruit juice added, in much the same way as Montclair, Castle Creek etc.

Many others of that ilk around and at around the same price.

[prk888]

i note rocky123 mentioned Camden Park in another thread today

[xylophone]

i note rocky123 mentioned Camden Park in another thread today

Cheap enough that's for sure and at that price still contains the added fruit juice which many of this price range do, however as I've often said, if you like it, then drink it.

[Berty100]

I noticed at Makro on Nua that they have an Australian boxed wine 13°, in white and red, named Brookford at 690 Baht for 5 liter.

There is no fill or expiry date on the boxes, reason why i gave it a miss, but in case anyone has tried it please share your opinion.

Beat me to it! Brookford is OK! The neighbors brought over a box this week for our party. Very drinkable!

Brookfords is an Australian wine with fruit juice added, in much the same way as Montclair, Castle Creek etc.

Many others of that ilk around and at around the same price.

Haven't seen any around at 690 Baht for 5 liter, they are all around 200 Baht a liter or more. By the way when i first noticed it about 2 weeks ago it was only 620 Baht.

Bought one case this evening, labeled 690 Baht, but at the check out they tried to charge me 720 Baht instead.

They counted on the wrong Berty for that, got it at 690, but it shows that in 2 weeks it had 2 price increases already and it is still cheaper than the others.

By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box

Edited July 29, 2016 by Berty100

[xylophone]

Beat me to it! Brookford is OK! The neighbors brought over a box this week for our party. Very drinkable!

Brookfords is an Australian wine with fruit juice added, in much the same way as Montclair, Castle Creek etc.

Many others of that ilk around and at around the same price.

Haven't seen any around at 690 Baht for 5 liter, they are all around 200 Baht a liter or more. By the way when i first noticed it about 2 weeks ago it was only 620 Baht.

Bought one case this evening, labeled 690 Baht, but at the check out they tried to charge me 720 Baht instead.

They counted on the wrong Berty for that, got it at 690, but it shows that in 2 weeks it had 2 price increases already and it is still cheaper than the others.

By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box

"By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box"

True enough and as with most of the cask (boxed) wines from Oz, the fruit juice is added there as part of the process. France and South Africa, along with the USA and others are doing likewise, whether they be in cask or bottle.

[JSixpack]

I noticed at Makro on Nua that they have an Australian boxed wine 13°, in white and red, named Brookford at 690 Baht for 5 liter.

There is no fill or expiry date on the boxes, reason why i gave it a miss, but in case anyone has tried it please share your opinion.

Beat me to it! Brookford is OK! The neighbors brought over a box this week for our party. Very drinkable!

Brookfords is an Australian wine with fruit juice added, in much the same way as Montclair, Castle Creek etc.

Many others of that ilk around and at around the same price.

Sounds vile. I'll pass.

[fforest1]

Any one looking for cheap wine should check out the liqueur store on 2nd road

access from the old Tops supermarket...

They sell litter bottles of wine really cheap (at least for Thailand)

I am not promising top quality wine but I have bought it a few times and all I have to say is

I have had better and I have had worse......

[Berty100]

Beat me to it! Brookford is OK! The neighbors brought over a box this week for our party. Very drinkable!

Brookfords is an Australian wine with fruit juice added, in much the same way as Montclair, Castle Creek etc.

Many others of that ilk around and at around the same price.

Haven't seen any around at 690 Baht for 5 liter, they are all around 200 Baht a liter or more. By the way when i first noticed it about 2 weeks ago it was only 620 Baht.

Bought one case this evening, labeled 690 Baht, but at the check out they tried to charge me 720 Baht instead.

They counted on the wrong Berty for that, got it at 690, but it shows that in 2 weeks it had 2 price increases already and it is still cheaper than the others.

By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box

"By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box"

True enough and as with most of the cask (boxed) wines from Oz, the fruit juice is added there as part of the process. France and South Africa, along with the USA and others are doing likewise, whether they be in cask or bottle.

That is strange, because almost every of those box wines I notice that they are bottled in Thailand, and the fruit juice added in Thailand.

Since that is how they avoid the high tax, by importing less wine in volume, and that is also written on the boxes from Siam winery and alike.

And if I'm not mistaken, it was YOU who has made that known to everyone on this forum, so I wonder what your agenda with Brookford really is.

[grumpyoldman]

The OP started the thread with the term "Uneducated Palate'.

....and o.k., for you thinking the fruit wines out there, check the box or bottle in small letters it says "Fruit Wine" are o.k. then good for you, not a big deal, but really for those of us who have known wine in a classic sense for a long time, these wines suck massively.

Truly shameful that some renowned companies in Thailand due to poor direction have taken up this fruit wine production in search of margin only to only denigrate their line. Sure, there will always be people out there that want a cheap plonk in the fridge for 1 or 2 glasses, but people that actually enjoy wine REAL WINE, that fruit plonk is cr@p, nothing less.

To then sell to wholesale customers as a quality wine is fraud. A wine-like product,,,, a wine drink,,,,,,o.k. But don't go telling people it's actual wine, thats B.S.

[xylophone]

Haven't seen any around at 690 Baht for 5 liter, they are all around 200 Baht a liter or more. By the way when i first noticed it about 2 weeks ago it was only 620 Baht.

Bought one case this evening, labeled 690 Baht, but at the check out they tried to charge me 720 Baht instead.

They counted on the wrong Berty for that, got it at 690, but it shows that in 2 weeks it had 2 price increases already and it is still cheaper than the others.

By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box

"By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box"

True enough and as with most of the cask (boxed) wines from Oz, the fruit juice is added there as part of the process. France and South Africa, along with the USA and others are doing likewise, whether they be in cask or bottle.

That is strange, because almost every of those box wines I notice that they are bottled in Thailand, and the fruit juice added in Thailand.

Since that is how they avoid the high tax, by importing less wine in volume, and that is also written on the boxes from Siam winery and alike.

And if I'm not mistaken, it was YOU who has made that known to everyone on this forum, so I wonder what your agenda with Brookford really is.

Not sure what you mean by your last sentence as I really don't have an agenda with Brookford??

And to set the record straight, those wines "produced" by Siam winery in Thailand do not mention (or at least the earlier ones didn't) that fruit juice is added and the only way that you can see it is by looking for the very small print on the side of the box and you will notice the term "Fruit Wine" used.

I consider that to be misleading and that is the reason I have made that known on this and other threads (see Montclair wine thread) about wine here, because some people are just not aware of it. However the wines which are produced in Australia and have fruit juice added in Australia, clearly state it on the side of the box and good on them for doing so.

I have no agenda against any wine producer or anyone who wishes to produce wine with fruit juice added, provided it is clearly stated, and Siam winery IMO do not do this, a fact which has been highlighted on a few publications I have seen in the recent past, and one of which I believe I posted.

Drink what you like is my motto, and as I have mentioned before I don't like many spirits or many beers, however I have no problem with folks who drink these, same as with wine with fruit juice added – – simple as that, as long as you know what you are drinking.

Cheers!

[Berty100]

Haven't seen any around at 690 Baht for 5 liter, they are all around 200 Baht a liter or more. By the way when i first noticed it about 2 weeks ago it was only 620 Baht.

Bought one case this evening, labeled 690 Baht, but at the check out they tried to charge me 720 Baht instead.

They counted on the wrong Berty for that, got it at 690, but it shows that in 2 weeks it had 2 price increases already and it is still cheaper than the others.

By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box

"By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box"

True enough and as with most of the cask (boxed) wines from Oz, the fruit juice is added there as part of the process. France and South Africa, along with the USA and others are doing likewise, whether they be in cask or bottle.

That is strange, because almost every of those box wines I notice that they are bottled in Thailand, and the fruit juice added in Thailand.

Since that is how they avoid the high tax, by importing less wine in volume, and that is also written on the boxes from Siam winery and alike.

And if I'm not mistaken, it was YOU who has made that known to everyone on this forum, so I wonder what your agenda with Brookford really is.

Not sure what you mean by your last sentence as I really don't have an agenda with Brookford??

And to set the record straight, those wines "produced" by Siam winery in Thailand do not mention (or at least the earlier ones didn't) that fruit juice is added and the only way that you can see it is by looking for the very small print on the side of the box and you will notice the term "Fruit Wine" used.

I consider that to be misleading and that is the reason I have made that known on this and other threads (see Montclair wine thread) about wine here, because some people are just not aware of it. However the wines which are produced in Australia and have fruit juice added in Australia, clearly state it on the side of the box and good on them for doing so.

I have no agenda against any wine producer or anyone who wishes to produce wine with fruit juice added, provided it is clearly stated, and Siam winery IMO do not do this, a fact which has been highlighted on a few publications I have seen in the recent past, and one of which I believe I posted.

Drink what you like is my motto, and as I have mentioned before I don't like many spirits or many beers, however I have no problem with folks who drink these, same as with wine with fruit juice added – – simple as that, as long as you know what you are drinking.

Cheers!

Well to start, the topic of this thread is about the taste of wine, not so much about wine connoisseurs.

Next the point of my post was to find out if Brookford of which I was aware that it was a fruit wine was drinkable, which was confirmed by Craig, and which I have verified since.

But there are fruit wines and there are fruit wines, and Brookford seems to be one of the better category in all respects, primarily because it is produced and bottled in Australia.Something you seem to deny.

This is what i found in Phuket Gazette. I don't know if links to this source are allowed, so i refrain from posting the link.

If the roselle extract, mulberry, blueberry, pomegranate juice or whatever – all rich in vitamin C – is added later, then conceivably the nutritional value of the product is enhanced. A worrisome thought, though, is whether or not other substances have found their way into the mix: sugar to sweeten or promote secondary fermentation, finings to clarify, even raw alcohol to give it more strength.

A blue label signifies a wine that is vinified elsewhere and imported into the Kingdom. This is an important guarantee, because in wine-producing countries such as Australia, consumer laws demand stringent laboratory analysis: without full compliance, no wine is permitted to leave the country.

And hey, even Brookford is mentioned in the article.

Presumably, these are added during the process of fining, whereby impurities and solids are removed from the bottom of the fermentation tank. While it is reassuring that these additives are at least mentioned, as they are in another fine red wine with fruit juice called Brookford

Edited July 30, 2016 by Berty100

[yogi100]

Any one looking for cheap wine should check out the liqueur store on 2nd road

access from the old Tops supermarket...

They sell litter bottles of wine really cheap (at least for Thailand)

I am not promising top quality wine but I have bought it a few times and all I have to say is

I have had better and I have had worse......

Most of the wine they sell is also available in Friendship but cheaper.

[xylophone]

Haven't seen any around at 690 Baht for 5 liter, they are all around 200 Baht a liter or more. By the way when i first noticed it about 2 weeks ago it was only 620 Baht.

Bought one case this evening, labeled 690 Baht, but at the check out they tried to charge me 720 Baht instead.

They counted on the wrong Berty for that, got it at 690, but it shows that in 2 weeks it had 2 price increases already and it is still cheaper than the others.

By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box

"By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box"

True enough and as with most of the cask (boxed) wines from Oz, the fruit juice is added there as part of the process. France and South Africa, along with the USA and others are doing likewise, whether they be in cask or bottle.

That is strange, because almost every of those box wines I notice that they are bottled in Thailand, and the fruit juice added in Thailand.

Since that is how they avoid the high tax, by importing less wine in volume, and that is also written on the boxes from Siam winery and alike.

And if I'm not mistaken, it was YOU who has made that known to everyone on this forum, so I wonder what your agenda with Brookford really is.

Not sure what you mean by your last sentence as I really don't have an agenda with Brookford??

And to set the record straight, those wines "produced" by Siam winery in Thailand do not mention (or at least the earlier ones didn't) that fruit juice is added and the only way that you can see it is by looking for the very small print on the side of the box and you will notice the term "Fruit Wine" used.

I consider that to be misleading and that is the reason I have made that known on this and other threads (see Montclair wine thread) about wine here, because some people are just not aware of it. However the wines which are produced in Australia and have fruit juice added in Australia, clearly state it on the side of the box and good on them for doing so.

I have no agenda against any wine producer or anyone who wishes to produce wine with fruit juice added, provided it is clearly stated, and Siam winery IMO do not do this, a fact which has been highlighted on a few publications I have seen in the recent past, and one of which I believe I posted.

Drink what you like is my motto, and as I have mentioned before I don't like many spirits or many beers, however I have no problem with folks who drink these, same as with wine with fruit juice added – – simple as that, as long as you know what you are drinking.

Cheers!

Well to start, the topic of this thread is about the taste of wine, not so much about wine connoisseurs.

Next the point of my post was to find out if Brookford of which I was aware that it was a fruit wine was drinkable, which was confirmed by Craig, and which I have verified since.

But there are fruit wines and there are fruit wines, and Brookford seems to be one of the better category in all respects, primarily because it is produced and bottled in Australia.Something you seem to deny.

This is what i found in Phuket Gazette. I don't know if links to this source are allowed, so i refrain from posting the link.

If the roselle extract, mulberry, blueberry, pomegranate juice or whatever – all rich in vitamin C – is added later, then conceivably the nutritional value of the product is enhanced. A worrisome thought, though, is whether or not other substances have found their way into the mix: sugar to sweeten or promote secondary fermentation, finings to clarify, even raw alcohol to give it more strength.

A blue label signifies a wine that is vinified elsewhere and imported into the Kingdom. This is an important guarantee, because in wine-producing countries such as Australia, consumer laws demand stringent laboratory analysis: without full compliance, no wine is permitted to leave the country.

And hey, even Brookford is mentioned in the article.

Presumably, these are added during the process of fining, whereby impurities and solids are removed from the bottom of the fermentation tank. While it is reassuring that these additives are at least mentioned, as they are in another fine red wine with fruit juice called Brookford

Really don't know what you've got a "bee in your bonnet" about and you've obviously misunderstood some points I made.

I've never mentioned anything about wine connoisseurs, but like another poster (Grumpy Old Man) has stated, I like to drink wine made from grapes which can be called just plain wine, rather than wine with fruit juice added. What one drinks is entirely up to them, however I think it is good to know exactly what is in the bottle or cask and that's always been my main point.

I don't know what you think I am "denying" but I have stated that Brookford is produced in Australia along with its fruit juice and I've never mentioned anything about its quality?

There are many cask wines produced in Australia which have fruit juice added and I have tasted a few and I have even recommended one on another thread, especially for those folks who don't mind drinking wine mixed with fruit juice.

As has always been the case, my concern has been with the lack of disclosure on some of the cask wines, particularly those produced and sold by Siam winery.

Simple as that, because whether you have an uneducated palate or not, it's good to know exactly what you are drinking.

Cheers again.

[Berty100]

All the ingredients are not mentioned on the box, but as far as i'm aware the same applies for a bottle of coke or fanta, and that is exactly my point.

In Australia there are stringent controls of what is inside the fruit wine, so you can be assured that no fruit wine will leave the country that is unhealthy in one way or another, where in Thailand there is no control at all.

Most box wines available in Thailand are bottled in Thailand or Vietnam, where you can expect the same consumer law compliance as in Thailand, while Brookford is one of the only few as far as I'm aware that is produced AND bottled in Australia.

I feel much more confident that I'm not swallowing chemicals when buying a box of Brookford than when buying any box wine bottled in Vietnam or Thailand.

[xylophone]

3 hours ago, Berty100 said:

All the ingredients are not mentioned on the box, but as far as i'm aware the same applies for a bottle of coke or fanta, and that is exactly my point.

In Australia there are stringent controls of what is inside the fruit wine, so you can be assured that no fruit wine will leave the country that is unhealthy in one way or another, where in Thailand there is no control at all.

Most box wines available in Thailand are bottled in Thailand or Vietnam, where you can expect the same consumer law compliance as in Thailand, while Brookford is one of the only few as far as I'm aware that is produced AND bottled in Australia.

I feel much more confident that I'm not swallowing chemicals when buying a box of Brookford than when buying any box wine bottled in Vietnam or Thailand.

Again, I never said that all the ingredients were mentioned on the box?

And whether you like it or not, the following wines are produced and put into cask in Australia; Brookford, Jimberoo, Rumours, Bodegas Valley, Berri Estates......plus a few others that I can't recall at the moment.

If you don't think you are swallowing chemicals when you buy a box of Brookford (or many other wines for that matter), please consider this shortened list of chemicals and additives which are allowed in Australian wines. I think they will surprise you....... (and for the record, sulphur dioxide is used in just about all wine production, even some of those labelled organic).

Ascorbic acid                                                  

Agar

Alginates, calcium and potassium salts

Ammonium phosphates

Argon

Bentonite

Calcium carbonate

Calcium tartrate

Carbon dioxide

Cellulose

Chitosan sourced from Aspergillus niger

Collagen

Copper sulphate

Cupric citrate

Diatomaceous earth   

Carbon dioxide

Citric acid

Erythorbic acid

Gum Arabic

Lactic acid

Malic acid

Metatartaric acid

Potassium sorbate

Potassium sulphites

Sodium carboxymethylcellulose

Sorbic acid

Sulphur dioxide

Tartaric acid

Dimethyl dicarbonate

Dimethylpolysiloxane

Egg white

Enzymes

Gelatine

Hydrogen peroxide

Ion exchange resins

Isinglass

Lysozyme

Milk and milk products

Nitrogen

Oak

Perlite

Phytates

Plant proteins permitted as processing aids under clause 3(a) to Standard 1.3.3

Polyvinyl polypyrrolidone

Potassium carbonate

Potassium ferrocyanide

Potassium hydrogen carbonate

Potassium hydrogen tartrate

Silicon dioxide

Thiamin chloride

[Berty100]

2 hours ago, xylophone said:

Again, I never said that all the ingredients were mentioned on the box?

And whether you like it or not, the following wines are produced and put into cask in Australia; Brookford, Jimberoo, Rumours, Bodegas Valley, Berri Estates......plus a few others that I can't recall at the moment.

If you don't think you are swallowing chemicals when you buy a box of Brookford (or many other wines for that matter), please consider this shortened list of chemicals and additives which are allowed in Australian wines. I think they will surprise you....... (and for the record, sulphur dioxide is used in just about all wine production, even some of those labelled organic).

Ascorbic acid                                                  

 

Agar

 

Alginates, calcium and potassium salts

 

Ammonium phosphates

 

Argon

 

Bentonite

 

Calcium carbonate

 

Calcium tartrate

 

Carbon dioxide

 

Cellulose

 

Chitosan sourced from Aspergillus niger

 

Collagen

 

Copper sulphate

 

Cupric citrate

 

Diatomaceous earth   

 

Carbon dioxide

 

Citric acid

 

Erythorbic acid

 

Gum Arabic

 

Lactic acid

 

Malic acid

 

Metatartaric acid

 

Potassium sorbate

 

Potassium sulphites

 

Sodium carboxymethylcellulose

 

Sorbic acid

 

Sulphur dioxide

 

Tartaric acid

 

Dimethyl dicarbonate

 

Dimethylpolysiloxane

 

Egg white

 

Enzymes

 

Gelatine

 

Hydrogen peroxide

 

Ion exchange resins

 

Isinglass

 

Lysozyme

 

Milk and milk products

 

Nitrogen

 

Oak

 

Perlite

 

Phytates

 

Plant proteins permitted as processing aids under clause 3(a) to Standard 1.3.3

 

Polyvinyl polypyrrolidone

 

Potassium carbonate

 

Potassium ferrocyanide

 

Potassium hydrogen carbonate

 

Potassium hydrogen tartrate

 

Silicon dioxide

 

Thiamin chloride

 

I looked up a big part of the "chemicals" on your list, couldn't be bothered to look them up all, and found that most of them are present in all wines. Several of them aren't even added, or are chemicals, because they are present in the grapes or are a byproduct of the fermentation.

So regardless of how impressive your list may look, it means nothing, because none of them are harmful, and most of them are also present in wines for the "educated" palate.

I also didn't say that you ever mentioned that all ingredients are mentioned on the box, but I tried to make clear that it doesn't mean anything that they are not all mentioned on a box because that would be impossible.

So what I am saying for 3 posts already, but for which you seem to be blind, is that a boxed fruit wine produced and bottled in Australia is guaranteed to be of better quality as 80% of box wines available in Thailand. And this for the simple reason that those 80% are bottled in Thailand or Vietnam and may or may not have harmful ingredients, because there is no control on the substance.

[xylophone]

12 hours ago, Berty100 said:

I looked up a big part of the "chemicals" on your list, couldn't be bothered to look them up all, and found that most of them are present in all wines. Several of them aren't even added, or are chemicals, because they are present in the grapes or are a byproduct of the fermentation.

So regardless of how impressive your list may look, it means nothing, because none of them are harmful, and most of them are also present in wines for the "educated" palate.

I also didn't say that you ever mentioned that all ingredients are mentioned on the box, but I tried to make clear that it doesn't mean anything that they are not all mentioned on a box because that would be impossible.

So what I am saying for 3 posts already, but for which you seem to be blind, is that a boxed fruit wine produced and bottled in Australia is guaranteed to be of better quality as 80% of box wines available in Thailand. And this for the simple reason that those 80% are bottled in Thailand or Vietnam and may or may not have harmful ingredients, because there is no control on the substance.

You stated:-

1). “Well to start, the topic of this thread is about the taste of wine, not so much about wine connoisseurs”.

I never stated anything about wine connoisseurs and that is just your interpretation of what has been written.

2). “But there are fruit wines and there are fruit wines, and Brookford seems to be one of the better category in all respects, primarily because it is produced and bottled in Australia. Something you seem to deny”.

I have never denied anything about Brookford wine and I know it is “bottled” in Australia, again that is something you have stated, not me.

3). “And if I'm not mistaken, it was YOU who has made that known to everyone on this forum, so I wonder what your agenda with Brookford really is”.

I have no agenda with Brookford and I really don’t know where you are coming from with this, another one of your “interpretations”.

4). “By the way, Brookford is produced and bottled in Australia, it says on the box”.

I know and have stated that previously?

5). “Since that is how they avoid the high tax, by importing less wine in volume, and that is also written on the boxes from Siam winery and alike”,

Nothing like this is written on the boxes from Siam winery and that is my main point, lack of disclosure, something you seem to miss in my posts.

6). “All the ingredients are not mentioned on the box”.

Nobody ever said they were and I know of no wine producer who does this. Sulphites are however mentioned.

7). “I looked up a big part of the "chemicals" on your list………”.

I stated that these were chemicals and additives, not just chemicals, again selective reading on your part. And for the record some elements are found in wine, such as the acids (and if some of these acids are lacking, then more are added), however others are added to improve the taste, smell, colour and fining of the wines, not to mention the storage.

As anyone can see from your comments above, they don’t seem to follow much in the way of a logical pattern apart from selective reading.

My main and only point has always been about the wines with added fruit juice being clearly labelled (as are the Australian ones) as such, something I have pointed out time and time again, but which seems to have eluded you.

 You may or may not be right with regards to the  Australian wines being "guaranteed" to be better quality, however that again is subjective, because there is no guarantee.

Time to put this particular discussion to bed as going round in circles.

Edited August 2, 2016 by xylophone

[Stew41]

I think I am going to have to shed my prejudices on fruit wines. After pouring a totally cooked 2010 Bordeaux (660 baht) I fired up the reserve wine, a 250 baht fruit wine from Cumulus (NSW Central Highlands) under the 'Sixty Spokes' label which is cabernet-based. Not a fruit bomb but plenty of balance and nice blackberry notes. Definitely not sweet. Must be a decent alternative to cask wine at the price?

[Skeptic7]

9 hours ago, Stew41 said:

I think I am going to have to shed my prejudices on fruit wines. After pouring a totally cooked 2010 Bordeaux (660 baht) I fired up the reserve wine, a 250 baht fruit wine from Cumulus (NSW Central Highlands) under the 'Sixty Spokes' label which is cabernet-based. Not a fruit bomb but plenty of balance and nice blackberry notes. Definitely not sweet. Must be a decent alternative to cask wine at the price?

Yes...I buy boxes of red all the time. Some are quite good such as Berri Estates  (Australian) and Mar Sol (Chilean)...among others. Can get 3 - 4.5 liters for B699 -B999. For daily red wine drinkers, these are excellent budget alternatives. 

[xylophone]

13 hours ago, Stew41 said:

I think I am going to have to shed my prejudices on fruit wines. After pouring a totally cooked 2010 Bordeaux (660 baht) I fired up the reserve wine, a 250 baht fruit wine from Cumulus (NSW Central Highlands) under the 'Sixty Spokes' label which is cabernet-based. Not a fruit bomb but plenty of balance and nice blackberry notes. Definitely not sweet. Must be a decent alternative to cask wine at the price?

 

Such a bummer when that happens and oddly enough, just last night I had my 1st bottle of "corked" wine in ages (that's where the process of sterilising the corks interacts with something in the cork and produces a chemical called trichloroanisole giving a nasty smell and taste which permeates into the wine and basically ruins it).

 

Wasn't aware of the range of which you speak (Cumulus, Sixty Spokes) although you do mention it is a cabernet based wine with added fruit, although I can't find that mentioned on the website.

 

The main thing is that you enjoyed it and that's all that matters and as I've often said here I have no problem with people drinking what they like, as long as the producers make it quite clear on the label exactly what is in the bottle with regards to grapes and fruit.

 

For what it's worth I have taken wine back to both Big C and Villa Market both of which were either "cooked" or had turned vinegar-like due to a leaking cork, and after much arguing and remonstrating I got them changed! The turning point was when I asked them for a glass and poured the wine into the glass and let them look – – a cloudy mess which smelt of vinegar and bitter sherry, and suggested they might want to take a drink, and that did it.

 

 

 

Edited August 4, 2016 by xylophone

[Stew41]

1 hour ago, xylophone said:

 

Such a bummer when that happens and oddly enough, just last night I had my 1st bottle of "corked" wine in ages (that's where the process of sterilising the corks interacts with something in the cork and produces a chemical called trichloroanisole giving a nasty smell and taste which permeates into the wine and basically ruins it).

 

Wasn't aware of the range of which you speak (Cumulus, Sixty Spokes) although you do mention it is a cabernet based wine with added fruit, although I can't find that mentioned on the website.

 

The main thing is that you enjoyed it and that's all that matters and as I've often said here I have no problem with people drinking what they like, as long as the producers make it quite clear on the label exactly what is in the bottle with regards to grapes and fruit.

 

For what it's worth I have taken wine back to both Big C and Villa Market both of which were either "cooked" or had turned vinegar-like due to a leaking cork, and after much arguing and remonstrating I got them changed! The turning point was when I asked them for a glass and poured the wine into the glass and let them look – – a cloudy mess which smelt of vinegar and bitter sherry, and suggested they might want to take a drink, and that did it.

 

 

 

This one definitely badly oxidised but I suspect due to very dry cork. The bottle had likely been upright for some time.  Re returns I find this process hard enough in Australia outside of fine wine stores so I just won't even bother with the staff in Villa Market. I have seen nothing yet to suggest they have the ability to contribute to questions I may have although they are quite skilled at sitting on a stool staring into a phone. 

 

The Cumulus website doesn't provide details of the export labels. From what I have seen these comprise Sixty Spoke (about 250 baht, cabernet and shiraz based wines) and a 'Grand Bin' label at about 400 baht.  I reckon the Grand Bin would be worth a look as well.

[Oink]

Just had a look at a box of Mont Clair. It says "White Fruit Wine". I understood all wine is made from fruit juice?

Says nothing about added juice, grape or otherwise.

[xylophone]

13 minutes ago, Oink said:

Just had a look at a box of Mont Clair. It says "White Fruit Wine". I understood all wine is made from fruit juice?

Says nothing about added juice, grape or otherwise.

 

Regulations as regards wine production state that wine will be made from grapes. If it is made from anything else other than all grapes it cannot be called just "wine", hence the reason why anything with fruit juice added has to be called "fruit wine".

 

"Says nothing about added juice, grape or otherwise". And that has been my point all along – – if fruit juice has been added then it should be clearly stated as it is on most/all of the boxes/casks/bottles which now originate from Australia and indeed the one as mentioned above by "Stew41" does have that written on the bottle, and I know that for sure because today I went out and looked at one! 

[Stew41]

and onto the Sixty Spokes Bin 53 'Shiraz'. Not as good as the cab, IMHO, but still an entirely satisfactory mid-weeker. A little plummy sweetness early but this drops away as the fruit drys out. Some spice.  270 baht at Big C. I'll be back.  Oh, you need a magnifying glass to identify the 'fruit wine' classification on the back label...........just a bit shifty me thinks.

Quote

 

 

[Oink]

That would suggest that the fruit juice is added before fermentation producing "White fruit Wine" (probably apple juice due to high sugar content), not afterwards as some post imply.

[craigt3365]

13 hours ago, Oink said:

Just had a look at a box of Mont Clair. It says "White Fruit Wine". I understood all wine is made from fruit juice?

Says nothing about added juice, grape or otherwise.

As has been pointed out, you don't know exactly what's been added as it's not clearly stated.  You have no idea what juice was used.  If it was real grape juice, it'd say so, right?  They are real sneaky also.  My wife bought a bottle of wine on the recommendation of a store employee.  Said France on the label, looked French.  But in small print, it says made and bottled in Vietnam, and fruit juice.  Terrible way to mislead consumers.