Thailand to Promote 10 Year Visa for Medical Tourism

[chiang mai]

5 hours ago, Lingba said:

Medical care in Thailand is sub par!....who on earth would want to come here to have anything serious taken care of...no to mention the costs are not as cheap as they indicate...You get much much better care in Malaysia or even Singapore at less costs

 

You don't know what you're talking about, you are completely wrong.

[impulse]

20 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

So as long as some are now suggesting alternatives to what the current proposal seems to suggest, maybe they are designing a Visa for persons that already have insurance and not for those over 50 who who then need to go shopping for insurance or put moneys into a somehow impregnable reserve fund. 

 

I would guess that the vast majority of posters tuned in here are from countries with nationalized health care, who wouldn't buy a private policy unless they were already living overseas.  Or contemplating a move overseas.

[JLCrab]

1 minute ago, impulse said:

 

I would guess that the vast majority of posters tuned in here are from countries with nationalized health care, who wouldn't buy a private policy unless they were already living overseas.  Or contemplating a move overseas.

So great -- they are designing a new visa for those over 50 who don't already have insurance but will find it difficult if not impossible to buy insurance for when in Thailand.

[impulse]

10 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

So great -- they are designing a new visa for those over 50 who don't already have insurance but will find it difficult if not impossible to buy insurance for when in Thailand.

 

With coverage as low as $10,000 and not much detail about locking people out for uncovered pre-existing conditions, I can foresee dozens of shady companies offering "insurance" to meet the demand.  Even if they don't come close to meeting honest insurance needs.

Edited November 28, 2016 by impulse

[jonclark]

4 hours ago, Pimay1 said:

I have to agree with you Colin. I was in the Queen Sirikit Heart Center in Khon Kaen for eight days having two stents placed in my coronary arteries. I could not have asked for better physicians or post op care. The total cost was 240,000 Baht which I consider quite reasonable. 

 

But would the cost have seemed reasonable if you were required to deposit 3M in a bank for 1 year prior to the op, and then only allowed to with draw 1.5 million over the next 4 years? 

 

I agree with you about both the cost and quality of health care at most hospitals. There will be horror stories of course, they exist in all countries. 

[JAG]

Why, is he in a wheelchair after a nose-job?

Well if you had just been told it would take 10 years and ThB 300000 to recover from plastic surgery you would probably need a wheelchair too!
:)

[Pimay1]

4 minutes ago, jonclark said:

But would the cost have seemed reasonable if you were required to deposit 3M in a bank for 1 year prior to the op, and then only allowed to with draw 1.5 million over the next 4 years? 

Certainly not.

[JLCrab]

8 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

With coverage as low as $10,000 and not much detail about locking people out for uncovered pre-existing conditions, I can foresee dozens of shady companies offering "insurance" to meet the demand.  Even if they don't come close to meeting honest insurance needs.

Foresee away.

[impulse]

1 minute ago, JLCrab said:

Foresee away.

 

More like following the money than foreseeing. 

 

I'm trying to figure out the angle in this new option that's going to put money in the right pockets.  

 

I can envision elder-condo projects to take up some of the real estate surplus and provide jobs to lots of people.  But I'm struggling to figure out the low ($10K/year) insurance coverage- unless there's insurance companies poised to jump in and make money.  $10K certainly isn't going to pay for much medical work in case of cancer, a stroke, heart attack or bad scooter wreck.

[jonclark]

24 minutes ago, Pimay1 said:

Certainly not.

 

This visa just seems nuts - I just don't understand why if you were sick you would want to stay in a foreign country for so long. Surely most people who come for medical treatment would go home after being treated?

 

Long stay expats have family and friends here. People who choose to come for medical treatments - such as plastic surgery, go home after the treatment is finished??? Especially if they are older and have established family and friend networks in their own countries. 

 

How many sick older people want to be away from their families?? Most want to be with their families. 

 

This just makes no sense? 

[chiang mai]

17 minutes ago, jonclark said:

 

This visa just seems nuts - I just don't understand why if you were sick you would want to stay in a foreign country for so long. Surely most people who come for medical treatment would go home after being treated?

 

Long stay expats have family and friends here. People who choose to come for medical treatments - such as plastic surgery, go home after the treatment is finished??? Especially if they are older and have established family and friend networks in their own countries. 

 

How many sick older people want to be away from their families?? Most want to be with their families. 

 

This just makes no sense? 

 

Not if you regard Thailand as your home you wouldn't, people who have lived here for fifteen years or more do, I certainly do - my family is here.

 

And if waiting lists back home are what they are, getting treatment in Thailand is certainly a viable option. Many health insurers in the US send their patients here anywhere because the costs are cheaper, Blue Cross being one.

Edited November 28, 2016 by chiang mai

[Thaiwine]

It would make more sense to me if it was a visa that included any medical treatment backed by the government, they could charge 10k a month for the visa.

[anotheruser]

You would think people would simply be delighted that this does seem to be one and the same as the other visa threads. No need to worry about this one as if you don't want it you simply don't get it. Everybody can breath easily and go about their day. 

[JLCrab]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

<snip> But I'm struggling <snip2>

Obviously. Why not relax and see what the regs are when it actually becomes official?

[chiang mai]

23 minutes ago, Thaiwine said:

It would make more sense to me if it was a visa that included any medical treatment backed by the government, they could charge 10k a month for the visa.

 

You think that medical treatment in Thailand is really that inexpensive that the government  could absorb that sort of cost? USD 10k may well be 350k baht but that's a pittance when it comes to medical care costs, a triple bypass alone could easily run 750k baht.

[Thaiwine]

2 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

 

You think that medical treatment in Thailand is really that inexpensive that the government  could absorb that sort of cost? USD 10k may well be 350k baht but that's a pittance when it comes to medical care costs, a triple bypass alone could easily run 750k baht.

 

I'm thinking of a 10 year visa option for people to live in Thailand that would cover any medical costs, not people who came only for treatment, if you came just for treatment you would hardly need a 10 year visa, and I was thinking 10k baht monthly for the visa, there would be quite a few takers I would have thought.

[chiang mai]

Just now, Thaiwine said:

 

I'm thinking of a 10 year visa option for people to live in Thailand that would cover any medical costs, not people who came only for treatment, if you came just for treatment you would hardly need a 10 year visa, and I was thinking 10k baht monthly for the visa, there would be quite a few takers I would have thought.

 

Understand. But 10k baht a month for a visa that includes medical costs is still very high, it's possible for the 65/70+ year old crowd (moi) to buy health insurance from the UK/Europe at less than that cost each month, Cigna being one. The wild card of course is pre-existing conditions, that could be a blank cheque book and a very costly one.

[jonclark]

54 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

 

Not if you regard Thailand as your home you wouldn't, people who have lived here for fifteen years or more do, I certainly do - my family is here.

 

And if waiting lists back home are what they are, getting treatment in Thailand is certainly a viable option. Many health insurers in the US send their patients here anywhere because the costs are cheaper, Blue Cross being one.

 

Thailand is my home as well and i totally agree with what you are saying. 

 

But what I don't get is if you live abroad and need surgery etc and are over 50, then Thailand is a great place to come for the surgery, treatment etc and then go home. Blue Cross sends their patients here...and then they go home after the treatment. They don't stay for 5 years and put 3 million in a foreign bank!

 

I just don't understand, if the intention is to encourage overseas visitors to use Thailand for medical purposes why the 5 year visa?  Only the chronically sick would need prolonged treatment and its arguable if those people would i) want to be away from family support networks in their home countries and ii)  would qualify for insurance.  

 

Your family is here - would you want to stay in a foreign country away from your family for 5 years whilst getting medical treatment? or would you rather take your chances on the NHS and be with your wife, children, grandchildren and wider family network? 

 

Think about it - a five year visa for a boob job!! This is not about medical tourism. Its about money. 

[inquisitive]

To all of you who are commenting about how good or bad the medical treatment is in Thailand based on personal experience, I have to ask if you really are able to tell? Do you really know whether your treatment was optimal? Could/should the doctor have done something else? What really were the alternatives (beyond the ones he might or might not have known)? Would another doctor have gotten a slightly better result?

The fact is that as a patient you only know what your doctor told you. If he had a gap in his knowledge, so now do you. So that begs the question: as a layman, how can you judge?

You really can't. You do as everyone else does and you assume that if the doctor ACTS knowledgeable and compassionate, the nurses are nice to you, and the equipment and room looks clean and new, well then the doctor must be good. That's the best you can do.

I am a medical professional/educator from America that has made his home in Thailand. I have published something like six textbooks, 50 scientific papers in 6-7 languages, presented over 200 lectures around the world, served on the faculty of around 6 universities in four countries, and have a handful of intentional patents for my medical innovations. I also have had the opportunity to see the health care industry up close and personal in Thailand and a few other countries.

And my conclusion? Whether you get good or damaging treatment depends entirely on one factor: people. The same as car repair people, or plumbers, or housepainters. If the person providing the service has good skills and really cares, then they won't take shortcuts that they know you won't discover. They'll keep their skills and knowledge up to date and refer out the things that someone else can do better even if they have an upcoming payment on their new Benz. They'll put your needs ahead of their own.

In Thailand the medical establishment has very few checks. Up until very recently it was unheard of to question a doctor, even after tragic results from obvious malpractice.

Unquestionably, Thai doctors and nurses are human beings. I don't believe that anything more needs to be said on this subject.

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, inquisitive said:

To all of you who are commenting about how good or bad the medical treatment is in Thailand based on personal experience, I have to ask if you really are able to tell? Do you really know whether your treatment was optimal? Could/should the doctor have done something else? What really were the alternatives (beyond the ones he might or might not have known)? Would another doctor have gotten a slightly better result?

The fact is that as a patient you only know what your doctor told you. If he had a gap in his knowledge, so now do you. So that begs the question: as a layman, how can you judge?

You really can't. You do as everyone else does and you assume that if the doctor ACTS knowledgeable and compassionate, the nurses are nice to you, and the equipment and room looks clean and new, well then the doctor must be good. That's the best you can do.

I am a medical professional/educator from America that has made his home in Thailand. I have published something like six textbooks, 50 scientific papers in 6-7 languages, presented over 200 lectures around the world, served on the faculty of around 6 universities in four countries, and have a handful of intentional patents for my medical innovations. I also have had the opportunity to see the health care industry up close and personal in Thailand and a few other countries.

And my conclusion? Whether you get good or damaging treatment depends entirely on one factor: people. The same as car repair people, or plumbers, or housepainters. If the person providing the service has good skills and really cares, then they won't take shortcuts that they know you won't discover. They'll keep their skills and knowledge up to date and refer out the things that someone else can do better even if they have an upcoming payment on their new Benz. They'll put your needs ahead of their own.

In Thailand the medical establishment has very few checks. Up until very recently it was unheard of to question a doctor, even after tragic results from obvious malpractice.

Unquestionably, Thai doctors and nurses are human beings. I don't believe that anything more needs to be said on this subject.

 

In Chiang Mai at least we have put significant energy into building a list of preferred medical professionals and this is pinned in the TV Chiang Mai forum. It's a list of doctors who have been recommended first hand by TVF members based on the personal experiences of at least three members (in most cases) AND a review of that doctors qualifications, special attention being paid to overseas experience and training. Increasingly the weight of foreign patient/consumer pressure is coming to bear on the Thai medical system in Chiang Mai at least and social media & rapid electronic communications play a role in this. Whilst there is still a long way to go before the medical due diligence system here is on par with some western countries, doctor imposed and individual hospital imposed  due diligence is slowly taking shape. It's also worth pointing out that the price you pay for immediate walk in "expert" medical care in Thailand is that your guarantee of optimal treatment is probably something like only 80%, whereas in the West such care would be mandated in most cases at the risk and penalty of litigation and oversight panels and this is reflected in the cost of that treatment.

[JLCrab]

43 minutes ago, inquisitive said:

<snip> I don't believe that anything more needs to be said on this subject.

Thanks -- I might have said that even before your above post.

Edited November 28, 2016 by JLCrab

[baboon]

7 hours ago, impulse said:

  

The care is great once they know you need the stents.  In my case, they didn't figure that out in 3 years of quarterly testing, and I ended up needing a bypass.  Quite a few of my co-workers also have horror stories of mis- and missed diagnosis at the best known hospitals in BKK.  IMO, diagnosis is weak here in BKK hospitals.  More accurately, hit and miss.  Some of the doctors seem good, but some of them are tragically bad.  Roll of the dice if you don't have a referral from a friend.

 

Care in the recovery process was amazing.  I'd recommend that to anyone in the world.  Which is why I think elder care would be wonderful in Thailand.

Good post.

A nieice was very badly injured in a road traffic accident, was rushed to the government hospital and operated on. Thankfully she survived and now leads a normal life.

 

I was diagnosed at the same hospital with a urinary tract infection. To cut a long story very short, I subsequently received a frantic email from our family doctor in the UK telling me to return immediately. (My Ma is a patient of his too. She has a medical background, was not happy with the diagnosis and got in touch with him.) Turned out I had a malignant tumour that had filled my entire bladder and were it not for her actions I would be dead by now.

Unfortunately it really is a game of Russian roulette at these places...

[KhunBENQ]

Even more sparse than the already "thin" reports so far.

Useless for me.

 

[chiang mai]

Before everyone goes overboard about the alleged poor quality of medical care in Thailand, I read that the UK NHS spent 800 million Pounds last year correcting mistakes made by surgeons in the private medical sector, in the UK!

[baboon]

5 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

Before everyone goes overboard about the alleged poor quality of medical care in Thailand, I read that the UK NHS spent 800 million Pounds last year correcting mistakes made by surgeons in the private medical sector, in the UK!

Isn't that from botched cosmetic surgery? I recall hearing similar, but I can't remember from where.

[chiang mai]

7 minutes ago, baboon said:

Isn't that from botched cosmetic surgery? I recall hearing similar, but I can't remember from where.

 

Lots of different ways to play the numbers, the article below suggests 1.1 billion amongst just 20 Trusts! (there's more than 100 Trusts)

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/11733719/Medical-blunders-cost-NHS-billions.html

 

This one says 2.5 billion per year:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/oct/16/mistakes-cost-nhs-billions-each-year

Edited November 28, 2016 by chiang mai