The anti-Trump resistance takes shape: 'Government's supposed to fear us'

[Morch]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

An inspiring article directly related to the resistance:

 

 

 

http://www.newyorker.com/culture/cultural-comment/now-is-the-time-to-talk-about-what-we-are-actually-talking-about

 

Inspiring how? Reads like it's ok for us to hate, because we are the righteous. We are against divisions, but all responsibility for bridging them lies with "them". Dissent among our ranks will not be tolerated. Anyone not carrying a pitchfork is a traitor. As inspiring as the drivel spouted by the resident wannabee Jacky Chiles impersonator. It would have been fitting as a motivational Star Wars movie speech. On second thought, strike that -  Razzie Award material, more like.

 

[Morch]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Nobody said the resistance was going to be a garden party. It's developing in many forms and it must and will continue, including "retro" underground comics. The USA faces an existential threat now to the best of our values. Over half of Americans get that. We won't be silenced.

 

The US does not face existential threats of any kind. Your so called "resistance" does not incorporate "over half of the Americans". And no one is trying to silence you. 

 

Here's another apt comics reference:

 

[Jingthing]

I actually think trump with the nuclear coded does pose an existential threat. I get you think it's OK to normalize trump. Can't go there with you.

[Jingthing]

 
Inspiring how? Reads like it's ok for us to hate, because we are the righteous. We are against divisions, but all responsibility for bridging them lies with "them". Dissent among our ranks will not be tolerated. Anyone not carrying a pitchfork is a traitor. As inspiring as the drivel spouted by the resident wannabee Jacky Chiles impersonator. It would have been fitting as a motivational Star Wars movie speech. On second thought, strike that -  Razzie Award material, more like.
 

I really don't understand how you got that from that article.

[Morch]

6 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I actually think trump with the nuclear coded does pose an existential threat. I get you think it's OK to normalize trump. Can't go there with you.

 

 

Trump (or any POTUS for that matter) cannot start a nuclear war on a whim by pressing a button. Doesn't work this way. What I think is that hyperbole and hysteria play into Trump's hands. What I'm sure of is that your view of the supposed popular resistance is off mark when it comes to its actual popularity. I get it some prefer to run in circles, scream and shout.

 

[Morch]

 

7 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I really don't understand how you got that from that article.

 

Just read the bit you quoted, it's all there.

 

[Morch]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Michael Moore is getting MILITANT!

http://www.nbcchicago.com/entertainment/entertainment-news/Michael-Moore-Tweets-Inauguration-Protest-Petition-405469775.html

 

 

I think it's already very obvious that the naysayers that asserted that the resistance to trump was going to be a short lived flash in the pan thing were totally wrong. It's building strongly now and there is no way it doesn't continue as long as the orange "populist" demagogue absurdly holds the office of president. If it comes to pass, that Pence replaces him, there will still be protest and dissent, but it would be more normal.

 

I don't see how disrupting the inauguration would do anything but increase Trump's approval ratings. Pretty much shoots down the whole "we accept the election results" line. It's been about a month since the elections, so yes...still short term. If and when anti-Trump activities will still be carried out with the same (or growing) intensity in a year's time you're welcome to celebrate it. Until then, just the flip side of  post fact society.

 

The NSC briefing thing, if factual, is a very legitimate criticism, and concerning as well.

 

Pence is, IMO, a way worse alternative when it comes to endangering many of the values you uphold.

[Morch]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

He's speaking only to his base and dissing all other Americans. 

 

If that's correct, then it similarly applies to your so-called "resistance". Considering voter turnout, and that not all those voting for one candidate or another are actually "hardcore", then most of the electorate did not exhibit such decisive or polarized points of view. And co-opting "all other Americans" into the "resistance" ain't going to change reality.

[MajarTheLion]

Welcome to the party, leftists. Many of us have been saying all along that government is supposed to fear the people, not vice versa. This should apply regardless of what letter a president or any other politician has after their name.

[muffy]

Get out of the Trump movement way or be run over .

[MajarTheLion]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

If that's correct, then it similarly applies to your so-called "resistance". Considering voter turnout, and that not all those voting for one candidate or another are actually "hardcore", then most of the electorate did not exhibit such decisive or polarized points of view. And co-opting "all other Americans" into the "resistance" ain't going to change reality.

 

I think "the resistance" is much smaller than many would believe. Oh sure, there are plenty who hate Trump. Like him or hate him, I doubt many would disagree that he has a big mouth and doesn't play by the PC rules. That and other things have clearly led to a toxic environment, from the media bubble perspective. But on Main Street, I assert it means little to nothing. My life wasn't affected when Obama said divisive things. It's not been affected by the things Trump has said. I would even challenge those who feel offended by Trump to show a demonstrable, measurable affect Trump's comments has had on their lives.

I suspect "the resistance" will soon diminish to a typical roar of people who hate the president (a group always present) and more people will simply accept he's president.

 

I have lived 52 years, through many types of presidents. I have managed to survive and even thrive through all sorts of them. There is no doubt a president can do much to affect many millions of lives. I still maintain America is plenty free enough to make of your life what you will.

[Jingthing]

17 minutes ago, muffy said:

Get out of the Trump movement way or be run over .

Yeah, because trump is a big BULLY and his core supporters now that he has won (while losing the popular vote) think it's open season now anyone not on board with the demagogue. Sorry, not going to take that kind of American style fascism passively. That's what the resistance is about.

 

 

Quote

This is what happens when Donald Trump attacks a private citizen on Twitter

For Batchelder, who studies history and gender studies at Saint Anselm College in Manchester, N.H, the abuse continues more than a year later. Five days before the election, she received a Facebook message that read: “Wishing I could f---ing punch you in the face. id then proceed to stomp your head on the curb and urinate in your bloodied mouth and i know where you live, so watch your f---ing back punk.”

 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/this-is-what-happens-when-donald-trump-attacks-a-private-citizen-on-twitter/2016/12/08/a1380ece-bd62-11e6-91ee-1adddfe36cbe_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_no-name%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.864b803d04ce

 

[MajarTheLion]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

I don't see how disrupting the inauguration would do anything but increase Trump's approval ratings. Pretty much shoots down the whole "we accept the election results" line. It's been about a month since the elections, so yes...still short term. If and when anti-Trump activities will still be carried out with the same (or growing) intensity in a year's time you're welcome to celebrate it. Until then, just the flip side of  post fact society.

 

The NSC briefing thing, if factual, is a very legitimate criticism, and concerning as well.

 

Pence is, IMO, a way worse alternative when it comes to endangering many of the values you uphold.

 

I think the security briefings is a legitimate concern- again, assuming it's true. Sadly, we have to question everything we're told by the entire media from across the political spectrum. Yes, some people think it's mostly CNN et al and others think it's mostly Fox et al. Hogwash! They're all working us to further their agenda.

 

I also have a problem with Bolton being on the radar for anything foreign relations-wise. The guy wants "regime change" in Iran. My god man, haven't we been down that road, lost enough lives and spent enough money to learn yet????

 

But let's take Mattis, for example. I'm willing to take a wait and see attitude. I like the thought of a kick ass military man being in charge of the military. That like stops when it means he wants to actually USE that military when it's not absolutely necessary. Only time will tell on Mattis and most other Trump picks. That said, I expected Trump to disappoint and he's right on schedule- just like pretty much every other politician.

 

Oh but you also touched on a very good point- disrupting the inauguration. While many of us here are very devout politicos, burning flags, assaulting people, rioting and generally behaving like miscreants does not further one's cause. I think that too often, people on the left, right, in between think screaming really loud convinces people. Most often, it doesn't. Simply behaving outrageous enough to get on TV doesn't mean one has "won" anything.

Edited December 9, 2016 by MajarTheLion

[iReason]

Just now, thaibeachlovers said:

Meanwhile, Trump fills stadiums with cheering people that are soooo happy he won and that she didn't.

 

As afore mentioned, the same stadiums and same fans of the monster truck rallies.

 

The Trumpeteers love to go on and on about "full" stadiums as if it means anything.

 

Televangelist Joel Osteen fills bigger stadiums with many more fools than the huckster Trump ever will.

 

 

Just goes to show, the bigger the con-man, the bigger the crowd...

 

[MajarTheLion]

1 hour ago, iReason said:

 

As afore mentioned, the same stadiums and same fans of the monster truck rallies.

 

The Trumpeteers love to go on and on about "full" stadiums as if it means anything.

 

Televangelist Joel Osteen fills bigger stadiums with many more fools than the huckster Trump ever will.

 

 

Just goes to show, the bigger the con-man, the bigger the crowd...

 

 

Guess who?

 

[iReason]

Just now, MajarTheLion said:

 

Guess who?

 

 

The President of the United States.

 

As opposed to the crass, bigoted, ignorant, Text Book Racist, draft dodging, tax dodging, mob associated, alleged peodophile, sexual predator, rip off huckster that is Trump.

 

Easy one.

Edited December 9, 2016 by iReason

[MajarTheLion]

Just now, iReason said:

 

The President of the United States.

 

As opposed to the crass, bigoted, ignorant, Text Book Racist, draft dodging, tax dodging, mob associated, alleged peodophile, sexual predator,

rip off huckster that is Trump.

 

Easy one.

 

"Just goes to show, the bigger the con-man, the bigger the crowd..."

 

[thaibeachlovers]

17 hours ago, Silurian said:

 

And who is paying for these "Pay Attention to Me!" Thank You tours anyway? And what is exactly the point of them?

 

The point, obviously, is to say thank you to the basketful of deplorables that stood firm against the hatred and lies of the Clinton campaign and kept her out of the White House.

I don't know who is paying. Why don't you find out if it bothers you?

[Jingthing]

It's obvious that arts and culture will be a big part of the resistance. Here's an inspiring song related to that:

 

 

[rabas]

22 hours ago, Jingthing said:

He's speaking only to his base and dissing all other Americans. 

 

He said all other Americans are deplorable?

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, rabas said:

 

He said all other Americans are deplorable?

We're not talking about your distortion of what Hillary Clinton said now. That's past. Now we're stuck with an atrocious authoritarian leader. 

[Diplomatico]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

It's obvious that arts and culture will be a big part of the resistance. Here's an inspiring song related to that:

 

 

 

  Yes, because the opinions of pop stars carry such weight in the grand scheme of the world.  Good lord, look at yourself....

Edited December 10, 2016 by Diplomatico

[Silurian]

9 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The point, obviously, is to say thank you to the basketful of deplorables that stood firm against the hatred and lies of the Clinton campaign and kept her out of the White House.

I don't know who is paying. Why don't you find out if it bothers you?

 

I tried to find out who is paying but it seems to not be public information.  Most likely it is being paid via campaign funds. But I also assume that the federal government has to pay part of it for security and the like. Sure is a good use of tax payers money, I guess.

 

Meanwhile the "From Russia with love" Thank You tour continues on. In about 6 weeks Comrade Donald will take the office in good faith that he won the election without any outside foreign assistance.

 

[Rhys]

Like the dude in PI...they thought it was time for someone with a johnson.

[Morch]

On 12/9/2016 at 9:46 PM, muffy said:

Get out of the Trump movement way or be run over .

 

There's no "Trump movement". And such threats as the above simply serve to highlight the reasons why Trump is bad news for the US.

[Morch]

On 12/9/2016 at 10:05 PM, MajarTheLion said:

 

I think "the resistance" is much smaller than many would believe. Oh sure, there are plenty who hate Trump. Like him or hate him, I doubt many would disagree that he has a big mouth and doesn't play by the PC rules. That and other things have clearly led to a toxic environment, from the media bubble perspective. But on Main Street, I assert it means little to nothing. My life wasn't affected when Obama said divisive things. It's not been affected by the things Trump has said. I would even challenge those who feel offended by Trump to show a demonstrable, measurable affect Trump's comments has had on their lives.

I suspect "the resistance" will soon diminish to a typical roar of people who hate the president (a group always present) and more people will simply accept he's president.

 

I have lived 52 years, through many types of presidents. I have managed to survive and even thrive through all sorts of them. There is no doubt a president can do much to affect many millions of lives. I still maintain America is plenty free enough to make of your life what you will.

 

The popular "resistance" not being quite as popular is a given. Generally speaking, mass protests rarely involve a majority of the citizens or anything close to it. IMO, a better measure for the "resistance"'s success would be if it remains a "thing" and if it will manage to involve wider groups and sectors. I have my doubts with regard to both.

 

That you feel your own life were not effected does not provide any good indication how others feel about it. And the opposite stands for those cheering the "resistance". Neither you nor them are Main Street, but rather trying to present the general public as supportive of your views. Life going on as usual, is normal - at least for most Americans. Guess that's less of a certainty when it comes to some groups, minorities and businesses. Dismissing it out of hand does not make their fears less relevant, and it does give the impression that Main Street is an idiosyncratic concept.

 

Trump's conduct is toxic. Not just a media bubble point of view. Supporters can say that Obama's years in office were also something of the sort. My answer would be that there are marked difference in quantity and quality.

 

America is plenty free enough now. People are worried that Trump's presidency might change that. It doesn't have to be the sky is falling sort of thing as some assert, but there's certainly reason to worry.

[Morch]

On 12/9/2016 at 10:09 PM, MajarTheLion said:

 

I think the security briefings is a legitimate concern- again, assuming it's true. Sadly, we have to question everything we're told by the entire media from across the political spectrum. Yes, some people think it's mostly CNN et al and others think it's mostly Fox et al. Hogwash! They're all working us to further their agenda.

 

I also have a problem with Bolton being on the radar for anything foreign relations-wise. The guy wants "regime change" in Iran. My god man, haven't we been down that road, lost enough lives and spent enough money to learn yet????

 

But let's take Mattis, for example. I'm willing to take a wait and see attitude. I like the thought of a kick ass military man being in charge of the military. That like stops when it means he wants to actually USE that military when it's not absolutely necessary. Only time will tell on Mattis and most other Trump picks. That said, I expected Trump to disappoint and he's right on schedule- just like pretty much every other politician.

 

Oh but you also touched on a very good point- disrupting the inauguration. While many of us here are very devout politicos, burning flags, assaulting people, rioting and generally behaving like miscreants does not further one's cause. I think that too often, people on the left, right, in between think screaming really loud convinces people. Most often, it doesn't. Simply behaving outrageous enough to get on TV doesn't mean one has "won" anything.

 

The problem is less with questioning and more with believing. What often results is people sticking with information sources that pander to their already held views. That, and the so-called post fact environment emerging, make it harder for people with different views to engage constructively. Media outlets contribution aside, the president elect can be said to be the prophet of this new era.

 

Most of Trump's picks are the anti-thesis of "draining the swamp" or do much to alleviate doubts about how his term in office will look like. Mattis, IMO, is pretty much the best of the lot.

 

As for "simply behaving outrageous enough to get on TV doesn't mean one has "won" anything." - awfully sounds like a description of Trump's campaigns, and current conduct. So guess at times, it does mean someone won.

[ilostmypassword]

" All this seemingly erratic behavior [of Trump} can be explained — if not justified — by thinking of Trump as a fascist. Not in the sense of an all-purpose bad guy, but in the sense of somebody who sincerely believes that the toxic combination of strong government and strong corporations should run the nation and the world. He spent his previous career negotiating with the government on behalf of corporations; now he has switched teams."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/donald-trump-is-actually-a-fascist/2016/12/09/e193a2b6-bd77-11e6-94ac-3d324840106c_story.html?hpid=hp_no-name_opinion-card-d%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.4301bf17fa2d

[Morch]

12 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The point, obviously, is to say thank you to the basketful of deplorables that stood firm against the hatred and lies of the Clinton campaign and kept her out of the White House.

I don't know who is paying. Why don't you find out if it bothers you?

 

I don't know who is paying. Why don't you find out if it bothers you?

 

What would be the point? Judging from numerous posts and topics, even coming up with clear evidence of wrongdoing will result it the usual denials, but-Hillarys, but-Obamas, calling information "whining", and all the familiar crapola. As a last resort, the default "I don't care" and "Trump won!" will be deployed.

 

[ilostmypassword]

His latest pick is absolutely astonishing. It's Gary Cohn, the number 2 guy at Goldman Sachs, to be head of the National Council of Economic Advisors.  Cohn was instrumental in backing those toxic mortgage deals that nearly put the United States and the World into a major depression. Drain the Swamp? Go Trump!