Criticism grows for Trump's assailing of Muslim vet's family

[ilostmypassword]

1 hour ago, JHolmesJr said:

 

You're using only pure logic in your reasoning and discounting the huge emotional, religious and cultural factors.

Muslim ideology isn't something you shed by signing a piece of paper and reciting an oath.

Unless you grew up in the khan household and witnessed the upbringing of this son you should at least defer to the possibility that you may not be 100% correct.

 

I have a cool muzzlim friend, one of my best buddies…we go out on the piss and eat pulled pork sandwiches (his favourite)….he has a huge extended family and some of the stuff he tells me (that they tell him) is frightening. They absolutely loathe jews and do not trust anyone who isn't muzzlim. He has all but disowned them.

 

This Khan kid was obviously not a terrorist but don't be fooled….they are pakistanis holding an american passport.

You start out with this:  Unless you grew up in the khan household and witnessed the upbringing of this son you should at least defer to the possibility that you may not be 100% correct.

And end with this: This Khan kid was obviously not a terrorist but don't be fooled….they are pakistanis holding an american passport.

In other words you leapt from possiblity to certainty.  You leave out one huge fact:  this kid died fighting extremists who fought in the name of Islam.  And he volunteered to do it. He wasn't drafted.  I didn't think it was possible to sink lower than Trump.  Now I see that it is. Maybe Trump should be voting for you.

[JHolmesJr]

12 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

….you leapt from possiblity to certainty. 

because i am certain….they are pakistanis holding an american passport.

[Pinot]

6 hours ago, Publicus said:

 

The son was born in Dubai and graduated from John F. Kennedy High School in an upper middle class suburb of Washington DC, Chevy Chase Md. He was a grad of the University of Virginia and its US Army Senior ROTC program.

 

So it is six of one and a half dozen of another when Trump criticises a Gold Star Family and then some denizens assault the son because he was KIA. This is in fact the base nature of the Trump campaign of the 2016 Republican Party and its outcasts.

 

Each election of Potus military personnel in the all-volunteer armed forces are well known to vote Republican by a vast majority.

 

As the Military Times found in its survey in May....

 

In a new survey of American military personnel, Donald Trump emerged as active-duty service members' preference to become the next U.S. president, topping Hillary Clinton by more than a 2-to-1 margin. However, in the latest Military Times election survey, more than one in five troops said they’d rather not vote in November if they have to choose between just those two candidates.

 

But given only those choices, 21 percent of the service members surveyed said they would abstain from voting. More than 54 percent of the 951 troops Military Times surveyed said they would vote for Trump, the presumed Republican presidential nominee, over Clinton, the Democratic front-runner. Only about 25 percent said they would vote for Clinton in that matchup.

 

http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/election/2016/05/09/military-times-survey-donald-trump-beats-hillary-clinton/84132402/

 

The survey did not of course include religion as a basis of voting because in the US armed forces religion is both irrelevant and has absolutely no bearing on one's loyalty or performance. 

 

We continue to see over time why the Constitution subordinates the military to the civilian control of the commander in chief and his designated civilian officers who command the commanding generals and admirals in every respect always and forever. 

 

They'll do what you tell them to do. God AND Buddha AND Mohammad bless em. 

[Publicus]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Strange that the Vietnam war is universally remembered as a bad thing, and thousands of Americans left the country to avoid the daft, yet because Trump was able to avoid going to Vietnam  he is somehow a bad person. Have you forgotten that people were shouting filth at troops when they returned from the conflict? No gold star parents back then.

 

Trump did more than avoid the draft.

 

He's tried to present himself as the equivalent of a war veteran and as one who since running for president actually cares for veterans and the military that he in fact degrades in his rantings and rage. Until Trump announced for president he never for a moment did anything about veterans or their families. 

 

He's attacking a Gold Star Family based on their religion and the mass of highly financed rightwingnoid well funded media is of course pushing it as are their nasty followers.

 

(There were no Gold Star Parents during the Vietnam Conflict because the fool LBJ did not want to confess there was a war going on...it was a Conflict. There wasn't any GI Bill for education readjustment until later because at the time the GI Bill was activated only during wartime which brings us back to LBJ and Conflict again.) 

 

All Trump has done from day one in his wildman campaign is to present himself as the lunatic crackpot Ignoramus jerk that he in fact is. The official nominee of the 2016 Republican Party.

[Publicus]

1 hour ago, Pinot said:

 

They'll do what you tell them to do. God AND Buddha AND Mohammad bless em. 

 

Yes indeed.

 

The oath of enlistment in the US armed forces affirms loyalty to the Constitution, the commander in chief, to all superior officers, and to the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Revealingly, the UCMJ says to obey only the lawful orders of superior officers. 

 

Equally informative but of a greater significance, the oath commissioned officers of all the armed forces take affirms fidelity and loyalty to the Constitution. That's it. The Constitution appoints Potus as CinC but it is the Constitution that does this. 

 

If the CinC gives an unlawful order somebody with stars on his/her shoulders or a law degree might be inclined to pull out a pocket copy of the Constitution to stick it in his face.

[surangw]

Khizr Khan's premise was that   they would not have been allowed to immigrate  under

trump's plan.

 

Khizr Khan failed  to mention that was then, this is now,   things have change since then.

[Publicus]

 

The biggest change is that the 2016 Republican Party has nominated for Potus an wildman Ignoramus crackpot lunatic. Voters of the same raging temperment voted him in to the nomination through the primaries and caucuses and at the Republican Party national convention.  On election day November 8th the broad centrist and middle-temperate electorate is going to give both Trump and the Republican Party the bum's rush.

[Skywalker69]

46 minutes ago, Publicus said:

 

The biggest change is that the 2016 Republican Party has nominated for Potus an wildman Ignoramus crackpot lunatic. Voters of the same raging temperment voted him in to the nomination through the primaries and caucuses and at the Republican Party national convention.  On election day November 8th the broad centrist and middle-temperate electorate is going to give both Trump and the Republican Party the bum's rush.

They have nominated the "whining little bitch"

[simple1]

9 hours ago, JHolmesJr said:

 

He may be an american on paper…but he will always be pakistani at heart….dont you ever forget that.

 

 

You appear to believe you are conversant with the situation and people of Pakistan, yet fail to acknowledge the tremendous sacrifices and effort Pakistani security have made fighting terrorism. In the past 13 years 6,252 security personnel have been killed, with 33,097 terrorists killed. In the period 21,209 civilians have been murdered by terrorist groups.

 

Your continual disparaging of the family manifests the unbelievable nastiness of Trump supporters.

[MajarTheLion]

On 8/1/2016 at 10:13 PM, MZurf said:

"One criticism is that it allows an immigrant to invest $500,000 in an approved type of business and in return get a set of green cards for the investor, the investor's spouse, and all their under 21-years-of-age children."

So it's legal then, which begs the question; what's your point????

 

The point is Mr. Khan has a financial interest in seeing to it that immigration of Muslims continues. While we're at it, it is Mr. Khan that needs to read up on the Constitution and laws. No one from any country has the right to immigrate to the United States of America. Jimmy Carter shut down visas of Iranians. This is legally identical to what Trump proposes and for similar reasons. So why is it leftists defend Jimmy Carter and attack Trump for legally identical immigration strategies?

 

[Publicus]

9 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The interviewer made the wry comment

 

Which is why Trump is correct when he calls the media biased. That moron should remember his job is to interview people and report that, not make stupid comments. I also really despise tv interviews where the interviewer insists in having his or her face inserted frequently into the narrative. The Prima Donnas should keep their faces out of the interview- it's not about them!

 

Droll and straight faced journalism in USA went the way of the Dodo bird long before there was cable-satellite television and very well in advance of the internet and its proliferation of well financed rightwhingnoid mass media.

 

The previously long time -- a couple of hundred years -- dominance of newspapers almost all of which were owned by wealthy white Protestant rightwing John Birch Society Republicans had bored a changing America to seek a better quality of journalism. Better quality includes the MSM as it has existed for more than three decades, let by broadcast journalism.

 

Joe McCarthy in the 1950s got away with murder but Donald Trump is being called to account. Let that be a measure of the differences. Edward R. Murrow, the only one to take on Joe McCarthy was a broadcast journalist who never could have done it as a newspaper slave.

 

Even President Eisenhower didn't have the balls to take on McCarthy. President Obama in his time is doing it right vis-a-vis Donald Trump the wildman lunatic ignoramus.

[Neurath]

36 minutes ago, MajarTheLion said:

 

The point is Mr. Khan has a financial interest in seeing to it that immigration of Muslims continues. While we're at it, it is Mr. Khan that needs to read up on the Constitution and laws. No one from any country has the right to immigrate to the United States of America. Jimmy Carter shut down visas of Iranians. This is legally identical to what Trump proposes and for similar reasons. So why is it leftists defend Jimmy Carter and attack Trump for legally identical immigration strategies?

 

Ah, there is a big difference between banning the issuing of visas to the citizens of a given country and prohibiting the issuing of visas to people of a particular religion because of that religion. One of those actions is unconstitutional and unconscionable. Trumps suggestion would ban the entry by the Mayor of London  - because he's a Muslim.

[Neurath]

9 hours ago, JHolmesJr said:

 

You're using only pure logic in your reasoning and discounting the huge emotional, religious and cultural factors.

Muslim ideology isn't something you shed by signing a piece of paper and reciting an oath.

Unless you grew up in the khan household and witnessed the upbringing of this son you should at least defer to the possibility that you may not be 100% correct.

 

I have a cool muzzlim friend, one of my best buddies…we go out on the piss and eat pulled pork sandwiches (his favourite)….he has a huge extended family and some of the stuff he tells me (that they tell him) is frightening. They absolutely loathe jews and do not trust anyone who isn't muzzlim. He has all but disowned them.

 

This Khan kid was obviously not a terrorist but don't be fooled….they are pakistanis holding an american passport.

Have you been watching The Eternal Jew and substituting Muslim/Pakistani for Jew? Sure sounds like it. Even if you haven't been watching it, your posts indicate that your thoughts and sentiments come from the same dark, twisted and perverted part of humans that led to the production of  that abomination. You are what Primo Levi warned about. Exactly what he warned about. Anybody doubts it - just read the first few pages of If this is a Man

[Publicus]

30 minutes ago, MajarTheLion said:

 

The point is Mr. Khan has a financial interest in seeing to it that immigration of Muslims continues. While we're at it, it is Mr. Khan that needs to read up on the Constitution and laws. No one from any country has the right to immigrate to the United States of America. Jimmy Carter shut down visas of Iranians. This is legally identical to what Trump proposes and for similar reasons. So why is it leftists defend Jimmy Carter and attack Trump for legally identical immigration strategies?

 

 

President Truman vetoed the legislation but Congress overrode the veto to make the bill law. Truman considered it unconstitutional as many legal minds continue to do, to include the prominent and respected Constitutional Law Prof. Lawrence Tribe of Harvard Law School among others.

 

President Carter used the law on the basis on nationality, Iranian. He did it during the Iran hostage emergency which was a national issue with Iran and an Iranian nationalist movement and issue rather than a strictly religious one.

 

The hostage takers had also violated the extraterritoriality guarantee of international law by violating the legal sanctity of the US national embassy in Tehran. The government of Iran had declined the hostage taker and US agreed deal to take possession of the hostages to return them to the US, which made the government in Tehran culpable in the hostage taking crime and thus liable to the kind of action Pres. Carter did in fact take. (Carter btw lost reelection as some may recall.)

 

Trump is focused on a religious test which is Constitutionally dubious at best. He's made some reference to banning Muslims based on countries that are terrorist sponsors but that blurb was just another passing Trump brain fart as he's said nothing of it since. Trump's use of the law would be terrible public policy domestically and for the USA abroad. It would be a windfall for terrorists throughout the ME and elsewhere.

 

The financial and moral cost to the USA of Trump's biggest stinker of a brain fart would be enormous and long lasting, well beyond even Trump's lifetime, never mind the fiasco of a Trump presidency. President Eisenhower did a mass deportation to Mexico which was underreported and under recorded in history, however, it remains a blotch on his record as does the internment of Japanese Americans by President Roosevelt at the outset of WW2 for the US. The Japanese Americans were interned because the their ethnicity and nationality after a formal declaration of war had been voted by the Congress.

 

8 USC 1182 has never been tested in the courts but if Trump has his way it most certainly would be brought to the US district and appeals courts right up to Scotus. If a US court puts a Trump executive order on hold to stop the scheme, what is Trump going to do, attack the judge for their gender, or their ethnicity, or their religion, or their skin color, or their view of abortion, or military service, or...

[happy Joe]

With due respect to Mr Khan and his family, he is not really important in this case.

 

No, what is shocking for all is to see D. Trump unable managing this little obstacle.

 

See him clinging to branches every day trying pathetically to save face is appalling.

 

There is still a problem in the US democratic system to Take affected by final choice this man in front to H C  that represents for me the archetypal politician without soul, without genius, without idea and probably also without conviction other than her personal situation.

[Pinot]

33 minutes ago, dexterm said:

 

Baloney.

 

Not mentioned anywhere in mainstream media.

 

From a site riddled with spelling mistakes and plastered with erectile dysfunction solutions and Get rich Quick ads for guys surrounded by semi naked trollops who look remarkably like you know who.

 

The wingnut rabid attack machine is fully engaged. I hope it goes on for the next three months as Trump continues the free fall in the polls. 

 

You can explain how illogical they are. You can tear apart the silly lies but you can't change a wingnut mind. They've got an alternative source for their (faux news) facts and they're going to continue to swig the koolaid. They don't want to know the truth. 

 

 

[MZurf]

7 hours ago, MajarTheLion said:

 

The point is Mr. Khan has a financial interest in seeing to it that immigration of Muslims continues. While we're at it, it is Mr. Khan that needs to read up on the Constitution and laws. No one from any country has the right to immigrate to the United States of America. Jimmy Carter shut down visas of Iranians. This is legally identical to what Trump proposes and for similar reasons. So why is it leftists defend Jimmy Carter and attack Trump for legally identical immigration strategies?

 

 

So? It's business for him. Are you against free enterprise? Are you, perhaps, a closet commie??

 

" While we're at it, it is Mr. Khan that needs to read up on the Constitution and laws. No one from any country has the right to immigrate to the United States of America." 

 

What's that even supposed to mean? If people want to move to the US and fulfill all the requirements then they DO have the right to emigrate to the US.

And I have a VERY strong feeling that if there had been a competition between you and Mr Kahn regarding knowledge of the Constitution he would have absolutely crushed you!

 

[dexterm]

6 hours ago, Neurath said:

Have you been watching The Eternal Jew and substituting Muslim/Pakistani for Jew? Sure sounds like it. Even if you haven't been watching it, your posts indicate that your thoughts and sentiments come from the same dark, twisted and perverted part of humans that led to the production of  that abomination. You are what Primo Levi warned about. Exactly what he warned about. Anybody doubts it - just read the first few pages of If this is a Man

Thanks for the links.

On the same theme, I like Bertolt Brecht:  "Do not rejoice in his defeat, you men. For though the world has stood up and stopped the bastard, the bitch that bore him is in heat again."

[JHolmesJr]

8 hours ago, Neurath said:

Ah, there is a big difference between banning the issuing of visas to the citizens of a given country and prohibiting the issuing of visas to people of a particular religion because of that religion. One of those actions is unconstitutional and unconscionable. Trumps suggestion would ban the entry by the Mayor of London  - because he's a Muslim.

 

Rubbish…."any class of aliens" is a very elastic term and covers any classification, by country, by ideology, by religion etc.

 

Mr Trump seems to know more about the constitution than 'Kaiser' Khan (I cant believe CNN is now pronouncing his name as Kaiser…he aint no King)

[iReason]

The Crazy Don racking up those divisive numbers again: 

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/08/04/politics/clinton-leads-trump-three-states/index.html

 

Keep doin' what you're doin' Donnie. 

[iReason]

Military veterans demand Republicans unendorse Trump and his 'ignorance'

"The backlash against Donald Trump escalated on Thursday as angry US military veterans arrived on Capitol Hill urging Republican leaders to withdraw their support for the party’s nominee."

 

"The protest came after a torrid week for the maverick candidate, whose criticism of Khizr and Ghazala Khan, the parents of an American Muslim soldier killed in Iraq in 2004, triggered a Republican revolt."

 

"The veterans presented a petition on Thursday to the office of Senator John McCain, a Vietnam war veteran and former prisoner of war who was the Republican presidential nominee in 2008."

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/aug/04/us-military-veterans-donald-trump-petition-john-mccain

 

The "Great Unifier" 

[thaibeachlovers]

Even military veterans are able to be manipulated, and this whole battle is an example of manipulation, on both sides. No doubt Khan was carefully chosen and coached as to how to bait Trump.

Personally, while I understand that he is grieving for his son, this whole gold star family thing is, IMO, rather precious. There was no such kid glove handling of the parents of the 50 thousand plus dead soldiers in the Vietnam conflict, or the parents of those killed in the Korean conflict, WW2 and WW1.

IMO, he could have just blamed Bush for causing his son's death and that would have been OK, but he attacked Trump over his immigration policy, and that made him fair game to be attacked back.

 

Perhaps those soldiers would be better served by protesting the disgraceful treatment by the VA of vets.

 

 

[ilostmypassword]

On 8/5/2016 at 3:27 AM, MajarTheLion said:

12 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Even military veterans are able to be manipulated, and this whole battle is an example of manipulation, on both sides. No doubt Khan was carefully chosen and coached as to how to bait Trump.

Personally, while I understand that he is grieving for his son, this whole gold star family thing is, IMO, rather precious. There was no such kid glove handling of the parents of the 50 thousand plus dead soldiers in the Vietnam conflict, or the parents of those killed in the Korean conflict, WW2 and WW1.

IMO, he could have just blamed Bush for causing his son's death and that would have been OK, but he attacked Trump over his immigration policy, and that made him fair game to be attacked back.

 

Perhaps those soldiers would be better served by protesting the disgraceful treatment by the VA of vets.

 

 

You don't seem to get it.  The problem isn't that Trump responded. It's the content of what he said.  He went after them on illegitimate grounds. He could have responded in a reasoned way. But he seems incapable of doing that.

[Jingthing]

This is hilarious.

A new trend in protests at trump monster truck campaign rallies.

Hold up pocket CONSTITUTIONS.

Watch the trumpeteers boo!

So patriotic! 

Watch starting minute 13:

http://www.npr.org/2016/08/04/488738033/protesters-wield-pocket-constitutions-at-trump-rally?utm_medium=RSS&utm_campaign=us

 

Quote

The pocket constitution became an instrument of protest against Trump in a speechKhizr Khan delivered at the Democratic National Convention last week. Khan, the father of a fallen Muslim soldier, held up a pocket constitution as he criticized Trump: "Let me ask you: Have you even read the United States Constitution? I will gladly lend you my copy."

 

[bendejo]

There is another group of people big on the pocket Constitution thing, the sort that took the bird sanctuary hostage last January.  They claim to read it constantly, like the Bible, the only other book they own.

 

[MajarTheLion]

22 hours ago, Publicus said:

 

President Truman vetoed the legislation but Congress overrode the veto to make the bill law. Truman considered it unconstitutional as many legal minds continue to do, to include the prominent and respected Constitutional Law Prof. Lawrence Tribe of Harvard Law School among others.

 

President Carter used the law on the basis on nationality, Iranian. He did it during the Iran hostage emergency which was a national issue with Iran and an Iranian nationalist movement and issue rather than a strictly religious one.

 

The hostage takers had also violated the extraterritoriality guarantee of international law by violating the legal sanctity of the US national embassy in Tehran. The government of Iran had declined the hostage taker and US agreed deal to take possession of the hostages to return them to the US, which made the government in Tehran culpable in the hostage taking crime and thus liable to the kind of action Pres. Carter did in fact take. (Carter btw lost reelection as some may recall.)

 

Trump is focused on a religious test which is Constitutionally dubious at best. He's made some reference to banning Muslims based on countries that are terrorist sponsors but that blurb was just another passing Trump brain fart as he's said nothing of it since. Trump's use of the law would be terrible public policy domestically and for the USA abroad. It would be a windfall for terrorists throughout the ME and elsewhere.

 

The financial and moral cost to the USA of Trump's biggest stinker of a brain fart would be enormous and long lasting, well beyond even Trump's lifetime, never mind the fiasco of a Trump presidency. President Eisenhower did a mass deportation to Mexico which was underreported and under recorded in history, however, it remains a blotch on his record as does the internment of Japanese Americans by President Roosevelt at the outset of WW2 for the US. The Japanese Americans were interned because the their ethnicity and nationality after a formal declaration of war had been voted by the Congress.

 

8 USC 1182 has never been tested in the courts but if Trump has his way it most certainly would be brought to the US district and appeals courts right up to Scotus. If a US court puts a Trump executive order on hold to stop the scheme, what is Trump going to do, attack the judge for their gender, or their ethnicity, or their religion, or their skin color, or their view of abortion, or military service, or...

 

Lots of irrelevant information there. The fact remains, what Jimmy Carter did was perfectly legal. What Donald Trump proposes is perfectly legal. Foreigners have no right to immigrate here and the law clearly states the president can discriminate against any class of immigrants as he sees fit. No matter how many times you say fart, it won't change the simple facts.

 

And your attempt to equate liberal god FDR's internment of people IN THE USA on the basis of national origin with Trump disallowing Muslims from entering the country is quite frankly laughable.

[MajarTheLion]

8 minutes ago, bendejo said:

There is another group of people big on the pocket Constitution thing, the sort that took the bird sanctuary hostage last January.  They claim to read it constantly, like the Bible, the only other book they own.

 

 

What's wrong with owning just the Constitution and the Bible?

[MajarTheLion]

8 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Even military veterans are able to be manipulated, and this whole battle is an example of manipulation, on both sides. No doubt Khan was carefully chosen and coached as to how to bait Trump.

Personally, while I understand that he is grieving for his son, this whole gold star family thing is, IMO, rather precious. There was no such kid glove handling of the parents of the 50 thousand plus dead soldiers in the Vietnam conflict, or the parents of those killed in the Korean conflict, WW2 and WW1.

IMO, he could have just blamed Bush for causing his son's death and that would have been OK, but he attacked Trump over his immigration policy, and that made him fair game to be attacked back.

 

Perhaps those soldiers would be better served by protesting the disgraceful treatment by the VA of vets.

 

 

 

Or perhaps Mr. Khan should have spoken at the RNC convention, given Hillary Clinton voted to send Mr. Khan's son to war.

[wooloomooloo]

The Donald is causing mayhem again and his popularity commensurately soars, as always.  Roll on the start of the live debates next month.  

 

Hold on to your seats.

[MajarTheLion]

Just now, wooloomooloo said:

The Donald is causing mayhem again and his popularity commensurately soars, as always.  Roll on the start of the live debates next month.  

 

Hold on to your seats.

 

I believe two things will happen in the debates:

 

1) Americans will see the lengths leftists will go to to tilt the election towards Hillary.

2) Donald Trump will rip her to smithereens.

 

In the meantime, we'll see the leftist media cry that Trump claims he saw the airplane with the ransom and cover that 25 times more than the real story: Barack Obama paid a massive ransom to Iran for hostages he should have negotiated the release of with his Iran nuke deal scam.