Prayuth's brother defends lucrative army contracts awarded to son

[Grubster]

No different than the USA, Does Hallaburton ring a bell.

[jamesbrock]

1 hour ago, ratcatcher said:

Neither of you have any idea what a failed state really is. It's just something to say.

"Failed state : a state whose political or economic system has become so weak that the government is no longer in control."

This "government" is very much in control whether we like it or not.  Fortunately, for the time being at least, we are still permitted to make comments on social media, something which failed states and banana republics don't seem to have.

 

In 2014 the Failed States Index, published annually by the United States think-tank Fund for Peace, was changed from the Failed States Index to the Fragile States Index (FSI), as it was argued that the term 'Failed State' established a false 'binary' division, or false dichotomy, between developed states and those that were deemed beyond recovery.

 

The FSI scores are sums of scores for 12 separate indicators related to various aspects of state stability and strength, with 0 being the lowest intensity (most stable) and 10 being the highest intensity (least stable), creating a scale spanning 0-120.

 

In 2016, the most stable country in the world is Finland with a score of 18.8, and the least stable is Somalia with a score of 114.0. Thailand is ranked 74^th least stable with a score of 78.8. (In 2013 Thailand was 90^th with a score of 75.1; in 2014 it fell to 80^th with a score of 77.0; in 2015 it dropped further to 71^st with a score of 79.1)

 

Thailand is in the "Elevated Warning" category, and is sat between Georgia and Bolivia.

 

The four indicators where Thailand ranks "Poor" are:

 

 

• 2016 HR rank: 34^th worst | score: 8.2  

 

• 2016 GG rank: 20^th worst | score: 9.0  

 

• 2016 SEC rank: 15^th worst | score: 9.2  

 

• 2016 FE rank: 11^th worst | score: 9.7

So, while it is far from a "failed state," its political and military indicators are very poor and getting worse under the junta:

 

 

Source: http://fsi.fundforpeace.org/rankings-2016

[heybruce]

30 minutes ago, thairay said:

What is wrong here? When I had to dig a septic tank,,, iI got my brothers son to do it..many others were capable but i chose him!555 I plead guilty to nepotism, anyone else here ever do something similar?

I think you're being facetious, but I'm not sure.  However, if you paid your brother with taxpayer's money, then you are guilty of nepotism.

[TheFishman1]

TIT

[JAG]

According to Sakdina...

It was in the reign of King Borommatrailokkanat (1448-1488) that a formalised system was introduced designed to force even the most far-flung regions into line. King Trailok passed a series of laws that have resonated down Thai history to today and are probably the most influential royal commands issued in Thai history. Trailok introduced a governmental system which nowadays is known as the Sakdina System, but at the time were laws of Civil, Military and Provincial Hierarchies. The system itself was based upon a cultural and social order that had been practiced in much of the country at local level for centuries, Trailok made three important changes to this system, he expanded it, standardised it and centralised it.

Thai society had long been divided into two classes, the nobles and the masses, the Sakdina System clearly defined the roles within society of these two groups, how they would interact with each other and amongst themselves creating a strict social order based on the quantified worth of each individual. Rigid castes were formalised within the ranks of both nobles and commoners excluding only Chinese and women of non-noble birth who were considered without worth.

 

As you can see, the system is well entrenched as a major part of Thai culture.

The ruling classes see nothing wrong with how they go about their business of governing the masses.

There is no attempt at "fairness" and democracy is a Western concept that they look upon as a quaint oddity.

Power is everything.

Ironical is it not that the Chinese immigrants (excluded as being of no worth ) are now effectively running the show.

Any way society is changing. Even the most impressive sand castles disappear when the tide comes in.

[robblok]

9 minutes ago, heybruce said:

The "But, but, but....Thaksin!" crowd is silent, however we are seeing the "But, but, but....America!" posters.

Thaksin was a crook too.. nepotism.. just look at YL and his brother in law who he put in power. This mob is doing the same thing and that is quite bad and is rightfully condemned here. 

[robblok]

14 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I think you're being facetious, but I'm not sure.  However, if you paid your brother with taxpayer's money, then you are guilty of nepotism.

 

Agreed.. maybe they should make laws that its illegal to hire family members to do jobs. But I doubt there will be anyone in the military.. or PTP or democrats that will support this. They all do the same when in power. 

[Leicamera]

The thing is, WHAT ARE THE ThAI PEOPLE DOING ABOUT????

 

Absolutely nothing, it's so ingrained into ThAI culture that the average ThAI office worker takes home his/her 12,000 Bt.

 

 

[heybruce]

28 minutes ago, robblok said:

Thaksin was a crook too.. nepotism.. just look at YL and his brother in law who he put in power. This mob is doing the same thing and that is quite bad and is rightfully condemned here. 

This raises the obvious question:  If military government, which can't be removed peacefully, is as corrupt as democratic government, which can be removed peacefully, why would anyone prefer military government?

[candide]

I guess most will agree that most of them are crooks, whatever their political orientation.

The difference is that before, the government and the so-called "checks and balance" belonged to two different sides of the political arena. It did not work very well, but there was a minium of balance.

Now we have the government and the "checks and balance" on the same side of the political arena, on top of the junta's quasi-absolute power. It can only go worse as the junta progressively appoints anyone that can be appointed following retirements or end of mandates.

This will last for long time because, with the appointed senate holding one third of votes, it is most likely that the next government will have a yellow-tainted PM. 

So if elections take place in 2017, it's at least 6 years with a government and appointed "checks and balance" belonging to the same political faction (without mentioning the upper level)..

In any country I know, such a situation has never resulted in less corruption, cronyism and nepotism.

 

[jayboy]

Jamie, Baerboxer, Haloween, et al, come out, come out, wherever you are...

I don't think one should be too judgemental.There is a perfectly respectable case for military rule though I don't happen to share it.Politics are nuanced and we should try to understand our opponents viewpoint.Those of us who have had experience of coups since the 1970's know it is always the same - initial enthusiasm followed by disillusion, a gradual awareness that the so called cure is worse than the disease.

Of course it would be nice if the forum hardliners publicly recognised they had shown poor judgement - but human beings are frail vain creatures and it takes intellect, self confidence and character to admit error.

But who knows? We may be surprised.

[GarryP]

10 minutes ago, jayboy said:

 

I don't think one should be too judgemental.There is a perfectly respectable case for military rule though I don't happen to share it.Politics are nuanced and we should try to understand our opponents viewpoint.Those of us who have had experience of coups since the 1970's know it is always the same - initial enthusiasm followed by disillusion, a gradual awareness that the so called cure is worse than the disease.

Of course it would be nice if the forum hardliners publicly recognised they had shown poor judgement - but human beings are frail vain creatures and it takes intellect, self confidence and character to admit error.

But who knows? We may be surprised.

 

I love that penultimate paragraph. You have left them in an impossible dilemma.  I think they will go with lacking intellect, lacking in self confidence and character.  But then couldn't you be wrong and that paragraph also apply to you. There are no absolutes when it comes down to politics.   

[anon467848]

Article in Asian Correspondent https://asiancorrespondent.com/2016/09/thailand-brother-accused-graft-contracts-son-wife/

[Hawk]

 I feel an article 44 coming, plus a few defamation cases and computer crimes cases coming to a court near you.

[Eric Loh]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

Thaksin was a crook too.. nepotism.. just look at YL and his brother in law who he put in power. This mob is doing the same thing and that is quite bad and is rightfully condemned here. 

 

So true that both sides are bent and crook but that is where the similarity ends. The dissimilarity is the sickening nauseating manner one side meet their fate while the other do the same with impunity and pretend that they are the righteous side. Got to excuse me for throwing up. 

 

[mike324]

18 hours ago, tomwct said:

Remember it's going to take 20 years to knock-out Corruption in Thailand! So this okay now!

 

20 years before we can educate a new generation of children to be corrupt free! But thats got to start now.....the current government is not exactly showing a good example...

[Baerboxer]

19 hours ago, brucec64 said:

Jamie, Baerboxer, Haloween, et al, come out, come out, wherever you are...

 

If the son had a business in operation, submitted bids with other competitors and the bids were evaluated in accordance with public procurement rules, and awarded to the best value for money bidder then all is good. If not, then the PM should act in accordance with his crackdown on corruption.

There will be records of public tender bids, evaluation criteria and award decisions so should be easy to check.

 

Just like all those mates of yours who like to tell us the bid put in by Thaksin's then wife was totally legit. She had the best bid out of a very small number of bids, apparently, even though it was way below market price. 

 

Let's see the evidence. Or is it only Shins who should be innocent until proven otherwise? And even when proven it's dismissed as "all political".

See my comments on another thread about how business in ethnic Chinese influenced countries work.

[ratcatcher]

3 hours ago, thairay said:

What is wrong here? When I had to dig a septic tank,,, iI got my brothers son to do it..many others were capable but i chose him!555 I plead guilty to nepotism, anyone else here ever do something similar?

Who was paying for the septic tank?  You?  If so, you could contract Santa Claus to do the work. 

In the General's case, it is the public's (taxpayers) money). Snivel servants seem to be unable to grasp the difference.

[Baerboxer]

1 hour ago, Eric Loh said:

 

So true that both sides are bent and crook but that is where the similarity ends. The dissimilarity is the sickening nauseating manner one side meet their fate while the other do the same with impunity and pretend that they are the righteous side. Got to excuse me for throwing up. 

 

 

Meet their fate - 555! Yes multi billionaire Thaksin must find live hard choosing which mansion to fly to in his private plane and deciding which passport to use. So tough that he never got all the statues of himself put up.

 

Asia is different Eric. Chinese keep it in the "family" - that's extended family, cronies, lackies and mates. Rival families feud and vie for position. See it all over Asia.

[brucec64]

18 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

If the son had a business in operation, submitted bids with other competitors and the bids were evaluated in accordance with public procurement rules, and awarded to the best value for money bidder then all is good. If not, then the PM should act in accordance with his crackdown on corruption.

There will be records of public tender bids, evaluation criteria and award decisions so should be easy to check.

 

Just like all those mates of yours who like to tell us the bid put in by Thaksin's then wife was totally legit. She had the best bid out of a very small number of bids, apparently, even though it was way below market price. 

 

Let's see the evidence. Or is it only Shins who should be innocent until proven otherwise? And even when proven it's dismissed as "all political".

See my comments on another thread about how business in ethnic Chinese influenced countries work.

 

You never disappoint...

 

If the son had a business in operation, submitted bids with other competitors and the bids were evaluated in accordance with public procurement rules, and awarded to the best value for money bidder then all is good.

 

Seriously, what are the odds of this? How long have you lived here?

 

If not, then the PM should act in accordance with his crackdown on corruption.

 

Never gonna happen. We all know the "crackdown on corruption" is a farce, and is politically motivated. It does not apply to the military, and definitely does not apply to the inner circle. I can write the NACC report myself. Just take the Rajabhakti Park report, and substitute "Rajabhakti Park" with "Contemporary Construction Limited Partnership".

 

[TKDfella]

I notice that there is no mention of the poor nark that let this story out, I mean at the root...wonder who it was?...note, I say 'was?'

[CharlieK]

Don't forget corruption will end in twenty years time, meanwhile! 

[elgordo38]

20 hours ago, AGareth2 said:

watch my lips

We are in charge.

[dominique355]

Don't forget corruption will end in twenty years time, meanwhile! 

Until then ... go for it. Right?

[Eric Loh]

1 hour ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Meet their fate - 555! Yes multi billionaire Thaksin must find live hard choosing which mansion to fly to in his private plane and deciding which passport to use. So tough that he never got all the statues of himself put up.

 

Asia is different Eric. Chinese keep it in the "family" - that's extended family, cronies, lackies and mates. Rival families feud and vie for position. See it all over Asia.

 

Fate is half of his assets being confiscated by the junta agency and the junta is making a habit of it by doing the same thing with Yingluck. Only means to fund the military extravagance lifestyles and yes, don't forget the statues. 

 

I think you meant the Chan's extended family, cronies, lackies and mates. Others are convicted but the Chan's family tree is never threatened or rather they threaten those who dare raise a voice. And they still claim to be righteous. Only in Thailand BB. 

 

 

 

 

[CharlieK]

20 minutes ago, dominique355 said:

 

Until then ... go for it. Right?

 

 

or maybe a case of do as I say not as I do! the claim that corruption will end in twenty years time, while taking part in corrupt practices doesn't show any real attempt at eradicating corruption. Post 88 above has it right. It is one faction acting against another, and when power is passed on to others, it starts all over again. Sharing the wealth of the country between factions rather than the people. 

[red roger]

19 hours ago, nausea said:

Grow up. This is the way the world works. You have a relative in Parliament, or on the London Underground, or a London taxi driver. Sheesh, the reason new guys and girls get appointed is cos the current crop can't cut the mustard. 

Admiration for your defence of the indefensible. Your London centric jaundiced opinion is not relevant. If anyone needs to "Grow up ". Look no further than your mirror. 

[jesimps]

21 hours ago, seajae said:

again we see the way thai govts do business, doesnt matter which group is in they all are guilty of nepotism. Any family members/friends of the govt should not be allowed to even quote on govt contracts, the amount of corrupt practices every govt does it absolutely pathetic. This the same as the ptp/thaksin did when in power and they are all just as guilty as each other, doubt they will ever have a corrupt free govt in Thailand as money is too important to all of them

Yes but to dive into the trough when you took power on an anti-corruption ticket makes it particularly sickening.

 

[candide]

2 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

If the son had a business in operation, submitted bids with other competitors and the bids were evaluated in accordance with public procurement rules, and awarded to the best value for money bidder then all is good. If not, then the PM should act in accordance with his crackdown on corruption.

There will be records of public tender bids, evaluation criteria and award decisions so should be easy to check.

 

Just like all those mates of yours who like to tell us the bid put in by Thaksin's then wife was totally legit. She had the best bid out of a very small number of bids, apparently, even though it was way below market price. 

 

Let's see the evidence. Or is it only Shins who should be innocent until proven otherwise? And even when proven it's dismissed as "all political".

See my comments on another thread about how business in ethnic Chinese influenced countries work.

You are perfectly right to compare with the Thaksin's wife case!

 

We don't have any information on this case indicating wether there is corruption and/or abuse of power or not (remember that in Thaksin's wife case the court assessed that there was no abuse of power). It needs to be proven (in case there would be a true investigation , which many doubt here).

 

However, it is a clear case of conflict of interest (and much clearer than Thaksin's wife case). Thaksin got 2 years for conflict of interest. Which sanction will this guy get? We all know the answer: nothing

Edited September 21, 2016 by candide

[tbthailand]

21 hours ago, seajae said:

again we see the way thai govts do business, doesnt matter which group is in they all are guilty of nepotism.

again we see a false equivalence being posted.